[TheRealThing]

^^ ABTW, not a lot of people are buying into the notion that the whistleblower report just dropped into Schiff's lap. There are those nagging reports coming from the likes of Devin Nunes, Kevin McCarthy, Mark Meadows, Jim Jordan et-al, which both question whether a member of the President's intel corps can even qualify as a whistleblower, and of his (Schiff's) involvement in the drafting of the report in the first place. It's hard to format and ghostwrite a whistleblower report, and then claim it sort of dropped into one's lap; isn't it?

[Cardfan1]

The people wanting to see MR Trump get into trouble are so inclined because they have contempt for the right, the traditional conservative values of our US heritage in other words. It's incredible to me to think the left expects conservatives to just lay down and get out of the way for them. Like I said, IF Republicans hadn't bum rushed out of the Congress last time around, Dems wouldn't have sailed into the House majority in the first place. And we see what they did with their newly regained power.

As in the case of the founders, service to this nation on the part of our elected officials is the stuff of love of country and the willingness of self sacrifice. Not of daisies and snowflakes who get their little delicate feelings mashed. But I have no worries whatever that should this fiasco spill onto the floor of the Senate, the timelines will be totally sorted out. :Thumbs:

The HOR being unproductive because of impeachment seems to be another falsity that’s out there. Over 400 pieces of legislation have been passed in the House including prescription drug reform earlier this month. Of course that bill will die in the Senate as most of the legislation passed by the House this year.

I expect the Senate to just hold a vote and acquit the President, which is Entirely within the Senate’s power afforded by the Constitution. But in no way will this sort out the fiasco. Right and left will trade voices about the legitimacy of trial/impeachment, and the circus goes on.

[Cardfan1]

^^ ABTW, not a lot of people are buying into the notion that the whistleblower report just dropped into Schiff's lap. There are those nagging reports coming from the likes of Devin Nunes, Kevin McCarthy, Mark Meadows, Jim Jordan et-al, which both question whether a member of the President's intel corps can even qualify as a whistleblower, and of his (Schiff's) involvement in the drafting of the report in the first place. It's hard to format and ghostwrite a whistleblower report, and then claim it sort of dropped into one's lap; isn't it?

The whistleblower went to Schiff early on; I call that dropping in his lap. I’m not sure anyone could ever prove if Schiff or his staffers typed the report. They deny it saying they directed the whistleblower to get a lawyer and follow procedure. It doesn’t seem the facts change either way, but Schiff possibly should have recused himself in hindsight. Politicians never do that.

Intel officers can be whistleblowers they just have a few more hoops to go through and according to the administration’s DNI this whistleblower followed the process.

These arguments seem to try to sidestep the matter at hand.

[Hoot Gibson]

The whistleblower went to Schiff early on; I call that dropping in his lap. I’m not sure anyone could ever prove if Schiff or his staffers typed the report. They deny it saying they directed the whistleblower to get a lawyer and follow procedure. It doesn’t seem the facts change either way, but Schiff possibly should have recused himself in hindsight. Politicians never do that.

Intel officers can be whistleblowers they just have a few more hoops to go through and according to the administration’s DNI this whistleblower followed the process.

These arguments seem to try to sidestep the matter at hand.

Schiff is a serial liar. He denied meeting with the so-called whistleblower before he blew the whistle before evidence surfaced that proved his denial was a lie. He fabricated the content of Trump's Ukrainian phone call before the transcript of the call was released, which once again demonstrated Schiff to be a liar. After the release of the transcript, Schiff claimed that his account of the call had been a "parody."

Using the words of Adam Schiff to support your position will not earn you any points for credibility.

[Hoot Gibson]

The HOR being unproductive because of impeachment seems to be another falsity that’s out there. Over 400 pieces of legislation have been passed in the House including prescription drug reform earlier this month. Of course that bill will die in the Senate as most of the legislation passed by the House this year.

I expect the Senate to just hold a vote and acquit the President, which is Entirely within the Senate’s power afforded by the Constitution. But in no way will this sort out the fiasco. Right and left will trade voices about the legitimacy of trial/impeachment, and the circus goes on.

400 pages of legislation translates to less than one page per member of the House of Representatives. I guess among Democrats, that is supposed to be outstanding productivity.

[TheRealThing]

The HOR being unproductive because of impeachment seems to be another falsity that’s out there. Over 400 pieces of legislation have been passed in the House including prescription drug reform earlier this month. Of course that bill will die in the Senate as most of the legislation passed by the House this year.

I expect the Senate to just hold a vote and acquit the President, which is Entirely within the Senate’s power afforded by the Constitution. But in no way will this sort out the fiasco. Right and left will trade voices about the legitimacy of trial/impeachment, and the circus goes on.

Ah yes, the circus WILL go on and on. Some folks really believe in the circus, take crab-boy for example. You remember the little fella with crab claws instead of forearms and hands, right?

Other folks know bull-craw when they see and hear it. Dems continue to take one of two tacks; Wrap their impeachment kangaroo up in the American flag, or troll the people with the help of the liberal media, in an attempt to validate the kangaroo with a Professor Irwin Corey style of legaleze and of course those deep feelings of theirs. I will never buy into either and there are millions of others out in the real world that agree with me. Liberals will find that simply repeating lies over and over, won't quite seal the deal for them in this case.

But I will say that your suggestion is entirely plausible. Now that House has so much egg on their faces, what other option other than trying to inundate the Senate with the same level of embarrassing stupidity do they really have? Trust me, I know the playbook.

[Cardfan1]

Schiff is a serial liar. He denied meeting with the so-called whistleblower before he blew the whistle before evidence surfaced that proved his denial was a lie. He fabricated the content of Trump's Ukrainian phone call before the transcript of the call was released, which once again demonstrated Schiff to be a liar. After the release of the transcript, Schiff claimed that his account of the call had been a "parody."

Using the words of Adam Schiff to support your position will not earn you any points for credibility.

I didn’t use Schiff’s words to support any position.

I did say , in hindsight, he should have recused himself. His actions have convoluted the real scandal allowing Trump supporters to make him the focal point.

[Cardfan1]

400 pages of legislation translates to less than one page per member of the House of Representatives. I guess among Democrats, that is supposed to be outstanding productivity.

Not hardly 400 Democrats in HOR. Some of the bills were bipartisan, which means Republicans participated.

The Senate has 354 bills waiting on them, and haven’t been “wasting time” on impeachment.

[Hoot Gibson]

Not hardly 400 Democrats in HOR. Some of the bills were bipartisan, which means Republicans participated.

The Senate has 354 bills waiting on them, and haven’t been “wasting time” on impeachment.

If you triple the number of pages of legislation, the House still has not achieved much. I think the failure of the Democrat House to pass bills that are enacted into law is a very good thing but no matter how you look at the stats, the Democrats in the House have had very little success. They are obviously worried that the man who they wrongfully impeached will still win the 2020 election.

[Hoot Gibson]

I didn’t use Schiff’s words to support any position.

I did say , in hindsight, he should have recused himself. His actions have convoluted the real scandal allowing Trump supporters to make him the focal point.

Whether you quoted him matters not. You post suggests that you either believe his lies or are comfortable spreading them.

[Cardfan1]

If you triple the number of pages of legislation, the House still has not achieved much. I think the failure of the Democrat House to pass bills that are enacted into law is a very good thing but no matter how you look at the stats, the Democrats in the House have had very little success. They are obviously worried that the man who they wrongfully impeached will still win the 2020 election.

Hard to hold the Democrats in the HOR, and for that matter the entire HOR, responsible if the Senate won’t vote on the bills they’ve sent over.

You are exactly right. Democrats are extremely worried about losing the general election in 2020.

[TheRealThing]

Whether you quoted him matters not. You post suggests that you either believe his lies or are comfortable spreading them.

Hear, hear! Up pops that due process confusion again. The presumption of innocence went the way of the Do-do under the skillful misguidance of the Obama administration. Overnight it has suddenly become okay to sentence the innocent and see if he can litigate his way out of it in front of the likes of Schiff, Waters, Green, Nadler and Pelosi. Not to forget the ever lurking in the background, string-pulling Schumer.

[TheRealThing]

Hard to hold the Democrats in the HOR and for that matter the entire HOR responsible if the Senate won’t vote on the bills they’ve sent over.

You are exactly right. Democrats are extremely worried about losing the general election in 2020.

^^ You've got to be kidding here. Harry Reid sat on EVERY bill sent up to the Senate from the day the House flipped in 2010. Selective memory is a wonderful thing, is it not? ABTW, you can bet the ranch, that the remaining house passed legislation you're so proud of is a who's who of climate baloney and special interest looney toons.

[Cardfan1]

Whether you quoted him matters not. You post suggests that you either believe his lies or are comfortable spreading them.

I realize Schiff has been turned into a lightning rod by Trump and supporters, but honestly you could replace him with anyone and the facts remain the same.

[Cardfan1]

^^ You've got to be kidding here. Harry Reid sat on EVERY bill sent up to the Senate from the day the House flipped in 2010. Selective memory is a wonderful thing, is it not? ABTW, you can bet the ranch, that the remaining house passed legislation you're so proud of is a who's who of climate baloney and special interest looney toons.

I’m sure some of the legislation awaiting a vote may not pass, but not taking it through the process is the problem.

Living in the here and now, it’s extremely hypocritical to point out the failure of one house when the other has done next to nothing.

We do agree it’s time to give up on the climate baloney. Time to react because climate change is already here.

[TheRealThing]

I’m sure some of the legislation awaiting a vote may not pass, but not taking it through the process is the problem.

Living in the here and now, it’s extremely hypocritical to point out the failure of one house when the other has done next to nothing.

We do agree it’s time to give up on the climate baloney. Time to react because climate change is already here.

Must have missed the climate change, the weather seems to be cycling on as it always has IMHO.


Scenario Context-- It is shortly after the great flood and God says the following:

Genesis 8:21-22 (KJV)
21 And the LORD smelled a sweet savour; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake; for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done.
22 While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease.



Have you explained all of your climate concerns to the Lord? Cause it would seem He thinks otherwise.

[TheRealThing]

I realize Schiff has been turned into a lightning rod by Trump and supporters, but honestly you could replace him with anyone and the facts remain the same.

I don't know about that. Schiff's performance on the Judiciary Committee doesn't speak very highly of his being much of a conductor.


Correct, that facts would remain the same. They still wouldn't bare the faintest similarity to the narrative put out by Nadler and Schiff. I would have put Pelosi in there, but who can really say they know what she's ever talking about? :igiveup:

[TheRealThing]

On the matter of due process

This AM on Maria Bartiromo's 'Sunday Morning Futures' concerning a Senate impeachment trial, per Senator Ted Cruz----


"If the President wants to call [say], Hunter Biden or the whistleblower; 'DUE PROCESS' mandates that he be allowed to defend himself, to make his case."

Now, I will cede that though no opinion from a constitutional law expert likes of the good Senator from Texas could ever compete with Card Fan's expertise with the Google function, I will side with MR Cruz on whether the President is afforded due process or not.

[Cardfan1]

On the matter of due process

This AM on Maria Bartiromo's 'Sunday Morning Futures' concerning a Senate impeachment trial, per Senator Ted Cruz----


"If the President wants to call [say], Hunter Biden or the whistleblower; 'DUE PROCESS' mandates that he be allowed to defend himself, to make his case."

Now, I will cede that though no opinion from a constitutional law expert likes of the good Senator from Texas could ever compete with Card Fan's expertise with the Google function, I will side with MR Cruz on whether the President is afforded due process or not.

I agree with Senator Cruz concerning the Senate trial of the President. But the Senate has “sole” power, so there is also an argument to be had there.

The discrepancy has been the issue of due process in impeachment in the House of Rep., where due process doesn’t exist.

[Cardfan1]

Must have missed the climate change, the weather seems to be cycling on as it always has IMHO.


Scenario Context-- It is shortly after the great flood and God says the following:

Genesis 8:21-22 (KJV)
21 And the LORD smelled a sweet savour; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake; for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done.
22 While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease.



Have you explained all of your climate concerns to the Lord? Cause it would seem He thinks otherwise.

Climate change seems synonymous with “weather cycling.”

Whatever the cause, man or Mother Nature, there are ramifications to a warmer Earth. The debate of the blame is putting us behind in preparation/reaction.

I’m in the vein of the old Russian proverb “pray to God, but row to shore.” I believe God has given us agency to help each other, and that divine intervention may just be humans uniting to solve the crises we may face.

[TheRealThing]

I agree with Senator Cruz concerning the Senate trial of the President. But the Senate has “sole” power, so there is also an argument to be had there.

The discrepancy has been the issue of due process in impeachment in the House of Rep., where due process doesn’t exist.

:biglmao:

[TheRealThing]

Climate change seems synonymous with “weather cycling.”

Whatever the cause, man or Mother Nature, there are ramifications to a warmer Earth. The debate of the blame is putting us behind in preparation/reaction.

I’m in the vein of the old Russian proverb “pray to God, but row to shore.” I believe God has given us agency to help each other, and that divine intervention may just be humans uniting to solve the crises we may face.

I wouldn't have expected you to cede sovereignty of the earth to God, I posted that for people who want to be reasonable. And there is no crisis, but the bolded part of your quote is still a perfect definition of secular humanism. :Thumbs:

Point of fact number one; in the past 170 years, earth temps have risen 1.37 degrees F. Now I don't care how excessively the left tries to massage the data, 1.37 degrees amounts to nothing.

Point of fact number two; no matter how much America continues to cut back her so-called carbon footprint, until China, India and all the 3rd world nations get on board with this idea of carbon elimination, let alone prove human carbon emissions mean a thing, ALL of today's climate hysteria remains a scientifically provable waste of time.

[Cardfan1]

I wouldn't have expected you to cede sovereignty of the earth to God, I posted that for people who want to be reasonable. And there is no crisis, but the bolded part of your quote is still a perfect definition of secular humanism. :Thumbs:

Maybe one that hasn’t hit outside your house, but many in this country face tragedies that are attributed to climate change.

Point of fact number one; in the past 170 years, earth temps have risen 1.37 degrees F. Now I don't care how excessively the left tries to massage the data, 1.37 degrees amounts to nothing.

What the heck...2/3 of that has happened since 1975. Talking about massaging the data. Measurements are about a decade behind, so the damage for the next decade has already been released.

Point of fact number two; no matter how much America continues to cut back her so-called carbon footprint, until China, India and all the 3rd world nations get on board with this idea of carbon elimination, let alone prove human carbon emissions mean a thing, ALL of today's climate hysteria remains a scientifically provable waste of time.

I’m not even saying cut back anymore, because it’ll never happen. It’s time study ways to react.

[Cardfan1]

:biglmao:

With all the “due process” and “fair trial” talk and the confusion with the criminal process, I got to thinking. What if the Senate chose 12 jurors from the pool of 100 Senators using the practices of the criminal system? Witnesses could be called and questioned on both sides with the jury deciding to acquit or remove the president on secret ballot.

It could happen. Would both sides see it as a fair trial?

[TheRealThing]

With all the “due process” and “fair trial” talk and the confusion with the criminal process, I got to thinking. What if the Senate chose 12 jurors from the pool of 100 Senators using the practices of the criminal system? Witnesses could be called and questioned on both sides with the jury deciding to acquit or remove the president on secret ballot.

It could happen. Would both sides see it as a fair trial?

Let us recap.

First, but only after nearly 3 years of threats and hollow impeachment votes, the Mueller probe, and all manner of slander towards the President, House Dems armed with the whistleblower strategy met in secret in basement bunkers on the Hill, to fine tune and practice the way they might rebuff the statements and questions certain to come their way by Republicans. Of course, Republicans were barred from those proceedings and when they attempted to crash the party, Adam Schiff immediately adjourned.

Second, President Trump was denied the same rights of due process that Republicans guaranteed and oversaw in the case of the Bill Clinton impeachment. This fact is beyond question or denial. All Republicans have to go on by way of evidence is Dems claim to have a secret witness. That fact alone is total juris-rubbish.

Third, because Nancy Pelosi gambled that Mitch would be somewhat apprehensive of a Senate trial, she cooked up a scheme with Chuck Schumer to get certain guarantees under which her lieutenants could continue their sham litigations in the upper House. Blowing that plan out of the water, Mitch said "bring it" and then proceeded to laugh her to scorn.
Since she knows that she will have completely lost control of the sham process the second she transmits the articles of ridicument to the Senate, she decided to take a Harvard Law prof's advice and just sit on the articles. At least that way the Dems could continue on with their concocted narrative.

Fourth, the presumption of innocence, due process and fair treatment, constitute one of the founding pillars of this nation. But I'm not surprised to see you suggest something so absurdly contraventional as the quote above. You ought to be embarrassed for having typed something like that.

[TheRealThing]

I’m not even saying cut back anymore, because it’ll never happen. It’s time study ways to react.

There are no so-called climate crises which are scientifically attributable to global warming, end of story.

And I'd appreciate it if you wouldn't insert responses in the text of my posts. Again, in the past 170 years the temps have risen 1.37 degrees. My opinion is the printed scale on thermometers was questionable, along with the difficulty in proper mercury fill proportions back in 1850, were very likely to be just a tad off in the best of conditions.

I can only hope that government forced cut backs will never happen. I'm solidly against them.

[Cardfan1]

Let us recap.

First, but only after nearly 3 years of threats and hollow impeachment votes, the Mueller probe, and all manner of slander towards the President, House Dems armed with the whistleblower strategy met in secret in basement bunkers on the Hill, to fine tune and practice the way they might rebuff the statements and questions certain to come their way by Republicans. Of course, Republicans were barred from those proceedings and when they attempted to crash the party, Adam Schiff immediately adjourned.

Second, President Trump was denied the same rights of due process that Republicans guaranteed and oversaw in the case of the Bill Clinton impeachment. This fact is beyond question or denial. All Republicans have to go on by way of evidence is Dems claim to have a secret witness. That fact alone is total juris-rubbish.

Third, because Nancy Pelosi gambled that Mitch would be somewhat apprehensive of a Senate trial, she cooked up a scheme with Chuck Schumer to get certain guarantees under which her lieutenants could continue their sham litigations in the upper House. Blowing that plan out of the water, Mitch said "bring it" and then proceeded to laugh her to scorn.
Since she knows that she will have completely lost control of the sham process the second she transmits the articles of ridicument to the Senate, she decided to take a Harvard Law prof's advice and just sit on the articles. At least that way the Dems could continue on with their concocted narrative.

Fourth, the presumption of innocence, due process and fair treatment, constitute one of the founding pillars of this nation. But I'm not surprised to see you suggest something so absurdly contraventional as the quote above. You ought to be embarrassed for having typed something like that.

Didn’t see anything bolded.

So I take it you would be ok with making the Senate trial like a criminal trial even though it’s not criminal and the president will not lose life or liberty.

[TheRealThing]

Didn’t see anything bolded.

So I take it you would be ok with making the Senate trial like a criminal trial even though it’s not criminal and the president will not lose life or liberty.

Who said anything about bolding?


I didn't say I was or would be okay with a thing, especially one of your weird ideas that supposedly have any basis whatsoever in US law.

[Cardfan1]

Who said anything about bolding?


I didn't say I was or would be okay with a thing, especially one of your weird ideas that supposedly have any basis whatsoever in US law.

As I have said before both houses are guaranteed sole power, so like it or not they can do what they want. My idea does have basis in the Constitution.

I thought since you were so keen on due process you would like the idea.

[TheRealThing]

As I have said before both houses are guaranteed sole power, so like it or not they can do what they want. My idea does have basis in the Constitution.

I thought since you were so keen on due process you would like the idea.

LOL, typical revisionist liberal doublespeak. You're just so impressed with your own ideas. Not to worry, I'm sure McConnell is out there hanging on every word you type. Me not so much.