[pjdoug]

It's the best definition I've seen. Which ones aren't in the mountains?
When compared to Harlan and Letcher, most counties don't have much as far as mountains.

most of them are. here are the high points http://peakbagger.com/list.aspx?lid=13503

[Real Badman]

Well according to that list, Wayne is more mountainous than Breathitt.

[pjdoug]

Well according to that list, Wayne is more mountainous than Breathitt.

Wayne should certainly be more of a mountain team than Pulaski too.

[Maroon State Champs]

I am not sure how Coach Hines, Pulaski County is not in the top 3 on this list behind Haywood and Miricle. If he had there talent for all the years he was at Pulaski he'd be no. 1 hands down. He has built Puslaski into a state power in the 5a.

[RunItUpTheGut]

For me, its Dudley Hilton hands down with Haywood a close second.
If I lived next door to Pike county instead of Bell County that may be different, but I watched Dudley coach for a long time and never seen anyone else get the players and teams put together like they did for so many years.

Ive always liked Matney, long before the Johnson Central days, always enjoyed Rock teams with Larkey, not so much at Harlan County, but Rock was pretty fun to watch back when Larkey was there. Cotton Adams to me is the greatest football mind that ever lived, even if he hasn't been a head coach for decades now, he still goes down in my book as the best there ever was. All time speaking, you cant leave out Archie Powers either.

[pjdoug]

For me, its Dudley Hilton hands down with Haywood a close second.
If I lived next door to Pike county instead of Bell County that may be different, but I watched Dudley coach for a long time and never seen anyone else get the players and teams put together like they did for so many years.

Ive always liked Matney, long before the Johnson Central days, always enjoyed Rock teams with Larkey, not so much at Harlan County, but Rock was pretty fun to watch back when Larkey was there. Cotton Adams to me is the greatest football mind that ever lived, even if he hasn't been a head coach for decades now, he still goes down in my book as the best there ever was. All time speaking, you cant leave out Archie Powers either.

hopefully Cotton is working his magic out on the Colonels campus

[EKUAlum05]

When it comes to accomplishments there is no debating #1.. noone in EKY even really comes close to Haywood's resume.

Hilton's merits speak for themselves..I think he is the clear #2. What defines him more than anything and how good he was as a coach is not anything he did at Bell... but what he did at Bourbon in such a short time frame.


Mike Holcomb I think gets overlooked a little because of recent history and the current state of Breathitt County football. Considering the location of Breathitt there is no doubt he did the most with less talent pool at his disposal. Breathitt County from all intents of purposes should have never became a state power. Holcomb to me maximized talent better than any coach in EKY.

Hilliard Howard also is a victim of the end of his career. His Pikeville career was amazing. His stint at Letcher Central I thought kind of tarnished his legacy a bit even though he made that program solid during his tenure.

Miracle is old school but was on top of his game

Matney needs the hardware... he has proven he can build a program like noone's business though

To Me:
1. Haywood
2. Hilton
3. Holcomb
4. Miracle
5. Howard


A few names who deserve some more love in this thread:
Coach Dixon at Hazard
Coach Roark at Middlesboro
Coach Derossett at Pburg

[pjdoug]

For me, its Dudley Hilton hands down with Haywood a close second.
If I lived next door to Pike county instead of Bell County that may be different, but I watched Dudley coach for a long time and never seen anyone else get the players and teams put together like they did for so many years.

Ive always liked Matney, long before the Johnson Central days, always enjoyed Rock teams with Larkey, not so much at Harlan County, but Rock was pretty fun to watch back when Larkey was there. Cotton Adams to me is the greatest football mind that ever lived, even if he hasn't been a head coach for decades now, he still goes down in my book as the best there ever was. All time speaking, you cant leave out Archie Powers either.

Dudley is without a doubt the best.

[HCS]

One thing that always bothers me in these sports debates is how people can make a definitive statement on who is the best at something when there is clearly a very debatable point being discussed.
I could see anyone picking Hilton as the No. 1 coach and I could see anyone picking Haywood as the No. 1 coach.
What I can't see is saying one or the other is "without a doubt" the best or "there is no debating No. 1."

[pjdoug]

One thing that always bothers me in these sports debates is how people can make a definitive statement on who is the best at something when there is clearly a very debatable point being discussed.
I could see anyone picking Hilton as the No. 1 coach and I could see anyone picking Haywood as the No. 1 coach.
What I can't see is saying one or the other is "without a doubt" the best or "there is no debating No. 1."

there is no debating gets a without a doubt from me every time because Hilton is "obviously" better than Haywood and Haywood only has more wins because Dudley has been out of the high school ranks for the past few years .if Dudley had stayed in high school he would clearly be number 1 in wins and be the best coach

[Hatz]

there is no debating gets a without a doubt from me every time because Hilton is "obviously" better than Haywood and Haywood only has more wins because Dudley has been out of the high school ranks for the past few years .if Dudley had stayed in high school he would clearly be number 1 in wins and be the best coach

I can see them as 1a and 1b.

I don't see Hilton as "obviously" better. Haywood has 10 finals appearances while Hilton has 3. 4 titles to 3. Wins are pretty even regardless of when Hilton stopped coaching for a while.

I also think it's not a good argument of "They would have more if they didn't have to go through "X" program all the time.

Same argument holds for both men's programs.

[StrayBullet]

Haywood is the obvious #1.
Curious to see where some would rank Chuke Williams?

[pjdoug]

Haywood clearly has the easiest path and Hilton is obviously a much better coach nicker:

[OutlawJoseyWales]

Bell co fans and Belfry haters are gonna side with Dudley....and Belfry fans and Bell Co haters gonna side with Haywood.

What's new??

Both have been fabulous coaches.

Let the debate rage on....

[RunItUpTheGut]

Bell co fans and Belfry haters are gonna side with Dudley....and Belfry fans and Bell Co haters gonna side with Haywood.

What's new??

Both have been fabulous coaches.

Let the debate rage on....

On the contrary, I hate Bell County and don't feel any emotions toward Belfry, yet id still take Dudley.

[jetpilot]

When it comes to accomplishments there is no debating #1.. noone in EKY even really comes close to Haywood's resume.

Hilton's merits speak for themselves..I think he is the clear #2. What defines him more than anything and how good he was as a coach is not anything he did at Bell... but what he did at Bourbon in such a short time frame.


Mike Holcomb I think gets overlooked a little because of recent history and the current state of Breathitt County football. Considering the location of Breathitt there is no doubt he did the most with less talent pool at his disposal. Breathitt County from all intents of purposes should have never became a state power. Holcomb to me maximized talent better than any coach in EKY.

Hilliard Howard also is a victim of the end of his career. His Pikeville career was amazing. His stint at Letcher Central I thought kind of tarnished his legacy a bit even though he made that program solid during his tenure.

Miracle is old school but was on top of his game

Matney needs the hardware... he has proven he can build a program like noone's business though

To Me:
1. Haywood
2. Hilton
3. Holcomb
4. Miracle
5. Howard


A few names who deserve some more love in this thread:
Coach Dixon at Hazard
Coach Roark at Middlesboro
Coach Derossett at Pburg

No way Howard is 5th. I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt by assuming your account has been hacked.

[pjdoug]

Bell co fans and Belfry haters are gonna side with Dudley....and Belfry fans and Bell Co haters gonna side with Haywood.

What's new??

Both have been fabulous coaches.

Let the debate rage on....

if I hated a team I would hate them both equally even their coaches,but Bell County clearly had the better coach in Dudley :truestory:

[pjdoug]

No way Howard is 5th. I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt by assuming your account has been hacked.

Howard is obviously ahead of Haywood nicker:

[HCS]

I don't know if the No. 1 coach has to be someone who has coached recently like Haywood or Hilton.

What Ed Miracle did in a 12-year period, in the days when only eight teams in the state made the playoffs when there were only TWO classes in the state for schools outside Louisville, was nothing short of amazing.

[pjdoug]

I don't know if the No. 1 coach has to be someone who has coached recently like Haywood or Hilton.

What Ed Miracle did in a 12-year period, in the days when only eight teams in the state made the playoffs when there were only TWO classes in the state for schools outside Louisville, was nothing short of amazing.

I agree 100%

[bac2369]

Haywood and Hilton are 1 and 2. It could be switched either way if Dudley had stayed in high school coaching instead of going to Pikeville College.

[Bucwheat]

I think both Larkeys deserve to be mentioned.

[pjdoug]

I think both Larkeys deserve to be mentioned.

What did Larkey's do in the mountains that deserve a top 10 spot?

[jetpilot]

Howard is obviously ahead of Haywood nicker:

While Howard was an active coach:
Howard state titles - 3
Haywood state titles - 0

[Hatz]

While Howard was an active coach:
Howard state titles - 3
Haywood state titles - 0

How does that relate when they competed in different classes?

How many titles would Howard have had if he had to play HHS in the semi-finals? That would be a more relevant question.

[jetpilot]

How does that relate when they competed in different classes?

How many titles would Howard have had if he had to play HHS in the semi-finals? That would be a more relevant question.

Only for people who have to make every topic about HHS. Most of the coaches on everyone's list competed in different classes. It's about best mountain coaches, not best coaches in their class.

[Hatz]

Only for people who have to make every topic about HHS. Most of the coaches on everyone's list competed in different classes. It's about best mountain coaches, not best coaches in their class.

And that's why the longevity and success factor favors Haywood over Howard IMO.

If it's over a 12 year span I would say that Ed Miracle surpasses Howard without a doubt.

[jetpilot]

And that's why the longevity and success factor favors Haywood over Howard IMO.

If it's over a 12 year span I would say that Ed Miracle surpasses Howard without a doubt.

Agreed. While both were coaching Howard was better, after Howard retired Haywood was better.:biggrin:

[jetpilot]

My list:
1. Miracle
2. Howard
3a. Hilton (worked magic everywhere)
3b. Haywood (mini-dynasty factor)
5. Holcomb
6. Jack Hall (has to be on list)

[ForearmShiver]

Although he was the beneficiary of being at the right place at the right time when Lynch was consolidated into Cumberland, and I am not sure of his overall record, Tim Saylor could prepare a team with the best of the best. He was innovative and maverick in his methods, and his ability to convey the knowledge he gathered via scouting to his players was phenomenal...master motivator as well.
One of my favorite moments was before the annual Harlan game, he was emphasizing his dislike for our opponent by stressing his hatred for the color green. When a player pointed out that the coach drove a green car, he didn't even hesitate, and quickly quipped "I hate that car!"