[dore20]

Perry County Central has to play a top 10 schedule in the mountains. They play many top 10 teams in there respective classes.

Class 2A
3. Somerset- Oct 28th Home
9. Prestonsburg- 35-34 (W)Home
Class 4A
6. Rockcastle Co- September 23rd Home
7. Johnson Central - 35-27(W)Away
8. Knox Central- 34-28(W)At Clay
Class 5A
5. Harlan Co.- Oct 21st Away

[cksportsfan]

PHSForever,

I'm not saying I'd vote for Paintsville. I know my paper's voter did NOT. My guess is their name is what got someone to vote for them and not someone else.

One of the worst things the AP did was when the KHSAA went from 4 to 6 classes, it didn't adjust its voting.

Trying to keep up with 40 or so teams is a lot easier than 60.

I'd be in favor of doing a top-five poll instead of 10 (because when you think about it, 31.25 percent of 1-A and 6-A is ranked). Put that in major college hoops perpective and that would be like having to rank 100 teams in numerical order instead of just the top 25.

Or a Super-20 regardless of class. Or a small, medium and large top-10.

Happens all the time in polls.

That being said, the high school volleyball and boys' soccer polls done by coaches don't list "others receiving votes" and the girls' soccer poll only lists ORV teams in ABC order (not by total votes).

Of course I posted two unbiased computer ratings (Massey, MaxPreps) and people on here disagreed with them too.

So if humans can't get it right and computers can't get it right, should we do away with polls/rankings/ratings all together?

[MVP2]

^

It's deff a top 10. I'd say they got the toughest. I've not seen many tougher than theirs.I do remember seeing Whitley Co having play Bell and Boyle both so theirs is up there but PCC IMO has the toughest schedule in the Mts.

[laker20]

^

It's deff a top 10. I'd say they got the toughest. I've not seen many tougher than theirs.I do remember seeing Whitley Co having play Bell and Boyle both so theirs is up there but PCC IMO has the toughest schedule in the Mts.

Whitley Co has the toughest schedule in the Mts bar none. They still have Bell, PCC, Harlan Co, Somerset, and Boyle Co.

PCC and Bell would be next IMO, but they have nothing like Whitley does.

[jetpilot]

Clay County's schedule is pretty brutal IMO. Their remaining games are Whitley, Knox, Bell, Russell Co., Rockcastle, and Breathitt.

[RunItUpTheGut]

Whitley Co has the toughest schedule in the Mts bar none. They still have Bell, PCC, Harlan Co, Somerset, and Boyle Co.

PCC and Bell would be next IMO, but they have nothing like Whitley does.

I do believe its the toughest, especially with a young team like Whitley has.
Its not only the toughest in the mountains but maybe top 10-15 in the entire state.

[Stardust]

5A is looking pretty good

Pulaski still belong in the top 10

[laker20]

Pulaski still belong in the top 10

It's really hard to tell at this point. Their loss at Somerset shouldn't really be enough to drop them out, but we're (Russell Co) kind of like Rockcastle because know one really knows for sure how we compare to some of the better teams. We will get to see how the Maroons play against Rock Friday and will hopefully be able to tell more.

IMO the 4A 6-10 are probably better than the 5A 6-10.

[ole_blue_sack_15]

Clay County's schedule is pretty brutal IMO. Their remaining games are Whitley, Knox, Bell, Russell Co., Rockcastle, and Breathitt.

better beat whiltley co, cause i them beatn the other teams!

[GetChili]

Pulaski still belong in the top 10

I don't think Pulaski still belongs in the top 10.

[PHSForever]

PHSForever,

I'm not saying I'd vote for Paintsville. I know my paper's voter did NOT. My guess is their name is what got someone to vote for them and not someone else.

One of the worst things the AP did was when the KHSAA went from 4 to 6 classes, it didn't adjust its voting.

Trying to keep up with 40 or so teams is a lot easier than 60.

I'd be in favor of doing a top-five poll instead of 10 (because when you think about it, 31.25 percent of 1-A and 6-A is ranked). Put that in major college hoops perpective and that would be like having to rank 100 teams in numerical order instead of just the top 25.

Or a Super-20 regardless of class. Or a small, medium and large top-10.

Happens all the time in polls.

That being said, the high school volleyball and boys' soccer polls done by coaches don't list "others receiving votes" and the girls' soccer poll only lists ORV teams in ABC order (not by total votes).

Of course I posted two unbiased computer ratings (Massey, MaxPreps) and people on here disagreed with them too.

So if humans can't get it right and computers can't get it right, should we do away with polls/rankings/ratings all together?

It's not that I would do away with polls, they are much too fun to debate. But polls like MaxPreps and Massey are too reliant on previous season results and a computer crunches the numbers. They show Pikeville as the 108th best team in the state. I think that may be too generous, but at the same time, they show Hazard as the 58th best team in the state, and that IS too generous for a team that has played 2 games while others have played 4 (most of them, anyway), and the team is 1-1. I like some of your suggestions, particularly a Super 20 regardless of class. That isn't bad. Cantrall comes close to doing that, but again, he gives more weight to city schedules than rural schedules, no matter how bad a team sucks. Look what Harlan County did to Dunbar, and what Belfry did to Henry Clay. Guarantee you, the next poll will show them still ranked higher overall, or MaxPreps or Massey wil rank them higher.

[dore20]

It's really hard to tell at this point. Their loss at Somerset shouldn't really be enough to drop them out, but we're (Russell Co) kind of like Rockcastle because know one really knows for sure how we compare to some of the better teams. We will get to see how the Maroons play against Rock Friday and will hopefully be able to tell more.

IMO the 4A 6-10 are probably better than the 5A 6-10.

How is that When PCC has already beat johnson and Knox and will probably beat Rock to? And im jus saying they would beat Russell by more then the other 3. So you argument there carries no weight.

[ole_blue_sack_15]

How is that When PCC has already beat johnson and Knox and will probably beat Rock to? And im jus saying they would beat Russell by more then the other 3. So you argument there carries no weight.

:Thumbs:

[BB CLAW]

I cant wait to make the trip to Wayne Co on the 23rd of this month. Should be a GREAT game with two Top 10 teams going at it!

Great Game? Bell will demolish. Wouldn't be suprised if it ended 77-0!

[Dragonsdad]

An injustice? That's laying it on a little thick. Personally, I think if you're upset about Harlan County being dropped then you should be upset about them dropping behind both Warren Central AND Christian County. I view both of those teams as almost interchangeable at this point, and if Harlan Co. is going to drop behind one, I think they should drop behind both.

I don't know anything about the out of state teams on Harlan County's schedule beyond the fact that they have a combined record of 1-6. The Massey Ratings aren't much to go off of, but each rate Trousdale County well higher than Morristown. Higher than Bearden as well, a team that Morristown lost to. Gate City isn't well rated in Virginia as well. Comparing in-state, is there any question that Franklin-Simpson, Meade County, and Fort Campbell are better than Paul Laurence Dunbar? Exactly what makes you think that schedule is not tougher?

You are right DF. But I just don't think Warren Central or Christian Co. could beat HC. But that's just my opinion. You are also right that "injustice" was laying it on a little thick. I was just shocked to see them ranked over HC after they had been ranked 3rd to this point. In my opinion,with the meat of HC's schedule coming up,HC will regain the third spot if not higher by season's end. But,other than the Green Dragons,I am partial to HC. I don't think you can fault me for that.

[RunItUpTheGut]

better beat whiltley co, cause i them beatn the other teams!

Im not sure what you said but sure.

[Dragonsdad]

Dragonsdad,

HARLAN COUNTY SCHEDULE
Morristown-Hamblen East, TN is 1-3
Paul Laurence Dunbar is 0-3
Gate City is 0-3

WARREN CENTRAL SCHEDULE
Trousdale County is 3-1 (only loss is Warren Central)
Franklin-Simpson is 3-1 (only loss is Warren Central)
Fort Campbell is 2-2 (also lost to Clarksville TN which is currently 2-2)
Meade County is 2-2 (also lost to unbeaten 5-A No. 2 John Hardin)

MasseyRatings.com, which takes into account EVERY school, says Warren Central has played the 24th toughest schedule in the state. Harlan County's schedule is 79th.

http://www.highschoolsports.net/Massey/s...11/9999/1/

FWIW, I'm not from Warren Central. Not in same district, region or time zone. I'm 50 minutes away on a good day.

Good detective work cksportsfan. I stand corrected.

[laker20]

How is that When PCC has already beat johnson and Knox and will probably beat Rock to? And im jus saying they would beat Russell by more then the other 3. So you argument there carries no weight.

My statement (not argument) wasn't trying to start a pi$$ing contest (however, I can pi$$ a fairly large volume and quite a long way), that's why it starts off "IMO," and is about the groups as a whole. I wasn't drawing out PCC specifically, but since that is the argument that you want to conclude from my comment then here goes:

Yes, PCC has beat Johnson and Knox Central, but as a whole I'm not overly impressed with 6-10 in 5A. I think PCC should actually be higher in that poll. Also, I honestly think Knox Central has been one of the most under-performing teams in 4A. They don't deserve to be in the 4A top 10 right now. I do think they will get there, they have the talent but have a ways to go as a team from what I've seen.

I don't think that there's many unbiased people out there that would say that PCC will 'Probably' beat Rock. PCC has had a surprising year from what was initially expected, but as an outsider my head hasn't swollen to the point of thinking that they are that good yet. They may be, but it's too early to tell. I honestly think this game could go either way and I definitely wouldn't give PCC the advantage just yet (we will see, but that's my opinion at this point).

As far as your PCC beating Russell Co, I guess you are entitled to your opinion and you may very well be right. I've said many times in various posts that I'm not sure if Russell Co actually deserves to be ranked where we are because of our defense. However, IMO from the games I've seen PCC play, as good as your teams defense has been against the Mt schools, it's exactly the kind of D that our offense exposes. I honestly think that PCC would have a hard time keeping Russell Co out of the endzone. And, as good as Huff is playing I don't think PCC can score enough to beat Russell Co (not that we will get a chance to see).

My original point about 4A vs 5A was that it seems that 5A tapers off quicker than 4A. There are legitimately 10-12 teams that could be considered 5th-10th in 4A. Where 5A seems to take a pretty steep drop beyond Jeffersontown (8th).

[Beauty & Beast]

Hazard will prove that their definately number one in Class A by season's end. Perry Central is overrated, way too high in 5A. Go DAWGS!

[KState]

Did Highlands just win the 5A State Championship last year? How are they now 4A? Funny how they've beaten 2 of the top 5 teams in their class.

[bubba22]

So anderson co. is a cream puff. :lmao:ARE U CRAZY!!!!

[ole_blue_sack_15]

Im not sure what you said but sure.

***better beat whitley county, cause i dont see them beating the rest of those teams!

[laker20]

So anderson co. is a cream puff. :lmao:ARE U CRAZY!!!!

Didn't say they were a cream puff, but Bryan Station beat them down pretty bad (24 Points), then BS only beat West Jessamine by 7 . West Jessamine lost to Knox Central (4A) by 8 and to Mercer Co (4A) by 18. Mercer Co is perhaps the 20th ranked 4A school. Now granted, Mercer Co has shown sparks of being very capable, but not consistent.

So based on performance, I would think Anderson Co would have trouble beating any of the Top 15 4A schools. Of course, AC only has 3 games under their belt, and could show otherwise. But the only teams that they've beat so far are win less.

There just seems to be a drop off around that Jeffersontown spot in class 5A. Look at the AP voting points...it goes from 66 J'town to 23 for AC. The only class with a drop that significant over one place.

I can back up what I'm saying all day long. However, it's just 4-weeks into the year so all these things will change. I just started looking at 5A when the question was asked if Pulaski belonged in Top 10 5A...and the truthful answer at this point of the season is Who Knows? because who else deserves the spot?

[cksportsfan]

PHSForever,

here's the latest Lexington Herald-Leader Cantrall COMPUTER ratings:

http://www.kentucky.com/2011/09/12/18792...ralls.html

Harlan County is NOT rated because the Dragons haven't played two instate games yet. Trinity is not rated either and we know how good Trinity is.
Fulton City, Hazard and Lexington Christian aren't rated either.

No Lexington school is in the top 15 and No. 16 is LexCath (which played John Hardin closer than Boyle or 6-A Meade). So I'm not sure the city schools' schedules are giving them major jumps in the ratings.

As far as your ranked-above theory, not so:

- Belfry 71.3
- Henry Clay 64.2
- Paul Dunbar 45.2 (that's lower than 16 2-A teams and four 1-A teams, including ... Fairview!)

[dore20]

My statement (not argument) wasn't trying to start a pi$$ing contest (however, I can pi$$ a fairly large volume and quite a long way), that's why it starts off "IMO," and is about the groups as a whole. I wasn't drawing out PCC specifically, but since that is the argument that you want to conclude from my comment then here goes:

Yes, PCC has beat Johnson and Knox Central, but as a whole I'm not overly impressed with 6-10 in 5A. I think PCC should actually be higher in that poll. Also, I honestly think Knox Central has been one of the most under-performing teams in 4A. They don't deserve to be in the 4A top 10 right now. I do think they will get there, they have the talent but have a ways to go as a team from what I've seen.

I don't think that there's many unbiased people out there that would say that PCC will 'Probably' beat Rock. PCC has had a surprising year from what was initially expected, but as an outsider my head hasn't swollen to the point of thinking that they are that good yet. They may be, but it's too early to tell. I honestly think this game could go either way and I definitely wouldn't give PCC the advantage just yet (we will see, but that's my opinion at this point).

As far as your PCC beating Russell Co, I guess you are entitled to your opinion and you may very well be right. I've said many times in various posts that I'm not sure if Russell Co actually deserves to be ranked where we are because of our defense. However, IMO from the games I've seen PCC play, as good as your teams defense has been against the Mt schools, it's exactly the kind of D that our offense exposes. I honestly think that PCC would have a hard time keeping Russell Co out of the endzone. And, as good as Huff is playing I don't think PCC can score enough to beat Russell Co (not that we will get a chance to see).

My original point about 4A vs 5A was that it seems that 5A tapers off quicker than 4A. There are legitimately 10-12 teams that could be considered 5th-10th in 4A. Where 5A seems to take a pretty steep drop beyond Jeffersontown (8th).

Yea i stopped reading after that part.

[Black Bear Cuz]

Lets hear it Harlan Co. fans.

HC has clearly been penalized in the polls because of their strength of schedule thus far, there is no reason to make excuses (it is what it is) but given time and the opportunity to show what they can do against teams like Knox Central, Perry Central and later on Bell I blieve we will see the Bears climb back up the polls!! I believe that taking an early hit in the polls and having people question them (because they havent beat a gerat team yet) will only be more motivation for the Bears to BRING IT every night!!! Bad news for the rest of the Bears opponents!!

[PHSForever]

PHSForever,

here's the latest Lexington Herald-Leader Cantrall COMPUTER ratings:

http://www.kentucky.com/2011/09/12/18792...ralls.html

Harlan County is NOT rated because the Dragons haven't played two instate games yet. Trinity is not rated either and we know how good Trinity is.
Fulton City, Hazard and Lexington Christian aren't rated either.

No Lexington school is in the top 15 and No. 16 is LexCath (which played John Hardin closer than Boyle or 6-A Meade). So I'm not sure the city schools' schedules are giving them major jumps in the ratings.

As far as your ranked-above theory, not so:

- Belfry 71.3
- Henry Clay 64.2
- Paul Dunbar 45.2 (that's lower than 16 2-A teams and four 1-A teams, including ... Fairview!)

When I said overall, I meant by their class, if they are in same class. Any school, not just Harlan County, etc. Looking at their schedule, Dunbar has played Harlan Co, E. Jessamine, and Fern Creek. EJ is at 55.2 and Fern Creek is at 62.2 In other words, due to them being ranked higher, Dunbar was EXPECTED to lose to them, which is reflected in their ranking. When they get into the meat of their schedule, the ranking will improve or stay the same, basically, due to strength of schedule:

Lafayette: 77.9
Madison Central: 53.3
Tates Creek: 65.2
Bryan Station: 67.8
Henry Clay: 64.2
Scott County: 83.1
Mercer County: 40.7

All 6A schools except Mercer (4A).

Now, look at Harlan County's remaining (in state schools only) schedule:

Knox Central (4A) 65.2
GRC (6A) 66.0
LCC (5A) 47.0
Whitely (5A) 52.1
PCC (5A) 64.2
Bell (3A) 78.2

So, strength of schedule-wise, Dunbar will be seen as having faced a tougher schedule by the end of the season, and will consequently be ranked higher overall (points-wise in THIS specific poll) unless they totally flame out and go zero for the season. While no other Lexington school is in the top overall no matter the class, Tate's Creek and Bryan Station are close, and Henry Clay is relatively close.

I get the point you were making, but at the end of the season, I think my point will be proven. It makes for a lively debate, for sure, since there are many ways of looking at it and interpreting the numbers and strength of schedule, etc.

[RoShamBo]

Great Game? Bell will demolish. Wouldn't be suprised if it ended 77-0!

I was thinking the same thing. If that is a great game then I would be very concerned if I were a Bell Co. fan.

[Dragonsdad]

PHSForever,

here's the latest Lexington Herald-Leader Cantrall COMPUTER ratings:

http://www.kentucky.com/2011/09/12/18792...ralls.html

Harlan County is NOT rated because the Dragons haven't played two instate games yet. Trinity is not rated either and we know how good Trinity is.
Fulton City, Hazard and Lexington Christian aren't rated either.

No Lexington school is in the top 15 and No. 16 is LexCath (which played John Hardin closer than Boyle or 6-A Meade). So I'm not sure the city schools' schedules are giving them major jumps in the ratings.

As far as your ranked-above theory, not so:

- Belfry 71.3
- Henry Clay 64.2
- Paul Dunbar 45.2 (that's lower than 16 2-A teams and four 1-A teams, including ... Fairview!)

Harlan County is the Blackbears. Harlan Ind. is the Dragons.

[bac2369]

Hazard will prove that their definately number one in Class A by season's end. Perry Central is overrated, way too high in 5A. Go DAWGS!

Hazard is probably any where 2 to 4 in the rankings of teams state wide in class a but probably the best in the mount ains and this side of the state.
Perry Central is not overrated, They have a solid team this year and I must say are getting better each game.