[Wildcatk23]

What am I missing in the rest of the thread. Why are they talking of shutting down the mines? Is it due to the need for Coal being reduced due to alternative measures, or have the mines been mined out?

I dont know the exact reason stardust. Maybe someone on here could tell us why the mines are being shut down. Even though alot of my friends has beed rehired now. SOMEONE EDUCATE us ON THIS MATTER PLS.

[Hoot Gibson]

100% for coal! Strip mining requires less workers than deep mining. It may be safer but it causes more damage than good. though it seems hazard was made from strip mining.

A common misconception, perpetrated by radical environmentalists and our mainstream media is that coal companies have the choice between underground mining and surface mining. That is usually not the case. In most cases, geologic conditions, safety considerations, and economics dictate which mining methods may be employed for a given block of coal reserves.

When a company does have the choice between mining methods, it should opt to surface mine. Recovery rates for surface mining can exceed 90 percent, versus 50 to 60 percent for underground mining, and roughly 30 to 35 percent for auger mining. Longwall mining can in some cases achieve recovery rates similar to surface mining but longwall mining requires large contiguous blocks of reserves and operations are usually conducted under deep cover.

Deep mining coal that can be economically recovered by surface mining is extremely wasteful. Coal is a valuable, non-renewable resource and mining recovery rates should be maximized whenever it can be done safely.

[BigBlueBobcatFan]

I dont know the exact reason stardust. Maybe someone on here could tell us why the mines are being shut down. Even though alot of my friends has beed rehired now. SOMEONE EDUCATE us ON THIS MATTER PLS.

It really depends on why a mine shuts down here are the reasons...
1.They are mined out
2.cost of evrything (equipment,fuel,men etc...)
3.Permits, our significant leader Pres. Obama is making it nearly impossible to get a permit getting a permit is like hitting the power ball jackpot.
4.some mines may have too many violations and have been shut down by federal and state inspectors.
But #3 is the main reason because the mine my dad works at in Harlan County has two more faced up and ready to go into but are waiting on permits to be cleared thats why my dad is currently laid off but if they get the permit to the mine they want the coal is about 48 inches high thats just about 4 foot between roof of the mine and the floor of the mine so its more room than usual and they said there was enough coal in there to last a good 20 years 30 if they took there time with it and the other mine was only bout 36 inches and had enough coal to mine a good 25+ years so thats the main reason iif it helps.

[BigBlueBobcatFan]

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:u0B8K...g_coal.jpg





http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:8Ig-k...icture.jpg


1st pic is a roof fall
2nd pic is a guy checking the roof i believe its so small its hard to tell
3rd pic is 2 miners working on a Continuous Miner








http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:YUflF...ate.79.jpg

[TidesHoss32]

It really depends on why a mine shuts down here are the reasons...
1.They are mined out
2.cost of evrything (equipment,fuel,men etc...)
3.Permits, our significant leader Pres. Obama is making it nearly impossible to get a permit getting a permit is like hitting the power ball jackpot.
4.some mines may have too many violations and have been shut down by federal and state inspectors.
But #3 is the main reason because the mine my dad works at in Harlan County has two more faced up and ready to go into but are waiting on permits to be cleared thats why my dad is currently laid off but if they get the permit to the mine they want the coal is about 48 inches high thats just about 4 foot between roof of the mine and the floor of the mine so its more room than usual and they said there was enough coal in there to last a good 20 years 30 if they took there time with it and the other mine was only bout 36 inches and had enough coal to mine a good 25+ years so thats the main reason iif it helps.

Your dad work at Black Mtn? Arch?

[Wildcatk23]

A common misconception, perpetrated by radical environmentalists and our mainstream media is that coal companies have the choice between underground mining and surface mining. That is usually not the case. In most cases, geologic conditions, safety considerations, and economics dictate which mining methods may be employed for a given block of coal reserves.

When a company does have the choice between mining methods, it should opt to surface mine. Recovery rates for surface mining can exceed 90 percent, versus 50 to 60 percent for underground mining, and roughly 30 to 35 percent for auger mining. Longwall mining can in some cases achieve recovery rates similar to surface mining but longwall mining requires large contiguous blocks of reserves and operations are usually conducted under deep cover.

Deep mining coal that can be economically recovered by surface mining is extremely wasteful. Coal is a valuable, non-renewable resource and mining recovery rates should be maximized whenever it can be done safely.

Ty, Ive just always been told that major coal companies prefer surface mining because its cheaper and requires less workers.

[CatDawg]

You also have to add to the fact that the economy going bust last year has really hurt coal. The reason behind this is due to cars not being produced results in less need for steel which means the steel mills don't need the same amount of coal. Additionally, power plants don't need as much steam coal because 1 many businesses have shut down that need the power look at Ravenswood Aluminum in WV when it closed they were the number 1 user of power in WV which was somewhere around 15% of all power generated in the state if I remember correct. 2 if the steel mills aren't producing much then they don't need as much power and they use a ton of power. So if the power plants don't need to produce as much power they need less coal. Then another portion is due to the fact that many electric generation plants that have the ability are using gas right now since it is cheaper to burn gas than coal at the current time. The temperatures in the US were also not has warm over the past summer. Most power rates across the nation are being projected to drop next year. I'll believe that when I see it. LOL. However, you add all this along with the other points mentioned and you have a major problem for the coal industry. Basically not one of these things alone would hurt coal that much but when you put them all together you have PERFECT STORM facing the industry.

[BigBlueBobcatFan]

He works at which he is laid off now but he and 6 of my cousins work up there 2 of which are supers one on 2nd shift the other on day shift but its was owned by stanley diddy which Blue Stone Energy bought it and they sold it and it is now called southern coal i think.you go up into harlan and go past pizza hut turn right go past o brothers market up into liggit holler and its all the way at the end

[Hoot Gibson]

Ty, Ive just always been told that major coal companies prefer surface mining because its cheaper and requires less workers.

In general, companies will always try to produce a product to maximize profits, and I am not disputing that fact. The point I try to make is that in many (and probably an increasing number) of cases, the conditions dictate the mining method. For example, if a block of coal reserves has an overburden depth of zero to 100 feet and it contains 6 feet of coal in seams ranging from 6 to 18 inches separated by 20 feet of shale partings, then it may be surface minable but it is not deep minable. The reason is that transporting, processing deep mined coal to remove rock is very expensive and there is a limit to the percentage of "rejects" that a coal preparation plant can economically remove.

Even if a coal seam is fairly clean, if the overburden is shallow enough to allow surface mining, then the roof conditions will often not allow the coal to be mined by underground methods. In other cases, thicker seams that underlie a seam lying higher on the hill may have been mined out previously. Subsidence caused by the previous mining sometimes renders the higher seam unminable by deep mining methods. Generally, if two seams are located within 20 feet in elevation of each other, only one of them may be deep mined - although much depends on the type of rock separating the seams.

The bottom line is that choosing a mining method is never as simple as surface mining opponents make it sound.

[BC75]

I'm all for coal. Almost every male in my family either was or is an underground coal miner. Dad started underground in 1979, this is his 30th year.

Their are a lot great jobs in places like Eastern Kentucky that may not be linked directly to coal, but the coal industry is the bulk of the economic structure. If you take that job surplus out of the equation, your looking at Detroit, and haven't we all heard the horror stories?

I SUPPORT COAL!

[logmountainboy64]

well its like this it is going to take people like us and goverment officials to hold more rallies so people like our great president can see what they are doing..

[CatDawg]

I agree we need to be heard and support coal in order for this area to survive. However, we need to be intelligent enough to know that a time is coming when coal will be no more for this area. This might be a short time or a long time but it will happen. Therefore, we need to be ready. We need to get this area ready for some other type of industry this can be one of the many alternative energy sources that are being suggested or something totally different, but if we continue to rely on coal alone a time will come when this area will suffer greater than anytime in our history. Let's pray we have time to be prepared.

[BigBlueBobcatFan]

supposedly on US highway 119 there at varilla curve if you are familiar with that area they have built this bridge you might have heard about this its called the bridge to nowhere on top of the mountain they are reportedly going to build an airport and rumors are that they was going to bulid this million dollar coal to liquid plant which is self explanatory coal companies will take there coal there and it will be turned into a liquid state which they are wanting to be the "alternative fuel source" but it has been a while since i have heard anything on this matter so thats why this is a RUMOR

[BigBlueBobcatFan]

It would also supply this area with more jobs which is really what we need

[BigBlueBobcatFan]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anPfTJyJVQY"]YouTube- harlan ky coal miners[/ame]




This one is for any body that is in support of coal because this is what i have done and what every other man in my family has done and i will fight to keep it alive so this one gos to any man that has ever went 2 miles into the belly of a cold dark mountain

[king360]

If someone voted against coal on this thread they cold possbly be severely beaten..lol

[BigBlueBobcatFan]

you got that right

[logmountainboy64]

you aint kidding

[Wildcatk23]

If someone voted against coal on this thread they cold possbly be severely beaten..lol

Lol

[TheRealVille]

supposedly on US highway 119 there at varilla curve if you are familiar with that area they have built this bridge you might have heard about this its called the bridge to nowhere on top of the mountain they are reportedly going to build an airport and rumors are that they was going to bulid this million dollar coal to liquid plant which is self explanatory coal companies will take there coal there and it will be turned into a liquid state which they are wanting to be the "alternative fuel source" but it has been a while since i have heard anything on this matter so thats why this is a RUMOR

I have heard that this is true, the gasification plant is being built on the WV side, around Williamson, if that is where you are explaining. The permits to build it are already being applied for. I have friends that that have been in meetings with the owners, if it's the same plant. It is a 3 billion dollar project.

[TheRealVille]

You also have to add to the fact that the economy going bust last year has really hurt coal. The reason behind this is due to cars not being produced results in less need for steel which means the steel mills don't need the same amount of coal. Additionally, power plants don't need as much steam coal because 1 many businesses have shut down that need the power look at Ravenswood Aluminum in WV when it closed they were the number 1 user of power in WV which was somewhere around 15% of all power generated in the state if I remember correct. 2 if the steel mills aren't producing much then they don't need as much power and they use a ton of power. So if the power plants don't need to produce as much power they need less coal. Then another portion is due to the fact that many electric generation plants that have the ability are using gas right now since it is cheaper to burn gas than coal at the current time. The temperatures in the US were also not has warm over the past summer. Most power rates across the nation are being projected to drop next year. I'll believe that when I see it. LOL. However, you add all this along with the other points mentioned and you have a major problem for the coal industry. Basically not one of these things alone would hurt coal that much but when you put them all together you have PERFECT STORM facing the industry.

:Thumbs:

[BigBlueBobcatFan]

I have heard that this is true, the gasification plant is being built on the WV side, around Williamson, if that is where you are explaining. The permits to build it are already being applied for. I have friends that that have been in meetings with the owners, if it's the same plant. It is a 3 billion dollar project.

You da man thats exactly it:Thumbs::Thumbs:

[The Fan]

What am I missing in the rest of the thread. Why are they talking of shutting down the mines? Is it due to the need for Coal being reduced due to alternative measures, or have the mines been mined out?

There is plenty coal reserves economy and burecrats ( sp ?) are the reason

[TATE_64]

I am for COAL........This is what my whole family has done all of there lives... We haul coal for a living...... It has really slowed down....

[crazytaxidriver]

What kills me is the fac that all these people from away from here think hey know what is best for us. I've worked on the surface for 10 years now. An while we are working the mountain is ugly. But when we are done you see some of the prettiest places ever. If the property owner wants to sell their land to coal companies then who is PETA to tell him he can't. This junk is getting out of hand. Everyone is Sooooo liberal these days. They have absolutely no conservativeism in them at all. And for that very reason we are in trouble. The law supports people who want to cause trouble more so than it helps people who just want to live work and raise a family.

It's like me saying I'm offended because Abe Lincoln is on a penny. I don't think he was worth a penny. So I'm goin to sue and have him taken off.











Ridiculous I know. And I don't mean it but that's about how it sounds to me

[TidesHoss32]

This one is for any body that is in support of coal because this is what i have done and what every other man in my family has done and i will fight to keep it alive so this one gos to any man that has ever went 2 miles into the belly of a cold dark mountain

1:22, the guy on the bolt machine..thats Mitchell Back, Im pretty sure..I worked with him

[football05]

I worked on a strip job and got laid off in March...And talking about compairing accidents from underground to surface...Yes surface is dangerous...But alot of it can be prevented...Take me for instance I am young and really didnt see what my life was worth until I got in a bad place with my rocktruck and it made me slow down, and be more cautious bc i thought since I was in a rock truck I was invisible and nothing could happen to me....And also I would like to know the fatalities for Night shift VS day shift........but I SUPPORT COAL 100 % and if makes me so mad that these people away from here knock us bc of what they heard on the news or from a NON COAL SUPPORTER.....



I think what it will take is ALL the coal companies from around the area shut down for 6 months just quit mining and ship NO COAL and then see how that changes things....Bc it would take probably 3 months if not a lil longer for the stock piles to run out....But the bad thing is you couldnt get everyone to do that....WHAT DO YOU ALL THINK?

[Old School]

I worked on a strip job and got laid off in March...And talking about compairing accidents from underground to surface...Yes surface is dangerous...But alot of it can be prevented...Take me for instance I am young and really didnt see what my life was worth until I got in a bad place with my rocktruck and it made me slow down, and be more cautious bc i thought since I was in a rock truck I was invisible and nothing could happen to me....And also I would like to know the fatalities for Night shift VS day shift........but I SUPPORT COAL 100 % and if makes me so mad that these people away from here knock us bc of what they heard on the news or from a NON COAL SUPPORTER.....



I think what it will take is ALL the coal companies from around the area shut down for 6 months just quit mining and ship NO COAL and then see how that changes things....Bc it would take probably 3 months if not a lil longer for the stock piles to run out....But the bad thing is you couldnt get everyone to do that....WHAT DO YOU ALL THINK?

True, most accidents and fatalities occour when the miners are not paying attention to the details, I myself have had many close calls in the mines and after each and everyone of those close calls I would become more aware of my surroundings. Many of these jobs are repetitive and after doing the same routine over and over, we seem to start taking short cuts and not paying attention to safety. All it takes is a split second for someone to be injured or killed.

[Old School]

I worked on a strip job and got laid off in March...And talking about compairing accidents from underground to surface...Yes surface is dangerous...But alot of it can be prevented...Take me for instance I am young and really didnt see what my life was worth until I got in a bad place with my rocktruck and it made me slow down, and be more cautious bc i thought since I was in a rock truck I was invisible and nothing could happen to me....And also I would like to know the fatalities for Night shift VS day shift........but I SUPPORT COAL 100 % and if makes me so mad that these people away from here knock us bc of what they heard on the news or from a NON COAL SUPPORTER.....



I think what it will take is ALL the coal companies from around the area shut down for 6 months just quit mining and ship NO COAL and then see how that changes things....Bc it would take probably 3 months if not a lil longer for the stock piles to run out....But the bad thing is you couldnt get everyone to do that....WHAT DO YOU ALL THINK?

I searched MSHA's site and could only find reports for 6 of the 9 surface fatalities, and surprisingly out of those 6, 5 happened during the day and the sixth happened at 6:45am just 15 minutes before the end of his shift.

[football05]

wow thats suprising to me also...I figured it would of been more on night shift...I worked day shift and got in a comfort zone I guess you could say so that could be why more happens during the day...