[The Outsider]

70 percent of the precincts in Wayne County, Michigan, had more votes counted than the number of ballots cast. Two Republican members of the canvassing board refused to go along with the two Democrat members, who wanted to certify the count. In response, the two Democrats doxxed the two Republican members. One of them encouraged people to go to their homes and to "share their anger." The other one gave the name of the school that one of the Republican's children attends and implied that the kids' black classmates will be upset when they find out what their mother did.

Why is it that so many Democrat politicians believe that harassment and violence are valid actions to settle political disputes in this country?

Wayne County had a voter turnout of 62%, so mathematically, that's not really possible.

There is no excuse for the threats.

[Hoot Gibson]

70 percent of the precincts in Wayne County, Michigan, had more votes counted than the number of ballots cast. Two Republican members of the canvassing board refused to go along with the two Democrat members, who wanted to certify the count. In response, the two Democrats doxxed the two Republican members. One of them encouraged people to go to their homes and to "share their anger." The other one gave the name of the school that one of the Republican's children attends and implied that the kids' black classmates will be upset when they find out what their mother did.

Why is it that so many Democrat politicians believe that harassment and violence are valid actions to settle political disputes in this country?

Wayne County had a voter turnout of 62%, so mathematically, that's not really possible.

There is no excuse for the threats.

In a fair election, competently run, with no fraud, it is not possible. That is the point. The two numbers should match exactly. However, if you use your imagination, it is not hard to think of reasons why there might be more votes than ballots. Come on, man, think! 

[TheRealThing]

^^ There were more votes counted than ballots cast because they cheated. Some on the left may feign support for an honest election as long as the string pullers go about resisting audits and other forms of validating the process. But there is little to nothing by way of substance to support their professed interest in getting to the truth. Point being they resist because they know something untoward will be found.

[mr.fundamental]

See my point to all of this what is being said in court. It is great to say whatever out in public. You have the right. You could scream the sky is orange and you have that right to do so.
However, if you say that a crime is being committed under oath, well that is something different. There is a reason why President Trump is losing that battle.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/...uxbndlbing

I know you will say Liberal source, but none the less it is a source... if you can disprove what I am putting out there in each of the cases cited. I will gladly stand corrected. Not an opinion, I prefer the transcripts. However, if what I have stated is true. I would think the same idea should be extended.

Enjoy.

[Hoot Gibson]

^^ You are right about one thing, you cited a very liberal source - one that I do not read by choice. Why do liberals not rely more on their own eyes, ears, and brains? Never in the history of American presidential elections have five states suspend vote counting on election night. Have you heard any credible explanation of why that happened? Have you heard any credible explanation about the large number of Biden votes that appeared the following morning to wipe out large Trump leads? Do you know what the odds are of more than 100,000 ballots in multiple instances consisting of 98 to 100 percent Biden votes? Can you think of any reason that far more ballots contained votes for Biden but no down ticket votes, compared to Trump ballots that contained no down ticket votes for any candidate?

Sidney Powell is a very respected attorney with a sterling reputation. She has challenged Dominion Voting Systems to sue her for her allegations against the company. Do you know why she did so and why it is very unlikely that Dominion will sue her? She has also accused of the Republican Governor and Secretary of State of accepting kickbacks and/or payments to family members and accepting "election insurance" for their role in getting the state of Georgia to purchase $100 million worth of voting machines from Dominion. Do you have any idea why she is not afraid of them suing her?

Likewise, L. Lynn Wood has made similar allegations. The attorney that has made a fortune from representing clients in defamation suits would not be making those kind of allegations if he was not very confident about the strength of the evidence that he has.

You may not be aware of this fact, but servers used to count votes or back up the counts have been seized in Frankfurt, Germany. The Trump lawyers have not disclosed who now has custody of those servers. There are also servers located in Barcelona, Spain. If the Trump team has access to those servers, then it should be easy to prove or disprove the allegations that Powell and others have made.

I skimmed a the first few pages of the article that you posted and did not find it credible or objective. When a news article starts with the authors conclusion and then sets out to find people who agree with that conclusion, it is more akin to an editorial than an article.

The Pennsylvania issues, as well as the Dominion allegations will almost certainly be decided by the Supreme Court. The Trump legal team is not going to put all of its cards on the table until then.

I just listened to a fairly long interview of Sidney Powell on the Larry O'Connor Show, which airs on a local DC radio station. She indicated that she suspects that both parties have benefited from Dominion fixing elections in the past. So, I would not be too swayed by the fact that some Republicans have been attacking Trump for not conceding.

[The Outsider]

^^ You are right about one thing, you cited a very liberal source - one that I do not read by choice. Why do liberals not rely more on their own eyes, ears, and brains? Never in the history of American presidential elections have five states suspend vote counting on election night. Have you heard any credible explanation of why that happened? Have you heard any credible explanation about the large number of Biden votes that appeared the following morning to wipe out large Trump leads? Do you know what the odds are of more than 100,000 ballots in multiple instances consisting of 98 to 100 percent Biden votes? Can you think of any reason that far more ballots contained votes for Biden but no down ticket votes, compared to Trump ballots that contained no down ticket votes for any candidate?

Sidney Powell is a very respected attorney with a sterling reputation. She has challenged Dominion Voting Systems to sue her for her allegations against the company. Do you know why she did so and why it is very unlikely that Dominion will sue her? She has also accused of the Republican Governor and Secretary of State of accepting kickbacks and/or payments to family members and accepting "election insurance" for their role in getting the state of Georgia to purchase $100 million worth of voting machines from Dominion. Do you have any idea why she is not afraid of them suing her?

Likewise, L. Lynn Wood has made similar allegations. The attorney that has made a fortune from representing clients in defamation suits would not be making those kind of allegations if he was not very confident about the strength of the evidence that he has.

You may not be aware of this fact, but servers used to count votes or back up the counts have been seized in Frankfurt, Germany. The Trump lawyers have not disclosed who now has custody of those servers. There are also servers located in Barcelona, Spain. If the Trump team has access to those servers, then it should be easy to prove or disprove the allegations that Powell and others have made.

I skimmed a the first few pages of the article that you posted and did not find it credible or objective. When a news article starts with the authors conclusion and then sets out to find people who agree with that conclusion, it is more akin to an editorial than an article.

The Pennsylvania issues, as well as the Dominion allegations will almost certainly be decided by the Supreme Court. The Trump legal team is not going to put all of its cards on the table until then.

I just listened to a fairly long interview of Sidney Powell on the Larry O'Connor Show, which airs on a local DC radio station. She indicated that she suspects that both parties have benefited from Dominion fixing elections in the past. So, I would not be too swayed by the fact that some Republicans have been attacking Trump for not conceding.

Powell stated that the down ticket Republicans and Democrats cheated in this election. I'm not sure that this lady has all her faculties.

[Hoot Gibson]

[Hoot Gibson]

Here is a long interview of Sidney Powell by Howie Carr. Powell says that she plans to begin filing suits in multiple federal courts by the end of next week. She also reveals that Dominion has not only closed their Toronto office but also their large office in Denver. BTW, Dominion is a Canadian company but is not used anywhere in Canadian elections.

[The Outsider]

Pennsylvania lawsuit to invalidate 7 million votes was dismissed today by a US District Judge.

---

So that got me wondering: What would a more comprehensive comparison look like? What would the US death toll be like if the country had the same rate of Covid-19 deaths as some other wealthy nations, accounting for population differences?

The results, based on Our World in Data, are staggering:

If the US had the same death rate as the European Union overall, nearly 84,000 Americans wouldn’t have died from Covid-19 (out of the nearly 190,000 who have died so far).
If the US had the same death rate as Canada, nearly 109,000 Americans wouldn’t have died from Covid-19.
If the US had the same death rate as Germany, more than 152,000 Americans wouldn’t have died from Covid-19.
If the US had the same death rate as Australia, more than 179,000 Americans wouldn’t have died from Covid-19.
If the US had the same death rate as Japan, more than 185,000 Americans wouldn’t have died from Covid-19.

[Hoot Gibson]

Most of the battleground state elections that the Trump legal team will be contesting are located in jurisdictions of federal Circuit Courts of Appeal that have been assigned to conservative justices.

[Van Hagar]

So in other words you’re insinuating these conservative judges are going to rule in Trump’s favor despite no evidence being presented? Hmmmm....that would seem to be more corrupt than anything you’ve accused anyone of doing so far. I guess if you can live with winning an election that way go for it. Just own it and drop the holier-than-thou stance.

[Hoot Gibson]

So in other words you’re insinuating these conservative judges are going to rule in Trump’s favor despite no evidence being presented? Hmmmm....that would seem to be more corrupt than anything you’ve accused anyone of doing so far.  I guess  if you can live with winning an election that way go for it. Just own it and drop the holier-than-thou stance.

No, that is not what I am saying but I am not inclined to waste my time explaining the role that the Supreme Court Justices play in the appeals process. The information is readily available for anybody who has any real intellectual curiosity. Google it for yourself.

[Van Hagar]

That’s exactly what you’re saying. You’re saying because these justices are Republican appointed, they are beholding to the Republican Party, facts and points of law be damned. Won’t happen though, you all aren’t stealing this one, Hoot.
And by the way, I would crush you on Jeopardy.

[Hoot Gibson]

That’s exactly what you’re saying.  You’re saying because these justices are Republican appointed, they are beholding to the Republican Party, facts and points of law be damned.  Won’t happen though, you all aren’t stealing this one, Hoot.
  And by the way, I would crush you on Jeopardy.

Liar. I posted a tweet without comment. You are much, much smarter than you seem if you could crush me on Jeopardy. Joe Biden likes to boast about his towering intellect too. 

[Van Hagar]

Oh, you have no idea. Right, JP? I won’t be texting anymore today, I have Mensa meetings scheduled.

[The Outsider]

That’s exactly what you’re saying.  You’re saying because these justices are Republican appointed, they are beholding to the Republican Party, facts and points of law be damned.  Won’t happen though, you all aren’t stealing this one, Hoot.
  And by the way, I would crush you on Jeopardy.

I have to agree with you, there is no other way to interpret it.  Someone in the GOP needs to stand up and try to end this insanity before our Democracy is forever stained by a spoiled brat who has cheated and lied his way to the top, and doesn't want to lose his power.

[Hoot Gibson]

Oh, you have no idea. Right, JP? I won’t be texting anymore today, I have Mensa meetings scheduled.

It's been my experience that people who are so insecure that they publicly brag about their own intelligence are not actually very bright at all. Geniuses do not need other people to vouch for their intelligence. If it will make you feel better about yourself, I will gladly call you Mr. Genius henceforth.

[Hoot Gibson]

That’s exactly what you’re saying.  You’re saying because these justices are Republican appointed, they are beholding to the Republican Party, facts and points of law be damned.  Won’t happen though, you all aren’t stealing this one, Hoot.
  And by the way, I would crush you on Jeopardy.

I have to agree with you, there is no other way to interpret it.  Someone in the GOP needs to stand up and try to end this insanity before our Democracy is forever stained by a spoiled brat who has cheated and lied his way to the top, and doesn't want to lose his power.

Did you feel the same way when Al Gore refused to accept multiple recounts of the results of a single county, until the Supreme Court put a stop to the Florida recounts 36 days after the election of George W. Bush?

[Hoot Gibson]

That’s exactly what you’re saying.  You’re saying because these justices are Republican appointed, they are beholding to the Republican Party, facts and points of law be damned.  Won’t happen though, you all aren’t stealing this one, Hoot.
  And by the way, I would crush you on Jeopardy.

I have to agree with you, there is no other way to interpret it.  Someone in the GOP needs to stand up and try to end this insanity before our Democracy is forever stained by a spoiled brat who has cheated and lied his way to the top, and doesn't want to lose his power.

Did you feel the same way when Al Gore refused to accept multiple recounts of the results of a single county, until the Supreme Court put a stop to the Florida recounts 36 days after the election of George W. Bush?

^^ "county" should have been "state" in my previous post.

[The Outsider]

That’s exactly what you’re saying.  You’re saying because these justices are Republican appointed, they are beholding to the Republican Party, facts and points of law be damned.  Won’t happen though, you all aren’t stealing this one, Hoot.
  And by the way, I would crush you on Jeopardy.

I have to agree with you, there is no other way to interpret it.  Someone in the GOP needs to stand up and try to end this insanity before our Democracy is forever stained by a spoiled brat who has cheated and lied his way to the top, and doesn't want to lose his power.

Did you feel the same way when Al Gore refused to accept multiple recounts of the results of a single county, until the Supreme Court put a stop to the Florida recounts 36 days after the election of George W. Bush?

Gore had a much better case than Trump, and handled his defeat 1000 times better than trump has.

---

Some Republicans are speaking out, although most are still too afraid of Trump's base to do so since their #1 goal is to get re-elected.

Some of Trump's fellow Republicans in Congress are now breaking ranks though many, including the most senior ones, have not.

Republican Senator Pat Toomey on Saturday said Brann's ruling "exhausted all plausible legal options" for Trump in Pennsylvania, and he urged the president to "accept the outcome of the election." Toomey also congratulated Biden and Vice President-elect Kamala Harris and referred to them as "dedicated public servants."

Liz Cheney, a member of the Republican leadership team in the House of Representatives, earlier called on Trump to immediately present evidence of widespread voter fraud or otherwise respect "the sanctity of our electoral process."

[Hoot Gibson]

That’s exactly what you’re saying.  You’re saying because these justices are Republican appointed, they are beholding to the Republican Party, facts and points of law be damned.  Won’t happen though, you all aren’t stealing this one, Hoot.
  And by the way, I would crush you on Jeopardy.

I have to agree with you, there is no other way to interpret it.  Someone in the GOP needs to stand up and try to end this insanity before our Democracy is forever stained by a spoiled brat who has cheated and lied his way to the top, and doesn't want to lose his power.

Did you feel the same way when Al Gore refused to accept multiple recounts of the results of a single county, until the Supreme Court put a stop to the Florida recounts 36 days after the election of George W. Bush?

Gore had a much better case than Trump, and handled his defeat 1000 times better than trump has.

---

Some Republicans are speaking out, although most are still too afraid of Trump's base to do so since their #1 goal is to get re-elected.

Some of Trump's fellow Republicans in Congress are now breaking ranks though many, including the most senior ones, have not.

Republican Senator Pat Toomey on Saturday said Brann's ruling "exhausted all plausible legal options" for Trump in Pennsylvania, and he urged the president to "accept the outcome of the election." Toomey also congratulated Biden and Vice President-elect Kamala Harris and referred to them as "dedicated public servants."

Liz Cheney, a member of the Republican leadership team in the House of Representatives, earlier called on Trump to immediately present evidence of widespread voter fraud or otherwise respect "the sanctity of our electoral process."

Gore had no case, other than vote counters might have made enough mistakes in each previous vote count to make a difference. Gore was not interested in a fair election, which is why he requested recounts only in four very blue counties. There were no allegations of election fraud or constitutional issues.

Trump's legal team has not even had time to prepare their federal lawsuits over election fraud and Democrats and RINOs are whining about Trump not conceding before he gets his days in court. There will be a trial over Trump's main election fraud lawsuits, which will probably be filed on Friday.

Demanding a recount in a close election does not require much time or effort. Preparing for a trial and gathering enough evidence to avoid an early dismissal of a case involving massive fraud takes more time. Sidney Powell claims that people will go to prison for 2020 election fraud and I do not believe that is an empty threat. Fortunately, the standard of proof in the civil lawsuits that she will be filing next week is the "preponderance of evidence." Any criminal trials will come later.

[Hoot Gibson]

For those who believe claims that there is no indication of widespread election fraud. What I find most interesting in this video is the claim that there was a 200 fold increase in the number of absentee ballots requested on the basis of "indefinite confinement" in Wisconsin, which is the only way to get an absentee ballot without showing proof of id. Approximately 200,000 such requests were made for the 2020 election, and Biden's current lead over Trump in Wisconsin is about 20.000 votes.

[TheRealThing]

Same old story, orange man bad, Republicans bad, Democrats all good. So we can either believe the Dems or our lying eyes.

Other than what is required in the brief, nobody presents evidence before they get to court. Liz Chaney and the other Republicans like her, who're calling for President Trump and the 74 million (who actually got recognized) Americans who voted for him to quietly just concede the election, ignore factual evidence. Why if as Dems insist everything was on the up and up, do they resist audits in the 5 states that nearly simultaneously 1 - stopped counting in the wee hours,  2 - during which stoppage saw huge gains all for Biden with almost zero votes for Trump, miraculously reversing what rational minded folks saw as an insurmountable lead for Trump, and  3 - saw hundreds if not thousands of affidavits filed post election charging election fraud? To daylight the whole business is the very best way to shut Trump up if that is really what they want. Show the people and they will accept it. I don't get it.

And. I don't accept the premise of those like Allan Dershowitz who say there probably was widespread fraud, just not enough to turn the election. Really now. To concede that there was widespread election fraud, a capitulation that many of the left are now prone to make on the premise that there weren't enough 'numbers' of invalid votes to overturn the election; and to do so on basically what amounts to a whim, without benefit of validating signatures, dates, and other long standing election criterion, is a twofold travesty. The whole point of a recount is to reassure the people's confidence in the process, thusly validating every legal vote and at the same time eliminating every illegal vote. Not to just go to the next level of supposition based on even more unproven supposition. But isn't that a lot like foregoing the actual election, and instead allow the skewed polls to elect the President? So now we're going let commentary-esque legaleze take the place of due process while we're at it? Let's try this thing in the courts, I mean it's only our Republic at stake here, right? No big deal.

Of course at this point they're going to insist there weren't enough invalid votes to swing the election. They won, not quite enough cheaters to overturn it. Unsettling is the fact that first supposedly, this was the most secure election in history, now we've fallen back to the position of barely secure enough. Somehow that doesn't make me feel alright about things.

[Hoot Gibson]

^^ I believe that Dershowitz is correct but I also believe that there is ample evidence that the scale of election fraud is sufficient to overturn the results of the presidential election, if the allegations are proven. Sidney Powell only needs to make a prima facie case persuasive enough to avoid having it dismissed before discovery in the pretrial phase of litigation. She will need to include enough facts in her pleadings to demonstrate that Trump has a plausible chance to win at trial. 

I am not sure of the mechanics of the trial process as to whether trials will be held in each federal District Court where the lawsuits are filed, or if the cases can be merged for a single trial at some point.

I think many people will be lawyering up as soon as judges allow cases to reach the discovery phase. It will be interesting to see how many Republicans demanding that Trump concede have ties to Dominion.

[Van Hagar]

That’s exactly what you’re saying.  You’re saying because these justices are Republican appointed, they are beholding to the Republican Party, facts and points of law be damned.  Won’t happen though, you all aren’t stealing this one, Hoot.
  And by the way, I would crush you on Jeopardy.

Liar. I posted a tweet without comment. You are much, much smarter than you seem if you could crush me on Jeopardy. Joe Biden likes to boast about his towering intellect too.  :D

Oooh, that would be lovely, and such a boost to my self-esteem. I’ll hold you to that! We cut our meetings short so everyone could watch the remake of the Three Stooges airing today (on One America News, of course!). It stars Donald Trump as Curly, Rudy Giuliani as Larry and Sidney Powell as Moe. In today’s episode Moe takes everyone to an All-American QAnon meeting.
Trump has time for this since he is doing nothing else right now, having retreated into the basement that Joe Biden allegedly stayed in. It’s not like there is anything going on in the country that a leader needs to address. That’s your boy!!!!

[Hoot Gibson]

That’s exactly what you’re saying.  You’re saying because these justices are Republican appointed, they are beholding to the Republican Party, facts and points of law be damned.  Won’t happen though, you all aren’t stealing this one, Hoot.
  And by the way, I would crush you on Jeopardy.

Liar. I posted a tweet without comment. You are much, much smarter than you seem if you could crush me on Jeopardy. Joe Biden likes to boast about his towering intellect too. 

Oooh, that would be lovely, and such a boost to my self-esteem. I’ll hold you to that!  We cut our meetings short so everyone could watch the remake of the Three Stooges airing today (on One America News, of course!). It stars Donald Trump as Curly, Rudy Giuliani as Larry and Sidney Powell as Moe. In today’s episode Moe takes everyone to an All-American QAnon meeting.
  Trump has time for this since he is doing nothing else right now, having retreated into the basement that Joe Biden allegedly stayed in. It’s not like there is anything going on in the country that a leader needs to address. That’s your boy!!!!

I thought you were done for the day, Mr. Genius. Another lie.

[The Outsider]

Christie told ABC "This Week" host George Stephanopoulos that it was time for Trump's refusal to concede to end, adding to pressure building from members of the GOP to begin recognizing President-elect Joe Biden's victory.

Stephanopoulos noted that Trump's legal team had lost 34 court cases and that Trump had attacked Sen. Pat Toomey (R-Pa.) for calling on the president on Saturday to recognize the results of the election.

"Is it finally time for this end?" Stephanopoulos asked.

"Yes," Christie responded. "The president has had an opportunity to access the courts. And I said to you, you know, George, starting at 2:30 a.m. on Wednesday morning, if you've got the evidence of fraud, present it. And what's happened here is, quite frankly, the conduct of the president's legal team has been a national embarrassment."

[Hoot Gibson]

Christie told ABC "This Week" host George Stephanopoulos that it was time for Trump's refusal to concede to end, adding to pressure building from members of the GOP to begin recognizing President-elect Joe Biden's victory.

Stephanopoulos noted that Trump's legal team had lost 34 court cases and that Trump had attacked Sen. Pat Toomey (R-Pa.) for calling on the president on Saturday to recognize the results of the election.

"Is it finally time for this end?" Stephanopoulos asked.

"Yes," Christie responded. "The president has had an opportunity to access the courts. And I said to you, you know, George, starting at 2:30 a.m. on Wednesday morning, if you've got the evidence of fraud, present it. And what's happened here is, quite frankly, the conduct of the president's legal team has been a national embarrassment."

Trump fired Christie. This is not exactly earth shaking news. In addition, there is a good chance that there are other Republicans besides Georgia's Governor and Sec. of State who had elections fixed. We may learn whether some of these RINOs have financial interests in Dominion before January 20 and whether they were as guilty of fixing elections as Joe Biden.

[Hoot Gibson]

It's not a good look when a politician's former staff member shows up to represent Dominion. First, it was Gov. Kemp of Georgia and now it is Sen. Mitt Romney. There are too many financial and personnel ties between U.S. elected officials and Dominion. Corruption is a bipartisan pastime in DC.

[Van Hagar]

Here’s some good news. My brother, who is a lawyer and a strong Republican, was in today for an early Thanksgiving. I asked him, in all seriousness, what were the chances of the election being overturned. He said, “absolutely zero.” And believe me, he would have liked for Trump to have been re-elected. So I’ll take his expertise, and you all can ride Sidney Powell.

---

That’s exactly what you’re saying.  You’re saying because these justices are Republican appointed, they are beholding to the Republican Party, facts and points of law be damned.  Won’t happen though, you all aren’t stealing this one, Hoot.
  And by the way, I would crush you on Jeopardy.

Liar. I posted a tweet without comment. You are much, much smarter than you seem if you could crush me on Jeopardy. Joe Biden likes to boast about his towering intellect too.  :D

Oooh, that would be lovely, and such a boost to my self-esteem. I’ll hold you to that!  We cut our meetings short so everyone could watch the remake of the Three Stooges airing today (on One America News, of course!). It stars Donald Trump as Curly, Rudy Giuliani as Larry and Sidney Powell as Moe. In today’s episode Moe takes everyone to an All-American QAnon meeting.
  Trump has time for this since he is doing nothing else right now, having retreated into the basement that Joe Biden allegedly stayed in. It’s not like there is anything going on in the country that a leader needs to address. That’s your boy!!!!

I thought you were done for the day, Mr. Genius. Another lie.

Thank you for addressing me as such. And I had a change of heart, you guys were just getting too excited over a fantasy that’s not going to play out, had to throw in a little dose of reality. And again, where exactly is the president?And what is he doing to address the great crisis the country is facing right now (and I ain’t talking bout no election). Never can seem to get a response for that one.............