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12-09-2009, 10:25 AM
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12-09-2009, 10:57 AM
Don't the Kiffin's know you can't give signing bonus's in college????
12-09-2009, 11:29 AM
nothing will ever come of this...If anything does they will rule it once again a secondary violation because they will not be able to prove that Kiffin and Co. sent these "hostees" out unless one or two of them spill their guts. Sounds a little more racey to me then just a group of girls traveling to games and such if you know what I mean. More than likely Kiffin is guilty but **** if he gets off the hook we might as well do the same
12-09-2009, 11:42 AM
****, don't that suck.
12-09-2009, 04:38 PM
Amun-Ra Wrote:So basically Tenn coaching staff is pimping out these girls to get in top recruits. Awesome.
Thanks for summing up what I was trying to say lol...**** if it aint broke dont fix it untill you get sanctioned
12-09-2009, 05:28 PM
Funny how this comes out right in the middle of a big part of the recruiting season and we already have a Top 5 recruiting class. From what I've read, even if the NCAA finds evidence they need to make something of this, its still not going to be a major violation. Maybe the NCAA will look into every other university's use of hostesses... Yeah, I doubt it.
12-09-2009, 05:48 PM
Amun-Ra Wrote:I am not saying Tenn is guilty of anything but if they are in fact paying girls to go and lure recruits to Knoxville what kind of infraction is that? I mean how many secondary violations can you get before you get more than a slap on the wrist?
I'm under the impression that there will need to be some sort of link to the coaching staff, athletic dept., etc. These girls are actually employed by the admissions office at UT, so they aren't directly involved with athletics, just visiting students of the university. If some sort of money trail is found linking it to the football program and not just the girl(s) acting alone, that would be the only way there could be trouble. While they're looking, they can find that needle in the haystack too. Theres a book written about Ed Orgeron and his recruiting abilities, so as our recruiting coordinator I seriously doubt he would leave anything out there, if in fact the football program is guilty.
12-09-2009, 06:09 PM
Amun-Ra Wrote:I am not saying Tenn is guilty of anything but if they are in fact paying girls to go and lure recruits to Knoxville what kind of infraction is that? I mean how many secondary violations can you get before you get more than a slap on the wrist?
"Pimpin ain't easy.":girlwink:
12-09-2009, 06:34 PM
The core issue is this:
-If these girls are employed by the Athletic Department and they are making contact (be it physcially or not) UNKNOWINGLY during no contact periods, then that is a secondary violation.
-If these girls are employed by the Athletic Department and they are making contact (be it physcially or not) KNOWINGLY during no contact periods, then that is a violation.
-If these girls really did travel to South Carolina on their own free will and UNKNOWINGLY have illegal contact, that is a secondary violation.
- -If these girls really did travel to South Carolina on their own free will and KNOWINGLY have illegal contact, that is a violation.
- If these girls are swaying a recruits choice by offering up goods (such as liquor, dinner, etc) or "services" (open to interpretation) and they can be traced back to the Athletic Department as a source of the funding, that is a major violation, and fringes on "lack of university control" which could lead to the infamous death penalty.
The key of the investigation is to determine the following:
1. Did these girls have illegal contact with recruits? Secondary
2. Did they know they were having illegal contact? Multiple Secondary
3. Did the University know they were having illegal contact? Violation
4. Did the University advocate the illegal contact? Major Violation
5. Did the University reward these girls for their illegal action? Death Penalty
... and of course... can each of these questions be proven.
Most likely scenario... UT gets like their 82nd Secondary violation and nothing happens for lack of evidence....
-If these girls are employed by the Athletic Department and they are making contact (be it physcially or not) UNKNOWINGLY during no contact periods, then that is a secondary violation.
-If these girls are employed by the Athletic Department and they are making contact (be it physcially or not) KNOWINGLY during no contact periods, then that is a violation.
-If these girls really did travel to South Carolina on their own free will and UNKNOWINGLY have illegal contact, that is a secondary violation.
- -If these girls really did travel to South Carolina on their own free will and KNOWINGLY have illegal contact, that is a violation.
- If these girls are swaying a recruits choice by offering up goods (such as liquor, dinner, etc) or "services" (open to interpretation) and they can be traced back to the Athletic Department as a source of the funding, that is a major violation, and fringes on "lack of university control" which could lead to the infamous death penalty.
The key of the investigation is to determine the following:
1. Did these girls have illegal contact with recruits? Secondary
2. Did they know they were having illegal contact? Multiple Secondary
3. Did the University know they were having illegal contact? Violation
4. Did the University advocate the illegal contact? Major Violation
5. Did the University reward these girls for their illegal action? Death Penalty
... and of course... can each of these questions be proven.
Most likely scenario... UT gets like their 82nd Secondary violation and nothing happens for lack of evidence....
12-09-2009, 06:40 PM
On a side note Boody:
Have you read "Meat Market"?
Interesting read to say the least.. it really outlines the whole recruiting season and the the quirks of Orgeron. But, a critical thing to note is Bruce Feldman writes this as an expose', and not as an investigative article. He basically overviews what he sees with all the doors open for him... but that doesn't mean that there are fine details that he never sees. Maybe Orgeron is scott free...or maybe when the doors were locked and Feldman was at his hotel Orgeron had some other critical conversations... we can't say one way from the other.
I strongly reccomend the book for anyone who enjoys the recruiting landscape.
Have you read "Meat Market"?
Interesting read to say the least.. it really outlines the whole recruiting season and the the quirks of Orgeron. But, a critical thing to note is Bruce Feldman writes this as an expose', and not as an investigative article. He basically overviews what he sees with all the doors open for him... but that doesn't mean that there are fine details that he never sees. Maybe Orgeron is scott free...or maybe when the doors were locked and Feldman was at his hotel Orgeron had some other critical conversations... we can't say one way from the other.
I strongly reccomend the book for anyone who enjoys the recruiting landscape.
12-09-2009, 06:47 PM
I see a little of "He Got Game" going on here.
12-09-2009, 08:04 PM
BloodyHarlanVOL Wrote:I'm under the impression that there will need to be some sort of link to the coaching staff, athletic dept., etc. These girls are actually employed by the admissions office at UT, so they aren't directly involved with athletics, just visiting students of the university. If some sort of money trail is found linking it to the football program and not just the girl(s) acting alone, that would be the only way there could be trouble. While they're looking, they can find that needle in the haystack too. Theres a book written about Ed Orgeron and his recruiting abilities, so as our recruiting coordinator I seriously doubt he would leave anything out there, if in fact the football program is guilty.
It all comes full circle if these girl really have been performing illegal deads in the recruiting no matter what the case is they are employeed by the university which is still a rule for violations. Doesn't matter at this point if they are tied to the athletic department which obvisouly they are in some aspect, if they have been "recruiting" several players by the sound of the article. Thus, any issues that may arise during this investigation will cause UT to be on a close watch. I firmly believe they are guilty but I also believe the case will stand to where with lack of information they will find their way out of this mess with several Secondary Violations.
12-10-2009, 12:10 AM
amun-ra Wrote:is lane kiffin really huggie bear in disguise?
lol
12-10-2009, 12:27 AM
EKUAlum05 Wrote:The core issue is this:
-If these girls are employed by the Athletic Department and they are making contact (be it physcially or not) UNKNOWINGLY during no contact periods, then that is a secondary violation.
-If these girls are employed by the Athletic Department and they are making contact (be it physcially or not) KNOWINGLY during no contact periods, then that is a violation.
-If these girls really did travel to South Carolina on their own free will and UNKNOWINGLY have illegal contact, that is a secondary violation.
- -If these girls really did travel to South Carolina on their own free will and KNOWINGLY have illegal contact, that is a violation.
- If these girls are swaying a recruits choice by offering up goods (such as liquor, dinner, etc) or "services" (open to interpretation) and they can be traced back to the Athletic Department as a source of the funding, that is a major violation, and fringes on "lack of university control" which could lead to the infamous death penalty.
The key of the investigation is to determine the following:
1. Did these girls have illegal contact with recruits? Secondary
2. Did they know they were having illegal contact? Multiple Secondary
3. Did the University know they were having illegal contact? Violation
4. Did the University advocate the illegal contact? Major Violation
5. Did the University reward these girls for their illegal action? Death Penalty
... and of course... can each of these questions be proven.
Most likely scenario... UT gets like their 82nd Secondary violation and nothing happens for lack of evidence....
Great information.. I do know that the girls are not employed by the athletic department, but by the admissions office. One of the South Carolina recruits' father released a statement today about the whole deal. He said that the players invited the girls to come to the game and that he had no knowledge of a sign being held up that said anything about Tennessee, just that it read the player's names. The girls were not dressed in any UT gear and once the game was over both parties went their seperate ways. Also, the game they attended was after the two players had already committed to UT. Take it for what its worth, since his son is committed to the Vols. I'm not sure what the deal is, but I do know that the whole story smells and I'm not sure what or who is behind all of it. Time will tell.
I have not read the book yet EKU, but I've heard it was a pretty interesting book. I plan to check it out.
12-10-2009, 11:27 AM
OK, I thought it was something major.. but it's just hot girls... nothing wrong with that, nice move Kiffin
12-12-2009, 04:01 PM
I hope they find a trail connecting this Volunteer Escort Service to the athletic department and that the NCAA drops the hammer on UT. It is an absolute joke that they have collected secondary violations like kids collect baseball cards and have recieved absolutely no significant punishment from the NCAA. I am sorry but the NCAA is at times like a modern day mafia who ultimately watches out for whoever makes the most money for them and is their most successful product.
12-12-2009, 05:38 PM
Brooks4Prez Wrote:I hope they find a trail connecting this Volunteer Escort Service to the athletic department and that the NCAA drops the hammer on UT. It is an absolute joke that they have collected secondary violations like kids collect baseball cards and have recieved absolutely no significant punishment from the NCAA. I am sorry but the NCAA is at times like a modern day mafia who ultimately watches out for whoever makes the most money for them and is their most successful product.
I agree.
12-14-2009, 01:06 AM
BloodyHarlanVOL Wrote:Also, the game they attended was after the two players had already committed to UT.
Really? When did they sign their LoIs?
12-14-2009, 06:04 PM
They have a good write up about this story on kentuckysportsradio.com....one father said that when he took his son on a recruiting visit there he had to tell one of the "hostesses" to stop rubbing her breast's on himself and his son, he said they were very touchy feely. But lets face it im sure that this happens at a lot of places....you ever seen He Got Game? haha
12-14-2009, 10:09 PM
A CNN/SI reporter posted a photo of two hostesses posing for a picture with two SC recruits following one of their home games. He had taken the picture and didn't even realize he had it.
The worst part of it is the fact that A) Despite some university reports it concludes 100% that the girls were at the game (Secondary violation automatically)
B) One of the hostesses in the picture is the same hostess who had numerous photos pop up on the internet with her alongside Bryce Brown (#1 player in the nation last year who changed his committment very late in the game) when UT was recruiting him. There is a rumor that Brown and this girl actually had a relationship for some time.
The worst part of it is the fact that A) Despite some university reports it concludes 100% that the girls were at the game (Secondary violation automatically)
B) One of the hostesses in the picture is the same hostess who had numerous photos pop up on the internet with her alongside Bryce Brown (#1 player in the nation last year who changed his committment very late in the game) when UT was recruiting him. There is a rumor that Brown and this girl actually had a relationship for some time.
12-15-2009, 01:01 AM
VHSL-helper Wrote:Really? When did they sign their LoIs?
Last I checked, you don't sign a LOI when you COMMIT.. Thats what signing day is for, turkey boy.
12-15-2009, 01:13 AM
EKUAlum05 Wrote:A CNN/SI reporter posted a photo of two hostesses posing for a picture with two SC recruits following one of their home games. He had taken the picture and didn't even realize he had it.
The worst part of it is the fact that A) Despite some university reports it concludes 100% that the girls were at the game (Secondary violation automatically)
B) One of the hostesses in the picture is the same hostess who had numerous photos pop up on the internet with her alongside Bryce Brown (#1 player in the nation last year who changed his committment very late in the game) when UT was recruiting him. There is a rumor that Brown and this girl actually had a relationship for some time.
I'm thinking we'll get another secondary violation over all of this. However, the longer this drags out, the more I'm starting to wonder. There's another report out too about an alumni of a high school in Florida, who works at UT, going with Kiffin to that school and supposedly recruiting. He's not allowed to recruit off campus. The photo puts to rest the part of the story that the girls had a sign that said "Come To Tennessee." Unless there is another photo out there.
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