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10-18-2015, 05:27 AM
Wanted to see if there is a way for KYMSFA to sanction organizations for the conduct of their coaches and dare I say fans. Raceland's staff was horrible attempting to intimidate officials/ aggressively approach the chain crew.... Really??? Kinda bush league. But expected I guess considering the location.
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10-19-2015, 04:31 AM
Guess no one cares.
10-19-2015, 05:59 AM
First let me say that my name is Doug Messer, I am an assistant coach for RACELAND middle school football and unlike people who post under pseudo names or the cover of an alias, I for one do not.
Please let's take some time to address these allegations one at a time.
(Sanctions against the Rams)
Answer: The KYMSFA game rules state that a running clock starts when a team scores at least 30 points more than their opponent. Even if that opponent scores and closes the gap the clock will continue to run.
The clock started running at 24 points in the third quarter, and continued to run even after we argued the rules to referee. He did not listen or did he correct the issue. Would it have made a difference, maybe but we will not know.
( Racelands coaching conduct)
We as a staff have coached together for over 7 years. Played in 2 state championship games in the KYMSFA and have been around since the inception of the KYMSFA. I for one being a sanctioned official to regional games in our area of the state. Never had an issue.
(Racelands coaches were horrible and attempting to intimidate the officials and the chain crew)
Great point- the three gentlemen who worked the chain crew were CAL associates either you are the gentleman in the black hoodie, the gentleman who was wearing the wireless microphone headset who was speaking to someone on and off the entire game or the other gentleman on the chain crew. Let's look at this- if you are a member of the chain crew you are to NOT coach, converse with the players or give instructions from your duty as a chain crew. You are to not communicate with players on the field. This continued to happen even after it was addressed to the referee. At no time did any staff or fan approach the chain crew or comment to you personally. Our verbalization of concern was addressed to the referee about interaction with players from the chain crew.
( kinda bush league, but expected that considering the location)
If you are making a statement about our town of residence or the fact that we are from Eastern Kentucky it shames the fact that your kids played a great game and are very athletic. Your team has some great athletes and played very hard. Why would post a defamation to the staff and fans of another team simply because we do not reside in a large populated area or is it because we come from a rural public school? Why you make such a comment strikes me as very sad.
In closing I wonder if you were a gentleman in the chain gang and feel that it is okay to make false claims against the coaching staff or if you are a fan who felt like posting a false statement you may have overheard as being factual.
Toward the end of the game, players were getting chippy toward each other from both sides but I did not see the opposing coach on the field correcting his players like our head coach was and making corrections to players on the field. Addressing issues face to face with kids who played hard and could not figure out why the rules changed on them during the game. (See time clock statement above)
How do you attempt to explain to your players that playing by the rules at all times no matter what, is the best reaction to adversity.
(Coaches behavior)
The only thing I can even see in this statement being contrived as factual is when our head coach had 2 flags thrown on him for argueing with the referee about the running clock incident. The clock started running In the third quarter and our coach was approached by the game sponsor and was asked about the running clock. Our coach spoke to the gentleman in charge and restated the KYMSFA running clock rule. The gentleman verbalized his understanding of the rules and agreed that the clock should not be a running clock as the score was not a 30 point difference.
When our head coach asked the referee about the clock the referee told our coach to take it up with the person in charge. ( the gentleman he has just spoke to) even after our head coach re approached the referee about running the clock, the referee did not correct the issue and continued to run the clock. Our head coach approached him again about why the clock was running and he threw a flag. He then threw another flag on him for asking the referee to explain why he threw the first flag.
So if this is the situation you are attempting to verbalized, I fail to see how you can make a statement of misconduct or behavior infraction.
When the game was completed the referee and the gentleman In charge were on the field with our head coach and the gentleman wanted to also know why the clock continued to run when it did not meet the criteria.
The referee had no comment and the gentleman in charge made an apology to our coach.
I hope that this clarifies some misconception of the statements made from the person above.
We want to take this time to wish CAL luck in the next game and hope that all goes well for them. Their Kids played hard and are very athletic.
Thank you for your time.
We support and have always supported the KYMSFA and this post is in no way an assault on their character as an organization. We feel that this is an isolated incident with the referee not fully understanding the running clock rule. This was just a frustrating incident that we could not correct. We appreciate the staff members and the crew who work for and with the KYMSFA and will be back next year to try it again.
Thank you again
Doug Messer
RACELAND Middle School Football
Please let's take some time to address these allegations one at a time.
(Sanctions against the Rams)
Answer: The KYMSFA game rules state that a running clock starts when a team scores at least 30 points more than their opponent. Even if that opponent scores and closes the gap the clock will continue to run.
The clock started running at 24 points in the third quarter, and continued to run even after we argued the rules to referee. He did not listen or did he correct the issue. Would it have made a difference, maybe but we will not know.
( Racelands coaching conduct)
We as a staff have coached together for over 7 years. Played in 2 state championship games in the KYMSFA and have been around since the inception of the KYMSFA. I for one being a sanctioned official to regional games in our area of the state. Never had an issue.
(Racelands coaches were horrible and attempting to intimidate the officials and the chain crew)
Great point- the three gentlemen who worked the chain crew were CAL associates either you are the gentleman in the black hoodie, the gentleman who was wearing the wireless microphone headset who was speaking to someone on and off the entire game or the other gentleman on the chain crew. Let's look at this- if you are a member of the chain crew you are to NOT coach, converse with the players or give instructions from your duty as a chain crew. You are to not communicate with players on the field. This continued to happen even after it was addressed to the referee. At no time did any staff or fan approach the chain crew or comment to you personally. Our verbalization of concern was addressed to the referee about interaction with players from the chain crew.
( kinda bush league, but expected that considering the location)
If you are making a statement about our town of residence or the fact that we are from Eastern Kentucky it shames the fact that your kids played a great game and are very athletic. Your team has some great athletes and played very hard. Why would post a defamation to the staff and fans of another team simply because we do not reside in a large populated area or is it because we come from a rural public school? Why you make such a comment strikes me as very sad.
In closing I wonder if you were a gentleman in the chain gang and feel that it is okay to make false claims against the coaching staff or if you are a fan who felt like posting a false statement you may have overheard as being factual.
Toward the end of the game, players were getting chippy toward each other from both sides but I did not see the opposing coach on the field correcting his players like our head coach was and making corrections to players on the field. Addressing issues face to face with kids who played hard and could not figure out why the rules changed on them during the game. (See time clock statement above)
How do you attempt to explain to your players that playing by the rules at all times no matter what, is the best reaction to adversity.
(Coaches behavior)
The only thing I can even see in this statement being contrived as factual is when our head coach had 2 flags thrown on him for argueing with the referee about the running clock incident. The clock started running In the third quarter and our coach was approached by the game sponsor and was asked about the running clock. Our coach spoke to the gentleman in charge and restated the KYMSFA running clock rule. The gentleman verbalized his understanding of the rules and agreed that the clock should not be a running clock as the score was not a 30 point difference.
When our head coach asked the referee about the clock the referee told our coach to take it up with the person in charge. ( the gentleman he has just spoke to) even after our head coach re approached the referee about running the clock, the referee did not correct the issue and continued to run the clock. Our head coach approached him again about why the clock was running and he threw a flag. He then threw another flag on him for asking the referee to explain why he threw the first flag.
So if this is the situation you are attempting to verbalized, I fail to see how you can make a statement of misconduct or behavior infraction.
When the game was completed the referee and the gentleman In charge were on the field with our head coach and the gentleman wanted to also know why the clock continued to run when it did not meet the criteria.
The referee had no comment and the gentleman in charge made an apology to our coach.
I hope that this clarifies some misconception of the statements made from the person above.
We want to take this time to wish CAL luck in the next game and hope that all goes well for them. Their Kids played hard and are very athletic.
Thank you for your time.
We support and have always supported the KYMSFA and this post is in no way an assault on their character as an organization. We feel that this is an isolated incident with the referee not fully understanding the running clock rule. This was just a frustrating incident that we could not correct. We appreciate the staff members and the crew who work for and with the KYMSFA and will be back next year to try it again.
Thank you again
Doug Messer
RACELAND Middle School Football
10-20-2015, 12:36 AM
And Coach messer drops the mic, walks off stage...lol
On side note, in JCPS we have always played up by 24points to start 2nd half means running clock.
I was told by a ref in the first round that no matter the score in the first half they don't run the clock till 2nd half. I inquired about the running clock because my team was up 24 points in the first 3 minutes of the first quarter, after he told me that I pulled my studs and played all backups.
I'm not a coach to rub it in.
On side note, in JCPS we have always played up by 24points to start 2nd half means running clock.
I was told by a ref in the first round that no matter the score in the first half they don't run the clock till 2nd half. I inquired about the running clock because my team was up 24 points in the first 3 minutes of the first quarter, after he told me that I pulled my studs and played all backups.
I'm not a coach to rub it in.
10-20-2015, 04:04 AM
KYMSFA rules state running clock at 36 points at anytime in the game, same as High School. Why officials still get this wrong boggles my mind, specifically when it is addressed each year when a reminder email is send to all of the KYMSFA Officials assignors and the KHSAA officials assigners reminding them of our MS rules. (actually I do know why, those official assignors and groups that take the time to read the email do communicate with their crews, those that dont well we can see who they are.)
10-20-2015, 10:32 AM
Probably unlikely but it would be nice if there was some sort of meeting or clinic before the season or even the playoffs for all the officials so they can get on the same page. Bluegrass played at Spencer county last weekend and after a touchdown bluegrass lines up for a 2pt try and gets it, well the officials say that if you run a play you get 1pt and if you kick it you get 2pts.
10-20-2015, 02:50 PM
Additionally, our 7th grade game with Clark Moores had 8:00 qtrs. I'm assuming it is supposed to be 7:00. Chain crew notified zebras to no avail.
10-20-2015, 02:54 PM
We had running clocks at 26, 30, and 36 this year. This season brought the most outrageous officiating I've seen in the last 5 or 6 years. Hope to see it improve next season. When you go to Knox County and have a better officiated game than you have at home, you have a problem.
10-20-2015, 09:40 PM
Wildcat18 Wrote:We had running clocks at 26, 30, and 36 this year. This season brought the most outrageous officiating I've seen in the last 5 or 6 years. Hope to see it improve next season. When you go to Knox County and have a better officiated game than you have at home, you have a problem.
:Thumbs::Thumbs::Thumbs:
10-20-2015, 09:59 PM
Lakers_football Wrote:Probably unlikely but it would be nice if there was some sort of meeting or clinic before the season or even the playoffs for all the officials so they can get on the same page. Bluegrass played at Spencer county last weekend and after a touchdown bluegrass lines up for a 2pt try and gets it, well the officials say that if you run a play you get 1pt and if you kick it you get 2pts.
Again, emails were sent to all the officials assignors.
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