[CowboyDad]

I fail to see the issue when its an option for anyone if they choose to.

Don't like it? That's fine

Want to do it? That's fine.

Just follow the policy that the KHSAA allows.

[PHSFAN]

I think holding kids back can only be beneficial to kids but every parent has the right to make the decision that is best for their child and family.

If I ever have children my kids will start school a year late so they will graduate at 19 regardless if my kid(s) is a boy or girl...sports would not even be considered in the decision making process.

[I Rule The World]

No doubt that the team with 19 year olds is going to dominate the team with 17 year olds 90% of the time. This makes all the difference in the world in high school football. Like the other posters said, though, it’s not illegal so the schools that make a concerted effort to have a bunch of old football players are going to win.

I do not agree just because you're older, you're tougher, stronger or better... I have a son and he will be held back because in society today no child is ready for the real world at 17-18 years old...

[bball_fan]

I coached middle school basketball for eight years at a very high level, I coached elementary football for a couple of years and now coaching baseball. The older kids get, the less holding a kid back becomes an issue due to size. When fourth and fifth graders do it, the size difference can be big but in high school, you know how big a kid will be by the time they are sixteen. You might have the rare exception to that.

Also as a father of two, I held both my son and daughter back. My son in fourth grade and my daughter in second. Why? Both of their grades since then have gone up exceptional since then. Their maturity level compared to their class mates has increased as well. The main reason, my son would have graduated high school at seventeen and barely been eighteen going to college. My daughter would have graduated high school at seventeen and went to college at seventeen. Neither of them will be nineteen at all during their hold back senior. A low percentage of this hold backs have August, September and October birthdays but what changes in those few months? A number? I choose to do it at such a young age so they would not be pulled from their friends at a later age and also because that year was a year my kids started at a new school. KHSAA has extended their non-eligibility rule as low as sixth grade now, whether middle schools choose to follow that or not is a school board issue.

Is their benefits in sports, absolutely but those are benefits the kids can only reap the benefits of. It is an extra year to play in a winning system and learn, which college's see. Not all of these kids will go D1 but if any of these kids go to college at any level on a full ride scholarship, then what was the issue? Ask any parent of any hold back, you will never hear any of them regret it! If you have any issues with a choice that is perfectly within the rules, why not do it yourself? Parents are not wanting too, then change your pitch on how to convince them too. Sale a mother on the fact she gets to keep her baby at home an extra year before college, and she'll be on board for it.

[Frank Martin]

I do not agree just because you're older, you're tougher, stronger or better... I have a son and he will be held back because in society today no child is ready for the real world at 17-18 years old...

I agree on your first point but strongly disagree on your second. There are plenty of them doing just fine.

[Woodsman]

This is simply a non issue. If you want to have a better sports program, hire a better coach and get more talent. Please stop whining about age because it literally does not matter in the slightest at the high school level. ZERO

[Jaguarhoundbird]

I would suggest you are wrong. That being said, 100% of the time those defending it are the ones trying to justify holding their kids back. They use the maturity card quite often when in reality it's about wanting your son or daughter to have a better chance at athletics. Nothing at all wrong with that in my opinion. It's within the rules so go for it. Just call it what it is and stop trying to sell it under the guise of maturity, academics, social, etc.. Also, admit it is and advantageous and stop saying he's just sophomore, etc. without adding in that he's actually as old as most juniors when someone asks about your kid. All that being said, it's a parents/families choice.

Who are parents trying to "justify" any decision about their children to? You? Lol. I'll go out on a limb that you're one of the parents blaming kids that held back for your child not getting a "fair shot". Advantage in middle school? Usually. Advantage in high school? Absolutely none.

[Frank Martin]

Who are parents trying to "justify" any decision about their children to? You? Lol. I'll go out on a limb that you're one of the parents blaming kids that held back for your child not getting a "fair shot". Advantage in middle school? Usually. Advantage in high school? Absolutely none.

If you read this thread there are some justifying it as part of the discussion. Also, without ever being asked or even part of the discussion I have had parents feel like they needed to explain or justify why they held their kid back. I'll reiterate, I have no issue with parents making that decision. It is theirs to make and 100% within the rules. My issue is with those that pretend it's not a temporary advantage for most. Though there is a school of thought that it actually causes some to regress to the level that they associate themselves with. Physical maturity being the exception.
If you go out on that limb it will break. Fortunately my kids have earned their shot and are and have been very successful at all levels academically and athletically (all credit to God and my better half on both fronts).
Lastly, it is an advantage in middle school but who cares? I always liked my kids playing against and with older kids during middle school. It begins to even out with each year of high school but it can still be an advantage. Let me ask the question, if there's no advantage in high school then why do it at all? Do a little research on human development and you'll see that with each year until early 20's males continue to mature cognitively, physically and emotionally Healthy debate is a good thing and that's all I am in this discussion for. Not trying to say anyone is wrong but just express my opinion and what it's based on.

[teampaul]

I’m not gonna judge another parent, but from my personal experience a year of growth and strength for a boy makes a huge different. Imagine your 19 year old self playing your 15 year old self on any sport. It’s simply not fair.

This is a hot take but I feel like being held back is just a way of saying I don’t think my kid is good enough to play on their natural talent and have to get a leg up.

I understand lots of kids are held back. Many of my friends in school were holdbacks. But research shows now that a student who is retained in a grade is generally academically less successful than their peers who are not for the rest of their careers. They’re also significant less likely to graduate. To me this sorta gets rid of any “maturity” argument.

Just my opinion though.

[Single Wing 77]

Holding back doesn’t really change a kids ceiling as far as talent goes in high school. It does help them reach their ceiling earlier. A kid may be starting as a sophmore rather than as a junior or senior. That extra year of game experience can pay dividends their senior year. As well as the extra year in the weight room. That’s if you’re only holding them back for sports, which I have no problem with. People who hold their kids back for academics and maturity are doing it to give their kids the best chance to succeed. What’s the problem with doing the same for sports? Many will say that scholarships shouldn’t be the focus which I agree with, but they’re only in high school once. Why not try to make it the best experience possible?

Also, the majority of athletic scholarships are awarded to kids who turn 20 during their freshman year of college. Food for thought.

[Woodsman]

You guys are right and I’m going to totally flip flop my position. I’m sorry that my archaic way of thinking has interrupted this discussion and upset the delicate sensibilities of our “everyone gets a trophy” mentality. No freshman, sophomore, or junior should EVER play varsity football. Further more, only kids going through puberty at the same exact time should be able to suit up. We also need to ban the really strong, fast, and big kids. It’s a safety issue at this point. Those older kids (albeit completely within the rules) should not be allowed to play because they are 6-8 months older than some of their competition. They are always superior is physical standard and athletic prowess. Always and that’s a rule. Stop the abuse!!! Coaches should be held criminally and civilly liable if they play underclassmen. The current system is just not fair to the younger kids.

[Woodsman]

Also, the varsity football coaches that I know are definitely using their personal time to orchestrate rosters 5 years in the future to ensure they have the oldest team possible. It’s a huuuuge priority for them!

[Woodsman]

Am I the only one that thinks this discussion is kinda crazy and completely irrelevant?

[armyfootball#1]

I apologize if my post was not clear. My issue isn't with holding back student athletes. My issue is when you have some programs with a "CULTURE" of sometimes almost entire classes being held back. I have knowledge of a few schools that have had 9 to 11 per class held back year in and out. That......to me.....negates the fact of holding a child back for maturity purposes. Unless those schools that do his have a very poor education system (which I do not believe it does). Call it what it is. It is much easier to be successful if you have a "CULTURE" of mass holdbacks annually within your program. All I was attempting to say. With that being said......IT IS OK. WOULD JUST LIKE TO SEE A RULE CHANGE and players lose a year of high school eligibility if this is taking place in MASS at a particular school. I am friends with some of these parents that were approached by coaches to do this......YEARLY!!!!!!! Hope this clears up my thoughts anyway. Good luck with all participants....be it held back or not. Just wish KHSAA would look at some schools with MASS HOLDBACKS ANNUALLY.

[HCS]

No way to judge what qualifies as "mass" holdbacks - where do you draw the line and how do you tell the eighth kid he can't repeat a grade if seven others already did?

[Woodsman]

I apologize if my post was not clear. My issue isn't with holding back student athletes. My issue is when you have some programs with a "CULTURE" of sometimes almost entire classes being held back. I have knowledge of a few schools that have had 9 to 11 per class held back year in and out. That......to me.....negates the fact of holding a child back for maturity purposes. Unless those schools that do his have a very poor education system (which I do not believe it does). Call it what it is. It is much easier to be successful if you have a "CULTURE" of mass holdbacks annually within your program. All I was attempting to say. With that being said......IT IS OK. WOULD JUST LIKE TO SEE A RULE CHANGE and players lose a year of high school eligibility if this is taking place in MASS at a particular school. I am friends with some of these parents that were approached by coaches to do this......YEARLY!!!!!!! Hope this clears up my thoughts anyway. Good luck with all participants....be it held back or not. Just wish KHSAA would look at some schools with MASS HOLDBACKS ANNUALLY.

Id like to see some birth certificates please. Regardless....still not an issue if literally every player was held back. No advantage whatsoever

[Woodsman]

I’ll take a good coach and mixed ages of actual talent over the oldest team every time.

[Frank Martin]

Am I the only one that thinks this discussion is kinda crazy and completely irrelevant?

I agree.....your posts are kinda crazy and completely irrelevant.

[Killer in the Sun]

Lots of kids are graduating at 17, I’m all for holding back boys. Graduating at 18 or 19 is better for them. We are going to start my grandson in 1st grade at age 6 , he has February birthday so he will be 19 when he graduates. Looks like he’s going to be big and athletic.

[IAM22]

Who are parents trying to "justify" any decision about their children to? You? Lol. I'll go out on a limb that you're one of the parents blaming kids that held back for your child not getting a "fair shot". Advantage in middle school? Usually. Advantage in high school? Absolutely none.

Right.....the 19 year old senior has no advantage over the 17 year old senior...

[IAM22]

Lots of kids are graduating at 17, I’m all for holding back boys. Graduating at 18 or 19 is better for them. We are going to start my grandson in 1st grade at age 6 , he has February birthday so he will be 19 when he graduates. Looks like he’s going to be big and athletic.

If he start 1st grade at 6 and turns 7 in February, he will be 18 when he graduates.

I will just use him being 7 in the first grade:

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12
7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18

You are actually starting him on time. Maybe you meant starting him in kindergarten at 6.

[Woodsman]

I agree.....your posts are kinda crazy and completely irrelevant.

That’s very profound. You should be very proud. Keep crying though. It will do a lot of good for your team. Meanwhile, actual teams with a coach and talent don’t care how old anyone is. Just look at the rosters for the best teams in the state. Are all starters and contributors seniors?!? Seniors that were held back? Get outta here. Check mate.

[Woodsman]

Right.....the 19 year old senior has no advantage over the 17 year old senior...

Probably correct. Give me more details because I know sevral 15 year old sophomores that will embarrass 19 year old seniors.

[Frank Martin]

That’s very profound. You should be very proud. Keep crying though. It will do a lot of good for your team. Meanwhile, actual teams with a coach and talent don’t care how old anyone is. Just look at the rosters for the best teams in the state. Are all starters and contributors seniors?!? Seniors that were held back? Get outta here. Check mate.

Who's crying? Just having an open discussion/debate. Go back and read what I have commented and tell me what I was crying about. I don't have a team and I don't care if parents hold their kids back. As I have stated, it's their choice. You on the other hand, have made absolutely zero intelligent points and have just spewed out nonsense that isn't worth commenting on.

[Woodsman]

Who's crying? Just having an open discussion/debate. Go back and read what I have commented and tell me what I was crying about. I don't have a team and I don't care if parents hold their kids back. As I have stated, it's their choice. You on the other hand, have made absolutely zero intelligent points and have just spewed out nonsense that isn't worth commenting on.

Riiiiiiiight. So care to go through the rosters of the top ten teams in the state and see the classes of their starters? Wanna bet not a one exclusively starts seniors? I’m pretty sure it’s evident who is making “intelligent points” and who is crying. Just saying.

[Frank Martin]

Riiiiiiiight. So care to go through the rosters of the top ten teams in the state and see the classes of their starters? Wanna bet not a one exclusively starts seniors? I’m pretty sure it’s evident who is making “intelligent points” and who is crying. Just saying.

I'll tell you what, you go through the rosters and get back to me. Then maybe you can explain what relevance that has to anything. Again, go read my previous posts on this thread....I don't care if everyone on every team holds their kids back. I am done with this nonsense but you keep at it because it's obviously more personal to you than it is to me.

[pjdoug]

Curious to hear EDUCATED and open minded responses. Without letting their personal teams success or failures to slide your judgment.

You probably won't hear much of that.

[pjdoug]

KHSAA rule has always been if you are 18 on August 1st of your senior year, you are eligible. People make this same complaint every year but answer me one thing, what does Belfry and Johnson Central have that most schools don’t? Two of the most successful coaches in the state. Quit blaming failures your school has on something that is not the issue. The two schools you mentioned have a great program from youth ages and up. These programs are winners because of coaching, player commitment and school backing. Blaming hold backs is an entitle excuse to bandage the real issue, your program is not on their level. Look at Beechwood, Corbin, Trinity, Mayfield, Bowling Green, Boyle, Danville, Pikeville... I can go on, but those teams have been in state championships left and right for thirty years! That’s not because of hold backs, that’s because they develop talent and maintain a stable program. Just stop, your embarrassing yourself.

I better every team you listed has a long list of hold backs. "You're" embarrassing your self.

[pjdoug]

If these kids are eligible by KHSAA rules, I’m not sure what the problem is.

KHSAA is obviously the problem.

[pjdoug]

The amount of hold backers getting defensive is funny. You bunch of low down dirty dawgs nicker: