[UK Wildcats]

What do you think about this??? Who should have won and why do you think this??? I have seen this talked about in a lot of other threads so I thought that it need a thread of it's own!!

[cat4life_#60]

IMO i think that Prestonsburg should have won just simply using common sense and seeing Johnson Central fall 5 times during their routine while Prestonsburg didn't fall any and they stuck everything in their routine

[blackcatcheer]

Prestonsburg should have won...no doubt about it. Johnson Central was good but their routine had to many mistakes in it. P-burg had just as much difficulty but they just made it look easy.

[CheerMom]

Both teams were good. Johnson Central fell once in the ending stunt sequence not 5 times. The "difficulty level" of the routine was the difference. Scores showed it.

[KentuckyHillBilly5321]

Lets give a little more detail as to what happened here.

The cheerleading discussions are VERY interesting to more people than just cheerleaders (which is probably what cheerleaders would like to hear).

[blackcatcheer]

Johnson Central's tumbler who attempted the full, fell bad.

[catsfan072]

No, more than one stunt fell. I just watched the tape, I watched all 4 Medium Squad and Central fell at least 4 or 5 times.

[CheerMom]

I just watched the tape also, in the stunt sequence in the middle of the routine, the side mounts come down early from that stunt and the last sequence the left side fell out of 360 and did not go up to the final heel stretch she only went to a half. The tumbling passes the full twist fell. But again all squads did well, the difficulty level was the key.

[BUNDY]

Prestonsburg should have won be a land slide.

[blackcatcheer]

CheerMom...difficulty only counts if you execute the stunts and gymnastics correctly. If difficulty was the only thing that counted any squad could stick stunts in their routine that could fall. I know you probably have a daughter that cheers for JC, but P-Burg should have won. I think anyone who sees the tape or watched the competition knows that.

[cat4life_#60]

Both teams were good. Johnson Central fell once in the ending stunt sequence not 5 times. The "difficulty level" of the routine was the difference. Scores showed it.

I know for a fact that they fell 5 times I've watched video on it countless number of times and VIDEO DOESN"T LIE!

[wildcat20]

After watching the two squads routine on tape, it's CLEARLY evident Prestonsburg's difficulty level along with EVERYTHING else in the entire routine was better. Only one of centrals mounts went. The rest fell, and no not a little bobble, a FALL. It would have been a different situation if Prestonsburg DESERVED to lose, but they did'nt. Every mount went, tumbling pass was awesome, motions were sharp, and I think the majority of people would agree. We are and always will be #1!!!!!

[wildcat20]

Both teams were good. Johnson Central fell once in the ending stunt sequence not 5 times. The "difficulty level" of the routine was the difference. Scores showed it.

No matter how "difficult" a stunt may be, if it falls it's pointless of even doing it!

[Team Spirit]

Why ask that qustion?...IMO, There is no "should have" to it if it was meant for you to win you "would have". Yeah, all of our (SF) stunts "should have" hit. You can set around all day and say this "should have" happened, but can do nothing about it. I am pretty sure the judges know what they are talking about and have their reasons for everything.

[catsfan072]

Well it is funny that, 3 of the 5 judges had Pburg ranked higher than everyone else!

[CheerEagle]

After watching the two squads routine on tape, it's CLEARLY evident Prestonsburg's difficulty level along with EVERYTHING else in the entire routine was better. Only one of centrals mounts went. The rest fell, and no not a little bobble, a FALL. It would have been a different situation if Prestonsburg DESERVED to lose, but they did'nt. Every mount went, tumbling pass was awesome, motions were sharp, and I think the majority of people would agree.We are and always will be #1!!!!!

I think both squads did very well! Good job Prestonsburg! However, I cheer for JC and I know the routine pretty well I would say, and there were not FIVE falls. There were two mounts who cradled 2 beats early in the end of the first half(that is not considered a FALL), and the ending stunt was put up to half, the climber NEVER fell. The difficulty was the winning factor. We had a double down out of a heel strech, 360's,and almost all squad standing tucks and roundoff tucks. I believe all squads did well, and the results are final. None of us deserve to be discouraged while were trying to prepare a routine to represent the 15th region at state level. Congraulations to all squads competing at state! SEE YOU THERE!:Cheerlead :Cheerlead :Cheerlead :Cheerlead

[EKYMAMA]

This is Ms. Sturgill's problem. She impliments all these difficult routines which are above the girls talent levels. Nothing against the girls, they are good, but she is killing them. And it will kill them come State time! What good is it if you have a very difficult routine, if you can't stick it or hold your mounts or stunts. It seems to me that a judge would score more towards a team that performed what was required and how well they did the required stunts. All others are just bonuses. Whether it is difficult or not if you fall , you fall! It should be a deduction. And my heart goes out to SC! That was just plain wrong what happened to them. These people need to get their act together because they broke alot of hearts this weekend.

[no~one~cares]

Im pretty sure P Burg should have won and what the heck was the deal with SC and the whole district miss conception? Thats a bunch of crap!

[BC75]

Lets give a little more detail as to what happened here.

The cheerleading discussions are VERY interesting to more people than just cheerleaders (which is probably what cheerleaders would like to hear).

good post

[RedHotMama]

Just wondering...were there any penalties that maybe a spectator wouldn't be aware of? For example, stepping on a sign (I believe I read that somewhere) or going over the time? Maybe there is more to this than we all know.

[Fuzzy5118]

This one was decided by 1 POINT. This should be a wake-up call to JC, to get on the stick and stop allowing yourselves to be distracted by others or rattled by a competition. You all have worked like tow heads all year, most of you have been to enough competitions in your lives that it shouldn't be nerves. Yes, I know there were extenuating circumstances beyond your control, but suck it up and do what you gotta do! Clean up those stunt sequences, maintain eye contact, everyone says the words, stop touching down on tumbling you've been doing forever. Stick it. leave no doubt. If you can't do it and make it look easy, then revise it. At State, it will be those things that take you higher than 5th place! Tucks are fine, but fulls are FULLS... you've been told this before! You have the talent and support of your parents, while the 57th is proud of you. Your routine was twice as hard a P-burgs. There is NO COMPARISON. I am not gonna get into a big deal over this. P-burg, you need to hire the right people to get you where you want to be. You need to stop whining and get your house in order. If you wanna win and you don't want it to be close, you've got to be committed to do what it takes. If that means you need a new coach, new attitude, new choreographers, or someone willing to work within KAPOS to know the rules and make them work for you, then so be it. You girls only have a 4 year window of opportunity, being able to look back fondly on things like this is what every squad deserves, instead of always being upset and feeling like the odd man out. Like SF. Look @ how far they have come this year! They remind me of Magoffin last year. South Floyd has earned respect this year and gotten a taste of success. SUCCESS BREEDS SUCCESS. Those SF girls aren't used to having anything handed to them, they have worked hard and enjoyed the fruits of their labors! I am sorry they didn't show well Saturday, but they know what has to be done and hopefully, they'll do it! JC probably won't have the troubles next year that they had this year, because Miss Sturgill was right and all the puffed up people who forced that situation on her will have to eat crow!(shame on them for getting involved in something of which they had no idea!) Like I said, P-burg, nice effort, but you simply have to have more! You may not like that or want to hear that, but it's true. Sometimes you just have to be 50 times better than everyone else! At least then, there's no being denied and no cause for nerves!

[eagleclaw]

I honestly feel that it could have gone either way. P-burg had a cleaner routine while JC had a more difficult routine. JC did not fall 5 times,they had a early dismount which is not deducted as a fall,one fall with a attempted full and a end mount that didn't go up. On the difficulty level they had 360's ,a double down and over half squad standing tucks(which is worth alot of points). Also, I thought JC"S dance portion was better. At the end of the performance I made the comment that it could go either way it just depended on what the judges put more emphasis on cleaness or difficulty.And evidently is was difficulty.I can understand why P-burg is upset the same thing happered to JC at nationals, we put a clean almost perfect routine on the floor, but we didn't advance to semi's while other squads who had falls did. I'm not a judge,but I have been been to too many comps to count and realize that the team with the least mistakes is not always the team that wins. Every competition has it's own scoring criteria and when broken down it is very possible to make up points in some areas that are deducted in others. I don't want to over simplify, but for example if a basketball team takes 10 2pt shots and makes them all ,their total points is 20. And if another team takes 10 3pt shots and makes 7 their score is 21. So even if they miss more shots the difficulty gives more points. I've heard that the difference in score was one point,while I don't know this for a fact, I wouldn't be surprised. Do I feel that P-burg was cheated? NO. Do I feel that JC would have been cheated if the results went the other way? No. I just believe that it was a really close call and could have gone either way. I'm really proud of the JC girls, one of their flyers dislocated her elbow tues. and was not able to compete so they had to redo about everything.Good luck JC at State. Also,good luck to the other squads who made it. I really do feel bad about what happened to Sheldon Clark, that was just awful. Even though myself nor anyone from JC had anything to do with this, I still feel like saying I'm truly sorry this happened

[PvilleCheerAlum]

This KAPOS talk has made me have to pull out my rule books.

Coming down early from a stunt will recieve a large deduction. in 2 1/2 minute routines, points will be taken off under the Partner stunts/pyramids/basket tosses category because this covers stunt execution. coming down early is considered incorrect execution. Points will also come off under Overall Execution. Even more points would come off under synchronization because that also covers stunt synchronization. So techincally, you might not get as many points taken off for coming down early as you would for a fall, but a heafty amount of points are coming off your score.

If anyone would like to check, this information is on pages 46-47 in the Kapos handbook.

[eagleclaw]

Great post Fuzzy. Everything you said was right on the money

[eagleclaw]

This one was decided by 1 POINT. This should be a wake-up call to JC, to get on the stick and stop allowing yourselves to be distracted by others or rattled by a competition. You all have worked like tow heads all year, most of you have been to enough competitions in your lives that it shouldn't be nerves. Yes, I know there were extenuating circumstances beyond your control, but suck it up and do what you gotta do! Clean up those stunt sequences, maintain eye contact, everyone says the words, stop touching down on tumbling you've been doing forever. Stick it. leave no doubt. If you can't do it and make it look easy, then revise it. At State, it will be those things that take you higher than 5th place! Tucks are fine, but fulls are FULLS... you've been told this before! You have the talent and support of your parents, while the 57th is proud of you. Your routine was twice as hard a P-burgs. There is NO COMPARISON. I am not gonna get into a big deal over this. P-burg, you need to hire the right people to get you where you want to be. You need to stop whining and get your house in order. If you wanna win and you don't want it to be close, you've got to be committed to do what it takes. If that means you need a new coach, new attitude, new choreographers, or someone willing to work within KAPOS to know the rules and make them work for you, then so be it. You girls only have a 4 year window of opportunity, being able to look back fondly on things like this is what every squad deserves, instead of always being upset and feeling like the odd man out. Like SF. Look @ how far they have come this year! They remind me of Magoffin last year. South Floyd has earned respect this year and gotten a taste of success. SUCCESS BREEDS SUCCESS. Those SF girls aren't used to having anything handed to them, they have worked hard and enjoyed the fruits of their labors! I am sorry they didn't show well Saturday, but they know what has to be done and hopefully, they'll do it! JC probably won't have the troubles next year that they had this year, because Miss Sturgill was right and all the puffed up people who forced that situation on her will have to eat crow!(shame on them for getting involved in something of which they had no idea!) Like I said, P-burg, nice effort, but you simply have to have more! You may not like that or want to hear that, but it's true. Sometimes you just have to be 50 times better than everyone else! At least then, there's no being denied and no cause for nerves!

[luvcheer]

Let me address the issue of difficulty- I am not partial to any squad by the way. Yes difficulty is taken into consideration, you can get a higher point value for DD and then get execution points taken away for bobbles or falls. I also agree that a squad should not do stunts or tumbling that is too difficult, that they will not hit but nobody knows what happen at practice, maybe they did hit all the time, just bad luck or nerves the day of competition. So we really can't make comments on things we do not know but difficulty is a parameter that the judges look at.

[schscheerleader]

If I had to pick between JC and P-Burg it would have to be P-Burg bc they didnt drop anyone! Oh yeah let I remind you Sheldon Clark got treated very bad! I think it was crap that they anounced us as district champs and ten minutes later they Have a change in the District.... For as long as I can remember JC has always been in our district! But oh well Thats the way Sc gets treated around here! I am used to it I guess there it always next year!PEACE*

[BigEagle]

Gee, pvillecheer alum, you are good with that rule book. Very quick to point out deductions. Very interesting, considering that at nationals that famous squad from Pikeville, not only drop a person from a mount, but the entire mount hit the ground. Plus the great tumblers, looked like a hockey game, running into and over each other. But getting back to the thread, I think it could have went either way. But I do think the JC have a more difficult routine, even though P-burg routine may have appeared cleaner. I think it was wrong for kapos to announce the wrong winner, I also think in that situation that SC should have recieved an invitation to state as well.

[catsfan072]

Personally, I don't think it matters who had a more difficult routine if it fell!!

[PvilleCheerAlum]

Gee, pvillecheer alum, you are good with that rule book. Very quick to point out deductions. Very interesting, considering that at nationals that famous squad from Pikeville, not only drop a person from a mount, but the entire mount hit the ground. Plus the great tumblers, looked like a hockey game, running into and over each other.

Wow i am shocked. THat was a 100% cheap shot. I dont cheer for pikeville anymore, and i wasnt at nationals. I am a certified KAPOS judge and people were asking judging questions.

I think that you forgot to read the Thread made by Pirate Pal about rude behavior in the forum.