[Granny Bear]

http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/17/politics/r...index.html


I'm anxious to hear you guys weigh in with your opinions on this debate. Personally, I believe Trump and Carson will lose some points to Fiorina, and I believe they should.

I have never considered Fiorina a strong candidate, but I really liked her performance last night. I'm still considering who I would vote for in the Republican primary, but one thing is for sure.....I would LOVE to see Fiorina debate Hillary Clinton.

[SKINNYPIG]

Rubio, Cruz and Fiorina did the best IMO. Trump "may" have lost a little ground. For the most part I thought the rest did ok. A lot of people are touting Christie & Bush for their performances last night, I just can't get over the hump with those two and I hope neither become the nominee. Rand Paul lost some steam last night IMO...if he had any steam.

[Granny Bear]

I consider Rand Paul to be a joke in the field. Sorry...I just do. Christie and Bush aren't far behind, IMO. Bush just looks lost and Christie.....well, I expect him to jerk out a machine gun and cut everybody down on stage! LOL He just looks mafia to me.

[WideRight05]

I haven't watched it yet. Trump seemed to fire off from the first minute LOL.

I heard the moderators avoided asking a lot of questions to Huckabee and Cruz, but I haven't watched it yet.

[Granny Bear]

I will probably get blasted for saying this, but I did not think the moderators did a good job at all! Mostly, they would pit the candidates against each other for arguments and finger pointing. I would've like to have seen more questions about policy and implementation. Fiorina made it a point to talk about those issues even if she wasn't asked. I thought she gained a lot last night.

[64SUR]

I'm all about ranking the debates.

1. Marco Rubio ( A professional debater )
2. Chris Christie ( A fighter for sure )
3. John Kasich ( I like this guy )
4. Carly Florina ( Call me I'm single )
5. Bobby Jindal ( Firecracker )
6. Rick Santorum ( sleeper I think )
7. Jeb Bush ( Nominee in the end )
8. Lindsay Graham ( Boots on the ground this scared me )
9. Rand Paul ( Smoking something )
10. Ted Cruz ( Waiting on Trump to drop out )
11. Scott Walker ( who )
12. Ben Carson ( Good Doctor )
13. Mike Huckabee ( Mike last stand )
14. Donald Trump ( Thanksgiving and its over Trump )
15. George Pataki ( need to go ahead and drop out )

Just my opinion only. nicker:

[WideRight05]

That seems to be the consensus, Fiorina gaining a lot of ground.

It doesn't surprise me that one would be upset with the CNN moderators. I probably will be too when I get the chance to watch.

[TheRealThing]

I will probably get blasted for saying this, but I did not think the moderators did a good job at all! Mostly, they would pit the candidates against each other for arguments and finger pointing. I would've like to have seen more questions about policy and implementation. Fiorina made it a point to talk about those issues even if she wasn't asked. I thought she gained a lot last night.

The moderators did a terrible job. It became obvious after the 3rd or 4th time they started their question with "Donald Trump said", last night's debate was a witch hunt that by design, was meant to encourage on stage infighting between the candidates, rather than any kind of meaningful debate. The idea was to make them look as petty and shallow as possible. And quite frankly, I thought the candidates more or less played right into it.

Carly Fiorina seems to be the exception rather than the rule where it comes to female leadership. Now don't take this wrong Granny, but in saying that I mean by contrast to other women, not men particularly. For example, if it came down to a vote between Clinton vs Fiorina, it's an automatic no brainer. Carly Fiorina every day and twice on Sunday. At any rate, I tend to believe we really need a strong and insightful man in the captain's chair, though I believe the people of this land would be much better served if all women in government were as astute and clear minded as Carly.

No CNN News anchor is going to be fair, balanced or even civil where it comes to hosting Republicans, whom they despise with every fiber of their being. The candidates need as much exposure as they can get but, that mushroom of an RNC Chairman Reince Priebus, might want to give all the candidates a bit of a heads-up about what to expect regarding debates and formats hosted by their media enemies next time around. It's the least he could do and they should all take a hard look at the way Candy Crowley helped Obama bushwhack Romney during the 2nd Presidential debate leading up to 2012. Remember how she backed up the President when he said he called the Benghazi attack terrorism in a Rose Garden speech? I mean, I've heard people stretch credulity in the past but, that one is thinner than a gnat's rear stretched over a boxcar!

And in defense of Trump's direct style I would submit this for consideration. We've been subjected to so much mealy mouthing from so many politicians for so long, that we now expect every point to be couched in soft peddling and vague half truths. What I like about Trump is his straight forward style of communicating a point. I don't know how many angels can dance on the head of a pin, but I know the truth when I hear it and it is in speaking the truth that Trump has surged ahead of the rest. :biggrin:

[Granny Bear]

I agree. Trump's popularity has come from the fact that he spits out the truth with no political correctness and B/S attached. Do you think for one second that the other candidates would talk so negatively about sanctuary cities, if Trump hadn't opened up that can of worms? I doubt it.

Fiorina was absolutely the winner of this debate, IMO. I would definitely vote for her should she win the primary; however, I personally don't believe she will.

I, too would like to see a strong and insightful man in the captain's chair. Do you know where we can find one? Fiorina spotlighted a lot of the weaknesses in the candidates; however, I must admit the questioning and moderators of CNN probably sat that up to a great degree.

Trump may have lost some points last night, and I hate that for him. As far as strength, confidence and ability to lead I still think he is still the front runner and I would have no issues voting for him...NOW. I do, however, think he will need a strong team around him. His lack of foreign policy knowledge was glaring.

[64SUR]

Time to moved Santorum, Jindal and Graham to the A-Team :Cheerlead

[Granny Bear]

Jindal did show a stronger side last night.

[TheRealThing]

I agree. Trump's popularity has come from the fact that he spits out the truth with no political correctness and B/S attached. Do you think for one second that the other candidates would talk so negatively about sanctuary cities, if Trump hadn't opened up that can of worms? I doubt it.

Fiorina was absolutely the winner of this debate, IMO. I would definitely vote for her should she win the primary; however, I personally don't believe she will.

I, too would like to see a strong and insightful man in the captain's chair. Do you know where we can find one? Fiorina spotlighted a lot of the weaknesses in the candidates; however, I must admit the questioning and moderators of CNN probably sat that up to a great degree.

Trump may have lost some points last night, and I hate that for him. As far as strength, confidence and ability to lead I still think he is still the front runner and I would have no issues voting for him...NOW. I do, however, think he will need a strong team around him. His lack of foreign policy knowledge was glaring.

I find some comfort in that situation however because as you say, he will need a strong team around him, which is most desirable of Presidential scenarios. That was the case with Ronald Reagan who had enough class and understanding to allow those he had picked for the various cabinet posts to actually do their job. He therefore stepped aside and implemented policy based on his staff's sage advice. And I can't help but point out the glaring, I really like that word LOL, contrast from among all those running in the Presidential field both parties inclusive. Leaving out the obvious exception, that being Hillary Rodham, whom I believe to be the female extension of Barack. But, you may recall that our esteemed and magnificent President often rolls right over the advice of US Armed Services Chiefs of Staff in his foreign policy machinations. Hence we see the world is ablaze, in unfavorable comparison with every past President all the way back to FDR.

In any case, though I agree that Fiorina was impressive, her performance none the less revealed a certain pettiness. She had the right to be incensed with the comment Trump made about her face, though I think she should have kept her consternation a more private matter. I believe he meant that as President she would have to go up against some very powerful and ruthless US haters in the persons of Putin, the entire Arab World, North Korea et-al. This country has been laughed to scorn quite enough if one would ask, especially in view of the past 7 years with Mr Mom Jeans. And Trump was saying that in the near future, such circumstances would need to be negotiated from a position of strength. Sorry, but being threatened by girls is just different and said leaders would expect that anyway. But, here is what I'm referring to. We all know how Hillary's campaign for example, is rooted in the propaganda line which states that the Republicans have for at least the last 16 or so years, been engaged in an active "war on women."

When Fiorina responded to the gender baiting question of Trump's comment about her face, and again, we have to remember that right now the face of America is Barack Obama, she in a sense jumped up on the same band wagon as Hillary. Trump's comment was in regard to HER face, not every woman in America's face. Because after all, as he said in perfect context, it would be Fiorina negotiating with a bunch of very hard men. Fiorina said "every woman in America knows what you meant." So, in that she was attempting to inspire or invoke choler in the hearts of US women against Donald Trump, whom she cast as the stereotypical chauvinistic pig.

That's not to say she hasn't been right about the things she's been saying on the campaign trail, or that her comment last night was not forgivable. But, trying to get votes based on emotionalism or using the tactics and rhetoric of Hillary's campaign, is not exactly lofty behavior either in my book. And the other side will certainly make as much of it as they possibly can, especially Hillary. In short, it is much ado about not much, and Trump had a plausible explanation for the meaning of his remarks that he has already shared. And lastly, Fiorina might have well never made the big debate if not for Trump's efforts on her behalf to have her included in the field.

[64SUR]

Wow!!! TheRealThing I thought Carly stood up against the bully Trump. :popcorn:

[RunItUpTheGut]

The republican party isn't going to elect Fiorina. It just wont happen, so she might as well drop out. I don't view her unfavorably, but I just know it will never happen.

Rand Paul may be the biggest turd senator ive ever seen. When are the people on the other side of this state going to realize the guy has used them over and over again? I cant for the life of me figure out why guys like Paul continue to stay in the race when they have literally 0% of winning no matter what happens. It just clogs up the stage.

Here are the facts from a realist view..

Candidates with a legitimate shot

Ted Cruz (Like him more and more every time I hear him talk)

Donald Trump (Will hopefully continue to piss off every liberal in the country)

Marco Rubio (Only IF he steals a big minority base from the dems)

Jeb Bush (A disaster waiting to happen. Country wouldn't get any better but he has a shot at winning the nomination and its just as likely, although he just doesn't have the personality to control the voting base)

Scott Walker (falling fast. needs some big help, but hasn't gone completely away just yet, but hes got to be sweating)


Needs a miracle...

Ben Carson (It was good while it lasted, but Carson will be a non factor in a month)

Chris Christie (I wanted to put him completely out but hes capable of coming up with something that may get him a lot of votes. VERY small chance. Like >3%)

Carly Fiorina (If she wasn't the only woman running for the nomination, im not so sure she would have ever made it to the big stage. It will phase out)

The Pretenders...

John Kasich (Just not enough name recognition)

Bobby Jindal (Not strong enough and not enough attention)

Rick Santorum (Should have quit after the last run. Hes 15 minutes are done)

Lindsay Graham (Couldn't even beat Hillary in South Carolina. Lifetimer)

Rand Paul (The biggest joke in the race, im not sure why he keeps using people of Western Kentucky and why they keep electing him. His views will never coincide with the majority of Repubs and get him nominated.)

Mike Huckabee (Huckabee is a really good guy. But that's where it stops)

George Pataki (Nobody knows him. Nobody wants to know him)

[TheRealThing]

Wow!!! TheRealThing I thought Carly stood up against the bully Trump. :popcorn:

As I said, Fiorina is smart, articulate, informed and she is a conservative. She may have her ducks in a row better than any woman politician I have ever heard speak and, I would not hesitate to vote for her.

Americans have been misled in wholesale fashion by politicians for decades, and they are more than tired of the hollow rhetoric. Trump has been stating, what most folks have been thinking since the media first began to champion the liberal cause and the scourge of same began to get a foothold in the halls of our legislatures. That's why Trump is doing well, we the people are starving for the truth. Only the establishment groupies of both parties think he is a bully, to everybody else he has been a breath of fresh air.

Trump thinks he can fix things and as Granny pointed out, as long as he surrounds himself with good people to advise him, I believe he may well be able to back up his words. Additionally, after watching the United States shrink for the past 7 years under the watchful eye of the ultimate pacifist, folks are ready to back a President who isn't smarmy to special interest groups, the green agenda, and the sworn enemies of Israel and the United States.

[TheRealThing]

the republican party isn't going to elect fiorina. It just wont happen, so she might as well drop out. I don't view her unfavorably, but i just know it will never happen.

Rand paul may be the biggest turd senator ive ever seen. When are the people on the other side of this state going to realize the guy has used them over and over again? i cant for the life of me figure out why guys like paul continue to stay in the race when they have literally 0% of winning no matter what happens. it just clogs up the stage.

Here are the facts from a realist view..

candidates with a legitimate shot

ted cruz (like him more and more every time i hear him talk)

donald trump (will hopefully continue to piss off every liberal in the country)

marco rubio (only if he steals a big minority base from the dems)

jeb bush (a disaster waiting to happen. Country wouldn't get any better but he has a shot at winning the nomination and its just as likely, although he just doesn't have the personality to control the voting base)

scott walker (falling fast. Needs some big help, but hasn't gone completely away just yet, but hes got to be sweating)


needs a miracle...

ben carson (it was good while it lasted, but carson will be a non factor in a month)

chris christie (i wanted to put him completely out but hes capable of coming up with something that may get him a lot of votes. Very small chance. Like >3%)

carly fiorina (if she wasn't the only woman running for the nomination, im not so sure she would have ever made it to the big stage. It will phase out)

the pretenders...

john kasich (just not enough name recognition)

bobby jindal (not strong enough and not enough attention)

rick santorum (should have quit after the last run. Hes 15 minutes are done)

lindsay graham (couldn't even beat hillary in south carolina. Lifetimer)

rand paul (the biggest joke in the race, im not sure why he keeps using people of western kentucky and why they keep electing him. His views will never coincide with the majority of repubs and get him nominated.)

mike huckabee (huckabee is a really good guy. But that's where it stops)

george pataki (nobody knows him. Nobody wants to know him)

ego

[RunItUpTheGut]

As I said, Fiorina is smart, articulate, informed and she is a conservative. She may have her ducks in a row better than any woman politician I have ever heard speak and, I would not hesitate to vote for her.

Americans have been misled in wholesale fashion by politicians for decades, and they are more than tired of the hollow rhetoric. Trump has been stating, what most folks have been thinking since the media first began to champion the liberal cause and the scourge of same began to get a foothold in the halls of our legislatures. That's why Trump is doing well, we the people are starving for the truth. Only the establishment groupies of both parties think he is a bully, to everybody else he has been a breath of fresh air.

Trump thinks he can fix things and as Granny pointed out, as long as he surrounds himself with good people to advise him, I believe he may well be able to back up his words. Additionally, after watching the United States shrink for the past 7 years under the watchful eye of the ultimate pacifist, folks are ready to back a President who isn't smarmy to special interest groups, the green agenda, and the sworn enemies of Israel and the United States.

While watching the debate I told my wife that if Trump were to win the nomination, the best thing he could do is to look no further than that stage for his advisors or cabinet members. Its not secret im voting Trump and Cruz. I will support whoever wins the nomination in the end although I believe it will be one of those two anyways. But lets for a minute think about what kind of minds you have up there.
While you may not like them all, you pretty much have a dream team of talent when theyre restricted to only working on things there strong at. Trump could make Cruz his VP or vise versa, and you could take Carson as your attorney general, and so on and so on using Bush, Rubio, Fiorina, Walker, etc. if they would all agree to it.
Why not? Ive never seen it tried before, but you would take the voters who wouldn't vote for you in the primary and wont in the election and maybe get them to by giving there choice a job in the white house right beside you.

I cant believe we even have to think about the actual election when the democrats only have Hillary who may be in prison, Bernie the socialist, and maybe uncle Joe with an IQ of 4 1/2. But its the sad world we live in. Whoever wins the republican nomination should have a cake walk to the presidency just as Trump says, but you know that wont be the case.

[Hoot Gibson]

I am still not sold on the notion that either Trump or Fiorina is a conservative but I like the way that both of them give clear, unapologetic answers to tough questions. But I have seen too many Republicans run in the primaries as conservatives and then move sharply to the left after getting the nomination. Both Trump and Fiorina have made taken some very troubling positions in the past and I also do not believe that Fiorina's track record at HP and Lucent can withstand much scrutiny.

I am still all in for Ted Cruz. The GOPe is doing all it can to limit Cruz's chances of winning the nomination, but I believe that as the field narrows, Cruz will continue to methodically climb in the polls. I cannot imagine Cruz ever making glowing statements about what a joy it is to work with the Rev. Jesse Jackson, as Carly has, or cynically supporting politicians like Hillary Clinton to further his own career, as Trump has done.

Still, I think that Trump and Fiorina are providing a valuable service by throwing wrenches into the GOPe's Plan A of awarding the nomination to another Bush. Jeb Bush sounded like an absolute fool in the second debate. I loved Margaret Thatcher, but what kind of idiot would want her face on American currency? The worst thing about his stupid response is that the question had to be one that any candidate should have seen coming, so his answer was not likely given without some premeditation.

[Granny Bear]

If you could solely choose the President/Vice President duo to run, Hoot.....who would it be?

[Hoot Gibson]

If you could solely choose the President/Vice President duo to run, Hoot.....who would it be?

That is a very tough question, Granny. A few months ago, I might have said Cruz/Kasich to give Republicans a better chance to carry Ohio, but after watching Kasich whine and drone on and on about his role in the last balanced budget, I just don't think that I could stand listening to Kasich much longer.

Despite my reservations about Fiorina, I am beginning to think that she might be the perfect VP candidate in this election. I love the way that she has remained focused on attacking Hillary Clinton's deplorable record. I think that the Democratic ticket, with or without Clinton, will be so bad that any of the Republican candidates will be relatively bulletproof in comparison.

So, right now, my ideal ticket would probably be Cruz/Fiorina, but that might change depending on who wins the Democratic nomination. If Cruz were to turn Carly loose to attack Hillary's record at will, she would be a devastating campaigner.

For now, my second choice would be Cruz/Rubio, but only because Rubio might help Cruz carry the state of Florida. Rubio needs to deliver a heartfelt, convincing apology for his role in the Gang of Eight. I would have a hard time supporting him as the party's nominee until he does so.

Others that I would carefully consider, who are not presidential candidates include:

New Mexico Gov. Susana Martinez
South Carolina Gov. Nicky Haley
Indiana Gov. Mike Pence

[Granny Bear]

Thank you.

Do we have enough boots in America for Lindsey Graham as Sec of Defense?

[Hoot Gibson]

Thank you.

Do we have enough boots in America for Lindsey Graham as Sec of Defense?

:thatsfunn I would not even allow Lindsey Graham to visit the White House as a tourist if I were president and I don't think Senator Cruz's opinion of Grahamnesty is much different than mine. My personal pick for Sec. of Defense would be Col. Allen West or Sen. Jeff Sessions.

[TheRealThing]

I am still not sold on the notion that either Trump or Fiorina is a conservative but I like the way that both of them give clear, unapologetic answers to tough questions. But I have seen too many Republicans run in the primaries as conservatives and then move sharply to the left after getting the nomination. Both Trump and Fiorina have made taken some very troubling positions in the past and I also do not believe that Fiorina's track record at HP and Lucent can withstand much scrutiny.

I am still all in for Ted Cruz. The GOPe is doing all it can to limit Cruz's chances of winning the nomination, but I believe that as the field narrows, Cruz will continue to methodically climb in the polls. I cannot imagine Cruz ever making glowing statements about what a joy it is to work with the Rev. Jesse Jackson, as Carly has, or cynically supporting politicians like Hillary Clinton to further his own career, as Trump has done.

Still, I think that Trump and Fiorina are providing a valuable service by throwing wrenches into the GOPe's Plan A of awarding the nomination to another Bush. Jeb Bush sounded like an absolute fool in the second debate. I loved Margaret Thatcher, but what kind of idiot would want her face on American currency? The worst thing about his stupid response is that the question had to be one that any candidate should have seen coming, so his answer was not likely given without some premeditation.

Kasick and Jeb Bush are basically liberals and RINO's and I don't like listening to either of them. Kasick's record speaks for itself, but it was a very revealing moment back when Jeb, with a heart full of soul, declared that allowing the millions of border crashers to free range this land is noble in the American sense because supposedly, they are all motivated by "acts of love." To my mind, aside from the face value absurdity of his statement owing to said illegal's crime and welfare rates, it is an example of incredibly flawed logic. Obviously America is a truly blessed land so anyone could understand why thousands would be willing to risk being part of the daily illegal 100 yard dash across the border to the south. My point would be as follows; if it is somehow a moral responsibility of the US citizen to support by means of heart and treasure the illegal immigration from Mexico, what is to become of the citizens of the remaining 195 nations around the globe? What are they, chopped liver? As in the case of Johnson's "Great Society" initiative, when we saw the welfare roles explode after we started giving away life's necessities, there will again be no place to draw the line. Cutting to the chase, can the entire planet just pick up and hop a train or a jet to the US?

For the moment it seems as if Trump has been experiencing his conservative renaissance, which would explain his reversals away from the liberal positions of his past. I can't prove that but, I have just never heard a liberal fake it as well as he would have to be doing without a single slip up. I mean, most of what he says is spontaneous.

The president makers are in their heydays, busily crafting manipulative and suggestive criticisms of the candidates they don't want in there, while lifting up those they do. At the same time the special interest brokers like Jorge Ramos are out pushing their agendas as was revealed in his encounter with Trump, where he used his guise as a reporter to make a political spectacle of Trump's desire to control illegal immigration. Why? Because obviously Ramos is an open border activist. BTW, if I was Trump I'd quell the upswell of detractors where it applies to deportation. All he has to say is in the course of everyday business-as-usual, being careful to include a qualifier of not allowing the dreaded racial profiling, if law enforcement were to run across an illegal, they deal with the problem from that point forward. And likely, that process would be much cheaper than are the maintenance and educational costs by present policy. At any rate, the media spawned image of jackbooted G-men out there actively rounding up innocent and productive families to ship out in boxcars is ridiculous.

With regard to how Bush sounded in the debate, my perception of the individual candidate's performances disagrees completely with the media line of rationale. For example, Fiorina did well, but in spite of what the media have proclaimed to the contrary, she certainly didn't blow everybody else off the platform. Media have also been lauding Bush's performance and like you suggested though he was louder to be sure, he was still flat as a pancake in my book. I just hope the Republicans don't do such a good job of eliminating each other that they wind up being the best asset the Dems have again.