[Old School Hound]

48%to 33%  ...   I like it !!!  Republicans continue to get it right. Trump is the guy. The MC has  MOE of about 2.2% . 

A new Harvard-Harris poll has Trump up 25 points over Desantis in a crowded GOP field.  When GOP-leaning independent voters are factored in, and it's just a one-on-one fight between Trump and Desantis, it becomes a very close race, with Desantis up 4.   Will the GOP field be a crowded one, like in 2016? That seems to be the key question. If so, Trump is the HEAVY favorite, at this point. If it is just Trump and Desantis, it's an open fight. I don't know if Desantis has the moxie and fight to go toe-to-toe with the dirtiest player in the game,Donald J.Trump.    I'm hoping for a crowded field .


Hopefully, Donald can knock off these pretenders  one by one just like he did in 2016.  I worry, though, that Trump will continue to do crazy things that will erode his support and allow Desantis to take control of the GOP field.  I'm rooting hard for Trump in this one. 

It will be interesting to see what people like Cheney will do to try  to prevent a Trump win. Will also be interesting to see what Trump does if he loses the nomination to Desantis?Will he run a third-party campaign to help sabatage a Desantis victory? Trump is capable of anything. You can bet he will stop at nothing to destroy Desantis.

https://morningconsult.com/2024-gop-prim...n-tracker/


https://floridapolitics.com/archives/577...ded-field/

[jetpilot]

^^^Translation: OSH and most liberals are scared sh!tless of DeSantis, as they should be.

[Old School Hound]

^^^Translation: OSH and most liberals are scared sh!tless of DeSantis, as they should be.

No, OSH, is much smarter than most Democrats. Dumb Washington Democrats have been trying to ruin Trump's chances, when he is actually their biggest ally in keeping the White House. Democrats are notoriously bad at knowing how to win elections.

---

Republicans better clear the field for DeSanta; otherwise, that lump of coal (well, probably not coal) they will have in their stockings two Christmases from now will be courtesy of Grandpa Joe.

[jetpilot]

^^^Translation: OSH and most liberals are scared sh!tless of DeSantis, as they should be.

No, OSH, is much smarter than most Democrats. Dumb Washington Democrats have been trying to ruin Trump's chances, when he is actually their biggest ally in keeping the White House. Democrats are notoriously bad at knowing how to win elections.

---

Republicans better clear the field for DeSanta; otherwise, that lump of coal (well, probably not coal) they will have in their stockings two Christmases from now will be courtesy of Grandpa Joe.

No, he falls for the same propaganda all the other liberals fall for, while never questioning, much less criticizing, his own "leaders." Some examples of dozens, he thinks 200 unarmed protesters walked into one building in DC and almost overthrew the US government. He believed the Russian collusion hoax, Hunter's laptop was Russian disinformation, the fine people hoax, the drink bleach hoax, thinks the 1/6 committee is legit...it never ends. He will believe all future hoaxes his leaders tell him to believe. And once Trump is out of the picture he will be calling DeSantis the devil when his TV tells him to. His opinions have already been assigned to him, he just doesn't realize it.

[Old School Hound]

Hypothetically, if the choice were a binary one between Trump and DeSanta, I would vote for Trump. I think Ron is smarter than Don, and therefore more dangerous.

I 'm encouraging all of my BGR right-leaning friends out there to do what's best for the country and vote for Donald Trump. Send some contributions, as much as you can afford. He loves you, unlike Ron Desantis.

[Hoot Gibson]

DeSantis is the GOP frontrunner already and he has not yet announced that he is a candidate for the presidency. Trump has already tried to tag DeSantis with a childish nickname. DeSantis just ignored the insult and it didn't stick. I really don't expect Trump to be a serious candidate in 2024. 

If DeSantis runs, then you can bet that he will be prepared for Trump to attack him like he attacked Jeb Bush in 2016 and I think that DeSantis is smart enough to ridicule Trump's insults while forcing Trump to defend his record. DeSantis will join Dr. Fauci and Donald Trump at the hip through his 2024 ads if DeSantis decides to run.

[Old School Hound]

Desantis is the frontrunner if he is head-to-head against Trump only but you throw in a dozen or so other hopefuls in the mix and Trump becomes a significant favorite, as the MC and HH polls show. I'm hoping for 12-16 losers like last time so that Trump can knock them off one by one. Hope he has a nickname ready for each one. In the business world, Trump sees any competitor as someone he must destroy. He carries that attitude over into politics. He will attempt to crush and humiliate all those who run against him.

[jetpilot]

Desantis is the frontrunner if he is head-to-head against Trump only but you throw in a dozen or so other hopefuls in the mix and Trump becomes a significant favorite, as the MC and HH polls show. I'm hoping for 12-16 losers like last time so that Trump can knock them off one by one. Hope he has a nickname ready for each one. In the business world, Trump sees any competitor as someone he must destroy. He carries that attitude over into politics. He will attempt to crush and humiliate all those who run against him.

Says the Joe/Kamala guy lol. Nicknames and humiliation won't work this time. Trump has a record to defend now. Republicans want to discuss the issues. Dems want that Maddow dude to tell them what to think.

Several Republicans can demolish the world laughingstock Pres & VP in 2024, especially now that Twitter will no longer be run by the DNC and running Dem lies and propaganda 24/7 while censoring and banning conservatives.

[Old School Hound]

Republicans want to talk about issues( LMAO)... Since when? Hunter's laptop , Hillary's emails, bamboo-laced ballots(lol), drivel, drivel, drivel .....

Anyway, Homophobic slurs aside... Let's talk.

Trump, while losing some support among right-leaning independents, still has a hold on a large percentage of the far right base. They are not going anywhere. Just ask my mother. lol Unless the field is cleared for a Trump-Desantis slugfest, Trump(assuming he wants the nomination and is not imprisoned yet) will be your GOP nominee. If they rig the nomination process so as to not allow him to win(like the Dems rigged it to make it impossible for Bernie to win), I look for Trump to form the Trump Party and siphon off enough votes to make it impossible for the Republican nominee to win. For Trump, winning is everything. If they try to prevent his nomination he will ruin Desantis' or any other Republican's chance. The GOP has a problem in Donald J. Trump. They created the monster and the monster may devour them.

[jetpilot]

Republicans want to talk about issues( LMAO)... Since when?  Hunter's laptop , Hillary's emails,  bamboo-laced ballots(lol), drivel, drivel, drivel .....

Anyway,  Homophobic slurs aside... Let's talk.

Trump, while losing some support among right-leaning independents,  still has a hold on a large percentage of the far right base.  They are not going anywhere. Just ask my mother. lol  Unless the field is cleared for a Trump-Desantis  slugfest, Trump(assuming he wants the nomination and is not imprisoned yet) will be your GOP nominee. If they rig the nomination process so as to not allow him to win(like the Dems rigged it to make it impossible for Bernie to win), I look for Trump to form the Trump Party and siphon off enough votes to make it impossible for the Republican nominee to win. For Trump, winning is everything. If they try to prevent his nomination he will ruin Desantis' or any other Republican's chance. The GOP has a problem in Donald J. Trump. They created the monster and the monster may devour them.

First of all I'm not homophobic. I just wish they would shut TF up already. When heterosexuals talk about their sex life when you don't want to hear about it, it's creepy. But we're subjected to this queer crap 24/7 everywhere we look. Sick of it, sick of hearing about it. Go away an do whatever you want, just go away.

Now about discussing issues, any time I bring that up you run off. Typical lib. You never tried to inform us what Hillary's accomplishments are, and you went silent when I hit you with 1/6 facts. So I will play along again. Make a pitch for a vote for Joe and/or Kamala. What are their accomplishments the last two years? I will wait patiently for your first stab at discussing issues.

[jetpilot]

Republicans want to talk about issues( LMAO)... Since when?  Hunter's laptop , Hillary's emails,  bamboo-laced ballots(lol), drivel, drivel, drivel .....

Anyway,  Homophobic slurs aside... Let's talk.

Trump, while losing some support among right-leaning independents,  still has a hold on a large percentage of the far right base.  They are not going anywhere. Just ask my mother. lol  Unless the field is cleared for a Trump-Desantis  slugfest, Trump(assuming he wants the nomination and is not imprisoned yet) will be your GOP nominee. If they rig the nomination process so as to not allow him to win(like the Dems rigged it to make it impossible for Bernie to win), I look for Trump to form the Trump Party and siphon off enough votes to make it impossible for the Republican nominee to win. For Trump, winning is everything. If they try to prevent his nomination he will ruin Desantis' or any other Republican's chance. The GOP has a problem in Donald J. Trump. They created the monster and the monster may devour them.

While we're at it please list any "crimes" you think Trump committed. Because so far there isn't a speck of evidence of any crime even with every dishonest lib hack on the planet trying to conjure one up for years.

[Granny Bear]

It will NEVER happen, but imagine a ticket with both Trump and DeSantis on it.

[Hoot Gibson]

I really do not want to see Trump on any ticket in the future. He had his shot but it is time for him to exit the stage and I think that more conservatives agree with me than want Trump to have a belated second term in office.

[Hoot Gibson]

Republicans want to talk about issues( LMAO)... Since when?  Hunter's laptop , Hillary's emails,  bamboo-laced ballots(lol), drivel, drivel, drivel .....

Anyway,  Homophobic slurs aside... Let's talk.

Trump, while losing some support among right-leaning independents,  still has a hold on a large percentage of the far right base.  They are not going anywhere. Just ask my mother. lol  Unless the field is cleared for a Trump-Desantis  slugfest, Trump(assuming he wants the nomination and is not imprisoned yet) will be your GOP nominee. If they rig the nomination process so as to not allow him to win(like the Dems rigged it to make it impossible for Bernie to win), I look for Trump to form the Trump Party and siphon off enough votes to make it impossible for the Republican nominee to win. For Trump, winning is everything. If they try to prevent his nomination he will ruin Desantis' or any other Republican's chance. The GOP has a problem in Donald J. Trump. They created the monster and the monster may devour them.

While we're at it please list any "crimes" you think Trump committed. Because so far there isn't a speck of evidence of any crime even with every dishonest lib hack on the planet trying to conjure one up for years.

I have a problem with the allegations that he left office with classified documents. That is the only allegation of a "crime" against Trump that may have some merit. The hypocrisy of liberals who continue to insist that Hillary Clinton committed no crimes by improperly hosting an email server at her home and using a personal email account to shield herself from FOIA requests and destroyed thousands of email messages that had been subpoenaed amazes - yet demand that Trump be prosecuted for possessing documents that his own executive branch classified amazes me. However, the fact that Hillary committed crimes and escaped justice does not make Trump's mishandling of classified documents right.

I don't thing that any government official should retain a security clearance at any level once they leave public office. Access to government secrets should always be given on a "need to know" basis and former government employees have no "need to know." I am not saying that Trump broke any laws, but at the very least he behaved stupidly by moving federal documents to his Florida home.

[Granny Bear]

I agree with that 100%

[jetpilot]

If the documents were that bad their contents would have already been leaked to all the usual outlets and/or the government would have filed charges by now. Whatever was stored in Trump's closet in boxes, at least it couldn't be accessed by our enemies like Hillary's illegal server. Obama took documents too and I don't believe the fake news narrative that it was perfectly fine. If it was a nothingburger with those two it's a nothingburger with Trump. Whatever Trump has in his closet doesn't make the top 1000 problems list in this country. If it was a Democrat you would be called a conspiracy theorist for even asking about it.

[Hoot Gibson]

If the documents were that bad their contents would have already been leaked to all the usual outlets and/or the government would have filed charges by now. Whatever was stored in Trump's closet in boxes, at least it couldn't be accessed by our enemies like Hillary's illegal server. Obama took documents too and I don't believe the fake news narrative that it was perfectly fine. If it was a nothingburger with those two it's a nothingburger with Trump. Whatever Trump has in his closet doesn't make the top 1000 problems list in this country. If it was a Democrat you would be called a conspiracy theorist for even asking about it.

I don't put much credibility into anything that federal investigators claim but I have not heard or read where Trump has denied that he had documents stamped as classified at his Mar-a-Lago home. If he took classified documents home with him as he left office, then it was wrong of him to do so. I don't care if every American president in history did the same thing, it was still wrong, if it happened, just as it would have been wrong for Obama or any other private citizen to have done.

I know that previous presidents have taken documents, which have been deposited in "presidential libraries"  and used as resources for autobiographies. Retired federal politicians have enough perks without taking documents home with them to promote their own presidential legacies after they leave office.

I don't believe in the "everybody does it" defense. Trump has suffered horrible injustices at the hands of crooked politicians who have no respect for the law and I fully support investigating, prosecuting, and punishing the people responsible for those crimes. But, if Trump knowingly took classified documents home with him, then he deserves to suffer the consequences of his actions the same as any other American does. Regardless of whether he is guilty of the allegations or not, I don't want to see him running for president again because I think that this country can do much better.

[TheRealThing]

Republicans want to talk about issues( LMAO)... Since when?  Hunter's laptop , Hillary's emails,  bamboo-laced ballots(lol), drivel, drivel, drivel .....

Anyway,  Homophobic slurs aside... Let's talk.

Trump, while losing some support among right-leaning independents,  still has a hold on a large percentage of the far right base.  They are not going anywhere. Just ask my mother. lol  Unless the field is cleared for a Trump-Desantis  slugfest, Trump(assuming he wants the nomination and is not imprisoned yet) will be your GOP nominee. If they rig the nomination process so as to not allow him to win(like the Dems rigged it to make it impossible for Bernie to win), I look for Trump to form the Trump Party and siphon off enough votes to make it impossible for the Republican nominee to win. For Trump, winning is everything. If they try to prevent his nomination he will ruin Desantis' or any other Republican's chance. The GOP has a problem in Donald J. Trump. They created the monster and the monster may devour them.

THE BOLDED^^
"losing some support among right-leaning independents"
It's fashionable for a lot of people to deny Trump publicly, while planning to vote for him if he gets the nomination. I don't put any credence in main stream media political analysis. They're been consistently wrong since along about 2010.

far right base.
This narrative of there being some vast 'far-right-base' is 99% fabrication. The truth is there is a large percentage of Americans who refuse to be co-opted into the liberal fold. Neither can they be shamed into so doing. Many of them prefer to stay out of the mud fight the left prosecutes on such holdouts, but they will vote conservatively in the booth. The far right as your side insists on tagging such folks, are merely conservatives. The vast majority of them being constitution loving conservatives who therefore value and esteem an orderly society as governed by law; Such has been the norm in this land for the most part up until the various 'Occupy Movements' violence originating under the Obama administration, and which continues up until this day. Nonetheless, the left may feel they have moved on and left conservatives behind, a situation I believe with which conservatives continue to be just fine.

[jetpilot]

If the documents were that bad their contents would have already been leaked to all the usual outlets and/or the government would have filed charges by now. Whatever was stored in Trump's closet in boxes, at least it couldn't be accessed by our enemies like Hillary's illegal server. Obama took documents too and I don't believe the fake news narrative that it was perfectly fine. If it was a nothingburger with those two it's a nothingburger with Trump. Whatever Trump has in his closet doesn't make the top 1000 problems list in this country. If it was a Democrat you would be called a conspiracy theorist for even asking about it.

I don't put much credibility into anything that federal investigators claim but I have not heard or read where Trump has denied that he had documents stamped as classified at his Mar-a-Lago home. If he took classified documents home with him as he left office, then it was wrong of him to do so. I don't care if every American president in history did the same thing, it was still wrong, if it happened, just as it would have been wrong for Obama or any other private citizen to have done.

I know that previous presidents have taken documents, which have been deposited in "presidential libraries"  and used as resources for autobiographies. Retired federal politicians have enough perks without taking documents home with them to promote their own presidential legacies after they leave office.

I don't believe in the "everybody does it" defense. Trump has suffered horrible injustices at the hands of crooked politicians who have no respect for the law and I fully support investigating, prosecuting, and punishing the people responsible for those crimes. But, if Trump knowingly took classified documents home with him, then he deserves to suffer the consequences of his actions the same as any other American does. Regardless of whether he is guilty of the allegations or not, I don't want to see him running for president again because I think that this country can do much better.

And I don't believe in selective prosecution. Regardless, there is no crime charged/prosecution as of yet so it's a moot point.

[Hoot Gibson]

If the documents were that bad their contents would have already been leaked to all the usual outlets and/or the government would have filed charges by now. Whatever was stored in Trump's closet in boxes, at least it couldn't be accessed by our enemies like Hillary's illegal server. Obama took documents too and I don't believe the fake news narrative that it was perfectly fine. If it was a nothingburger with those two it's a nothingburger with Trump. Whatever Trump has in his closet doesn't make the top 1000 problems list in this country. If it was a Democrat you would be called a conspiracy theorist for even asking about it.

I don't put much credibility into anything that federal investigators claim but I have not heard or read where Trump has denied that he had documents stamped as classified at his Mar-a-Lago home. If he took classified documents home with him as he left office, then it was wrong of him to do so. I don't care if every American president in history did the same thing, it was still wrong, if it happened, just as it would have been wrong for Obama or any other private citizen to have done.

I know that previous presidents have taken documents, which have been deposited in "presidential libraries"  and used as resources for autobiographies. Retired federal politicians have enough perks without taking documents home with them to promote their own presidential legacies after they leave office.

I don't believe in the "everybody does it" defense. Trump has suffered horrible injustices at the hands of crooked politicians who have no respect for the law and I fully support investigating, prosecuting, and punishing the people responsible for those crimes. But, if Trump knowingly took classified documents home with him, then he deserves to suffer the consequences of his actions the same as any other American does. Regardless of whether he is guilty of the allegations or not, I don't want to see him running for president again because I think that this country can do much better.

And I don't believe in selective prosecution. Regardless, there is no crime charged/prosecution as of yet so it's a moot point.

I agree 100 percent but Trump taking documents to Florida with him was a political blunder whether it was a crime or not.

I want to see the Biden gang and Hillary behind bars for their crimes and the Trump administration made no progress on that front. There were too many executive orders and too little action that survived the end of Trump's term, IMO. "Lock her up" should have been more than a chant at political rallies. There was also no excuse for the FBI being able to cover up the evidence of the Bidens' criminal activities on Hunter Biden's laptop during Trump's own term in office. The swamp thrived while Trump was in office.

[TheRealThing]

^^ Straighten me out on something. Do not all Presidents remove hundreds, thousands, of documents which wind up being displayed in the Presidential libraries of their namesakes?

[Hoot Gibson]

^^ Straighten me out on something. Do not all Presidents remove hundreds, thousands, of documents which wind up being displayed in the Presidential libraries of their namesakes?

I said as much above. I don't like treating former presidents like kings, regardless of how many of them have been treated like kings in the past. Under no circumstances should presidents be leaving office with classified documents in their possession, IMO. Federal employees, following their retirement or election loss, should have no more right to possess federal documents than any other private American citizen because that is all they are - private American citizens. The notion of a ruling class rubs me the wrong way, as it did those who founded this nation.

[TheRealThing]

These guys have been desperate to charge him with something since before he took office and that is documented fact.

TheWashingtonPost.com Jan 20, 2017 — "At the moment the new commander in chief was sworn in, a campaign to build public support for his impeachment went live."

[Hoot Gibson]

These guys have been desperate to charge him with something since before he took office and that is documented fact.

TheWashingtonPost.com Jan 20, 2017 — "At the moment the new commander in chief was sworn in, a campaign to build public support for his impeachment went live."

Yes, they have been desperate to saddle tramp with some ridiculous charge to prevent him from running again since before he took office and I think many real crimes have been committed as part of those efforts. The people responsible should be prosecuted. But the fact that Trump has been illegally persecuted by his own government is not a good reason to support Trump in his bid for a second term. The presidency is not, nor should it be a consolation prize.

If you believe that Trump is the best-qualified candidate in the GOP to be president, then you should support him in his quest for another term. I will support Trump's bid only if he wins the nomination and only because I have sworn to never support another Democrat politician for the remainder of my lifetime.

With the major exception of restoring some sanity to the Supreme Court, I consider the Trump presidency as a largely wasted four-year opportunity for this country to move forward for a change. Most of the other Trump accomplishments were in areas where progress was quickly reversed when Joe Biden took office. Whoever becomes the next Republican president needs to be capable of making lasting changes to the direction this country is heading through constitutional legislation and Trump has shown that he is not the right person for that job.

[jetpilot]

These guys have been desperate to charge him with something since before he took office and that is documented fact.

TheWashingtonPost.com Jan 20, 2017 — "At the moment the new commander in chief was sworn in, a campaign to build public support for his impeachment went live."

Yes, they have been desperate to saddle tramp with some ridiculous charge to prevent him from running again since before he took office and I think many real crimes have been committed as part of those efforts. The people responsible should be prosecuted. But the fact that Trump has been illegally persecuted by his own government is not a good reason to support Trump in his bid for a second term. The presidency is not, nor should it be a consolation prize.

If you believe that Trump is the best-qualified candidate in the GOP to be president, then you should support him in his quest for another term. I will support Trump's bid only if he wins the nomination and only because I have sworn to never support another Democrat politician for the remainder of my lifetime.

With the major exception of restoring some sanity to the Supreme Court, I consider the Trump presidency as a largely wasted four-year opportunity for this country to move forward for a change. Most of the other Trump accomplishments were in areas where progress was quickly reversed when Joe Biden took office. Whoever becomes the next Republican president needs to be capable of making lasting changes to the direction this country is heading through constitutional legislation and Trump has shown that he is not the right person for that job.

This is where I'm at as well. I have Trump fatigue. I love the way DeSantis destroys liberals at every turn while remaining pretty low-key. Trump exposed a ton of corruption but very little came of it and it has only gotten worse. In fact half the country still refuses to acknowledge any of it *coughcoughOSHcoughcough*. I'm ready to move on. Unless Trump is in charge he really doesn't help much, and I don't like that about him. Not a team player.

[TheRealThing]

Honestly considering what a third election and second term for Trump would actually look like should make any reasonable person shudder. By 2020 the endless dog-piling which characterized the Trump Presidency had been perfected to art form, let alone what one might expect to see the next time around. MAYBE DeSantis has the chin for it. But even with dogged determination and a military-esque sense of purpose and his obviously superior ability to communicate and prosecute a complex line of thought, I can't see things things turning around to any appreciable degree.

I loved Trump's insistence on trade agreements, especially with China and Mexico. And his border policies. And his defense policies. And his economic policies. And his energy policies. I agree his crowning achievement were his SC picks. But I just don't know what to start to expect if he should be elected again.

[jetpilot]

Honestly considering what a third election and second term for Trump would actually look like should make any reasonable person shudder. By 2020 the endless dog-piling which characterized the Trump Presidency had been perfected to art form, let alone what one might expect to see the next time around. MAYBE DeSantis has the chin for it. But even with dogged determination and a military-esque sense of purpose and his obviously superior ability to communicate and prosecute a complex line of thought, I can't see things things turning around to any appreciable degree.

I loved Trump's insistence on trade agreements, especially with China and Mexico. And his border policies. And his defense policies. And his economic policies. And his energy policies. I agree his crowning achievement were his SC picks. But I just don't know what to start to expect if he should be elected again.

Loved all of Trump's policies. That's why the establishment is trying to destroy him.

[LOOKAYANNER]

I voted for Trump in 2016 and 2020, but I’m
switching support to DeSantis for 2024 if he decides to run. Trump cannot win, simply put. Too many factors working against him. The Dems could run about anyone against him (with the exception of Kamala) and defeat him. If the GOP decides to nominate him they might as well start making plans to try to win the White House back in 2028 because it isn’t happening in ‘24.