Rules question

**FBALL** · 11-03-2009, 12:54 AM

A defensive player launches himself, leading with the head, directly into the ball carriers knees.

Cheap shot or good hardnosed play. I have my own opinion but I want to hear what some of you guys think.

Jshort5 · 11-03-2009, 01:06 AM

CHEAP. Coming from a Bengals' fan I think all hits below the knees should be banned if intentional...lol

**Stardust** · 11-03-2009, 01:09 AM

If you are saying that the defender "lead with his head" that is illegal. You can never lead with your head as a weapon to any part of the opposing players body.

**Stardust** · 11-03-2009, 01:10 AM

I guess I didn't answer the question, but if it is illegal, then it is cheap.

**FBALL** · 11-03-2009, 01:13 AM

Stardust Wrote:If you are saying that the defender "lead with his head" that is illegal. You can never lead with your head as a weapon to any part of the opposing players body.

Helmet directly to the knee cap if that clears it up any.

**LeeCoUKFan** · 11-03-2009, 03:04 AM

As far as my knowledge goes if you lead with the helmet towards the knees, that is similar to a chop block and those are illegal. So i do belive, that kind of tackle would be illegal and if for some reason its not, it needs to be!

Schmilla88 · 11-03-2009, 09:20 AM

I think it would be a chep shot. But if they don't use their helmet and they wrap up at the legs that is perfectly fine. As long as they don't put their helmet in your knee or leg, its good.

BluegrassBuckeye · 11-03-2009, 09:37 AM

Schmilla88 Wrote:I think it would be a chep shot. But if they don't use their helmet and they wrap up at the legs that is perfectly fine. As long as they don't put their helmet in your knee or leg, its good.

I agree

**EKUAlum05** · 11-03-2009, 09:47 AM

Cheap shot and wreckless.... not only could it severely injure the opposing player but it could also result in serious head and neck injuries for the tackler as well. In terms of being legal, I would have to assume it is legal though.

**Stardust** · 11-03-2009, 09:50 AM

Using the head as a weapon is illegal - thus cheap!

BluegrassBuckeye · 11-03-2009, 09:51 AM

I'd like to know the point of this thread. Obviously someone took a cheap shot at some point. Was he hurt? Was a flag thrown? Details?

Schmilla88 · 11-03-2009, 09:56 AM

On a similiar subject, Florida Gator's linebacker Brandon Spikes was caught eye gouging Georgia's running back Washaun Ealey, and he will be benched the first half of the Vandy game. Some think that is not enough or to much. Thoughts?

**FBALL** · 11-03-2009, 10:57 AM

BluegrassBuckeye Wrote:I'd like to know the point of this thread. Obviously someone took a cheap shot at some point. Was he hurt? Was a flag thrown? Details?

The player that took the helmet to the knee is currently on crutches with the knee imobilized. MRI is pending.
No flag was thrown and when the question was brought up to the official he made a sarcastic remark after the coach had walked away.

Here is my take on it. Tackling low and wrapping up is fine. Launching your body while leading with the head at a runners knees is not.

bucslover68 · 11-03-2009, 11:04 AM

FBALL Wrote:The player that took the helmet to the knee is currently on crutches with the knee imobilized. MRI is pending.
No flag was thrown and when the question was brought up to the official he made a sarcastic remark after the coach had walked away.

Here is my take on it. Tackling low and wrapping up is fine. Launching your body while leading with the head at a runners knees is not.

I totally agree FBALL. Tackling, by launching oneself and leading with the head, should be avoided. Too many injuries, to both parties involved, could happen.

mandan · 11-03-2009, 11:11 AM

I think we need someone with a rule book (or a striped shirt) help us out on this one.

Schmilla88 · 11-03-2009, 12:10 PM

"Spearing: Hitting another player with the crown of the helmet.
Spearing is illegal and results in a 15-yard penalty against the offending team."

I found this around the internet, but i could not find an actual rule book to check it.

stripes · 11-03-2009, 12:22 PM

first of all, you cannot lead with your helmet and that is going to be judged solely on the covering official. IF, deemed, this would be a personal foul, 15 yards. Most of these hits with the helmet is helmet to helmet. Remember, tackling below the waist is legal, if B is in the air and his helmet happens to hit A, that does not mean that the intent was there but it just happened. Often, an official has to see the play to judge. The first thing, was there intent to hurt someone?

BluegrassBuckeye · 11-03-2009, 12:27 PM

[quote=FBALL]The player that took the helmet to the knee is currently on crutches with the knee imobilized. MRI is pending.
No flag was thrown and when the question was brought up to the official he made a sarcastic remark after the coach had walked away.

Just to play Devil's Advocate. Perhaps the helmet didn't actually make contact. It may have appeared that it did from certain angles though. Instant replay has proven me wrong many times. Things happen quick. Perhaps the hit was illegal but the official didn't see it. This seems likely as he would have thrown the flag had he seen it. As for the sarcastic remark; maybe the coach was giving the business to the official all night and he was just tired of hearing it. There are always two sides to every story. :thanks:

redstorm · 11-03-2009, 12:38 PM

If he is the runner ( ball carrier) get him down the best way you can by tackling him. That is part of the game. Can you ask a kid that weights 150 pounds, tackle a ball carrier that weights 205, up high? the defensive guy will get trucked every time.

**FBALL** · 11-03-2009, 01:02 PM

redstorm Wrote:If he is the runner ( ball carrier) get him down the best way you can by tackling him. That is part of the game. Can you ask a kid that weights 150 pounds, tackle a ball carrier that weights 205, up high? the defensive guy will get trucked every time.

I agree that tackling low is all right. But launching your body directly into the knees is not tackling. It is reckless and dangerous. if you are a smaller player and have to go low then tackle the legs with a shoulder and wrap up.

**FBALL** · 11-03-2009, 01:14 PM

BluegrassBuckeye Wrote:Just to play Devil's Advocate. Perhaps the helmet didn't actually make contact. It may have appeared that it did from certain angles though. Instant replay has proven me wrong many times. Things happen quick. Perhaps the hit was illegal but the official didn't see it. This seems likely as he would have thrown the flag had he seen it. As for the sarcastic remark; maybe the coach was giving the business to the official all night and he was just tired of hearing it. There are always two sides to every story. :thanks:

To play devils advocate back with you. The coach involved asked the question about leading with the helmet. He was not out off line or abusive in any way. The official got defensive and said "one of your players just led with his helmet do you want me to call that?". The coach told him if anyone is leading with thier helmet to call it and walked away. The official then made a comment about taking off helmets and picking up pom poms. Again this was after the coach had walked away. It was inappropriate and uncalled for in my opinion.

By the way, it was helmet directly on the knee cap when the runners foot was planted. It didn't look good at all.

BluegrassBuckeye · 11-03-2009, 01:55 PM

FBALL Wrote:To play devils advocate back with you. The coach involved asked the question about leading with the helmet. He was not out off line or abusive in any way. The official got defensive and said "one of your players just led with his helmet do you want me to call that?". The coach told him if anyone is leading with thier helmet to call it and walked away. The official then made a comment about taking off helmets and picking up pom poms. Again this was after the coach had walked away. It was inappropriate and uncalled for in my opinion.

By the way, it was helmet directly on the knee cap when the runners foot was planted. It didn't look good at all.

Actually, you aren't playing devils advocate. It sounds like you have first hand knowledge of the incident. You held back on the details in the beginning and made it difficult to form a good opinion. If what you are saying is true then the whole thing is "dirty". Flags should have been thrown and penalties marked off. Hope the injured player makes a full recovery! :thanks:

**FBALL** · 11-03-2009, 02:41 PM

BluegrassBuckeye Wrote:Actually, you aren't playing devils advocate. It sounds like you have first hand knowledge of the incident. You held back on the details in the beginning and made it difficult to form a good opinion. If what you are saying is true then the whole thing is "dirty". Flags should have been thrown and penalties marked off. Hope the injured player makes a full recovery! :thanks:

Yeah I have first hand knowledge of the situation Mr. Picky. I gave all of the details but left some specifics out just so I could get honest opinions and try to influence anyone's thoughts.

Hopefully the kids injuries don't turn out to be too severe and the recovery is quick.

I'll be honest. The officials actions bothered me worse than anything else.

BluegrassBuckeye · 11-03-2009, 02:47 PM

FBALL Wrote:Yeah I have first hand knowledge of the situation Mr. Picky. I gave all of the details but left some specifics out just so I could get honest opinions and try to influence anyone's thoughts.

Hopefully the kids injuries don't turn out to be too severe and the recovery is quick.

I'll be honest. The officials actions bothered me worse than anything else.

You don't have to call me Mister, mister.

stripes · 11-03-2009, 03:51 PM

FBALL Wrote:Yeah I have first hand knowledge of the situation Mr. Picky. I gave all of the details but left some specifics out just so I could get honest opinions and try to influence anyone's thoughts.

Hopefully the kids injuries don't turn out to be too severe and the recovery is quick.

I'll be honest. The officials actions bothered me worse than anything else.

If we had as many as you who put down officials each week, we would not have a shortage. The problems that many of you have, you bring in different rules from NCAA and NFL and try to put them toward NFHS. One problem, we have five officials per contest, one of which has to take the qb on each play. The other four, take on 20+ players on a pretty big surface.

You can look at all this stuff, always, someone has a derogatory comment about someone wearing stripes. Just what did this official say that made you feel so terrible?

Hatz · 11-03-2009, 04:10 PM

BluegrassBuckeye Wrote:You don't have to call me Mister, mister.

I liked their songs in the mid 80's. :biggrin:

(Just trying to bring levity to the place.):eyeroll:

**FBALL** · 11-03-2009, 05:40 PM

stripes Wrote:If we had as many as you who put down officials each week, we would not have a shortage. The problems that many of you have, you bring in different rules from NCAA and NFL and try to put them toward NFHS. One problem, we have five officials per contest, one of which has to take the qb on each play. The other four, take on 20+ players on a pretty big surface.

You can look at all this stuff, always, someone has a derogatory comment about someone wearing stripes. Just what did this official say that made you feel so terrible?

Well that's already been covered in this thread. I don't have a problem with officials and I'm not bringing NFL rules into this. The only problem I had with the official was him trylng to create a confrontation when the discussion was done. Maybe we just need fewer people like you who are so senstlative that they take every question as a condemnation of thier own knowledge.