[cat86]

Anyone on here with any knowledge of how the KHSAA works on cases like this?

It would seem to me that they would have to do something definitive BEFORE the Regional final round of games. I mean, if PCC beats Russell, and gets DQ'd before the second round game, then really no biggie...Russell just advances instead of PCC.

However, if PCC wins round 1 and round 2, THEN gets DQ'd, what do you do there? Both Russell and PCC's week 2 opponent could hypothetically have a claim to the regional title.

IT would seem to me like the KHSAA has 2 options:

(1) don't make any ruling until AFTER the State Championships. Of course, if they vacate PCC's season, all the teams PCC may have beaten in the playoffs will scream bloody murder.

or

(2) make a ruling sometime within the next 9 days.

Anyone got any insight?

[mandan]

I think the rule is a student's elgibility starts wherever he is enrolled at the beginning of his/her freshman year. I think Boggs was at Perry Central. The fact that he had attended Jackson City and SMS (Breathitt Co.) before that had no bearing on his elgibility. But, when a student has attended 4 different school systems in such a short period of time, suspicion is inevitable, especially when a gifted athlete is involved.

[zaga_fan]

This is a bad situation.
With Boggs transferring to 2 different schools it has to look bad.

[EKUAlum05]

Anyone on here with any knowledge of how the KHSAA works on cases like this?

It would seem to me that they would have to do something definitive BEFORE the Regional final round of games. I mean, if PCC beats Russell, and gets DQ'd before the second round game, then really no biggie...Russell just advances instead of PCC.

However, if PCC wins round 1 and round 2, THEN gets DQ'd, what do you do there? Both Russell and PCC's week 2 opponent could hypothetically have a claim to the regional title.

IT would seem to me like the KHSAA has 2 options:

(1) don't make any ruling until AFTER the State Championships. Of course, if they vacate PCC's season, all the teams PCC may have beaten in the playoffs will scream bloody murder.

or

(2) make a ruling sometime within the next 9 days.

Anyone got any insight?

I am curious to know as well... I would think it would be a "play at your own risk" type of scenario and function more retroactively. If I were a betting man a ruling will not be passed until after the playoffs are over, at which point either the KHSAA will retroactively enforce their punishment or choose to put the case into a legal purgatory. This way they can avoid having to allow a team who just lost a game to get a free pass to the next round, plus with appeals possible it could be foreseaable that PC could advance for several weeks before the case could finally be ruled upon.


It is easier to strip a title than it is to give one to someone who didn't win the game.

[cat86]

I'm guessing that it would be similar to the Memphis situation with Calipari. Even though Memphis had their wins vacated, the teams they beat in the NCAA tourney had no legal recourse. Some of them may have been able to make the argument that they may have beat Kansas in the finals, but it was too late then.

[OrangenowBlue]

Where did Boggs live at last year. Did he live in Wolfe County. If he didn't, he should be eligible as it states that you have to move into another school district to transfer. Not necessarily the school district that you will be attending.

[ballcrazy]

Now good for PC , i think all schools should go by the rules but so few will.

[Belfry0304]

There's a meeting at 2pm tomorrow about the subject. I assume it's Pike Central officials and KHSAA officials. Don't know where or any details, just that it's going down. Anybody got any other information?

[BobcatStuckInPowell]

Wolfe County doesn't have football so aren't you allowed to go somewhere else that has football even in another district?

[Poseidon]

I can honestly say that I hate that this happened to the KIDS!!! I mean, I'm sure that it was the adults who encouraged this and talked these kids into whatever "agreement" was made for them to come to Pike Central to play football. Evidently, the adults in this situation didn't care one iota about what may happen to the KIDS if/when they were caught cheating. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that kids usually can't keep secrets very well and they aren't going to think twice about posting comments on facebook walls or that a coach meeting parents at a park and ride in Prestonsburg every morning to pick up the kids would go unnoticed.

I can also honestly say that I have absolutely NO RESPECT for Chapman or his assistant coach Mike Smith. I was a witness to Smith's cheering for an injured Belfry player. Low Class at it's finest!

I also have a question...If I read the paper correctly, it stated that the Affidavits were from some people from Floyd County..so how are these people supposed to be "disgruntled parents whose son lost their position to the recruited/shipped-in players"? Last time I checked, Pike Central was in Pike County.

There comes a time when a "kid" must grow up and do what needs to be done, and if he\she cheats, they should be held accountable. I am sure that the kids had pressure on them to make the bad decision, but they are responsible in the end for the choices they make.

[fedscreekviking]

As I stated in the closed thread a persons view on this subject depends on whether their school is helped or harmed by transfers. But lets state some facts here. Similar events have happened all over the state for as long as there has been HS sports. As long as some coachs have "win and I care how" it will continue. Most of the time investigations are based on who has the most pull. If you have someone of the KHSAA board of control you can get done whatever you want. Occasionally so much evidence is collected that the KHSAA must act. This may be one of those occasions

[phs1986]

Wolfe County doesn't have football so aren't you allowed to go somewhere else that has football even in another district?

It's my understanding that it has to be the next "closest" available school district with the sport desired to be played...... Is PC the closest available?

I do hate this for the kids. I feel that the higher ups knew all along what was going on and by this, I don't only mean the administration and/or coaches at PC. I hate it for the young men who HAVE busted their tails all season long, for all the hard work, sweat, blood, and dedication they have put into a game that they evidently love to play or they wouldn't be playing it. I don't only mean Shouse and Boggs either. I am talking about their teammates as this doesn't only affect them, it affects their entire team INCLUDING the young man whose parents obtained the information. Sometimes, the kids can use better common sense than adults!

[Poseidon]

I actually seen the emails circulated and that were sent to the KHSAA and in my opinion it is pretty concrete evidence. Pictures, videotapes, Facebook pages, legal affidavits, were all included. Someone did some hardcore investigating and put alot of time and effort in getting this stuff.

To all you future high school football players out there:
Play football where you are SUPPOSED to play football and if you don't like it there or your school doesn't have football, then MOVE somewhere else so you can be LEGAL to play.

As far as the school administration and coaches, they should be ashamed. This isn't the way to build a program.

I don't blame the parents for being mad either. If I had a son the I watched play little league and junior high, only to get to high school and be replaced by kids that the coach recruited, I would feel obligated to at least try to do something about it too.

:Thumbs:

[PaintsvilleTigerfan]

After I read the Chapman wanting the paintsville job posts, I've asked people around town and no one has ever known anything about it. There probably isn't any truth to that. Im just trying to figure out what kind of point paintsville tiger fan is trying to make.... I see what he means that it could have been a mistake, but looking at the way that things are going he makes no sense.

I was trying to prove that maybe our admins arent as stupid as ppl think.

[Panther Thunder]

vacate [vəˈkeɪt]vb (mainly tr)1. to cause (something) to be empty, esp by departing from or abandoning it

Let's all learn the meaning of the word now, as to be ready for the near future. :eyeroll:

[Panther Thunder]

This is a bad situation.
With Boggs transferring to 2 different schools it has to look bad.

And the fact that his father is on record as saying he chose Pike Central for academics.

[Panther Thunder]

I think it is ironic that you have Pikeville fans and Belfry fans being critical of Pike Central over recruiting allegations. If you go in the parking lot of Belfry High school, there are more West Virginia tags then in the parking lot of WVU football stadium on gameday. For over twenty years they have kids that live in West Virginia and play for Belfry. They can say whatever they want to justify this but it isn't nothing but plain ole HYPOCRISY. As far as Pikeville, they have had the same thing with kids from West Virginia and all over Pike County. When Pikeville won their state titles in the late eighties/early nineties, they had kids from more states then the University of Kentucky had on their team. So if you live in a glass house, dont be throwing any stones and believe me these two schools have lived in glass house for years.

I don't think anyone from Pikeville said a word until me. There aren't many Pikeville posters anymore. Be sneakier and more careful next time!

[Panther Thunder]

And from what I heard, PC needs to worry about more than recruiting.

[gotcha2]

Recruiting goes on everywhere everyday and don't fool yourselves in to thinking otherwise. Everyone is pointing fingers at this school and that school and making accusations and truthfully most of them are probably true. I know (personally) of parents being contacted and offered jobs and housing for their athlete to switch schools. Leave the kids alone, let them play their games and enjoy their lives. Choose your school while your in middle school- enroll as a freshmen and move on. IF PCC did what they were accused of then SHAME ON THEM!! IF not, then GOOD LUCK to the HAWKS!!

[Poseidon]

I hope that this is not as serious as it seems to be. The kids that were there and have done nothing wrong have to be angry about all of this crap. Unfortunately, the whole team will be punished, not just the players in question.

[Real Badman]

And from what I heard, PC needs to worry about more than recruiting.

Sounds like me and you heard the same thing.

On a side note. I seen viable proof of Boggs current living arrangements.

[vundy33]

The political bs I was referring to is that some kids only get to play due to money. Others have to sit and watch. The khsaa needs to be better at their job. But as far as they go I know they enforce the rules. They just do a shotty job of it.

When I question fairness my point was meant to say that it isn't fair that a few teams have to sit back and watch other teams do the very same thing they are getting accused of. But they have to sit back and take it. That my friend isn't fair.

Do I agree with it? No I do not. Nor do I condone it. But waiting until playoff time and the end of the season because someone wasn't thorough enough to check up on things really bugs the crap out of me.

And lastly, don't question my integrity. This is a touchy subject and vie been quiet the whole time. But the fairness things hit a button.

Have a nice day

You're still wrong, and I still question your integrity because you still are trying to bring other schools into this. They. Do. Not. Get. Caught. It's as simple as that. If they were to get caught by the KHSAA, they would get in trouble, simple as that. There is no conspiracy here, no matter how much you want to believe it. The other teams that you say we have to sit back and watch while we get in trouble either don't have enemies that care enough about it to get proof and report them or they just do a better job at hiding it.

Unless you have proof, it's not fair to start calling out other teams for cheating when our school gets caught. Be a man and take it, if they did wrong, we'll take our punishment, if they're innocent, then we'll be fine. I don't understand why you want to divert the attention to other schools when you have no proof at all of anything. We all know the rumors from Belfry and Pikeville, but when ANY other school, including my ER and Central, gets caught up in something, the first thing 90% of the fans do is scream out how it's not fair that they get caught and the other teams don't instead of being adults about it and admitting fault and taking the punishment.

Just because another team cheats, doesn't mean our team should. It's unacceptable, and we're better than that. We don't have to lower ourselves to get better. We showed that last year.

[crazytaxidriver]

I agree with your last paragraph vundy. But it's hard to make a point typing everything out on a cell phone. And it wouldn't come across the way I wanted it to anyway. But I wasn't trying to drag anyone else into this.

I don't believe there is a conspiracy against pc.

Like i said earlier someone needs to be more thorough in their initial investigations so this stuff don't happen.

But I do want to ask what happens if the parties are found guilty? Are they going to make the kid go back to whatever school he came from??

[VoR_58]

If a team has done something illegal and someone wants to accuse them of doing it, the only way the KHSAA is going to do anything about it, in most cases, is if someone gathers all the evidence like was done here, and turns it into them. Otherwise, there not going to pay much attention to the accusations and simply consider it just someone spreading rumors.

I hate to see this happen to these kids and this team, but we have got to realize that they did it to themselves. The players and the parents of the players are the ones who made the decisions they made, knowing they were ethically and legally, the wrong decisions. Not only will they have to suffer the consequences (if any), the whole team and the whole school will.

[OrangenowBlue]

I don't think anyone from Pikeville said a word until me. There aren't many Pikeville posters anymore. Be sneakier and more careful next time!

So basically what you are stating is the only thing I need to change is the word fans to fan. If that is the only thing you feel like is wrong, I rest my case. As far as being sneakier, what has that got to do with anything. That doesn't make any sense.

[Pirate Pal]

There comes a time when a "kid" must grow up and do what needs to be done, and if he\she cheats, they should be held accountable. I am sure that the kids had pressure on them to make the bad decision, but they are responsible in the end for the choices they make.

That's true to a point, but peer pressure that this age is what most succumb to and I would almost bet that as hard as it is saying no to a person their own age, it would be impossible to say no to a Coach/parent who is applying that pressure. In my opinion, the Coach should receive more of a punishment than the kid in this situation.

[BlueSky]

Well it is what it is. This is nothing new. The KHSAA has as much politics in it as any other organization. They will rule with what is best for the ones that have patted their back. The powers of the county system will take care of the matter, and the recuiting wars will continue on and on. The KHSAA always acts as if they are so fair. (what a joke). They are are powerful political organization and nothing else. We must understand the way it is and live with it. If you can find it in your heart to play unfair or not by the rules just because so many others do than so be it. I hope and pray that some day we will put the children first and realize these sports are a game, but a game that is suppose to teach character and honesty.........

[EKUAlum05]

You're still wrong, and I still question your integrity because you still are trying to bring other schools into this. They. Do. Not. Get. Caught. It's as simple as that. If they were to get caught by the KHSAA, they would get in trouble, simple as that. There is no conspiracy here, no matter how much you want to believe it. The other teams that you say we have to sit back and watch while we get in trouble either don't have enemies that care enough about it to get proof and report them or they just do a better job at hiding it.

Unless you have proof, it's not fair to start calling out other teams for cheating when our school gets caught. Be a man and take it, if they did wrong, we'll take our punishment, if they're innocent, then we'll be fine. I don't understand why you want to divert the attention to other schools when you have no proof at all of anything. We all know the rumors from Belfry and Pikeville, but when ANY other school, including my ER and Central, gets caught up in something, the first thing 90% of the fans do is scream out how it's not fair that they get caught and the other teams don't instead of being adults about it and admitting fault and taking the punishment.

Just because another team cheats, doesn't mean our team should. It's unacceptable, and we're better than that. We don't have to lower ourselves to get better. We showed that last year.

Well said.... until the headline reads "_______________ (insert rival school here) Being Investigated By KHSAA" then the excuse of "It's not fair!Everyone else does it!"simply isn't going to fly and is laughable.

Many reactions by PC fans on here are akin to being pulled over for speeding and saying "But the guy who passed me ten miles ago was going faster, why didn't you pull him over?" and expecting that will cause the cop to drop the ticket.

[the predicament]

The Shouse kid had an legit move. His parents split so he moved in with his mom in pikeville. (from what ive heard) The Boggs kid i know he lives in wolfe county.

THe part where you said (From What I've heard) nullified the whole statement. THat, my friend is called hearsay, and doesn't stand up anywhere.

[hypersport]

There have been allegations of eligibility since the beginning of sport from Little League to College. Even our beloved UK Wildcats have had their share of problems.
But I think Lou Holltz said it best last night during the Georgia Tech/ VA Tech halftime show, " It is never right to do what is wrong and it is never wrong to do what is right.
What a concept! Imagine if everyone would adopt this philosophy.

The court injunction allows the player to participate, but if you look at the history of court injunctions and the KHSAA you will find that the KHSAA ruling stands almost 100 percent of the time. Just the fact that all of this is going on puts all involved in a negative light.
The children have no fault they can only do what they are allowed to do in this type of situation.