[mr.fundamental]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/...d=msedgntp

TRT... I know I have neglected you lately and I am sorry for that... I stand corrected thought the count so far 1-47 as of Friday night. The one by the way was to separate 2000 votes that were already being separated.

We will see what happens in Georgia next.

[TheRealThing]

Well, some of us will. The rest of you will have to wait for the folks at msnbc to tell you what to think first before you will 'see.'

[Hoot Gibson]

Tulsi Gabbard will be a force in Democrat presidential politics in 2024 and beyond. She is positioning herself as the moderate alternative to the lunatic left that is currently getting all of the media attention. As more election fraud emerges and Democrats continue to use terrorist groups like Black Lives Matter and Antifa to intimidate businesses and voters, Gabbard is betting that there will be a backlash against the far left wing of her own party and, if that happens, she will be left standing as one of the few viable presidential candidates.

[vector#1]

281,000 dead from the Trump Flu
And what is the Dear Leader doing ?
Holding another super spreader event
Time for him to go

[WideRight05]

281,000 dead from the Trump Flu
And what is the Dear Leader doing ?
Holding another super spreader event
Time for him to go

Do you mean the super spreader events like the democrats held going out celebrating in the cities after Biden “won?” Or the racial protests that democrats held marching in the streets?

[Old School Hound]

Just saw this topic. Don't know whether to laugh or cry. Mind-blowing... Facebook as a credible news source, conspiracy theories that are even less credible. crushing of democratic norms, Congressional enabling of a wannabe autocrat... We were close, REALLY close to losing what the Founding fathers launched some 244 years ago- the great American experiment that espoused freedom and democracy over tyranny an monarchy. A close call... we should never forget it or take our democracy for granted ever again. Maybe next time when a rogue leader gains power, he might actually be smart and not a TV con man with a eighth grade reading level. History tells us that democracies have finite lifetimes. Death of a democracy usually doesn't happen overnight but little by little, stripping away of democratic norms. That's what makes authoritarianism so insidious- it rapes us of our democracy piece by piece- separation of powers, political plurality, democratic voting , all die at the hands of iron-fisted central tyranny.

Take a deep breath...exhale. Think of what we might have lost if there had been four more years of stripping away of what men like John Adams, Samuel Adams, Benjamin Franklin, Alexander Hamilton, Patrick Henry, Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, John Marshall, George Mason, and George Washington set in motion almost a quarter of a millennium ago.

Drop the silly conspiracy theories that are perpetuated on social media and get behind this new President. Wish him to be successful in bringing this country back from the brink of becoming what we fought so hard against from 1775-1783. If want this country to be well again, if you want the divisions to heal , if you want to avoid another 1861-1865 or an American version of the Third Reich, then get behind the new leader and wish him and the country success.

[Hoot Gibson]

Just saw this topic. Don't know whether to laugh or cry.  Mind-blowing...  Facebook as a credible news source, conspiracy theories that are even less credible. crushing of democratic norms,  Congressional enabling of a wannabe autocrat... We were close, REALLY close to losing  what the Founding fathers launched some 244 years ago- the great American experiment  that espoused freedom and democracy over tyranny an monarchy. A close call... we should never forget it or take  our democracy for granted ever again.  Maybe next time when a rogue leader gains power, he might actually be smart and not a TV con man with a eighth grade reading level.  History tells us that democracies have finite lifetimes. Death of a democracy usually doesn't happen overnight but little by little,  stripping away of democratic norms. That's what makes authoritarianism so insidious- it rapes us  of our democracy piece by piece- separation of powers, political plurality, democratic voting , all  die at the hands of iron-fisted central tyranny.

Take a deep breath...exhale.  Think of what we might have lost if there had been four more years of stripping away of what men like  John Adams, Samuel Adams, Benjamin Franklin, Alexander Hamilton, Patrick Henry, Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, John Marshall, George Mason, and George Washington set in motion almost a quarter of a millennium ago. 

Drop the silly conspiracy theories that are perpetuated on social media and get behind this new President.  Wish him to be successful in bringing this country back from the brink of becoming what we fought so hard against from 1775-1783. If want this country to be well again, if you want the divisions to heal , if you want to avoid another 1861-1865 or an American version of the Third Reich,  then get behind the new leader and wish him and the country success.

Maybe you should actually read through the thread before commenting. The "new leader," is the threat to our democracy. The Supreme Court has been composed of 9 members for the past 150 years. When and if Democrats regain full control of Congress and the White House, the Supreme Court will be packed with as many members as necessary to guarantee the liberal justices a majority and the filibuster rule will be eliminated. Many Democrats are also in favor of granting statehood not only to the District of Columbia and Puerto Rico, but also creating additional states by splitting states to ensure a permanent majority in the Senate.

If you think that single party rule will be a good thing, then you are right to dismiss Trump's allegations about widespread election fraud as nothing but a conspiracy theory.

If you do take time to actually read this thread with an open mind, you will also find that there are allegations that the Republican Governor and Secretary of State were responsible for Georgia's purchase of $106 million worth of voting machines from Dominion Voting Systems, which included a guarantee that they would be re-elected. Fair elections are a cornerstone of our democratic republic and everybody has an interest in ensuring that elections are free and fair, no matter how much you may hate Donald Trump.

What I do not understand about liberal Democrats is how they can possibly view Donald Trump as an authoritarian president. Joe Biden, if elected, plans on enacting a federal mask mandate. Would not an authoritarian have already either mandated that people wear masks in public or prohibited state governors from requiring masks? Would an authoritarian left the decision about closing or restricting businesses up to state governors? Donald Trump has brokered peace treaties between three Middle Eastern countries and Israel and also helped negotiate an agreement with Saudi Arabia to allow Israel to fly commercial planes over the kingdom. Trump has also brought nearly all of our troops home from Iraq and Afghanistan after many years of war.

There has been a Trump good news embargo imposed by the mainstream media, but he has overseen the most successful foreign policy of any president since Ronald Reagan, if not before. Joe Biden has promised that one of the first things he will do as president is to reengage with the tyrannical Iranian government and resume the disastrous nuclear deal with the terrorist state that Obama initiated. Middle East peace will not survive a nuclear armed Iran. Trump's foreign policy is working and he is in the process of isolating Iran by forging commercial and diplomatic ties between Arab countries and Israel.

I reluctantly voted for Trump in 2016 as the lesser of two evils, but I honestly cannot understand why so many people just parrot news channels like CNN, MSNBC, and unfortunately Fox News, and instead judge him on his actual record. I have no idea how old you are but I have been following politics closely for most of Joe Biden's long career and he has never been a leader. IMO, Kamala Harris would be president before the end of a Biden first term, and she is a more liberal Senator than Bernie Sanders. Maybe you view that as a positive but I see capitalism and a free market society as a good thing.

If the election had been fair, I would agree that Trump should concede and prepare to resume private life. But the election was not fair and the way in which it was rigged will be repeated many times in the future if the system is not fixed now. Even if Biden is installed as president, our electoral system is broken and must be fixed if we are to avoid becoming a banana republic. American votes should be cast on American voting machines and counted on American soil. The machines should never be connected to the internet and if the machines cannot be made secure, then our elections should return to using paper ballots and hand counts.

[Old School Hound]

I haven't heard or read anything reputable that proves any widespread voter fraud. Trump started his "rigged" election verbiage weeks before the election when he realized he was going to lose. He kept repeating it, knowing his cult would buy in. It has been a technique he has used since he was a young man- repeating nonsensical lies over and over, hoping that they would stick. That is one of the few things he has been successful at. I don't expect I will find any proof in this thread of election rigging, but I promise I will read through the whole thread when I get the time to give it a good hour or two of reading.

[WideRight05]

Hoot, I’m starting to wonder if many of these “liberals” are one and the same. You notice how they each parrot the same rhetoric and yet none of them can ever form a coherent, reasonable response to the material that has been posted?

[Hoot Gibson]

I haven't heard or read anything reputable that proves any widespread voter fraud. Trump started his "rigged" election verbiage weeks before the election when he realized he was going to lose. He kept repeating it, knowing his cult would buy in. It has been a technique he has used since he was a young man- repeating nonsensical lies over and over, hoping that they would stick. That is one of the few things he has been successful at.  I don't expect I will find any proof in this thread of election rigging, but I promise I will read through the whole thread when I get the time to give it a good hour or two of reading.

I won't waste any time trying to change your opinion. There is no way that a feeble old man suffering from dementia who barely campaigned at all received far more votes than Obama or even Hillary Clinton did, IMO. If video from four different cameras showing four Democrats counting votes after Republican observers were sent home because of a nonexistent broken water main do not constitute evidence of election fraud, then nothing that I post will convince you. Overnight, Biden overcame a Trump's lead in Georgia because of the Biden votes counted in Atlanta while voting had reportedly been halted and Republican observers had gone home.

The biggest thing that convinced me that the election was rigged in Biden's favor is that voting was supposedly halted in five battleground states on election night with Trump having sizable leads in each. The following morning, Biden took the lead in those five states. Stopping the count of votes on election night was unprecedented and it happened in five key states. I want to know who made that decision in each of those states.

Thank you for taking time to read through the thread and watching some of the videos. I have relied heavily on Twitter in my posts because the media has really done a poor job with coverage and the lawyers who have filed the election related lawsuits have been using Twitter and many of the hearings and public meetings have not been televised by the networks or major cable channels.

[Old School Hound]

An honest question for those who are crying about the election being rigged. Was your outrage just as vociferous and demonstrative in 2016 when it was shown that Trump's comrades, the Russians , interfered to rig the election in Trump's favor? Hoot said that there is no way a" feeble old man suffering from dementia"(not true, btw) could have gotten more votes than Obama or Hillary. How could a lifelong con man that has failed in virtually every business venture he undertook have gotten more votes that an accomplished professional and experienced diplomat like Clinton? We know Russia had a role. Did you show your outrage then?

You know, I became convinced that this Trump thing is a cult when talking to my dear mother. Mom used to be a fervent Bill and Hillary Clinton supporter. A few years ago, she began to rely on social media for her sole source of "news." She became vulnerable to ridiculous conspiracy theories and became a Trump "follower. " I asked her back during the summer if there is anything Trump could do that would change her mind and make her drop her support for him. Rape? Murder? Treason? Pedophilia? What mom, would lose your support? "Absolutely nothing," mom replied. I knew then that there was no way to change the thinking of a MAGA/QANON person. Serious deprogramming would have to occur. I think the Tea Party opened the door to what the GOP has morphed into today. With the way Texas, Ga, and Arizona is changing demographically and with the once Mitt Romney-John McCain-Ronald Reagan-George Bush Republican Party being usurped by Trump, the GOP may never win another Presidential election. Texas will be blue in 2024 and it's "game over" for the Trump Party.

[Hoot Gibson]

An honest question for those who are crying about the election being rigged. Was your outrage just as vociferous and demonstrative in 2016 when it was shown that Trump's comrades, the Russians , interfered to rig the election in Trump's favor?  Hoot said that there is no way a" feeble old man suffering from dementia"(not true, btw) could have gotten more votes than Obama or Hillary. How could a lifelong con man that has failed in virtually every business venture he undertook have gotten more votes that an accomplished professional and experienced diplomat like Clinton?  We know Russia had a role. Did you show your outrage then?

You know, I became convinced that this Trump thing is a cult when talking to my dear mother.  Mom used to be a fervent Bill and Hillary Clinton supporter.  A few years ago, she began to rely on social media for her sole source of "news."  She became vulnerable to ridiculous conspiracy theories and became a Trump "follower. "  I asked her back during the summer if there is anything Trump could do that would change her mind and make her drop her support for him. Rape? Murder? Treason? Pedophilia?  What mom, would lose your support?  "Absolutely nothing," mom replied. I knew then that there was no way to  change the thinking of a MAGA/QANON person.  Serious deprogramming would have to occur.  I think the Tea Party opened the door  to what the GOP has morphed into today. With the way Texas, Ga, and Arizona is changing demographically and with the once Mitt Romney-John McCain-Ronald Reagan-George Bush Republican Party being usurped by Trump, the GOP may never win another Presidential election. Texas will be blue in 2024 and it's "game over" for the Trump Party.

The Russians did not help get Trump elected in 2016. You fell for a hoax that was intended to put Trump on the defensive and divert attention from Hillary Clinton's illegal use of a personal email server at home. Some of the email sent through that non-secure server was classified.

Nothing will convince me that Joe Biden won the election. I vaguely remember LBJ visiting Paintsville as a very young boy. Thousands of people turned out to see the president. My dad lifted me onto his shoulder so that I could see. I contrast that memory and seeing tens of thousands of people attending Trump rallies with Biden's inability to fill a small parking lot. There was no enthusiasm for Biden and enthusiasm drives turnout. Hillary also had difficulty drawing an audience but even her crowds dwarfed those that Biden drew. Obama's supporters were energized because many people wanted to see and support the first serious black presidential candidate.

Regardless of what you think about Donald Trump, his job approval is around 50 percent, which is at least as high as Obama's rating when he ran for his second term. Incumbent presidents with high approval ratings have consistently won reelection. IMO, Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden are the two weakest Democrat presidential candidates to run during my lifetime and that includes Dukakis and Mondale.

Whether you dismiss Trump's supporters as cult members or not, you would have to be blind and deaf to believe that Trump does not enjoy widespread, enthusiastic support. The evidence of widespread election fraud is overwhelming and you will not convince me that Joe Biden, a man who performed very poorly when he twice ran for president previously, before his sharp mental decline, won the election.

I write computer software for a living and I am required to take the same annual training that Hillary Clinton was required to have that covers network security and operations security. If I plug a flash drive into my computer, an email message is sent to my department manager warning that I have connected an unauthorized storage device to my computer. If I continue to hook devices up to a USB port, I get banned from the network, which keeps me from doing my job, and then get terminated for not being able to do my job.

I have watched videos of vote counters connecting flash drives to voting machines and then hooking the flash drives to laptops connected to the internet. The Dominion voting machines are not secure. There is no legitimate reason for moving data back and forth between laptops and the voting machines.

Until there is a thorough audit performed on the voting machines used in the battleground states, nobody will be able to say with any certainty that the vote counts were valid and that nobody tampered with them.

As for states turning blue, if Joe Biden and/or Kamala Harris serves a term as president, that trend will likely be reversed. Rigged elections are no substitute for actual support of the electorate. Democrat governors are already destroying the economies of blue states by making it impossible for many small businesses to stay open. When Biden/Harris take those policies national, their popularity will sink even lower than it is now. Those of us who voted for Trump - and 70 percent of us believe that Trump won the election - are never going to support socialist policies of the left.

[TheRealThing]

^^ You're probably exactly right in what you have said here Hoot. I just find it difficult to accept the likelihood that there are so many professing the belief that the Russians helped get MR Trump elected in 2016. The concept is past just being gullible. Even to the point of providing a plausible cover for those who so desperately want to see the traditionally conservative values of our founding destroyed, that they will willingly fake the role of useful idiots. The other alternative is that they really are useful idiots. A nation killing prospect in either case and the violence associated being much more like the trappings of a pre WW2 Germany than any political movement worthy of America.

[The Outsider]

An honest question for those who are crying about the election being rigged. Was your outrage just as vociferous and demonstrative in 2016 when it was shown that Trump's comrades, the Russians , interfered to rig the election in Trump's favor?  Hoot said that there is no way a" feeble old man suffering from dementia"(not true, btw) could have gotten more votes than Obama or Hillary. How could a lifelong con man that has failed in virtually every business venture he undertook have gotten more votes that an accomplished professional and experienced diplomat like Clinton?  We know Russia had a role. Did you show your outrage then?

You know, I became convinced that this Trump thing is a cult when talking to my dear mother.  Mom used to be a fervent Bill and Hillary Clinton supporter.  A few years ago, she began to rely on social media for her sole source of "news."  She became vulnerable to ridiculous conspiracy theories and became a Trump "follower. "  I asked her back during the summer if there is anything Trump could do that would change her mind and make her drop her support for him. Rape? Murder? Treason? Pedophilia?  What mom, would lose your support?  "Absolutely nothing," mom replied. I knew then that there was no way to  change the thinking of a MAGA/QANON person.  Serious deprogramming would have to occur.  I think the Tea Party opened the door  to what the GOP has morphed into today. With the way Texas, Ga, and Arizona is changing demographically and with the once Mitt Romney-John McCain-Ronald Reagan-George Bush Republican Party being usurped by Trump, the GOP may never win another Presidential election. Texas will be blue in 2024 and it's "game over" for the Trump Party.

I agree about Trumpism being a cult.  What scares me is that Trump has shown the pathway to bringing down our Democracy to others who are much more intelligent and knowledgeable in the workings of government.

[Hoot Gibson]

^^ You're probably exactly right in what you have said here Hoot. I just find it difficult to accept the likelihood that there are so many professing the belief that the Russians helped get MR Trump elected in 2016. The concept is past just being gullible. Even to the point of providing a plausible cover for those who so desperately want to see the traditionally conservative values of our founding destroyed, that they will willingly fake the role of useful idiots. The other alternative is that they really are useful idiots. A nation killing prospect in either case and the violence associated being much more like the trappings of a pre WW2 Germany than any political movement worthy of America.

I found it difficult to accept too, TRT, but the more that I have watched video clips and read tweets made by reporters from CNN, MSNBC, and other media outlets, the more I have realized how much disinformation much of the public consumes. In many places in this country, if you subscribe to a basic cable package, then CNN is your default cable news source. Have you listened to the CNN daily conference calls that James O'Keefe has been releasing over the past few days? Hearing how Jeff Zucker and his staff plot what Trump news to cover and which news to ignore is a real eye opener. Most CNN viewers have no idea that Hillary Clinton cooked up the Russia/Trump collusion hoax or that there was a documented meeting to discuss her strategy that Obama, Biden, Comey, and John Brennan attended.

Fox News was the last cable news channel to make any attempt at fairness in how they cover the news. Then, I watched as four "info babes" interrupted former Speaker of the House, Newt Gingrich, as he criticized George Soros. (Actually, only two of them censored Gingrich, but the other two failed to defend his right to speak.) When Tucker Carlson attacked Sidney Powell for not providing him with ALL of the evidence that she planned to file in her Georgia and Michigan lawsuits, I decided that I had had enough of Fox News. The only shows that I ever watch on FNC now are those of Maria Bartiromo and Lou Dobbs, and I do not watch them on a regular basis.

All on air reporters have Twitter accounts and it is scary how ignorant many reporters are of the news - and I know that statement will be taken as evidence that I am a conspiracy theorist.   But most schools of journalism are dominated by very liberal professors and most news organizations are owned and managed by individuals with a very liberal bias. Most reporters are on a short leash to cover the news that their corporate employers want them to cover and cover that news the way that they want it covered. Most young reporters seem to work their shift and then tune out the news when they are not on the clock.

I believe that it is a matter of time before NewsMax and OANN fall under liberal control as well. Buying controlling interests in successful American media companies is a cheap way for the CCP, Soros, et al., to manage American public opinion. It has been a sad process for me to finally realize that the British tabloids, Al Jazeera, and Russian propagandist outlet, RT America, are less politically biased than our own news media.

There are still a few exceptions of objectivity in the mainstream news media. Catherine Herridge of CBS News is an excellent investigative reporter who, for some reason, seems free to report on Donald Trump and conservatives (I still do not view Trump as a conservative) objectively.

One of Trump's biggest accomplishments, IMO, has been to fully expose the political bias in our national news media. The bias has always been present but years ago, liberal journalists were encouraged and rewarded for making an effort to separate their own political bias from their reporting of facts. I had a great deal of respect for journalists like Tim Russert and Sam Donaldson. They asked tough, but fair, questions of politicians, regardless of the party affiliation of their subject.

Supporters of the imbecile President-elect wannabe, Joe Biden, who want an honest, objective opinion of the man who won their vote with an almost non-existent campaign, should watch some video of how he was covered by liberal journalists when he ran for president unsuccessfully the first time. He was even ridiculed by Eleanor Clift for his rampant dishonesty and stupid, easily verifiable lies. There was virtually no critical news coverage of Biden's 2020 "campaign." Biden is very dishonest and he is a very bad liar but that does not matter much when most people watch a progressive, lapdog news media, which is very good at deception.

[Hoot Gibson]

An honest question for those who are crying about the election being rigged. Was your outrage just as vociferous and demonstrative in 2016 when it was shown that Trump's comrades, the Russians , interfered to rig the election in Trump's favor?  Hoot said that there is no way a" feeble old man suffering from dementia"(not true, btw) could have gotten more votes than Obama or Hillary. How could a lifelong con man that has failed in virtually every business venture he undertook have gotten more votes that an accomplished professional and experienced diplomat like Clinton?  We know Russia had a role. Did you show your outrage then?

You know, I became convinced that this Trump thing is a cult when talking to my dear mother.  Mom used to be a fervent Bill and Hillary Clinton supporter.  A few years ago, she began to rely on social media for her sole source of "news."  She became vulnerable to ridiculous conspiracy theories and became a Trump "follower. "  I asked her back during the summer if there is anything Trump could do that would change her mind and make her drop her support for him. Rape? Murder? Treason? Pedophilia?  What mom, would lose your support?  "Absolutely nothing," mom replied. I knew then that there was no way to  change the thinking of a MAGA/QANON person.  Serious deprogramming would have to occur.  I think the Tea Party opened the door  to what the GOP has morphed into today. With the way Texas, Ga, and Arizona is changing demographically and with the once Mitt Romney-John McCain-Ronald Reagan-George Bush Republican Party being usurped by Trump, the GOP may never win another Presidential election. Texas will be blue in 2024 and it's "game over" for the Trump Party.

I agree about Trumpism being a cult.  What scares me is that Trump has shown the pathway to bringing down our Democracy to others who are much more intelligent and knowledgeable in the workings of government.

I believe that we reside in parallel universes and each of us believes that the other lives in the Bizzaro universe.

[Hoot Gibson]

Hoot, I’m starting to wonder if many of these “liberals” are one and the same. You notice how they each parrot the same rhetoric and yet none of them can ever form a coherent, reasonable response to the material that has been posted?

Unfortunately, WR, I have seen some of the same opinions expressed by members of my own family. People who get their news from what they believe are reputable sources, such as ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN, MSNBC, NYT, Washington Post, etc., do not realize the degree to which those news sources collaborate to present a unified view of the country and world. Buying influence through purchasing ownership interest in corporations that have news media subsidiaries evidently is an affordable, effective way for progressive billionaires like Jeff Bezos and George Soros to mold public opinion.

I have always mistrusted the big tech companies and media outlets but I realized during the 2020 campaign how many major current events are ignored or injected with political bias by the traditional news media. You get an entirely different perspective when you watch videos recorded by ordinary American citizens showing Black Live Matters and Antifa rioting, looting, and attacking innocent non-black citizens, as they curse and hurl bodily fluids at police officers.

Those who dismiss videos recorded by fellow citizens while accepting CNN's news as "reputable" are doing themselves a real disservice. The mostly peaceful protests covered by CNN were often not mostly peaceful. CNN reminded me of Baghdad Bob as they described protests as mostly peaceful as fires started by Democrat arsonists raged in the background. There is nothing reputable about CNN or any of the formerly reliable news sources that I grew up watching and reading.

[Hoot Gibson]

Here is a great interview by Maria Bartiromo of Ken Starr and Alan Dershowitz about the current situation with the 2020 presidential election. Bartiromo is the best interviewer in the business, IMO. She asks relevant questions to her guests and then gives them time to answer the questions. She also seems to be good at selecting guests that give straightforward answers to straightforward questions.

[vector#1]

284,000 Dead from the Trump Flu
And what is the Dear Leader doing ?
Playing another round of golf.
He's got to go bring in the moving vans

[Van Hagar]

You can’t comprehend Biden’s appeal? His main appeal was that his opponent was Donald J. Trump. There were a number of Democratic candidates that would have garnered even more votes than Biden, and won the electoral college vote by an even greater amount. It would have taken an unspeakably bad candidate for most of us 80,000,000 plus that voted AGAINST Trump to have considered not making that choice. We despise him, Hoot and TRT, we think he is one of the worst humans to ever disgrace the office of the Presidency. We don’t despise the Bushes, most of us had respect for Reagan, but Trump is a different animal altogether. There is nothing you guys could ever post that will sway us from that. We can’t for the life of us understand how any halfway-educated person can voice support for such a reprehensible man. But that’s what makes the world go round.

[Old School Hound]

Hoot, I’m starting to wonder if many of these “liberals” are one and the same. You notice how they each parrot the same rhetoric and yet none of them can ever form a coherent, reasonable response to the material that has been posted?

I haven't read the material that has been posted in this thread  but I promised Hoot that I would, and I will .  I'll read it thoroughly when I get the time to devote a few hours to read and digest it.  We are so polarized nowadays in our politics that I don't think either Progressives or Trumpites are very open to perspectives that are different from their own.

[vector#1]

It looks like Georgia Democrats may have skipped the part of the election fraud manual that explains disabling security cameras before you attempt to steal an election. 

One America News Network (OANN), also known as One America News (OAN), is a far-right,[14] pro-Donald Trump[22] cable channel founded by Robert Herring Sr. and owned by Herring Networks, Inc., launched on July 4, 2013.[27] The network is headquartered in San Diego, California, and operates news bureaus in Washington, D.C., and New York City.
Its prime time political talk shows have a conservative perspective, and the channel has described itself as one of the "greatest supporters" of Trump.[28] Trump himself has promoted both the network and some of its hosts.[4][29][30][31]
The channel is prominent for promoting falsehoods and conspiracy theories.[40] On November 24, 2020, YouTube suspended and demonetized OANN's channel for one week as a first strike under its three-strike community guideline violation policy, for falsely claiming a COVID-19 cure.[41]

Just more Lies and Bullsh!t
275,000 dead from the Trump Flu He's got to go pull up the moving vans

That's it, dumbass, don't trust your own eyes and ears. Trust Wikipedia. It has to be right because anybody can add information to their articles.   

You have to believe that hundreds of witnesses who have testified about the felonies that they saw during the 2020 election are willing to lie and go to prison to testify for Trump to think that the election was not rigged. This video was most likely provided in response to a subpoena from either one of Trump's attorneys or L. Lin Wood. 

Wood has subpoenaed all of the security footage taken while votes were counted in Georgia. They will probably be able to track those suitcases full of ballots shown in the video from the loading dock to the vote tabulators. Democrats got sloppy with their election fraud and they got caught in multiple states. 

Joe Biden will never be the legitimate President of the United States. Even 30 percent of Democrats believe that he stole the election.

You can’t comprehend Biden’s appeal? His main appeal was that his opponent was Donald J. Trump. There were a number of Democratic candidates that would have garnered even more votes than Biden, and won the electoral college vote by an even greater amount. It would have taken an unspeakably bad candidate for most of us 80,000,000 plus that voted AGAINST Trump to have considered not making that choice. We despise him, Hoot and TRT, we think he is one of the worst humans to ever disgrace the office of the Presidency. We don’t despise the Bushes, most of us had respect for Reagan, but Trump is a different animal altogether. There is nothing you guys could ever post that will sway us from that. We can’t for the life of us understand how any halfway-educated person can voice support for such a reprehensible man. But that’s what makes the world go round.

Well i would agree with everything you said  but not the other candidates would beat Donald. Biden is the only one who could beat the Dear Leader this race was all about Donald and his character and handling of the Trump Flu it's been a total disaster especially after memorial day he has to own it and it's not good

[Old School Hound]

An honest question for those who are crying about the election being rigged. Was your outrage just as vociferous and demonstrative in 2016 when it was shown that Trump's comrades, the Russians , interfered to rig the election in Trump's favor?  Hoot said that there is no way a" feeble old man suffering from dementia"(not true, btw) could have gotten more votes than Obama or Hillary. How could a lifelong con man that has failed in virtually every business venture he undertook have gotten more votes that an accomplished professional and experienced diplomat like Clinton?  We know Russia had a role. Did you show your outrage then?

You know, I became convinced that this Trump thing is a cult when talking to my dear mother.  Mom used to be a fervent Bill and Hillary Clinton supporter.  A few years ago, she began to rely on social media for her sole source of "news."  She became vulnerable to ridiculous conspiracy theories and became a Trump "follower. "  I asked her back during the summer if there is anything Trump could do that would change her mind and make her drop her support for him. Rape? Murder? Treason? Pedophilia?  What mom, would lose your support?  "Absolutely nothing," mom replied. I knew then that there was no way to  change the thinking of a MAGA/QANON person.  Serious deprogramming would have to occur.  I think the Tea Party opened the door  to what the GOP has morphed into today. With the way Texas, Ga, and Arizona is changing demographically and with the once Mitt Romney-John McCain-Ronald Reagan-George Bush Republican Party being usurped by Trump, the GOP may never win another Presidential election. Texas will be blue in 2024 and it's "game over" for the Trump Party.

I agree about Trumpism being a cult.  What scares me is that Trump has shown the pathway to bringing down our Democracy to others who are much more intelligent and knowledgeable in the workings of government.



Astute observation.  Scary indeed.

---

An honest question for those who are crying about the election being rigged. Was your outrage just as vociferous and demonstrative in 2016 when it was shown that Trump's comrades, the Russians , interfered to rig the election in Trump's favor?  Hoot said that there is no way a" feeble old man suffering from dementia"(not true, btw) could have gotten more votes than Obama or Hillary. How could a lifelong con man that has failed in virtually every business venture he undertook have gotten more votes that an accomplished professional and experienced diplomat like Clinton?  We know Russia had a role. Did you show your outrage then?

You know, I became convinced that this Trump thing is a cult when talking to my dear mother.  Mom used to be a fervent Bill and Hillary Clinton supporter.  A few years ago, she began to rely on social media for her sole source of "news."  She became vulnerable to ridiculous conspiracy theories and became a Trump "follower. "  I asked her back during the summer if there is anything Trump could do that would change her mind and make her drop her support for him. Rape? Murder? Treason? Pedophilia?  What mom, would lose your support?  "Absolutely nothing," mom replied. I knew then that there was no way to  change the thinking of a MAGA/QANON person.  Serious deprogramming would have to occur.  I think the Tea Party opened the door  to what the GOP has morphed into today. With the way Texas, Ga, and Arizona is changing demographically and with the once Mitt Romney-John McCain-Ronald Reagan-George Bush Republican Party being usurped by Trump, the GOP may never win another Presidential election. Texas will be blue in 2024 and it's "game over" for the Trump Party.

I agree about Trumpism being a cult.  What scares me is that Trump has shown the pathway to bringing down our Democracy to others who are much more intelligent and knowledgeable in the workings of government.

I believe that we reside in parallel universes and each of us believes that the other lives in the Bizzaro universe.


Lol. I think you're right. But let me say I appreciate the opportunity to talk politics with those like yourself who enjoy the topic. Maybe we can find one or two points of agreement once in awhile .  Even in parallel universes, surely a thought or two eventually finds the same wavelength. Thanks for the discussion.

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You can’t comprehend Biden’s appeal? His main appeal was that his opponent was Donald J. Trump. There were a number of Democratic candidates that would have garnered even more votes than Biden, and won the electoral college vote by an even greater amount. It would have taken an unspeakably bad candidate for most of us 80,000,000 plus that voted AGAINST Trump to have considered not making that choice. We despise him, Hoot and TRT, we think he is one of the worst humans to ever disgrace the office of the Presidency. We don’t despise the Bushes, most of us had respect for Reagan, but Trump is a different animal altogether. There is nothing you guys could ever post that will sway us from that. We can’t for the life of us understand how any halfway-educated person can voice support for such a reprehensible man. But that’s what makes the world go round.

Absolutely !  I was going to post but you said it for me. I watched hundreds of videos of lifelong Republicans(Republicans Against Trump) who felt the same way most Democrats did-they would walk fifty miles over broken glass just to vote against Trump. This guy is different from Bush 41, Bush 43, or Reagan. I wasn't crazy about their politics but I didn't despise them. They had a sense of decency and honor. They weren't despicable people like Trump is. This man has been a con from the time of his "bone spurs" to the present. Biden received over 80,000,000 votes and won by an overwhelming margin because Americans wanted to fire Donald Trump. Eighty million souls realized they were in danger of having their democracy stripped away by a wannabe autocrat.

[TheRealThing]

Hoot, I’m starting to wonder if many of these “liberals” are one and the same. You notice how they each parrot the same rhetoric and yet none of them can ever form a coherent, reasonable response to the material that has been posted?

Excellent point Wide, and here's the thing. What I believe you are observing is the hopelessness of willful ignorance. No matter how much the truth is posted, or reported, or written about or aired by the Mark Levin's, Lou Dobb's, and Bartiromo's of Hoot's mention, and in my view that has happened sufficiently enough BTW, the people's will to deny that truth will intensify accordingly.

2 Thessalonians 2:11 KJV
11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

Blinded by that strong delusion, the vast unfortunate majority of folks do not even recognize that our nation is on the verge of collapse. The riots they think, may be blamed on the President, as are the American deaths due to the coronavirus. They blame him for everything in fact, and give him his richly deserved credit for nothing. Trump certainly isn't the deliverer of America, but neither is he the cause of our ills. This world belongs to the Creator, and only through Him can understanding in these times be realized.

To reject that validity of the Savior's death on the cross is to reject truth. This is why I have written about the fact that all truth is of God. There is no separation between secular truth and spiritual truth. God Himself is spirit in fact. To deny Him is to doom one's self to believe a lie. And in that men in this day will never get their appetite for lies satisfied.

[Van Hagar]

Those people spout your version of the truth. That does not make it the truth, that makes it what you believe , or in other words an opinion, exactly what those that oppose you have. I believe you would do well to reread your Thessalonians scripture and ask yourself “Wait, am I the one that is being deluded?” Have you ever bothered to explore that possibility?

[vector#1]

Same old TRT a couple lines of Bull Sh!t and then Bible Versus
The Dear Leader got to go the people have spoken
He's FIRED

[Old School Hound]

Those people spout your version of the truth. That does not make it the truth, that makes it what you believe , or in other words an opinion, exactly what those that oppose you have. I believe you would do well to reread your Thessalonians scripture and ask yourself  “Wait, am I the one that is being deluded?” Have you ever bothered to explore that possibility?

Or as the Orange Meanie would say, " Two Thessalonians."    LOL

---

Same old TRT a couple lines of Bull Sh!t and then Bible Versus
The Dear Leader got to go the people have spoken
He's FIRED

Evangelicals showed their true colors these past two election cycles in their support of the most non-Christian person ever to vie for the Presidency. What color is hypocrisy?  I say orange.

[Van Hagar]

God bless you two, nice to have some others here in Trumpland that see the truth. How about this one? In the past week, Trump has tweeted 145 times about the election results. He has tweeted 4 times about the coronavirus. And in those, he just wanted to say he was right and we are turning the corner!!! Amazingly tone deaf and incompetent! We could be invaded by a foreign country today and he would just stay in the White House basement and tweet about the election. Or come up with more family members to pardon even though they haven’t been charged with anything. Or give the Medal of Freedom to Bill Belichick or somebody. You know, important stuff, not any thing about COVID or some relief for the unemployed or anything trivial like that. You da man, Donald!

[WideRight05]

Hoot, I’m starting to wonder if many of these “liberals” are one and the same. You notice how they each parrot the same rhetoric and yet none of them can ever form a coherent, reasonable response to the material that has been posted?

I haven't read the material that has been posted in this thread  but I promised Hoot that I would, and I will .  I'll read it thoroughly when I get the time to devote a few hours to read and digest it.  We are so polarized nowadays in our politics that I don't think either Progressives or Trumpites are very open to perspectives that are different from their own.

That ones on me Old School Hound, my phone only caught the top parts of your post and not part where you said that you would read Hoot's information and I appreciate that you will take the time to read that. Definitely my mistake.

I do agree regarding politics being polarized, it's tough to have a conversation with anyone these days. I have read your perspective and will share mine. I know Hoot can speak for himself with these issues but for one questioning Hoot's strong support with Trump (this isn't anything you've brought up but just for reference) if you go back to posts from 2016 several conservatives on this board were split over Donald Trump. Hoot or I were the strongest in opposition to Trump during that time period and you'll see many posts especially from Hoot criticizing Trump. I was set to vote for Darrell Castle until he backtracked from conservative positions later on in the election cycle. Hoot may correct this but I believe he was set to write in Austin Petersen. Personally I felt that Trump wouldn't cast conservative votes or push conservative legislation.

If you go further back from 2016 you'll see posts from TRT, Hoot, Bob Seger, Granny Bear, just about any conservative on this board venting frustration with what was a Republican Party that constantly caved in to demands from the other side and even acted apologetic for defending conservatism. We had a president and cabinet that would constantly label those in opposition haters, bigots, deplorables, all in the name of love and supposedly showing respect toward people whom you might disagree with. Conservatives were hoping that somebody at some point would step up and fight back.

Then comes Donald Trump. Not the most conservative guy or even a conservative by some senses, but he’s fighting back hard. Then the party of love starts riots, questions the legitimacy of Trump’s presidency (which is one reason I don’t feel the least bit bad about Trump fighting back in this situation), and goes on an all-out assault to harass Trump and his supporters. Take a look at what's happened with Maxine Waters encouraging harassment of Trump supporters or others even encouraging that restaurant establishments not serve Mitch McConnell, Ted Cruz, or other conservative politicians.

I agree with you that the fighting is high, it's certainly the highest that it has been in my young lifetime. I think what you will also see though, if you do want to look back, is between Hoot, TRT, or whoever, each of them at some point on this board have been heavily critical of Republicans almost equally with what you're seeing the criticism of the election. Hoot, TRT, and I strongly agree on many issues but you will also won't see hesitancy from any of us to criticize that which we disagree with. Look at some most of the liberals that have posted on this board (unless some of these are people pretending to be liberals for giggles) and you won't see that same ability to comprehend and think for themselves. TRT, Hoot, and I debated, sometimes strongly, over Donald Trump four years ago. That being said, if I disagreed with what was posted not one time did they just throw some random link out and dismiss what was at hand. They gave an educated, understandable response and even if you disagree then there's still a level of respect that can happen. IMO a big problem with our society lies with the inability to communicate properly.

[TheRealThing]

Those people spout your version of the truth. That does not make it the truth, that makes it what you believe , or in other words an opinion, exactly what those that oppose you have. I believe you would do well to reread your Thessalonians scripture and ask yourself  “Wait, am I the one that is being deluded?” Have you ever bothered to explore that possibility?

Somehow I just find that I hold the opinions of those people in higher esteem than the contemptuous prattle of your favor.

But you talk like one of 'those people' that think men will find out which way they're going after they pass from this life. That is not the way I see it, the saved know before they die. And no, I don't need to explore that possibility. No one that is saved has to.

2 Peter 1:10  KJV
10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure:

In any case, I trust my own eyes for accuracy both for historical and current events. And my own interpretation of what constitutes truth. I do find it hilarious that you're invoking God's name to bless those you agree with out of one side of your mouth, and declaring for yourself AND others that you despise Trump out the other.