[64SUR]

Final

[Real baller]

 Eyes on Harlan look at the schedule they have played this team is special. Beat the top 3 teams in the 14th number one team in the 15 and south laurel and now Ashland wow

[16thregioner]

Harlan does appear to be a top 25 team in the state this season. It looks like Jason Mays left behind a punishing schedule as the Tomcats have already lost to Great Crossing, GRC, Bracken, and now Harlan. Maybe that Boyd County win was their Super Bowl?

[The_Messenger]

There is no question that Harlan has played a great schedule and they have beat some very good teams. I agree with the statement they are a Top 25 team.

I know Ashland is only 4-4 on the young season but their schedule is brutal as well. The four teams that have beat Ashland is a combined 31-5 (86.1%) and all the teams are outside the Region. (Harlan 8-0, Bracken Co. 8-1, GRC 6-2 & Great Crossing 9-2) If Ashland doesn't get discouraged with the wins and losses during the regular season, come District & Region time they will be very well prepared.

[LOOKAYANNER]

There is no question that Harlan has played a great schedule and they have beat some very good teams. I agree with the statement they are a Top 25 team.

I know Ashland is only 4-4 on the young season but their schedule is brutal as well. The four teams that have beat Ashland is a combined 31-5 (86.1%) and all the teams are outside the Region. (Harlan 8-0, Bracken Co. 8-1, GRC 6-2 & Great Crossing 9-2) If Ashland doesn't get discouraged with the wins and losses during the regular season, come District & Region time they will be very well prepared.

I agree with this. It is a very demanding schedule but should make the Tomcats tournament tough for the important battles in post season.

[Gridiron_Raid]

Harlan is a definite top 25 team in the state, representing the 13th well can’t wait for them to take on some of the teams in the thirteenth!!

[16thregionballer]

Harlan is good and the schedule is tough. No question there. It will only prepare us for the post season.

[SocratesKy]

There is no question that Harlan has played a great schedule and they have beat some very good teams. I agree with the statement they are a Top 25 team.

I know Ashland is only 4-4 on the young season but their schedule is brutal as well. The four teams that have beat Ashland is a combined 31-5 (86.1%) and all the teams are outside the Region. (Harlan 8-0, Bracken Co. 8-1, GRC 6-2 & Great Crossing 9-2) If Ashland doesn't get discouraged with the wins and losses during the regular season, come District & Region time they will be very well prepared.

District and Region?  This year?  My humble opinion is that their season will end before post season play.  Can’t see KHSAA allowing them in.

[Spud6]

Harlan is a great team that plays extremely hard and are fun to watch. If they are hitting 3’s I think they could shock some folks at Rupp Arena.

[64SUR]

Harlan is a great team that plays extremely hard and are fun to watch. If they are hitting 3’s I think they could shock some folks at Rupp Arena.

You got that right. Harlan reminds me of the 2015 Williamsburg team. Very well could be a dream season for sure.

[LOOKAYANNER]

There is no question that Harlan has played a great schedule and they have beat some very good teams. I agree with the statement they are a Top 25 team.

I know Ashland is only 4-4 on the young season but their schedule is brutal as well. The four teams that have beat Ashland is a combined 31-5 (86.1%) and all the teams are outside the Region. (Harlan 8-0, Bracken Co. 8-1, GRC 6-2 & Great Crossing 9-2) If Ashland doesn't get discouraged with the wins and losses during the regular season, come District & Region time they will be very well prepared.

District and Region?  This year?  My humble opinion is that their season will end before post season play.  Can’t see KHSAA allowing them in.

If that was going to happen it would have already been done. The KHSAA concluded their end of it with the one month recommendation for the coaches’ suspension. Ashland’s superintendent, however, decided to remove the coach and everything has gone forward since. Ashland will be in post season. 100%. But you’re entitled to your humble opinion. I’m sure you mean well.

[SocratesKy]

There is no question that Harlan has played a great schedule and they have beat some very good teams. I agree with the statement they are a Top 25 team.

I know Ashland is only 4-4 on the young season but their schedule is brutal as well. The four teams that have beat Ashland is a combined 31-5 (86.1%) and all the teams are outside the Region. (Harlan 8-0, Bracken Co. 8-1, GRC 6-2 & Great Crossing 9-2) If Ashland doesn't get discouraged with the wins and losses during the regular season, come District & Region time they will be very well prepared.

District and Region?  This year?  My humble opinion is that their season will end before post season play.  Can’t see KHSAA allowing them in.

If that was going to happen it would have already been done. The KHSAA concluded their end of it with the one month recommendation for the coaches’ suspension. Ashland’s superintendent, however, decided to remove the coach and everything has gone forward since. Ashland will be in post season. 100%. But you’re entitled to your humble opinion. I’m sure you mean well.

If the KHSAA "concluded their end", why does the KHSAA respond with it's still an ongoing investigation when questioned?  There has never been a recommendation.   I mean well for the rest of the region that is still unfairly playing against recruited players.

[The_Messenger]

I’m kind of with Lookayanner on this topic. I don’t think there will be a post-season ban this year.

The KHSAA’s “further investigation” was concluded prior to the start of the season. The results of that investigation was forwarded to Ashland prior to the start of the season. That is why Ashland made the decision they made. With that being said, I think it would be extremely unprofessional for the KHSAA to tell Ashland to make a decision on the “investigation findings” by Nov. 25th when they were not willing to make a decision on the same “Investigation findings”. I can see the KHSAA vacating wins over the past 3 years if they can “prove” players were recruited. The tape proved the prior coach tried to recruit players. But the players the tape proves he tried to recruit didn’t play in games. I don’t figure the kids or parents currently in the program are going to admit they were recruited. Without that admission I think it would to pretty hard to penalty players without “proof”.

But we are talking about the KHSAA and they are known for unprofessional decisions. Nothing from the KHSAA would surprise me.

[SocratesKy]

I’m kind of with Lookayanner on this topic. I don’t think there will be a post-season ban this year.

The KHSAA’s “further investigation” was concluded prior to the start of the season. The results of that investigation  was forwarded to Ashland prior to the start of the season.  That is why Ashland made the decision they made. With that being said, I think it would be extremely unprofessional for the KHSAA to tell Ashland to make a decision on the “investigation findings” by Nov. 25th when they were not willing to make a decision on the same “Investigation findings”. I can see the KHSAA vacating wins over the past 3 years if they can “prove” players were recruited. The tape proved the prior coach tried to recruit players. But the players the tape proves he tried to recruit didn’t play in games. I don’t figure the kids or parents currently in the program are going to admit they were recruited. Without that admission I think it would to pretty hard to penalty players without “proof”.

But we are talking about the KHSAA and they are known for unprofessional decisions.  Nothing from the KHSAA would surprise me.

No offense, but you seem to be disconnected. They are CURRENTLY stating that this is an ongoing investigation and will be wrapped up prior to the post-season. It was Ashland's decision, not the KHSAA, to fire the coach. Feel free to call the KHSAA for yourself, or just go back and listen to the Ashland parent meeting. Also, you should go back and listen to the recruiting recording. That alone shows key kids on the current team were recruited. In addition, only the KHSAA investigators know what has been uncovered since. Recruited kids are playing against teams that did not recruit, obviously that is unfair.

[The_Messenger]

No disrespect but I’m a “little” more connected than you might know!! Lol!!! I have direct connection to people that were in the “further investigation” so you may want to check your facts before you say “disconnected”! Lol!! ???

[SocratesKy]

Just because you or someone else says or post something doesn't mean it is true. Please contact the KHSAA yourself Wednesday morning and you can hear it from the horse's mouth. This is still an ongoing investigation planned to be wrapped up prior to post season play. You don't have to be a reporter or journalist. They will also reply to an email if you choose to send one as well. They will give you no other comment. I know it isn't what you want to hear, sorry.

[The_Messenger]

You are exactly correct just because "YOU" or "I" post something does not make it a true. The only truth you have added to the situation is the KHSAA will answer your question about the Ashland recruiting violations with the response "It is an on going investigation". It is only on going because they have not made a public statement on the situation. They have concluded their interviews with all the other people they wanted to talk to. (Truth) So there really is no excuse for them to not make a public statement and hand out their punishment. I hope everybody had a "Merry Christmas".

[SocratesKy]

You are exactly correct just because "YOU" or "I" post something does not make it a true. The only truth you have added to the situation is the KHSAA will answer your question about the Ashland recruiting violations with the response "It is an on going investigation".  It is only on going because they have not made a public statement on the situation. They have concluded their interviews with all the other people they wanted to talk to. (Truth)  So there really is no excuse for them to not make a public statement and hand out their punishment.  I hope everybody had a "Merry Christmas".

Just curious, why do you think the KHSAA would say this is an ongoing investigation planned to be complete before post season play?  It sounds like you translate that into hey nothing to see here, the investigation is over?  You have changed your story from you knowing the investigation is over to they have concluded interviews. How does anybody know that they have concluded interviews?  I can understand they have been interviewed, but obviously there are possibly more clarification needed based on subsequent interviews.  I'm basing MY RATIONAL OPINION on the KHSAA statement along with them continuing to play with recruited players. To me logic would say the reference to post season play timeframe is significant as well. Good luck on your next game.

[The_Messenger]

"Good Luck on your next game"?? No offense but you seem to be disconnected. LOL!!!! I'm not sure what you think you know but I don't have a next game. LOL!!!!!

As far as changing my story ... Nope! It's the same as it's always been. Now you may try to change my story to meet the narrative you want to spin but that is on you .... not on me. You can believe what you want and I will believe what I'm told by people involved.

Please respond to this so you can have the last word. I'm done with it because it doesn't matter to me about the penalty phase. I already know nothing will change between now and when they announce the penalty.

[16thregioner]

"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing." - Socrates

Socrates continued placement of the phrase that "Ashland continues to play with recruited players" in his posts is revealing that Socrates has a vendetta against Ashland and will gain joy by seeing Ashland banned from the postseason this year.

The fact is that the recorded call proves only that Mays was trying to recruit Spurlock, a player who never played for Ashland. List one other exact quote from the call that proves Mays recruited any player on the current Ashland roster. You can't.

[SocratesKy]

"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing."  - Socrates

Socrates continued placement of the phrase that "Ashland continues to play with recruited players" in his posts is revealing that Socrates has a vendetta against Ashland and will gain joy by seeing Ashland banned from the postseason this year.

The fact is that the recorded call proves only that Mays was trying to recruit Spurlock, a player who never played for Ashland.  List one other exact quote from the call that proves Mays recruited any player on the current Ashland roster.  You can't.

Vendetta against Ashland? Not at all. Does everyone that Ashland plays or is scheduled to play feel they are getting a fair shake? No way!  Again, only Ashland homers feel like this is water under the bridge.

---

"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing."  - Socrates

Socrates continued placement of the phrase that "Ashland continues to play with recruited players" in his posts is revealing that Socrates has a vendetta against Ashland and will gain joy by seeing Ashland banned from the postseason this year.

The fact is that the recorded call proves only that Mays was trying to recruit Spurlock, a player who never played for Ashland.  List one other exact quote from the call that proves Mays recruited any player on the current Ashland roster.  You can't.

Vendetta against Ashland? Not at all. Does everyone that Ashland plays or is scheduled to play feel they are getting a fair shake? No way!  Again, only Ashland homers feel like this is water under the bridge.

Listen to the tape I'm not putting kid's names on a forum.  It's clear, very clear.

---

"Good Luck on your next game"??  No offense but you seem to be disconnected. LOL!!!!    I'm not sure what you think you know but I don't have a next game. LOL!!!!! 

As far as changing my story ... Nope! It's the same as it's always been. Now you may try to change my story to meet the narrative you want to spin but that is on you .... not on me. You can believe what you want and I will believe what I'm told by people involved.

Please respond to this so you can have the last word. I'm done with it because it doesn't matter to me about the penalty phase. I already know nothing will change between now and when they announce the penalty.

Yes you changed your story. If it doesn't matter to you then why would you comment in the first place. You are tripping over your own words. You are no more informed than what you read on the internet.

[16thregionballer]

"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing."  - Socrates

Socrates continued placement of the phrase that "Ashland continues to play with recruited players" in his posts is revealing that Socrates has a vendetta against Ashland and will gain joy by seeing Ashland banned from the postseason this year.

The fact is that the recorded call proves only that Mays was trying to recruit Spurlock, a player who never played for Ashland.  List one other exact quote from the call that proves Mays recruited any player on the current Ashland roster.  You can't.

If you listened to it you would know that BC PG was recruited as well. Mays clearly states Brian Lemaster is handling that for him. Quote Mays. In addition to he spoke with his father the same way he did Spurlock. lastly he stated a third time I quote. “Let me get a better grip on the Deboard situation “. You would have to be Helen Keller or Stevie Ray not to see or hear that. The Greenup kid could be a case on how to circumvent the khsaa like mays quotes in the audio. You May need a refresher on it. Regardless it is still active from what I have been told as well and the parents and kids are anxious. I wish they’d just get it over with already and let’s see what we are facing.

[16thregioner]

If you listened to it you would know that BC PG was recruited as well. Mays clearly states Brian Lemaster is handling that for him. Quote Mays. In addition to he spoke with his father the same way he did Spurlock. lastly he stated a third time I quote. “Let me get a better grip on the Deboard situation “. You would have to be Helen Keller or Stevie Ray not to see or hear that. The Greenup kid could be a case on how to circumvent the khsaa like mays quotes in the audio. You May need a refresher on it. Regardless it is still active from what I have been told as well and the parents and kids are anxious. I wish they’d just get it over with already and let’s see what we are facing.

I disagree with you that Mays admitted to recruiting Deboard.  He told Spurlock he would try to find out if Deboard was coming to Ashland via Lemaster since he was friends with the parent.  He only told him this because Spurlock insisted on trying to find out if Deboard was coming there.  It sounded as if Mays honestly didn’t know if Deboard was coming to Ashland. 

As for Carter, I don’t hear anything on the call that indicates Mays recruited him.  He just tells Spurlock that Carter came to Ashland before his freshman year just like Porter did.  He factually states that anything you do prior to that year is OK with the KHSAA.  He never says anything about trying to get Carter to come to Ashland.

Sounds like we are hearing the same words and getting different meanings.  That’s OK. I have seen enough to see the 16th is a 2 horse race this season between Ashland and Boyd.  If the KHSAA doesn’t intervene, Ashland will win the region.  If the KHSAA bans Ashland from the postseason, Boyd will win the region.

[SocratesKy]

If you listened to it you would know that BC PG was recruited as well. Mays clearly states Brian Lemaster is handling that for him. Quote Mays. In addition to he spoke with his father the same way he did Spurlock. lastly he stated a third time I quote. “Let me get a better grip on the Deboard situation “. You would have to be Helen Keller or Stevie Ray not to see or hear that. The Greenup kid could be a case on how to circumvent the khsaa like mays quotes in the audio. You May need a refresher on it. Regardless it is still active from what I have been told as well and the parents and kids are anxious. I wish they’d just get it over with already and let’s see what we are facing.

I disagree with you that Mays admitted to recruiting Deboard.  He told Spurlock he would try to find out if Deboard was coming to Ashland via Lemaster since he was friends with the parent.  He only told him this because Spurlock insisted on trying to find out if Deboard was coming there.  It sounded as if Mays honestly didn’t know if Deboard was coming to Ashland. 

As for Carter, I don’t hear anything on the call that indicates Mays recruited him.  He just tells Spurlock that Carter came to Ashland before his freshman year just like Porter did.  He factually states that anything you do prior to that year is OK with the KHSAA.  He never says anything about trying to get Carter to come to Ashland.

Sounds like we are hearing the same words and getting different meanings.  That’s OK. I have seen enough to see the 16th is a 2 horse race this season between Ashland and Boyd.  If the KHSAA doesn’t intervene, Ashland will win the region.  If the KHSAA bans Ashland from the postseason, Boyd will win the region.

No doubt you are an Ashland Homer or didn't listen to the recording.  There is no different meaning unless you are just wanting this to go away.  I would much rather see any team including Boyd that did not run a systematic marketing and recruiting program within their High School basketball program.  To any other team, Boyd down to Greenup, it is embarrassing for the 16th region to have a team that acted in this manner.

---

I was in a conversation with two coaches from 10th region that are in charge of very successful programs. Both coaches were very familiar with the Ashland program and stated they were floored after hearing the recording at how much they knowingly and willingly went against KHSAA rules on recruiting. And yes they saw no way in the world they would not see at least one post season ban but were guessing two because they continued to play with recruited players.

[16thregionballer]

If you listened to it you would know that BC PG was recruited as well. Mays clearly states Brian Lemaster is handling that for him. Quote Mays. In addition to he spoke with his father the same way he did Spurlock. lastly he stated a third time I quote. “Let me get a better grip on the Deboard situation “. You would have to be Helen Keller or Stevie Ray not to see or hear that. The Greenup kid could be a case on how to circumvent the khsaa like mays quotes in the audio. You May need a refresher on it. Regardless it is still active from what I have been told as well and the parents and kids are anxious. I wish they’d just get it over with already and let’s see what we are facing.

I disagree with you that Mays admitted to recruiting Deboard.  He told Spurlock he would try to find out if Deboard was coming to Ashland via Lemaster since he was friends with the parent.  He only told him this because Spurlock insisted on trying to find out if Deboard was coming there.  It sounded as if Mays honestly didn’t know if Deboard was coming to Ashland. 

As for Carter, I don’t hear anything on the call that indicates Mays recruited him.  He just tells Spurlock that Carter came to Ashland before his freshman year just like Porter did.  He factually states that anything you do prior to that year is OK with the KHSAA.  He never says anything about trying to get Carter to come to Ashland.

Sounds like we are hearing the same words and getting different meanings.  That’s OK. I have seen enough to see the 16th is a 2 horse race this season between Ashland and Boyd.  If the KHSAA doesn’t intervene, Ashland will win the region.  If the KHSAA bans Ashland from the postseason, Boyd will win the region.

I disagree. Mays tells Spurlock that Brian Lemaster is handling the Deboard situation.  If you look at that’s sentence alone objectively.  That’s one of his assist coaches  handling a player at another school. At a minimum it’s contact.  Mays is quoted saying I Spoke with players dad.  Again another violation of Bylaw 16.  IMO. That is more damaging the him recruiting the 8th grader. Simply because he openly states those two things happens and the player magically shows up a week before school is out. The systematic way he told other players that didn’t come and some that did. You’d have to be an absolute idiot to think that’s not enough evidence.  Again IMO.  I will gladly agree to disagree. I think a real problem is why is the KHSAA dragging this out. Having it hanging over the kids/coaches heads?  How does Brian Lemaster still get to coach with Mays saying he was handling the player from Boyd who transferred?  Opinions!?

[LOOKAYANNER]

Post #23 by 16thregioner explains it perfectly. There is nothing on the audio that offers proof that any of the players currently at Ashland or in the past have been recruited. It’s just the way some of these posters want to paint it and add their own twist. There’s a small group constantly posting on here that are interjecting their own interpretations of the call and taking a lot of dramatic license, a term occasionally used in movies. They use certain word and terms, such as “blatant”, “recruiting”, “cheating”, etc, over and over in posts with the hopes if they continue saying them enough that it will make their slant seem true to readers.
Mays’ violation is speaking to Spurlock, which is contact and a violation of Bylaw 16, regardless if he wasn’t even the caller. That’s it in a nutshell….impermissible contact. That’s not recruiting. But he did answer the phone and was drawn into a conversation. He should have immediately referred him to the Principal or guidance office to answer his questions and politely said goodbye. But alas he didn’t. Friendly guy and too nice for his own good. So now he’s not the coach and that’s okay. I’m sure he will probably coach somewhere else in the future. Right now he continues working at the school and has more time to enjoy his family. I wish him the best. And I will be rooting for the Ashland Tomcats come February to win another regional championship and make it back to Rupp. GO TOMCATS!!!!

[16thregionballer]

Post #23 by 16thregioner explains it perfectly. There is nothing on the audio that offers proof that any of the players currently at Ashland or in the past have been recruited.    It’s just the way some of these posters want to paint it and add their own twist.  There’s a small group constantly posting on here that are interjecting their own interpretations of the call and taking a lot of dramatic license, a term occasionally used in movies. They use certain word and terms, such as “blatant”, “recruiting”, “cheating”, etc, over and over in posts with the hopes if they continue saying them enough that it will make their slant seem true to readers.
Mays’ violation is speaking to Spurlock, which is contact and a violation of Bylaw 16, regardless if he wasn’t even the caller. That’s it in a nutshell….impermissible contact. That’s not recruiting. But he did answer the phone and was drawn into a conversation.  He should have immediately referred him to the Principal or guidance office to answer his questions and politely said goodbye. But alas he didn’t. Friendly guy and too nice for his own good. So now he’s not the coach and that’s okay. I’m sure he will probably coach somewhere else in the future. Right now he continues working at the school and has more time to enjoy his family. I wish him the best. And I will be rooting for the Ashland Tomcats come February to win another regional championship and make it back to Rupp. GO TOMCATS!!!!

Yeah. Campbell tried to play it off like you are doing. Khsaa politely said you may want to actually do an investigation. Based off additional findings. Then Campbell fired him.

[i82much]

Been out of town, first for my retirement job and then for Christmas. While trying to catch up on my love for 16th region sports I click on this thread looking for game discussion between Harlan and Ashland only to find out the chatter has regressed to the same old crap. If you must continue with the bickering do it on the threads dealing directly with the subject or start a new thread so unsuspecting old guys or innocent Harlan fans don't have to listen to the relentless babbling.

[LOOKAYANNER]

There is no question that Harlan has played a great schedule and they have beat some very good teams. I agree with the statement they are a Top 25 team.

I know Ashland is only 4-4 on the young season but their schedule is brutal as well. The four teams that have beat Ashland is a combined 31-5 (86.1%) and all the teams are outside the Region. (Harlan 8-0, Bracken Co. 8-1, GRC 6-2 & Great Crossing 9-2) If Ashland doesn't get discouraged with the wins and losses during the regular season, come District & Region time they will be very well prepared.

District and Region?  This year?  My humble opinion is that their season will end before post season play.  Can’t see KHSAA allowing them in.

If that was going to happen it would have already been done. The KHSAA concluded their end of it with the one month recommendation for the coaches’ suspension. Ashland’s superintendent, however, decided to remove the coach and everything has gone forward since. Ashland will be in post season. 100%. But you’re entitled to your humble opinion. I’m sure you mean well.

If the KHSAA "concluded their end", why does the KHSAA respond with it's still an ongoing investigation when questioned?  There has never been a recommendation.   I mean well for the rest of the region that is still unfairly playing against recruited players.

Been out of town, first for my retirement job and then for Christmas. While trying to catch up on my love for 16th region sports I click on this thread looking for game discussion between Harlan and Ashland only to find out the chatter has regressed to the same old crap. If you must continue with the bickering do it on the threads dealing directly with the subject or start a new thread so unsuspecting old guys or innocent Harlan fans don't have to listen to the relentless babbling.

You are so very on spot 182much. I apologize for being part of getting this thread off it’s original message.

[16thregionballer]

Been out of town, first for my retirement job and then for Christmas. While trying to catch up on my love for 16th region sports I click on this thread looking for game discussion between Harlan and Ashland only to find out the chatter has regressed to the same old crap. If you must continue with the bickering do it on the threads dealing directly with the subject or start a new thread so unsuspecting old guys or innocent Harlan fans don't have to listen to the relentless babbling.

Lol. What do you think this site is on any thread!!  Welcome back !