[wildcats fan]

About Bell County High School reinstating the prayer at Bell County football home games

http://www.kentucky.com/2015/08/24/40034....html?rh=1

What does everyone think about the new problem with the foundation about the prayer?

[pjdoug]

About Bell County High School reinstating the prayer at Bell County football home games

http://www.kentucky.com/2015/08/24/40034....html?rh=1

What does everyone think about the new problem with the foundation about the prayer?

:Clap: way to go Bell County.

[Leonidas]

It never should've left.

[Demarcus ware]

Looks like a complaint has already been filed after the first game. Seen it in the news today.

[EKUAlum05]

Looks like a complaint has already been filed after the first game. Seen it in the news today.

Some people simply lead miserable lives

[Briscoe]

Don't give in Bell Co. If it's student organized and student led, they should be allowed to continue.

[Cat Daddy]

This is ridiculous, if people don't want to be a part of the prayer, then don't go to the game, or show up to the game after the prayer concludes. We shouldn't have to change our beliefs, to accommodate a few a$$holes. I haven't personally heard the prayer at Bell County, but the majority of the prayers that I have heard at local sporting events, focus on sportsmanship and the safety of our kids. So my question is, what is so offensive??

[Granny Bear]

Wonder if the same restraint would be applied to a student if he/she threw a scatter rug over the 50 yard line, and faced east.........

[Thrillex]

This is ridiculous, if people don't want to be a part of the prayer, then don't go to the game, or show up to the game after the prayer concludes. We shouldn't have to change our beliefs, to accommodate a few a$$holes. I haven't personally heard the prayer at Bell County, but the majority of the prayers that I have heard at local sporting events, focus on sportsmanship and the safety of our kids. So my question is, what is so offensive??

Well this is sort of ironic #sochristlike

[walterwhite]

Another casualty of the "separation of church and state" myth.

[Football1]

Nonbelievers have rights. They have the right to ignore any prayer they don't believe. They have the right to not attend things that offend them. They have the right to say they don't believe. But by God's GRACE and MERCY I pray they stop having the RIGHT to tell Christians how and when we are allowed to pray to the Creator and Savior. May the men and women in Bell county who are that target of this attack stand in courage and unity.

Dave Diamond
Pound High School Class of 89
Union College Class of 93
US Army Class of 1997
[email]cdavediamond@gmail.com[/email]

[Objective]

I hope there's nothing that can be done about it. It was student led and done over a PA system (set up in the stands) donated by a local person not associated with the school. Bell Co school systems did not endorse it or provide any school funds or equipment to allow it. Bell co School board was asked by a student group last week at a Broad meeting if they could pray before the game and the board said it was permissible under these guidelines

[Bobcats 9108]

It's a shame the world is going to hell. I have been to a lot different schools and they do the same thing I never hear about them. Must have some disgruntled people in our county I guess. Taking prayer out of schools is what's wrong. When I went to school we had prayer every morning right before the pledge.

[Thrillex]

If you don't believe in hell, you can't go to hell....

[Granny Bear]

Dangerous thought!

[Demarcus ware]

Well I guess if they don't allow prayer then they surely won't like my half naked hula dance on the 50 yard line nicker:

[WideRight05]

I get on here and troll around usually, but this post will be approached with a serious perspective considering my strong Biblical beliefs. I'm going to try to view this from a neutral stance to best enhance my argument.

If I didn't believe in God...I think about the following.

What do we usually pray for?

We pray for safety of the players...
Sportsmanship and character on both sides...
An injury-free ball game...
The coaches as they teach these young men right from wrong...
We pray that most importantly, the young men on that football field develop and grow as both a team and as individuals from this football experience...

If I'm looking at it from the perspective of somebody who doesn't believe, how could I find any of that offensive? Even though one may not believe, what's so offensive about prayer and hope that the game results in positive conclusions in each of the above mentioned areas? Isn't that what we want? Injury-free, wisdom from the coaches, players who learn life skills from the experience?

I hope it's not bad for me to alienate God for that short paragraph. But looking at it from that perspective, I don't see any reason to obsess over trying to stop people at a football game who are praying for a positive outcome.

Now, for my personal opinion, and I hope everybody who reads this (especially Bell County fans) takes note - keep at it and don't let those atheist groups intimidate you by trying to utilizing the courtroom to shove their agenda down your throats. I may not be a Bell County football program supporter, but we are all Bell County fans when it comes to the fact that this program is trying to take a positive stand. Follow the examples in Mississippi, in Georgia right now where high school football programs and bands are not budging to the atheist agenda.

If you're fined, so be it. Keep at it. We have a simple tool called Gofundme now. And if that happens, you can bet I'll be opening my wallet for Bell County.

Not to turn this political, and I'm not a big Donald Trump guy, but if we took his courage in standing up for what we believed in then we wouldn't have this problem. I applaud the Bell County fans for displaying this kind of courage, and I strongly agree that should the atheists make an issue of this that we ALL take a stand right beside Bell County.

[Image: http://www.mghelmets.com/high%20school%2...nty-ky.gif]

[Granny Bear]

Well I guess if they don't allow prayer then they surely won't like my half naked hula dance on the 50 yard line nicker:

If you're here illegally or you do that dance on that scatter rug, then you'll be okay! Besides, I hear there ain't nothin' to see!!!

:lmao:

[Bobcats 9108]

I get on here and troll around usually, but this post will be approached with a serious perspective considering my strong Biblical beliefs. I'm going to try to view this from a neutral stance to best enhance my argument.

If I didn't believe in God...I think about the following.

What do we usually pray for?

We pray for safety of the players...
Sportsmanship and character on both sides...
An injury-free ball game...
The coaches as they teach these young men right from wrong...
We pray that most importantly, the young men on that football field develop and grow as both a team and as individuals from this football experience...

If I'm looking at it from the perspective of somebody who doesn't believe, how could I find any of that offensive? Even though one may not believe, what's so offensive about prayer and hope that the game results in positive conclusions in each of the above mentioned areas? Isn't that what we want? Injury-free, wisdom from the coaches, players who learn life skills from the experience?

I hope it's not bad for me to alienate God for that short paragraph. But looking at it from that perspective, I don't see any reason to obsess over trying to stop people at a football game who are praying for a positive outcome.

Now, for my personal opinion, and I hope everybody who reads this (especially Bell County fans) takes note - keep at it and don't let those atheist groups intimidate you by trying to utilizing the courtroom to shove their agenda down your throats. I may not be a Bell County football program supporter, but we are all Bell County fans when it comes to the fact that this program is trying to take a positive stand. Follow the examples in Mississippi, in Georgia right now where high school football programs and bands are not budging to the atheist agenda.

If you're fined, so be it. Keep at it. We have a simple tool called Gofundme now. And if that happens, you can bet I'll be opening my wallet for Bell County.

Not to turn this political, and I'm not a big Donald Trump guy, but if we took his courage in standing up for what we believed in then we wouldn't have this problem. I applaud the Bell County fans for displaying this kind of courage, and I strongly agree that should the atheists make an issue of this that we ALL take a stand right beside Bell County.

[Image: http://www.mghelmets.com/high%20school%2...nty-ky.gif]

Well said:Clap:

[Demarcus ware]

If you're here illegally or you do that dance on that scatter rug, then you'll be okay! Besides, I hear there ain't nothin' to see!!!

:lmao:

Stop talking to my girlfriend woman

[PirateTech31]

Its a sad situation that it took one person to change prayer being in schools and at school functions. Now, it will take a band of Christians and those who want it there; to get it back! I stand with Bell County on this! That's one thing I'm am proud to say about Belfry, they never stopped praying and still do so! I find it an honor to know that somewhere along the lines of "bad blood" or "Rivalries" someone still cares enough to say a prayer for me as a fan, my friends as coaches and more importantly, those who are playing their hearts out on that field! Bell County...don't back down!!!! #PRAYOUTLOUD

[Bobcats 9108]

Its a sad situation that it took one person to change prayer being in schools and at school functions. Now, it will take a band of Christians and those who want it there; to get it back! I stand with Bell County on this! That's one thing I'm am proud to say about Belfry, they never stopped praying and still do so! I find it an honor to know that somewhere along the lines of "bad blood" or "Rivalries" someone still cares enough to say a prayer for me as a fan, my friends as coaches and more importantly, those who are playing their hearts out on that field! Bell County...don't back down!!!! #PRAYOUTLOUD

:rockon:

[InItToWinIt]

I do not understand. Atheist have to believe in something or they wouldn't be hating on it. It is scary to think this reached a group of non-believers in Wisconsin??? I am very proud of Bell Co students to request to have prayer. They should not have to, it should be a given. Somebody in this county does this??? Why don't you stand up and give your opinion openly? No, you pick some radical group to do it for you. Christians have rights and according to our Constitution, we are protected by freedom to practice religion. I guarantee is someone wanted to have a prayer rug, and worship Mohammed, not one word would be said. We need prayer and I am honored that students stand up for their right to do so. Middlesboro needs to follow suit. I would love to know the people here that are causing this ruckus. I wasn't a bit surprised when the complaint showed up in the paper. Crazy world and someone is offended everyday by something.

[AtlPirateFan]

At the risk of alienation I will speak up for the non-believers. I am an atheist. The definition of such is that I don't not hold a belief in any single deity, there are those out there who equate Atheism to Satanic worship. This is incorrect as I do not believe in him either. I choose to be a good person because it is the right thing to do and not because I have a fear of eternal damnation or because things a book told me to.

Quick background for transparency sake. I was born and raised in a Christian family, I was baptized early in life in the Freewill Baptist church. I was baptized because I felt it was what I was supposed to do as a christian, from day 1 religion made no sense to me because I could not reconcile what I saw and experienced in the real world with what I was being told about the spiritual world. I left religion behind not because I was mad at god or the church or because I wanted to sin and not feel guilty about it. I left it because to me it made no sense to live in fear of damnation and hope of eternal life, spending every moment of this magical precious thing called life preparing for whats after it. I give this background because I want people to understand that my stance on this particular issue does not come from a position of hate or anger.

Now as for the public prayer to the christian creator and savior at the Bell Co games or any public event for that matter. My first statement is that a student led prayer is 100% OK with me. If a group of Christian students want to hold a prayer for anyone who wants to participate that is awesome. I would hope that Christians would be 100% OK with other religions doing the same thing. I am all for people freely practicing their religion as it is constitutionally protected for them to do so. However schools should not be hosting or leading a prayer to a single deity, even if the message is a positive one. UNLESS that same school is willing to do the same thing for other major religions as well.

On this planet there are ~2 billion Christians, ~1.5 billion followers of Islam, ~1 Billion Hindus and ~1 billion Athiest/Agnostic/Undecided. That doesn't list the other dozen or so major religions on the planet. When Christian prayer is the sanctioned form of kicking off an event of any kind then people from all other walks of life tend to feel uncomfortable and complain. If Islamist where to all be given time to pray publicly over a sporting event then everyone but the Islamist would complain and the cycle continues no matter who is performing the religious practice, someone will always complain.

I'm not offended by Christian prayer or any prayer for that matter and most people aren't. I am however uncomfortable during and slightly after. As I stand silently respecting your right to pray and I see all the others who are standing the same way awaiting the moment to pass I shouldn't have to worry about the guy who is praying that looks at me out of the corner of his eye and shakes his head or the lady who raises her head two or three times during the prayer to scan the crowd for who isn't praying to make the moment cringe worthy. I don't need someone to proselytize me after the event or during. I will be the last person in the world to tell you that you are wrong to believe in any religion but the religious will jump at the chance to tell me I am wrong or going to hell for not believing.

It's not that we are attacking Christianity, though I know it feels that way. It's that way are asking for 100% inclusion and that all walks of life be considered.

[chipmunksyndrome]

I do not understand. Atheist have to believe in something or they wouldn't be hating on it. It is scary to think this reached a group of non-believers in Wisconsin??? I am very proud of Bell Co students to request to have prayer. They should not have to, it should be a given. Somebody in this county does this??? Why don't you stand up and give your opinion openly? No, you pick some radical group to do it for you. Christians have rights and according to our Constitution, we are protected by freedom to practice religion. I guarantee is someone wanted to have a prayer rug, and worship Mohammed, not one word would be said. We need prayer and I am honored that students stand up for their right to do so. Middlesboro needs to follow suit. I would love to know the people here that are causing this ruckus. I wasn't a bit surprised when the complaint showed up in the paper. Crazy world and someone is offended everyday by something.

As an atheist, let me address this a bit. I don't care whether or not people want to pray at a football game. In fact, I encourage people to. If you hold that belief, then practice it. As long as you're not forcing me to practice your religion, which last time I checked nobody was holding a gun to my head telling me to say ten Hail-Marys, then by all means, practice away. I don't have to pray. I don't have to bow my head. At the same time, I'm not going to belittle others because they want to. That's the stance of the vast majority of rational atheists. The only caveat I have for you is that other religions and belief systems have to have the same right and freedom to practice as you and me.

The problem you seem to be having is with the atheist version of the Westboro Baptist Church. For those of us who just want to live and let live, they're a blight on the face of what we believe. I have the same problem with them. Honestly, the problem permeates all lifestyles and religions. People tend to crucify others for having different beliefs and values than we do because we're terrified of what is different and unknown. In nearly every walk of life you can find someone who fits that description. It's an area each of us can strive to improve. We all need to lead by example.

[Thrillex]

I get on here and troll around usually, but this post will be approached with a serious perspective considering my strong Biblical beliefs. I'm going to try to view this from a neutral stance to best enhance my argument.

If I didn't believe in God...I think about the following.

What do we usually pray for?

We pray for safety of the players...
Sportsmanship and character on both sides...
An injury-free ball game...
The coaches as they teach these young men right from wrong...
We pray that most importantly, the young men on that football field develop and grow as both a team and as individuals from this football experience...

If I'm looking at it from the perspective of somebody who doesn't believe, how could I find any of that offensive? Even though one may not believe, what's so offensive about prayer and hope that the game results in positive conclusions in each of the above mentioned areas? Isn't that what we want? Injury-free, wisdom from the coaches, players who learn life skills from the experience?

I hope it's not bad for me to alienate God for that short paragraph. But looking at it from that perspective, I don't see any reason to obsess over trying to stop people at a football game who are praying for a positive outcome.

Now, for my personal opinion, and I hope everybody who reads this (especially Bell County fans) takes note - keep at it and don't let those atheist groups intimidate you by trying to utilizing the courtroom to shove their agenda down your throats. I may not be a Bell County football program supporter, but we are all Bell County fans when it comes to the fact that this program is trying to take a positive stand. Follow the examples in Mississippi, in Georgia right now where high school football programs and bands are not budging to the atheist agenda.

If you're fined, so be it. Keep at it. We have a simple tool called Gofundme now. And if that happens, you can bet I'll be opening my wallet for Bell County.

Not to turn this political, and I'm not a big Donald Trump guy, but if we took his courage in standing up for what we believed in then we wouldn't have this problem. I applaud the Bell County fans for displaying this kind of courage, and I strongly agree that should the atheists make an issue of this that we ALL take a stand right beside Bell County.

[Image: http://www.mghelmets.com/high%20school%2...nty-ky.gif]

So you Pray but Little Johnny still tears his ACL his senior season? What now? Because everyone prayed for it not to happen...but it did? Ohhhh but that's right God is teaching Johnny a lesson, That you can't be out there playing the sport you love, with your best friends, on a beautiful Friday Night because God has plans for you. God kinda seems selfish.

[AtlPirateFan]

This is a very interesting and important conversation and hope people can stay on topic and not get nasty about it.

[Granny Bear]

It took a lot of courage for you to place this post, and I appreciate your honesty and your attempt to explain things from your viewpoint. However, for me anyway, you have missed the mark.

At the risk of alienation I will speak up for the non-believers. I am an atheist. The definition of such is that I don't not hold a belief in any single deity, there are those out there who equate Atheism to Satanic worship. This is incorrect as I do not believe in him either. I choose to be a good person because it is the right thing to do and not because I have a fear of eternal damnation or because things a book told me to.

This statement is ambiguous to me. It's the right thing to do, under whose scrutiny? Who do you hold in authority to say what is right and what is wrong?


Quick background for transparency sake. I was born and raised in a Christian family, I was baptized early in life in the Freewill Baptist church. I was baptized because I felt it was what I was supposed to do as a christian, from day 1 religion made no sense to me because I could not reconcile what I saw and experienced in the real world with what I was being told about the spiritual world. I left religion behind not because I was mad at god or the church or because I wanted to sin and not feel guilty about it. I left it because to me it made no sense to live in fear of damnation and hope of eternal life, spending every moment of this magical precious thing called life preparing for whats after it. I give this background because I want people to understand that my stance on this particular issue does not come from a position of hate or anger.

I'm not sure anyone can "reconcile" the daily life of the real world and the spiritual world. They are like apples and oranges. To me, this is where my faith comes to be. I absolutely believe you when you say that your issue doesn't come from hate or anger. I've NEVER seen that from you.


Now as for the public prayer to the christian creator and savior at the Bell Co games or any public event for that matter. My first statement is that a student led prayer is 100% OK with me. If a group of Christian students want to hold a prayer for anyone who wants to participate that is awesome. I would hope that Christians would be 100% OK with other religions doing the same thing. I am all for people freely practicing their religion as it is constitutionally protected for them to do so. However schools should not be hosting or leading a prayer to a single deity, even if the message is a positive one. UNLESS that same school is willing to do the same thing for other major religions as well.

We would have to be okay with it. It is the politically correct thing to do these days. In this case, the school didn't have anything to do with the prayer. Even the PA system was privately donated.


On this planet there are ~2 billion Christians, ~1.5 billion followers of Islam, ~1 Billion Hindus and ~1 billion Athiest/Agnostic/Undecided. That doesn't list the other dozen or so major religions on the planet. When Christian prayer is the sanctioned form of kicking off an event of any kind then people from all other walks of life tend to feel uncomfortable and complain. If Islamist where to all be given time to pray publicly over a sporting event then everyone but the Islamist would complain and the cycle continues no matter who is performing the religious practice, someone will always complain.

I agree. When I complained last year about an Islam based TV crew coming to video our game and pre-game prayer, I was pretty much ridiculed by most folks on this board.


I'm not offended by Christian prayer or any prayer for that matter and most people aren't. I am however uncomfortable during and slightly after. As I stand silently respecting your right to pray and I see all the others who are standing the same way awaiting the moment to pass I shouldn't have to worry about the guy who is praying that looks at me out of the corner of his eye and shakes his head or the lady who raises her head two or three times during the prayer to scan the crowd for who isn't praying to make the moment cringe worthy. I don't need someone to proselytize me after the event or during. I will be the last person in the world to tell you that you are wrong to believe in any religion but the religious will jump at the chance to tell me I am wrong or going to hell for not believing.


In my opinion, the judgmental Christian has done more to hurt our faith than Satan himself, but you can't judge the entire faith from one or two separate people. That's sort of what you are accusing Christians of doing....isn't it? Maybe I misunderstand you here. Please feel free to explain if you want.


It's not that we are attacking Christianity, though I know it feels that way. It's that way are asking for 100% inclusion and that all walks of life be considered.

Again thank you for posting this viewpoint. It's very important that everyone understand.

[Granny Bear]

So you Pray but Little Johnny still tears his ACL his senior season? What now? Because everyone prayed for it not to happen...but it did? Ohhhh but that's right God is teaching Johnny a lesson, That you can't be out there playing the sport you love, with your best friends, on a beautiful Friday Night because God has plans for you. God kinda seems selfish.

This is ridiculously childish and wrong on so many levels.

[AtlPirateFan]

Morning Granny, it's Football season!

I think you more than most on here know what kind of person I am because we have had several off site interactions.

I will try to touch on your points quickly.

1. Right vs Wrong - This is always a hard thing to explain to those who are not an atheist. Most Christians feel they get their morals from the Bible but I don't believe that is necessarily true. I believe right and wrong are a part of us from birth. Take my children for example. My wife (who believes in God and prayer) and I came to the understanding long ago that for our marriage to work we would not ridicule each others beliefs, nor would we raise our children under either banner. Even at early ages they displayed the basic knowledge of right and wrong. They realize they need to treat others how they want to be treated based upon their interactions and emotions. It's been amazing to watch two children with hearts of gold develop in front of my eyes.

2. Reconcile Spiritual with Reality - this subject I tried to be vague on in my first post because its the one spot that my atheism can get a little on the offensive side. I'll put it this way and hope it is at least slightly understood. I could not reconcile why it was so imperative for a God who loves everyone to only accept those who have been saved or that a Vengeful God who was supposedly omnipotent and infallible from the Old Testament became the loving God of the new testament, to me it made the God I believed in fallible and that is where I began to question things. (The elaboration on this would take paragraphs)

3. Judgmental Christians - I agree with you 100% on this one. It's the same on my side of the street. Angry attacking atheists give us a bad name and often get us a negative association. Just like ISIS and the 9/11 terrorists give Islam a bad name. All sides have their radicals and they give us all a bad rap.