[cart man]

Doesn't the KHSAA have an eligibility rule that says that if a player turns 19 before the season he/she is participating in, then that player is ineligible? Isn't it true to suggest that the main reason for holding back in middle school is competitive advantage?

That was the old rule, the new rule is August 1.

Bylaw 3. Age

Pursuant to KRS 156.070 (2) (e), a student who becomes nineteen

(19) years old before August 1 shall be ineligible for interscholastic
athletic competition. A student who becomes nineteen (19) on or
after August 1 shall remain eligible for the entire school year. The
Board of Control and the Commissioner may waive the provisions
of this regulation and the student shall be eligible for high school
athletics in Kentucky if the written documentation is provided to
clearly demonstrate that the student:
1. Qualified for exceptional children services and had an individual
education program developed by an admissions and release
committee (ARC) while the student was enrolled in the primary
school program;
2. Was retained in the primary school program because of an ARC
committee recommendation; and
3. Has not completed four (4) consecutive years or eight (8)
consecutive semesters of eligibility following initial promotion
from grade eight (8) to grade nine (9).
The Board of Control and the Commissioner may not adopt
administrative procedures that allow for waiver of this rule under
any other condition.
(Case situations related to this bylaw appear on pages 19 through
43 of this Handbook)

2007-2008 KHSAA HANDBOOK

[uk96]

JBS has three starters held back two years and another starter was held back one year.

That is not accurate......

[ARC]

That is the only reason for doing it. Different people have different excuses on how it is good. But that is all they are, excuses to get a extra year of playing in middle school. People say because kids are not mature enough for college at 17 or 18. Yet very few athletes even go to college from the county. Even if they did, how can a parent tell how mature a kid will when graduated from high school while they are only in the 7th grade? Some say they are not mature enough for their grade. Yet, I bet when they get old enough they get their drivers permit and license as soon as possible. If there are any other reasons, or excuses as to why the ruling should be changed, will someone please post them?

Too many variables are involved and it is really a 'case by case' basis. You seem to be arguing that kids do not mature in any aspect in one year. I'm glad that you don't make the decision for my children, whether I choose to hold them back or not.

[thecavemaster]

Assuming compliance with the above stated KHSAA rule (August 1st)... this means a student could start school as a senior at age 19... using my own kid as an example.. he turned six in late August of his kindergarten year. Now, if we had decided to hold back in middle school, he would have turned 19 in late August of his senior year, making him eligible. In all honesty, my experience has been that holding a middle school kid back for athletic reasons is not particularly good socially for the kid.

[uk96]

This has turned out to be quite the topic today...My two cents... I think that holding a kid back is the option that a parent has...The only thing I will say is that most of the time it is done for athletic reasons and not the excuses that most parents give. Most of the time it is telling a kid that dont work hard to excel just stay back and you will be older and stronger and do better against younger competition. It is also one thing to hold a kid back once but when it is done twice then that is purely done for athletic reasons and some parents are just trying to relive their lives thru the lives of their kids. There are some exceptions but not many...

[PC_You_Know]

Honestly, I don't see a case in which it has hurt anyone.

[thecavemaster]

Honestly, I don't see a case in which it has hurt anyone.

I will say that since a lot of middle schools now house 6th, 7th, and 8th graders, the social impact is probably less.

[uk96]

Honestly, I don't see a case in which it has hurt anyone.

I
I think that some feel that it hurts the younger kids they play against because it is not a level playing field. Also it could hurt the kids that are own your own team that are two years younger than you. Just a thought.

[thecavemaster]

I
I think that some feel that it hurts the younger kids they play against because it is not a level playing field. Also it could hurt the kids that are own your own team that are two years younger than you. Just a thought.

In good AAU tournaments, there is a pretty strict adherence to age requirements (birth certificates and ID required)... and the age groups are single (8U, 9U, 10U, 11U, 12U etc.). Here, the idea is playing "up" if one is skilled enough. I think that is good policy, good practice.

[NEXT]

Now that I've started this I will put my view out there.


1 - not every child needs to be held back.

2 - not always is a 17 year old less mature than a 18-19 year old BUT I want to give my son every chance he has to grow and get experience in this world while under my roof.

3 - It is a proven fact that there is a HUGE difference in the mental and physiological development between a 17-19 year old MALE - go look into any college biomechanics or anatomy and physiology 300-400 level college text book.

4 - Why punish a kid in the 6-8th grade if he is held back? How do I know how my son will mature? Who can look at a 1st-5th grader and say he is mature beyond his years? Some kids you can, some you can't. The social and mental aspects of middle school reveal some flaws in the development of children. Because at this age hormones start going crazy and you start to introduce complex networks and paths in the brain because of this. Sports help children deal with these things because they are surrounded by their peers - but if they are 11 and another child is 13 or they are not allowed to play they are not surrounded by their peers.

[PC_You_Know]

Now that I've started this I will put my view out there.


1 - not every child needs to be held back.

2 - not always is a 17 year old less mature than a 18-19 year old BUT I want to give my son every chance he has to grow and get experience in this world while under my roof.

3 - It is a proven fact that there is a HUGE difference in the mental and physiological development between a 17-19 year old MALE - go look into any college biomechanics or anatomy and physiology 300-400 level college text book.

4 - Why punish a kid in the 6-8th grade if he is held back? How do I know how my son will mature? Who can look at a 1st-5th grader and say he is mature beyond his years? Some kids you can, some you can't. The social and mental aspects of middle school reveal some flaws in the development of children. Because at this age hormones start going crazy and you start to introduce complex networks and paths in the brain because of this. Sports help children deal with these things because they are surrounded by their peers - but if they are 11 and another child is 13 or they are not allowed to play they are not surrounded by their peers.

You have all my support in the world for this statement, I was held back late before I even started school, my mother thought I should wait another year and I don't see any problem with it, I don't turn 19 till this summer, and I don't think it has hurt me at all, I wouldn't have liked to graduate with the class in front of me anyways.

[Benchwarmer]

JBS has three starters held back two years and another starter was held back one year.

That is not accurate......

It is accurate and I know what I'm talking about.

[NEXT]

Basketballfanonly - how many Pikeville players were holbacks on last years team?


Harmon
Clevinger
Honaker



I think there are more than that, but would they have been as good without them?

[Benchwarmer]

Basketballfanonly - how many Pikeville players were holbacks on last years team?


Harmon
Clevinger
Honaker



I think there are more than that, but would they have been as good without them?

Don't use names.

[BoondockSaint]

Yeah.... BUT... who wants a 19 (going on 20) year old SENIOR in high school!!!

IF their birthdate allows and they have poor grades and are below level...... then go for it! IF they are "of grade age", have a 4.0 GPA, and have straight distinguished on their CATS tests... you are NOT going to help them by holding them back for sports. Their academics will get them into a good school.... I thought that is why they go to school anyway.... to get an EDUCATION!!!

So if your kid is 19 during his/her senior year of high school you wouldn't want them anymore??

[BoondockSaint]

I am pretty sure that Elliott county players are legit ages for their grades. Now Rose Hill in the 16th Region is definetly a different story. Especially their Middle School players. Johnson and Lawrence are bad for this in Football as well.

All of Elliot Co.'s first six are holdbacks.

[BoondockSaint]

LOLOL.... you ask if he even goes to a county school and then you come back with where he goes!! DANG... your good!!

Sorry if anyone got offened by my opinion but that is just what it is... MY OPINION.... My child is the only one that I am making statements about. It is each parents own decision to hold their child back whether it be for maturity, sports, OR grades. I just feel that is isn't the right thing to do for my child. He does too well in his academics and he does like I said earlier, excel in 2 of the 3 sports that he does play.

I do have this feeling about the sports aspect of it though......Are coaches who want their "players" held back looking at it for the maturity of their player OR for the betterment of their team?? Meaning... they have a superstar player and want to hold onto them for another year..... ?????

Maybe they want to see their players get the most out of their potential and give them fully alotted time to do so in high school.

[Dream_Weaver]

This had to be one of the hardest decisions that our family made in regards to doing what was right for our child. And I am still not sure that we made the right decision. We didn't take this decision lightly--we discussed pros and cons at great length--and the BOE rule did play a part in our decision making.

In my opinion this should be a private family matter and as long as the parents and child are aware of regulations regarding future eligibilty the BOE shouldn't be a factor.

[gotcha2]

In good AAU tournaments, there is a pretty strict adherence to age requirements (birth certificates and ID required)... and the age groups are single (8U, 9U, 10U, 11U, 12U etc.). Here, the idea is playing "up" if one is skilled enough. I think that is good policy, good practice.

AAU accomodates holdbacks. Or at least they still did 2 years ago. The student has to have a form signed by their principal that verifies what grade they are in.

[NEXT]

AAU accomodates holdbacks. Or at least they still did 2 years ago. The student has to have a form signed by their principal that verifies what grade they are in.

YBOA and AAU allow 2 grade exceptions for every team.



I'll give you this example, Belfry can play in 12 and under AAU for their entire 8th grade team.............

[phs1986]

So if your kid is 19 during his/her senior year of high school you wouldn't want them anymore??

I meant to say who would WANT to be a "going on 20" year old senior...

[phs1986]

So if your kid is 19 during his/her senior year of high school you wouldn't want them anymore??

and OH... I forgot... MY kid will be a 17 year old senior... NOT a 20 year old one.... and YES... I would still want him... LOLOL.... He is my baby!!

[The Installer]

I meant to say who would WANT to be a "going on 20" year old senior...

But see that's the point about holdbacks. Not every child that would be held back would be a 19 year old senior. My child will graduate at 17. Even if I held him back he would graduate at age 18. Every child is different and every case is also different. That is why it should be the decision of the parent and not of anyone else.

[phs1986]

But see that's the point about holdbacks. Not every child that would be held back would be a 19 year old senior. My child will graduate at 17. Even if I held him back he would graduate at age 18. Every child is different and every case is also different. That is why it should be the decision of the parent and not of anyone else.

EXACTLY!!! and I agree 100%.... parents choice!!

[NEXT]

But see that's the point about holdbacks. Not every child that would be held back would be a 19 year old senior. My child will graduate at 17. Even if I held him back he would graduate at age 18. Every child is different and every case is also different. That is why it should be the decision of the parent and not of anyone else.

We have a winner...........thanks for getting the point.

[BoondockSaint]

I meant to say who would WANT to be a "going on 20" year old senior...

Ask all of the former "19 year old seniors who will turn 20 their freshman year of college" and see if you can find any that regrets the decision.

Most of them will tell you that they hated the decision at the time it was made by their parents, but none will regret it & they will probably do the same with their kids.


Give me the choice of sending my child to college as a 17 year old or a 19 year old, and I'd pick the 2 years more mature 19 year old everyday of the week & twice on Sunday.

I agree with you that it is or should be a parent's choice, not a Board decision, principal decision, or coach's decision.

But there is no denying that the maturity level of a 19 year old, both mentally & physically, is two years greater than that of a 17 year old.

[BoondockSaint]

One more thing and I'm done.

I think that the one thing we can all agree on is that holding a child back is a parent's decision, and no one is more inclined or informed to make that decision than a child's parent.

If the thread starter meant for this thread to support the "Parental Decision" of holding a child back in Pike Co., then we should all back those whose right to make that decision up until the 8th grade have been taken away regardless of how we feel about holding our own child back.

Not supporting their rights or decisions of those who would like to hold their children back because you do not agree with the concept contradicts all those who say it should be a parental decision but do not support parents wishing to hold back their child.

There are many decisions in our adult life that we'd like to make but can't because of various reasons. How we raise our children, or what's best for our children should not be one of them.

[BasketBallonlyfan]

Too many variables are involved and it is really a 'case by case' basis. You seem to be arguing that kids do not mature in any aspect in one year. I'm glad that you don't make the decision for my children, whether I choose to hold them back or not.

I dont make decisions for anyones kids but my own. Same as you do for your kids and no one elses. The good part about it is that you can still make that decision. You can still hold your child back in middle school if you feel it is in the best interest of your child. Why complain about it if you can still do it?

[The Installer]

One more thing and I'm done.

If the thread starter meant for this thread to support the "Parental Decision" of holding a child back in Pike Co., then we should all back those whose right to make that decision up until the 8th grade have been taken away regardless of how we feel about holding our own child back.

Not supporting their rights or decisions of those who would like to hold their children back because you do not agree with the concept contradicts all those who say it should be a parental decision but do not support parents wishing to hold back their child.

There are many decisions in our adult life that we'd like to make but can't because of various reasons. How we raise our children, or what's best for our children should not be one of them.

You are 100% right!

[Dream_Weaver]

One more thing and I'm done.

I think that the one thing we can all agree on is that holding a child back is a parent's decision, and no one is more inclined or informed to make that decision than a child's parent.

If the thread starter meant for this thread to support the "Parental Decision" of holding a child back in Pike Co., then we should all back those whose right to make that decision up until the 8th grade have been taken away regardless of how we feel about holding our own child back.

Not supporting their rights or decisions of those who would like to hold their children back because you do not agree with the concept contradicts all those who say it should be a parental decision but do not support parents wishing to hold back their child.

There are many decisions in our adult life that we'd like to make but can't because of various reasons. How we raise our children, or what's best for our children should not be one of them.

excellent post!