[Beetle01]

McCain, unlike his Democratic Rival, has continued to maintain one of the highest levels of independence demonstrated by any US Senator since 2000. For instance, during the 110th Session of Congress, McCain ranked 65th among his colleagues having voted along party line 88% of the time, a far cry from the 12th place rank of Obama. Yet, McCain's voting record during the current session of Congress is likely to hold closer to party lines due to the nearly 50 bills that contained an Troop Withdrawal Timeline. During the 109th session of congress, McCain ranked 94th out of 100 Senators, having voted along party lines 79.4% of the time. This ranking and percentage are nearly identical to his 93rd place rank during both the 107th and 108th Congressional Sessions.

McCain has not voted with his party or George Bush 90% or 95% of the time. Obama's statistics are not based upon any actual statistical data, but rather a soundbite taken years ago at a highly partisan rally in which McCain made a misstatement. But then again, that misstatement would be no different from the fact that even Obama and Biden can't seem to keep the rhetoric straight. McCain should take Obama to task on the partisan voting issue, after all, Barack Obama, the self-proclaimed moderate, has voted along party lines more often than even Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid have.

[Beetle01]

Rank & % of time voted with party
2007-2008
Obama - 12th - 96.0%
McCain - 65th - 88.0%

2005-2006
Obama - 5th - 94.8%
McCain- 94th - 79.4%

2003-2004
Obama - NOT IN CONGRESS
McCain - 93rd - 84.5%

2001-2002
Obama - NOT IN CONGRESS
McCain - 93rd - 76.2%


McCain's voting record during the current session of Congress is likely to hold closer to party lines due to the nearly 50 bills that contained an Troop Withdrawal Timeline

[thecavemaster]

Rank & % of time voted with party
2007-2008
Obama - 12th - 96.0%
McCain - 65th - 88.0%

2005-2006
Obama - 5th - 94.8%
McCain- 94th - 79.4%

2003-2004
Obama - NOT IN CONGRESS
McCain - 93rd - 84.5%

2001-2002
Obama - NOT IN CONGRESS
McCain - 93rd - 76.2%


McCain's voting record during the current session of Congress is likely to hold closer to party lines due to the nearly 50 bills that contained an Troop Withdrawal Timeline

Again, McCain is not Bush and vice versa. McCain is running like Bush and has voted in support of Bush initiatives and policies, which has nothing to do with whether Bush is in the Senate or not... and you know that. Stop introducing red herrings. I am not talking about party votes... and you know that.

[Beetle01]

Again, McCain is not Bush and vice versa. McCain is running like Bush and has voted in support of Bush initiatives and policies, which has nothing to do with whether Bush is in the Senate or not... and you know that. Stop introducing red herrings. I am not talking about party votes... and you know that.

First you say Mccain is not Bush, but then that he is running like him. When there is proof in front of your face that he is nothing like Bush. Bush has controlled Republic policy for the last 8 years, so not voting with the Republican party line, is the same as not voting with Bush.

[Beetle01]

Still this is pointless because in my eyes voting in the Senate has almost nothing to do with voting with the President on issues, unless the President himself introduces a bill.


If a bill is introduced by another Senator or starts in the house, that is not voting with the President. Actually that is the President agreeing with you, because he gets it last.

[thecavemaster]

First you say Mccain is not Bush, but then that he is running like him. When there is proof in front of your face that he is nothing like Bush. Bush has controlled Republic policy for the last 8 years, so not voting with the Republican party line, is the same as not voting with Bush.

Bush doctrine: lots of votes go on and on and on that the President doesn't count as necessarily good or bad...but they aren't part of his agenda, his policy initiatives. Again, you know that. I did not suggest that McCain is Bush. I am suggesting that McCain is not a maverick, not a credible agent of change, kissing Bush in front of the base, dissing Bush in front of independents and Reagan democrats. Why would I post a link when I can read the speeches and votes of the candidates themselves? Quoting blogs and pundits suggests we can't figure things out for ourselves if we are diligent citizens.

[Beetle01]

Bush doctrine: lots of votes go on and on and on that the President doesn't count as necessarily good or bad...but they aren't part of his agenda, his policy initiatives. Again, you know that. I did not suggest that McCain is Bush. I am suggesting that McCain is not a maverick, not a credible agent of change, kissing Bush in front of the base, dissing Bush in front of independents and Reagan democrats. Why would I post a link when I can read the speeches and votes of the candidates themselves? Quoting blogs and pundits suggests we can't figure things out for ourselves if we are diligent citizens.

Your the one that brought up the 90% statistic, stating McCain voted with Bush.

Bush and Mccain differ on many many many issues.

[More Cowbell]

Rank & % of time voted with party
2007-2008
Obama - 12th - 96.0%
McCain - 65th - 88.0%

2005-2006
Obama - 5th - 94.8%
McCain- 94th - 79.4%

2003-2004
Obama - NOT IN CONGRESS
McCain - 93rd - 84.5%

2001-2002
Obama - NOT IN CONGRESS
McCain - 93rd - 76.2%

Obama's records of voting along party lines 96% and 95% of the time are way too high, although McCain's 88% isn't all that great either.

We need more free thinkers in office, people who vote based on their own personal convictions, not just repeating their respective party's positions like a ventriloquist dummy. McCain is closer to being an independent thinker than Obama, but I don't think either of them will deviate too far from the usual party politics if he is elected to the Presidency.

[DevilsWin]

Religion and Racism for the most part have no connection. Yes there are extremists who try and contort views to further Racism. However, racism does not come from being religious, and to even suggest so is unbelievable.

Rev. Wright didn't say what he said because he is Christian. He said what he said because he is a racist who happens to be a preacher.

He said what he said because he's African American.

[Beetle01]

He said what he said because he's African American.

A racist African American.

[DevilsWin]

A racist African American.

Maybe so but African Americans don't become racist because they've been given everything they need.
Racism come from injustice.

[thecavemaster]

A racist African American.

Racism is a human characteristic, not a color specific one. Rev. Wright did not use "gd" in the blasphemic sense...separate the words. If one knows the New Testament at all, one knows that in many, many instances, America might ask for that utterance. Plus, "when they own the information, they can bend it all they want." ... Rev. Wright had a lifetime body of work; they pulled out excerpts, less than 1%.

[Braves_Fan_26]

Give it up cavemaster, these racist white republicans have to defend their men, and will go to the grave doing the same thing. I agree with and support everything you posted and may I say you are very knowledgeable and know how and what to say what you feel and believe in. Great job.

[thecavemaster]

Give it up cavemaster, these racist white republicans have to defend their men, and will go to the grave doing the same thing. I agree with and support everything you posted and may I say you are very knowledgeable and know how and what to say what you feel and believe in. Great job.

I appreciate your words. I don't think all Republicans are racists, though, and they strongly defend the candidates they support, as they should. I do think Rev. Wright, as do a lot of people, got ground up in the media without fair and representative evaluation.

[Beetle01]

I guess only white people can be racist. Also, if anyone else is even close to being racist, then it's the "White Man's" fault.

[thecavemaster]

I guess only white people can be racist. Also, if anyone else is even close to being racist, then it's the "White Man's" fault.

Per earlier post: racism is a human characteristic, not a color specific one. However, the history of this country does not include MASSIVE civil rights violations as a way of life outside of one particular race. Wouldn't you agree with that?

[Beetle01]

If anyone has a right to be mad I'm gonna have to go with Native Americans.

Yes there was a great injustice in slavery in America, but lets not act like this was the only place it happened. America itself freed its own slaves. No other country in the world has done so.
Then there was a time after that of "adjustment" which even more atroccities were committed. However, as long as we keep the racial lines evident in our political views and government views. The racial line will always exist in our social lives.

[thecavemaster]

If anyone has a right to be mad I'm gonna have to go with Native Americans.

Yes there was a great injustice in slavery in America, but lets not act like this was the only place it happened. America itself freed its own slaves. No other country in the world has done so.
Then there was a time after that of "adjustment" which even more atroccities were committed. However, as long as we keep the racial lines evident in our political views and government views. The racial line will always exist in our social lives.

An understanding of the past is vital to the future. Native Americans were cheated and forced off land they inhabited. Africans were stolen from their homeland and transported to a foreign place and forced to do backbreaking labor for ramshackle housing. Neither make for proud moments of American history. If you were whipped and forced to work for near nothing for fifty years, then released with a freedom that translated into economic deprivation unless you returned to the very fields that had enslaved you, would you then say, "Well, my master is the only one around who freed us, glory be to god for that generous man"?

[Beetle01]

An understanding of the past is vital to the future. Native Americans were cheated and forced off land they inhabited. Africans were stolen from their homeland and transported to a foreign place and forced to do backbreaking labor for ramshackle housing. Neither make for proud moments of American history. If you were whipped and forced to work for near nothing for fifty years, then released with a freedom that translated into economic deprivation unless you returned to the very fields that had enslaved you, would you then say, "Well, my master is the only one around who freed us, glory be to god for that generous man"?

Exactly the past.
Noone is saying ignore it or act like it didn't happen. Definetly learn from it. Its 2008, not 1968 anymore. Things have drastically changed, and unless we can look more towards the future things will stay the same.

It makes me sick to think of all the people who lived their entire lives as slaves and never experienced anything more than a whip to the back and a hard life. I don't ask anyone to say glory for that generous man, I never freed a slave nor were any black people today ever slaves. I say that we learned from our mistake and our misdeeds. Lets move on as Americans and put the 19th and 20th centuries behind us and move on into the 21st century.

[thecavemaster]

Exactly the past.
Noone is saying ignore it or act like it didn't happen. Definetly learn from it. Its 2008, not 1968 anymore. Things have drastically changed, and unless we can look more towards the future things will stay the same.

It makes me sick to think of all the people who lived their entire lives as slaves and never experienced anything more than a whip to the back and a hard life. I don't ask anyone to say glory for that generous man, I never freed a slave nor were any black people today ever slaves. I say that we learned from our mistake and our misdeeds. Lets move on as Americans and put the 19th and 20th centuries behind us and move on into the 21st century.

If we had a mile race, and a group of runners got a head start, then the other runners had to also run with ankle weights on... If you are suggesting that race is a minimal factor circa 2008 in America, I would suggest that you are not paying close attention.

[Beetle01]

If we had a mile race, and a group of runners got a head start, then the other runners had to also run with ankle weights on... If you are suggesting that race is a minimal factor circa 2008 in America, I would suggest that you are not paying close attention.

Maybe you are not paying attention.

I think Obama is evidence of that. If he was more moderate he would be a shoe in. The fact that a black man with no experience, 0 military service is in a tight race with a white american war hero who has been a politician for 30+ years proove's my point.

[lawrencefan]

If we had a mile race, and a group of runners got a head start, then the other runners had to also run with ankle weights on... If you are suggesting that race is a minimal factor circa 2008 in America, I would suggest that you are not paying close attention.

Nothing on this planet has the same chance, not a man, animal, or a leaf on a tree. What matters is that we are all given equal justice. We should receive what we deserve as individuals not by how our ancestors were treated. My ancestors were chased out of every decent country in Europe. There is not one group of people in the world who has not been beat up on by one group or another. That's just the nature of humanity, and, barring the return of Christ, it will never change.

[DevilsWin]

Maybe you are not paying attention.

I think Obama is evidence of that. If he was more moderate he would be a shoe in. The fact that a black man with no experience, 0 military service is in a tight race with a white american war hero who has been a politician for 30+ years proove's my point.

Do you not think that if Obama's name was Barry Dunham(he went by Barry in school and his mothers name was Dunham) he would be having to debunk all these false accusations about his faith?

Do you think that if Obama had white skin like his mother he would be putting up with the racism he's had to endure.

[Beetle01]

Do you not think that if Obama's name was Barry Dunham(he went by Barry in school and his mothers name was Dunham) he would be having to debunk all these false accusations about his faith?

Do you think that if Obama had white skin like his mother he would be putting up with the racism he's had to endure.

I think his background is why he has to put up with questions about his faith. I'm sure his name has to do with it in some people's views, but I doubt as many as u think.

So youre saying the only people who are racist is white people?

[DevilsWin]

I think his background is why he has to put up with questions about his faith. I'm sure his name has to do with it in some people's views, but I doubt as many as u think.

So youre saying the only people who are racist is white people?

Don't try to twist my words. The answer to your question is no.

What is so troublesome about his background?

[launchpad4]

Do you not think that if Obama's name was Barry Dunham(he went by Barry in school and his mothers name was Dunham) he would be having to debunk all these false accusations about his faith?

Do you think that if Obama had white skin like his mother he would be putting up with the racism he's had to endure.

What racism. The media has been so pro-Obama that its sickening. You come on here and try to talk all this crap about how Obama is going to bring change and how much McCain isn't when the truth is that Obama has only been a senator for two years, most of that time he has been running for president. McCain has been a senator for over twenty years, most of that trying to better our country. If there were no parties and you had two guys up for election and we only got to see their accomplishments and what they plan to do with the country McCain would clearly be the easy winner in the election. Let me ask you this, if you needed to treatment from a life or death illness would you rather have an experienced doctor who has seen the issue before or would you want treatment from an intern just out of med. school? The same thing applies with this election. These men are going to be dealing with life or death decisions for every American. Whether to raise or lower taxes, increase domestic oil exploration and refinerary, to secure our country from future attacks by terrorists by any means, whether to allow our country to remain a free market economy or to socialize programs. Vice-presidential candidate Joe Biden said it best when he said that the office of President of the United States isn't the place for on the job training. Too much is at stake in the world today to hope that someone can learn quickly, especially when they refuse to state their intentions once they reach the White House.

[launchpad4]

Don't try to twist my words. The answer to your question is no.

What is so troublesome about his background?

What's so troublesome about his background is his refusal to talk about it. Any time someone tries to question it he goes off on them like a little spoiled brat who has never had to answer a hard question in his life. What's so troublesome about his background are the people that he routinely associates with: Bill Ayers, Rev. Wright, Father Flager, the ACLU, slum-lords, etc.. It's also troublesome when he talks down to the people that he states he is trying to help, ie his San Francisco speech.

[DevilsWin]

What's so troublesome about his background is his refusal to talk about it. Any time someone tries to question it he goes off on them like a little spoiled brat who has never had to answer a hard question in his life. What's so troublesome about his background are the people that he routinely associates with: Bill Ayers, Rev. Wright, Father Flager, the ACLU, slum-lords, etc.. It's also troublesome when he talks down to the people that he states he is trying to help, ie his San Francisco speech.

He does not "routinely" associate himself with Bill Ayers. They worked on a Education Bill together. That's it. He didn't plot any bombings with Bill Ayers so that reason is unjustified.

He is no longer a member of that church.

You, just like Hannity, Rush and Beck do a very good job of misrepresenting the facts to muddy the waters.

But just saying it doesn't make it true.

[DevilsWin]

What racism. The media has been so pro-Obama that its sickening. You come on here and try to talk all this crap about how Obama is going to bring change and how much McCain isn't when the truth is that Obama has only been a senator for two years, most of that time he has been running for president. McCain has been a senator for over twenty years, most of that trying to better our country. If there were no parties and you had two guys up for election and we only got to see their accomplishments and what they plan to do with the country McCain would clearly be the easy winner in the election. Let me ask you this, if you needed to treatment from a life or death illness would you rather have an experienced doctor who has seen the issue before or would you want treatment from an intern just out of med. school? The same thing applies with this election. These men are going to be dealing with life or death decisions for every American. Whether to raise or lower taxes, increase domestic oil exploration and refinerary, to secure our country from future attacks by terrorists by any means, whether to allow our country to remain a free market economy or to socialize programs. Vice-presidential candidate Joe Biden said it best when he said that the office of President of the United States isn't the place for on the job training. Too much is at stake in the world today to hope that someone can learn quickly, especially when they refuse to state their intentions once they reach the White House.

So you're gonna support Cancer Ridden John McCain so when he finally croaks Sarah Palin will be getting the OJT that you fear so much for Obama.

Give me a break.

Your guys have been in charge for 8 years and have failed Miserably on Every Issue!

Immigration- Wrong
The Economy- Wrong
Foreign Policy- Wrong
The Contitution- Wrong

The Extreme right has nearly brought America to its knees and you want more time to finish the job.

Pure insanity.......

Oh I almost forgot.....Cindy McCain is a Drug Addict- Good choice for a 1st lady.

[thecavemaster]

Nothing on this planet has the same chance, not a man, animal, or a leaf on a tree. What matters is that we are all given equal justice. We should receive what we deserve as individuals not by how our ancestors were treated. My ancestors were chased out of every decent country in Europe. There is not one group of people in the world who has not been beat up on by one group or another. That's just the nature of humanity, and, barring the return of Christ, it will never change.

Yes, yes...and if you look out the window and see one white horse, you conclude that all horses are white. This begs the question: are we given equal justice, as citizens of the United States, all citizens? Let us tell the child beaten up and ridiculed on the playground: "Well, buddy, life's not fair; most every child gets beaten up and made fun of now and again." What?