Reds trade Encarnacion and two pitchers for Blue Jays' Rolen

Jshort5 · 07-31-2009, 06:53 PM

Per ESPN.

Discuss.

beasy_bo · 07-31-2009, 07:23 PM

woo hoo about time

**MVP2** · 07-31-2009, 08:03 PM

I like the move!

Jshort5 · 07-31-2009, 08:57 PM

We also got cash to offset Rolens' 11 million, yes 11 MILLION, salary. In another deadline trade the Reds' traded Jerry Hairston Jr. to the Yankees for a minor league catcher. I don't like the Hairston trade AT ALL! We already have Hernandez and a young catcher in Hanigan.

**kywldcat01** · 07-31-2009, 09:03 PM

Not sure how I feel about this. Rolen is a nice veteran to add to a young ball club but he's also 34 and on the backside of his career. I don't see him being around more than 2 or 3 more years.

Jshort5 · 07-31-2009, 09:15 PM

kywldcat01 Wrote:Not sure how I feel about this. Rolen is a nice veteran to add to a young ball club but he's also 34 and on the backside of his career. I don't see him being around more than 2 or 3 more years.

That's what I was thinking also, but he brings veteran experience to a VERY young ball club. With this addition I hope they get a new pitching coach and a new manager. Don't get me wrong I like Dusty Baker, but he is just not a very good coach in my opinion. I wish Pete Rose would get un-banned AND be allowed to manage, but that's not gonna happen any time soon I don't think. But, if it were to, I'd be in Cincinnati every weekend during the summer.

**Stardust** · 07-31-2009, 10:02 PM

Great move!

**Playboy5** · 07-31-2009, 10:32 PM

I think it is a GREAT MOVE!

**MVP2** · 07-31-2009, 10:43 PM

Jshort5 Wrote:We also got cash to offset Rolens' 11 million, yes 11 MILLION, salary. In another deadline trade the Reds' traded Jerry Hairston Jr. to the Yankees for a minor league catcher. I don't like the Hairston trade AT ALL! We already have Hernandez and a young catcher in Hanigan.

I dont like this trade at all either! I liked Hairston Jr. a lot.

***Spud6*** · 07-31-2009, 11:00 PM

I think it's an excellent move.

**More Cowbell** · 07-31-2009, 11:56 PM

TERRIBLE move!

If the Reds had simply traded Encarnacion for Rolen straight up, I would have been fine with it. But that wasn't the whole trade. The Reds actually gave up two young pitchers in the deal as well, Josh Roenicke and Zack Stewart.

I still wouldn't be upset if they had just added one of the two young pitchers, just not both. Roenicke had been pitching on the big-league level for the Reds for the last few weeks and had done a pretty good job. Stewart is a fireballer with a 97 mph fastball who was tearing through the Reds' minor league system this year. There is no way they should have included both of these guys.

Yeah, Rolen is a definite upgrade at third for the 2010 season (after which he's a free agent). But the bullpen lost one of its likely assets for next year, and Stewart looks like he might have been a very valuable arm as well. I just think they seemed way too desperate to add a 34-year-old player to the mix.

By the way, I actually like the Hairston deal. He made too much money for a bench player, and the Reds farm system needed another young catcher. Good trade there.

**Stardust** · 08-01-2009, 09:24 AM

More Cowbell Wrote:TERRIBLE move!

If the Reds had simply traded Encarnacion for Rolen straight up, I would have been fine with it. But that wasn't the whole trade. The Reds actually gave up two young pitchers in the deal as well, Josh Roenicke and Zack Stewart.

I still wouldn't be upset if they had just added one of the two young pitchers, just not both. Roenicke had been pitching on the big-league level for the Reds for the last few weeks and had done a pretty good job. Stewart is a fireballer with a 97 mph fastball who was tearing through the Reds' minor league system this year. There is no way they should have included both of these guys.

Yeah, Rolen is a definite upgrade at third for the 2010 season (after which he's a free agent). But the bullpen lost one of its likely assets for next year, and Stewart looks like he might have been a very valuable arm as well. I just think they seemed way too desperate to add a 34-year-old player to the mix.

By the way, I actually like the Hairston deal. He made too much money for a bench player, and the Reds farm system needed another young catcher. Good trade there.

Hariston should not have been a bench player

beasy_bo · 08-01-2009, 02:30 PM

Stardust Wrote:Hariston should not have been a bench player

amen

beasy_bo · 08-01-2009, 02:31 PM

one thing is when we get everyone back we'll be good. but we need to start soon!!!!

**MVP2** · 08-01-2009, 02:57 PM

Stardust Wrote:Hariston should not have been a bench player

:rockon::Thumbs:

Rob Van Winkle · 08-01-2009, 04:58 PM

Jshort5 Wrote:That's what I was thinking also, but he brings veteran experience to a VERY young ball club. With this addition I hope they get a new pitching coach and a new manager. Don't get me wrong I like Dusty Baker, but he is just not a very good coach in my opinion. I wish Pete Rose would get un-banned AND be allowed to manage, but that's not gonna happen any time soon I don't think. But, if it were to, I'd be in Cincinnati every weekend during the summer.

You mean you don't like it when Richard "****" Pole (pitching coach, and yes that's his name) comes out to the mound and gets nothing accomplished? I listen to the Cowboy on 700 WLW during the games and it drives him crazy that the Red's can beat teams the first time around, but the Reds pitchers never develop any more pitches to get batters out and they get shelled. He's exactly right. (See recent losing streak and 9 1/2 games back).
I'm not ready to pull the plug on Baker yet, but his days are numbered. It doesn't help that Volquez has been hurt all year and Bruce and Votto have missed a ton of time.
With that being said, I can't leave a post with a negative comment. The Reds have some young building blocks and pitching, for the most part, as kept them in games, a big time change from the past.

**Stardust** · 08-01-2009, 05:06 PM

Rob Van Winkle Wrote:You mean you don't like it when Richard "****" Pole (pitching coach, and yes that's his name) comes out to the mound and gets nothing accomplished? I listen to the Cowboy on 700 WLW during the games and it drives him crazy that the Red's can beat teams the first time around, but the Reds pitchers never develop any more pitches to get batters out and they get shelled. He's exactly right. (See recent losing streak and 9 1/2 games back).
I'm not ready to pull the plug on Baker yet, but his days are numbered. It doesn't help that Volquez has been hurt all year and Bruce and Votto have missed a ton of time.
With that being said, I can't leave a post with a negative comment. The Reds have some young building blocks and pitching, for the most part, as kept them in games, a big time change from the past.

RVW, I'll blame Dusty on his hire of **** Pole. Dusty had a reputation with both the Giants and the Cardinals of not developing pitchers and in the case of the Cubs, ruining great arms. I'm not a fan of Dusty's coaching choices. The expectation was the Dusty could come in and take the young talent that we have and turn them into superstars. That is still debatable. But if you look at Dusty's history, he builds a team around one offensive superstar (Bonds and Sosa). I think the writing is on the wall with the young talent. If Dusty is still here next year, you will see the Reds bring in an aging Big Bopper, and Dusty will revert back to HR ball as his only known way of winning games. If Dusty is here, say goodbye to the young talent. The acquisition of Rolen I believe is just the first of many similar moves you will see this guy perpetuate!

**More Cowbell** · 08-04-2009, 09:35 PM

Stardust Wrote:Hariston should not have been a bench player

Any team that would rely on Jerry Hairston to be anything more than a jack-of-all-trades bench player is setting themselves up for a big disappointment. His role with the Yankees will be exactly what it should be.

**Stardust** · 08-04-2009, 09:49 PM

More Cowbell Wrote:Any team that would rely on Jerry Hairston to be anything more than a jack-of-all-trades bench player is setting themselves up for a big disappointment. His role with the Yankees will be exactly what it should be.

With the Yankees yes, but with the Reds, he was a starter. You are right, he is a role player, but on the Reds, short of quality players, he had a starting role that was better then many on this squad

**More Cowbell** · 08-04-2009, 10:48 PM

Stardust Wrote:With the Yankees yes, but with the Reds, he was a starter. You are right, he is a role player, but on the Reds, short of quality players, he had a starting role that was better then many on this squad

I'm pretty sure even the Reds didn't envision him as a starter when they signed him last winter. Going into the season, the starting OF's were Bruce, Tavares, and Dickerson, while the starting IF was Votto, Phillips, Gonzalez, and EE. Hairston was supposed to fill the role he's best at, that of supersub.

Of course, the main job of the supersub utility guy is to fill in for injured players, and there have been plenty of those (EE, Gonzalez, Bruce, Dickerson, Tavares). So consequently, Hairston has had numerous chances to start for the Reds this year.

Still, I think the stats would bear out that if Hairston is an everyday starter for an extended length of time, he will show why he is best suited to the utility role.