[teampaul]

Coming from someone who is in the region who has to travel and watch games, the gym at Harlan County is nearly 10000000 times better than the Arena in Corbin. The arena is much more expensive and for a majority of 13th Region schools is a farther trip.

However looking at the numbers it is almost impossible make an argument to hold it at HC anymore. The travel distance changes little, however I would take a good basketball enviroment as a fan over sitting in the nosebleeds. But money dictates all and honestly I dont really care

[SEKYFAN]

Coming from someone who is in the region who has to travel and watch games, the gym at Harlan County is nearly 10000000 times better than the Arena in Corbin. The arena is much more expensive and for a majority of 13th Region schools is a farther trip.

However looking at the numbers it is almost impossible make an argument to hold it at HC anymore. The travel distance changes little, however I would take a good basketball enviroment as a fan over sitting in the nosebleeds. But money dictates all and honestly I dont really care

You may want to look at a map.

[Ballers]

Damn I have been away from BGR too long..
I love watching you all bitch at each other over something stupid, it's great.

[RunItUpTheGut]

^
Says a guy who discusses 14th region basketball and transfers everyday :biglmao:

I guess thats important...

[vundy33]

Big City.....Now thats funny.

I lol'd when I saw that too man, hahaha.

[cksportsfan]

Coming from someone who is in the region who has to travel and watch games, the gym at Harlan County is nearly 10000000 times better than the Arena in Corbin. The arena is much more expensive and for a majority of 13th Region schools is a farther trip.

However looking at the numbers it is almost impossible make an argument to hold it at HC anymore. The travel distance changes little, however I would take a good basketball enviroment as a fan over sitting in the nosebleeds. But money dictates all and honestly I dont really care

Expensive as far as what? Concessions? Never go to state or a UK or U of L game then. You'll be floored by the prices.

Expensive as far as rental? Doesn't matter. Schools made MORE when it was at Corbin than in Harlan.

So your price is a moot point. Strike One.

Travel? Pretty sure more region fans are CLOSER to Corbin than Harlan. So there's Strike Two.

And nosebleed? Corbin ain't Rupp, Yum, Diddle, NKU Bank of Ky.
The Corbin Arena and Pikeville East KY Expo are SMALL arenas. Not "nosebleed" by any stretch.
Louisville Valley, Marshall County, Montgomery County, Central Hardin, Henry County and Mason County have HS gyms similarly sized to Corbin Arena.

So that's Strike Three. You're out.

Next.

[HDE]

Expensive as far as what? Concessions? Never go to state or a UK or U of L game then. You'll be floored by the prices.

Expensive as far as rental? Doesn't matter. Schools made MORE when it was at Corbin than in Harlan.

So your price is a moot point. Strike One.

Travel? Pretty sure more region fans are CLOSER to Corbin than Harlan. So there's Strike Two.

And nosebleed? Corbin ain't Rupp, Yum, Diddle, NKU Bank of Ky.
The Corbin Arena and Pikeville East KY Expo are SMALL arenas. Not "nosebleed" by any stretch.
Louisville Valley, Marshall County, Montgomery County, Central Hardin, Henry County and Mason County have HS gyms similarly sized to Corbin Arena.

So that's Strike Three. You're out.

Next.

I'm curious how many games you've watched at The Arena and the HCHS gymnasium.

[cksportsfan]

I'm curious how many games you've watched at The Arena and the HCHS gymnasium.

Haven't been to games in either one. Not sure why that matters, though.

Judging by photos, seating sharts and information (media, websites, etc.) Corbin is not a huge venue. Looks quite similar to Pikeville (East KY Expo) and Alltech (new arena at Kentucky Horse Park). All less than 10,000.

Heck, I wouldn't really consider Diddle at WKU to be a "nosebleed" arena.

But if Corbin is a "nosebleed" arena, heaven forbid the poster/team/school advance to Rupp. Good heavens that would be a rude awakening. His nose would literally start to bleed.

Maybe the seats in Corbin are way more vertical than photos let on. Maybe it really is a horribly designed arena. But I've sat in the upper deck at YUM, Freedom Hall, Commonwealth, Old Cardinal, PJCS, Rupp, Diddle, Dodger Stadium, the Tennessee Titans' Stadium (whatever it is called now) and even the Edward Jones dome (St. Louis) when Louisville was in the final four there. Survived them all. Some of those have nosebleed seats.

But Corbin? Really?

Don't get me wrong, from every photo I've seen, Harlan County has a very very very nice high school gym. If that was my school, I'd be proud of it. I'm not ripping Harlan County's gym.

I never said Harlan County didn't have a capable/suitable site. In other regions -- and most every district -- it is a more than capable site.

But maybe it was the weather.
But maybe it was the teams (schools who would bring more fans to region getting knocked out).

Whatever the reason, attendance was down this year (based on information provided to the newspaper). Waaaaaaaaay down. Unless the numbers lie. People who said they went to the tournament admitted it was down.

I wasn't there (at Corbin region or Harlan region). I personally can't vouch for how accurate the attendance numbers are. But at least one newspaper felt they were a viable source.

So maybe, just maybe, people didn't want to hike to Harlan to watch a game at a high school when you could watch it in a neutral arena with a college floor in Corbin.

I'm not from Corbin. Last time I went there was driving to Gatlinburg.

[BriarCreekBrave]

Here is the mileage from google maps from the town to town not even to HCHS for this years 13th region schools.

Corbin to Harlan 67.3 miles
Barbourville to Harlan 48.2 miles.
London to Harlan 63.6 miles
Manchester to Harlan 62.3 miles
Middlesboro to Harlan 41.8 miles
Williamsburg to Harlan 69.9 miles
Pineville to Harlan 31.9 miles
Lynn Camp to Harlan 65.1 miles

Now here is the trip from the same schools to Corbin.
Corbin 1.2 miles
Barbourville 17.1 miles
London 13.1 miles
Manchester 31.9 miles
Middlesboro 45.0 miles
Williamsburg 17.4 miles
Pineville 32.6 miles
Lynn Camp 5.8 miles
Harlan 67.3 miles

It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out which is easier, faster and cheaper to get to for all the schools that participated in the region tourny......but lets not forget they have to show off the "Rupp of the Mountians" as I heard it called several times during the region tournament. Seriously?????

[unbiasedopinions]

Mountain people are typically grounded where they are. The are usually not mobile. Probably not ever going to agree to hold it at the arena.

[insideinfo]

I think eveyone but Harlan Co.has decided the Arena is the best place to host the tournament.Note I did not say the best place to watch a game.

[bear claw]

I give up. What is the big deal if the school's time to host a regional tourney host it at there place. I mean it will happen every 15 years. I am officially done with with topic. Is it football season yet?

[insideinfo]

I'm curious how many games you've watched at The Arena and the HCHS gymnasium.

I have been to a least one session of the regional tournament since the early 70s except 79 or 80 when I went to the 14th region with my college room mate.I remember when they had it had Union college every year.

[HDE]

I think it's interesting that the argument keeps shifting on why it shouldn't be at Harlan County.
There was some question at first whether HCHS was big enough, if they had enough parking and whether it would be too big of a homecourt advantage. When none of that held up, it became a screaming fit that the attendance was down.
Well, the attendance did drop the past couple of years, even at The Arena, and yes, it is farther to HCHS for most of the schools in the region.
I have a great seat at The Arena. I've never said anything bad about it, except it's a shame to have to drive 60-plus miles six times every year. Of course, that's a very selfish argument and the fact is that The Arena is a nice facility. Many others have complained about the horrible view, but I am clearly spoiled by being on press row and that hasn't been a factor for me.
I'll be honest that I'd rather be at The Arena than any of the other high school gyms because it was much too crowded and the split sessions were a pain. Neither is a problem at HCHS.
But the bottom line for me is this:
No one from Harlan County suggested it should be at HCHS every year. It's one year out of 16. Perhaps two out of 16 if Harlan has it here. The arrogance gets a little overwhelming at times from the people who can't believe they have to drive to Harlan County for a regional tournament once a decade or so.

[HDE]

Mountain people are typically grounded where they are. The are usually not mobile. Probably not ever going to agree to hold it at the arena.

Is that another unbiased opinion?
I'm still waiting to hear about what kind of place Harlan is. Heck, with my backwoods mentality, I don't even know what an unbiased opinion is.

[HDE]

I have been to a least one session of the regional tournament since the early 70s except 79 or 80 when I went to the 14th region with my college room mate.I remember when they had it had Union college every year.

I went to the tournament the first time in 1976 when it was at Union. It didn't stay there long though. It was at Knox Central for several years after that, then Bell when that school opened.

[insideinfo]

I went to the tournament the first time in 1976 when it was at Union. It didn't stay there long though. It was at Knox Central for several years after that, then Bell when that school opened.

I was thinking that it went to Midlesboro or Corbin after it left Union.KnoxCentrals new gym open in 1980 and i remember Barbourville, Lynn Camp and Knox Central used this gym when it was there turn.As i think about it I believe it was at Whitley in 1979 I belive Clay still used Union untill there new gym was built.The longer I think about I believe Barbouville got there feeling hurt and went back to Union one year, this may have been the District though.

[HDE]

It was in Middlesboro in 78. Cawood lost to Pineville in the first round, the biggest upset in 13th Region Tournament history in my book.

[insideinfo]

It was in Middlesboro in 78. Cawood lost to Pineville in the first round, the biggest upset in 13th Region Tournament history in my book.

Was Phill and his brother both on this team, or did his brother graduate in 77 I allways thought Cawood had really good teams what was the last year Cawood hosted the region.

[cksportsfan]

HDE,

Nice, thought-out, logical response with basis. Kudos. Seriously.

Now I wasn't one of those that questioned if HCHS was big enough. However, with you having been to said tournament, is HCHS big enough -- WITHOUT having split sessions -- to hold the crowds reported in the past?

I'm not one of those naive to say HCHS should be forbidden from hosting, especially when it has a capable site within the KHSAA bylines for region hosting.

I deal with that where I'm from. Central Hardin has the biggest gym in the 5th Region. Huge parking lot. Easy to get to. Restaurants close by. No need for split sessions. No overcrowding near bathrooms or concession area.

However, Green County (a haul), Marion County (a haul), Hart County (easy drive) and Nelson County (cake drive) all insist on being in the rotation. And although technically they seat enough, the other four are lengthier drives for the 5th Region fanbase compared to Central Hardin. Alll in smaller towns with less restaurants. Parking sometimes an issue. And they usually have to have split sessions.

Colleges are not an option. Campbellsville, Lindsey Wilson and St. Catharine have college floors, but their gyms are all less than 2,000 each IIRC. Plus, not near the population base (Hardin County-Nelson County) for the region.

So in years Central Hardin doesn't host, the 17th District (which has the most titles in the region, no matter where it is played) will complain. And rightfully so. It's gotten so bad that even Central Hardin's district rivals -- namely Elizabethtown and North Hardin, which do not have gyms capable of hosting region because they are way too small -- rather have it at a rival's court than travel to the other four.

And it's not like Central Hardin has homecourt advantage -- NEVER won the boys' region. Most of the time, CHHS isn't in the region tournament no matter where it's at.

But getting back to HCHS. Should they be able to host? Sure.

Should they be free from complaints (some very well warranted)? No.

[HDE]

Was Phill and his brother both on this team, or did his brother graduate in 77 I allways thought Cawood had really good teams what was the last year Cawood hosted the region.

Donnie graduated in 77.
Phil graduated in 81.
Greg Coldiron, Husky Turner, Will Clem, Lynn Rhymer and Fred Sturgill started on the 78 team that was 24-2. Phil played a lot but didn't start until the next year.
Cawood was second in the region in 76, 81, 83 and 86.
Cawood hosted the regional in 68, 97, 01 and 05.

[rojas]

It was in Middlesboro in 78. Cawood lost to Pineville in the first round, the biggest upset in 13th Region Tournament history in my book.

An upset that would rival the Pineville/Cawood upset as the 13s biggest upset ever was Jackson Co over Corbin in 1994. Corbin was ranked #1 in KY for much of the year. Jackson Co keep hitting 3s and beat Corbin in 3 overtimes. If I remember correctly Jackson Co shot 38 free throws in regulation to Corbin's 1.

[rojas]

Donnie graduated in 77.
Cawood hosted the regional in 68, 97, 01 and 05.

I was at the 68 regional tournament. I watched Clay County beat Harlan in the finals. As a 9 year old, I thought the JACHS gym was huge.

[RunItUpTheGut]

An upset that would rival the Pineville/Cawood upset as the 13s biggest upset ever was Jackson Co over Corbin in 1994. Corbin was ranked #1 in KY for much of the year. Jackson Co keep hitting 3s and beat Corbin in 3 overtimes. If I remember correctly Jackson Co shot 38 free throws in regulation to Corbin's 1.

I was there as well....

[panther nation]

:hilarious:

Expensive as far as what? Concessions? Never go to state or a UK or U of L game then. You'll be floored by the prices.

Expensive as far as rental? Doesn't matter. Schools made MORE when it was at Corbin than in Harlan.

So your price is a moot point. Strike One.

Travel? Pretty sure more region fans are CLOSER to Corbin than Harlan. So there's Strike Two.

And nosebleed? Corbin ain't Rupp, Yum, Diddle, NKU Bank of Ky.
The Corbin Arena and Pikeville East KY Expo are SMALL arenas. Not "nosebleed" by any stretch.
Louisville Valley, Marshall County, Montgomery County, Central Hardin, Henry County and Mason County have HS gyms similarly sized to Corbin Arena.

So that's Strike Three. You're out.

Next.

Roflmao now this is great love it..

[bear claw]

All I am saying is the school should have the right to host the tourney if they are capable to do so. It is not like it is at Harlan County every year. Once in 16 is more like it. People get over it, Harlan County wanted to host the tourney. What is the big deal? We don't want you all to have to travel the Harlan Pineville road once in 16 years but we will travel that same road EVERY 15 years. I am done with this conversation. We will just agree to disagree. I respect your opinion.

[SEKYFAN]

All I am saying is the school should have the right to host the tourney if they are capable to do so. It is not like it is at Harlan County every year. Once in 16 is more like it. People get over it, Harlan County wanted to host the tourney. What is the big deal? We don't want you all to have to travel the Harlan Pineville road once in 16 years but we will travel that same road EVERY 15 years. I am done with this conversation. We will just agree to disagree. I respect your opinion.

I agree, even though I obviously prefer the 5 minute drive to The Arena from my house.

I'm sure the biggest reason for the drop in attendance is because Harlan Co. is not centrally located, but there could be many other factors that affected the attendance that had nothing to do with the location, such as the teams playing, economy, timing of the tournament, etc.

[Olred]

I am fine with it being in Harlan 1 in 16 or even a little more than that IF they will somehow match the money the arena makes. It's unfair to the schools to give up the revenue for one school to get to break from the rotation. I truly believe no one has anything against Harlan except the drive for most of the fans is longer. Like I said though its only fair, as long as they can promise the schools the average share that they would get at the arena.

[Dietpepsidrinker]

I agree that is boils down to money, and it is clear that Harlan County did not produce the same money as the Arena in Corbin. Love may make the world go around but money is the axis that it spins on. I also have a problem with the KHSAA voiding a vote by the rest of the region just to appease Harlan County. (it would almos make you think they were going to make him an honorary coal miner) I was at every session and it cost me a boat load of money to make the drive to Harlan that many days. So yeah lets keep it at the arena for the forseeable future.

And by the time Harlan County is set to host again it may be a moot point. They could be in another region, there could be an arena type facility in another part of the region, they may vote to have it at the University of the Cumberlands,......bottom line we don't have to worry about it again for a long time.....Thank Goodness!!!!!!!!

[TheChief]

KHSAA should step in and start choosing the sites. It would take the local politics out of the decision. KHSAA would choose the Corbin Arena which makes the most sense and is best for kids.