[TheTigersEye]

I doubt it. Clay County is notorious for being corrupt but even this committee isn't that shady.

[SKINNYPIG]

I doubt it. Clay County is notorious for being corrupt but even this committee isn't that shady.

Would that be shady???

[walterwhite]

Would that be shady???

I agree SKinnypig. I ain't too smart but what the....................

[TheTigersEye]

If they've interviewed and went through the process not at all.

[SKINNYPIG]

I don't see a thing wrong with a few prelim talks. A lot of times interviews become nothing more than a formality...actually, most of the time. We'll know soon enough guys.

[LandoGriffin]

Could it be that some of the comm. members are reluctant to make much of a decision until after the first board meeting of the new year with the new board members? Who knows whats in the cards.

[Tigercreek]

They don't make decisions, just recommendations. Hell Bobby Keith Gave them his opinion lol

[LandoGriffin]

Oh I see ,Then we should call it a recommending comm. instead of a hiring comm. lol

[Tigercreek]

Who ever called it a hiring one? Search is also ok

[LandoGriffin]

I thought I read it in the paper but you're most likely right But it just seems to me that the process is taking a little more time than I expected

[Tigercreek]

Yea just assume that final say is with principal and prolly AD. They are doing a lot of the checks on them and talking to their references. Who knows as things have changed since I was getting a job. Back then it was who you knew. May still be lol

[TrueTigerfan]

I agree that the committee will do the searching and work out all kinks but the hire will be who the principal and ad wants. Although the super has to have a hand in it because of a job position.

[bossman313]

Well Ive been reading these posts for two months now and I think they need to get on with it no matter who they choose. I would like to give my personal thoughts on this matter. I do not have a problem with hiring a proven coach from outside our district providing they understand the nature of our problems and have a valid plan to solve the issues we have. My guess is there is not an "outside" guy who will stick around long enough to help us build the type of program we want. (I may be wrong)...Our lack of a consistent program starts at the eementary level. Last year we had two schools who did not even field a team and another that had to play 4th graders just to have enough to say they fielded a team. Thats a problem gentlemen. And it only gets worse as these kids get older. Out of the 20 eight graders who played last year we will be lucky to get 10-12 out for the team as freshmen and of that group only a handful will play all four years. This must change if we want to build a successful program. I honestly dont see how an out-of-towner will change this? We need total community involvement. We need the QB Club to get more involved. We need a staff who understands our issues and make it a priority to change them. We need an elementary sports group get together and see what options we can come up with to fix our program. We need our middle school to get their numbers up. If transportation is the issue then lets get them a ride home. Our problems can be solved by us. Why do we think we need someone from Bell, Laurel, Whitley, Knox, Leslie, Magoffin or Breathitt county to come in here and be our savior. This is OUR problem and we should be men enough to fix it...

[LandoGriffin]

Who's Hibbard that some people are speaking of.Is that the one that was called Little A. That used to play basketball at CCHS?

[TheTigersEye]

Wow, great post! Too many local haters on here though brother.

[SKINNYPIG]

Well Ive been reading these posts for two months now and I think they need to get on with it no matter who they choose. I would like to give my personal thoughts on this matter. I do not have a problem with hiring a proven coach from outside our district providing they understand the nature of our problems and have a valid plan to solve the issues we have. My guess is there is not an "outside" guy who will stick around long enough to help us build the type of program we want. (I may be wrong)...Our lack of a consistent program starts at the eementary level. Last year we had two schools who did not even field a team and another that had to play 4th graders just to have enough to say they fielded a team. Thats a problem gentlemen. And it only gets worse as these kids get older. Out of the 20 eight graders who played last year we will be lucky to get 10-12 out for the team as freshmen and of that group only a handful will play all four years. This must change if we want to build a successful program. I honestly dont see how an out-of-towner will change this? We need total community involvement. We need the QB Club to get more involved. We need a staff who understands our issues and make it a priority to change them. We need an elementary sports group get together and see what options we can come up with to fix our program. We need our middle school to get their numbers up. If transportation is the issue then lets get them a ride home. Our problems can be solved by us. Why do we think we need someone from Bell, Laurel, Whitley, Knox, Leslie, Magoffin or Breathitt county to come in here and be our savior. This is OUR problem and we should be men enough to fix it...

We all know that it's not going to happen, but doing away with the middle school would help our program more than anything. I understand we have some problems in the elementary program but I think our biggest problem lies between the 8th & 10th grade, that's where we're losing our numbers. The middle school is pretty successful year in and year out and usually have between 20 and 25 players on the eighth grade team as well as the seventh. I'm not sure improving the elementary program would increase numbers a whole lot, but it might get a few more quality players in the system. Again, we need 12 to 15 seniors to compete for district titles, middle school is sending 25 up, where are they going?

Personally, I believe if the high school, middle school and grade school s would just get on the same page it would help a bunch. Fundamentals and techniques used by the high school should be taught to 4th graders too.

Hopefully the committee will be asking the applicants questions that are directly linked to our program's problems.

[bossman313]

We will just have to agree to disagree on the issue of the importance of the elementary program SP. I think it is highly important that 8-10 year olds learn the game and hoprfully find a love for the game. If we have 25 eight graders, I say why dont we have 30 then? One reason we dont keep these fine athletes once they get into high school is we have never placed a great value on our underclassmen. (or so it seems). Why are we not competing in a conference or league every year? Why do we feel the need to to use our underclassmen as practice targets? We need a staff to make certain that our underclassmen are playing every week and practicing daily as a group. We need to promote these kids and we need to ask those who are not playing why arent you playing. Once again if its a transportation issue lets get that resolved. A big issue in the past has been that we seldom have our coaches at the high school level. I think it would be a high priority to have a couple coaches at both the middle school and high school level so we can keep in constant contact with these kids and we leave no stone unturned and have these good kids fall thru the cracks.

[SKINNYPIG]

We will just have to agree to disagree on the issue of the importance of the elementary program SP. I think it is highly important that 8-10 year olds learn the game and hoprfully find a love for the game. If we have 25 eight graders, I say why dont we have 30 then? One reason we dont keep these fine athletes once they get into high school is we have never placed a great value on our underclassmen. (or so it seems). Why are we not competing in a conference or league every year? Why do we feel the need to to use our underclassmen as practice targets? We need a staff to make certain that our underclassmen are playing every week and practicing daily as a group. We need to promote these kids and we need to ask those who are not playing why arent you playing. Once again if its a transportation issue lets get that resolved. A big issue in the past has been that we seldom have our coaches at the high school level. I think it would be a high priority to have a couple coaches at both the middle school and high school level so we can keep in constant contact with these kids and we leave no stone unturned and have these good kids fall thru the cracks.

Not really disagreeing in regards to elementary football. More players is always a good thing. And yes, having one or two coaches at the high school full time is paramount.

If we have 35 players on the 8th grade team and we play our top 15 players (as most teams do) to get the W, is that really making things better? 20 of em will warm the bench and skip out before they're sophomores. At least that's what's been happening.

Anytime we've had the numbers in the younger grades we've played a decent JV schedule, not sure on the conference stuff.

More freshman = more sophomores, more sophomores = more juniors and so on and so on. So I guess more 6th graders = more 7th graders, right?

[PBR]

Not sure why there is all this love for locals. Two of your last three coaches have been from Clay County. You fired one who had an asst who had THIRTY years invested in the program and the other used you to get what he thought would be a head coaching job in another state. Sounds like a great decision to hire local. Actually why don't you hire everybody local. Where is the superintendent from? WAY to many agents on here who have agendas. Anyone who opens themselves up to this mess is either 1. Just wanting to be a head coach. 2. A masochist who loves pain. Or 3. Just stupid.

Good luck to whatever poor soul whether it be a local or "outsider" who is "blessed" to get this job. Bottom line: Clay County eats it's own and runs out any outsider who wants to make a difference.

[bossman313]

Well we certainly can agree with winning is everything at every level. If our middle school has 25 players on the team but they are only playing 15 then we have a major issue. Football is designed to play lots of players and keep their interest level up. But I totally understand that the desire to win supercedes anything resembling helping build a successful high school program. And I totally agree with you on the issues I have with the middle school system we have in place. I remember a time when every school fielded a team excpet Oneida and they transported their kids to Laurel Creek so they could play. We had 55-60 eight graders playing every year. And our youth basketball teams took a back seat to no-one. Its something that we will never see again but our county had plenty of youth participation. I noticed the other day that we played in middle schools basketabll tourney in Lexington and only 7 kids made the trip? Or at least thats all I counted in the team picture. But our new coach must make it a priority to work closely with the middle school and elementary schools and get as many kids involved as possible.

[SKINNYPIG]

And then there's the Coaching Thread troll that swings through with his input.

[SKINNYPIG]

Well we certainly can agree with winning is everything at every level. If our middle school has 25 players on the team but they are only playing 15 then we have a major issue. Football is designed to play lots of players and keep their interest level up. But I totally understand that the desire to win supercedes anything resembling helping build a successful high school program. And I totally agree with you on the issues I have with the middle school system we have in place. I remember a time when every school fielded a team excpet Oneida and they transported their kids to Laurel Creek so they could play. We had 55-60 eight graders playing every year. And our youth basketball teams took a back seat to no-one. Its something that we will never see again but our county had plenty of youth participation. I noticed the other day that we played in middle schools basketabll tourney in Lexington and only 7 kids made the trip? Or at least thats all I counted in the team picture. But our new coach must make it a priority to work closely with the middle school and elementary schools and get as many kids involved as possible.

If I'm not mistaken, our middle school still plays 7th graders up on the 8th grade team. IMO a practice that should cease.

[The Eagle has landed]

Well Ive been reading these posts for two months now and I think they need to get on with it no matter who they choose. I would like to give my personal thoughts on this matter. I do not have a problem with hiring a proven coach from outside our district providing they understand the nature of our problems and have a valid plan to solve the issues we have. My guess is there is not an "outside" guy who will stick around long enough to help us build the type of program we want. (I may be wrong)...Our lack of a consistent program starts at the eementary level. Last year we had two schools who did not even field a team and another that had to play 4th graders just to have enough to say they fielded a team. Thats a problem gentlemen. And it only gets worse as these kids get older. Out of the 20 eight graders who played last year we will be lucky to get 10-12 out for the team as freshmen and of that group only a handful will play all four years. This must change if we want to build a successful program. I honestly dont see how an out-of-towner will change this? We need total community involvement. We need the QB Club to get more involved. We need a staff who understands our issues and make it a priority to change them. We need an elementary sports group get together and see what options we can come up with to fix our program. We need our middle school to get their numbers up. If transportation is the issue then lets get them a ride home. Our problems can be solved by us. Why do we think we need someone from Bell, Laurel, Whitley, Knox, Leslie, Magoffin or Breathitt county to come in here and be our savior. This is OUR problem and we should be men enough to fix it...

there are a lot of things you say I agree with but Holcomb is not from Breathitt and I don't think dud was from Bell co. You just need the best head coach you can get regardless of where he is from and how long you think he will be there. I don't disagree with you on most things but the best coach you can get regardless if he is sitting here now or from somewhere else is what the boys need and deserve. again I am not from clay but have watched yall in bball and football over the years and have a lot of respect for the type of players yall have. IMO if you hire a guy because you think he will be there for the long haul and that is your main reason for the hire you are not getting the most important thing which is the best football coach you can get. Who is to say that the guy you think will stay there for ten years doesn't get another offer that is just to good to pass up or after 2 years says it just aint for him. I have taken two different jobs in my life where I thought that they would be my last job and both times left those jobs for better jobs one reason because the money was just to good to pass up and the other reason it was a better situation for my children. Now I don't know how a football coach thinks about taking other jobs I am just saying it probable aint much different from what all of us would think in our jobs. Again the best football coach could be sitting in Clay co. right now I don't know the answer to that but regardless if he is from Manchester or thousand sticks I hope for yalls sake and more importantly for the boys they get the best football coach they can find.

[Granny Bear]

They don't make decisions, just recommendations. Hell Bobby Keith Gave them his opinion lol

Well, then it's over!! LOL If Bobby Keith has spoken!!

Yea just assume that final say is with principal and prolly AD. They are doing a lot of the checks on them and talking to their references. Who knows as things have changed since I was getting a job. Back then it was who you knew. May still be lol

It is ALWAYS who you know to a degree in the mountains. Good or bad!!

Not sure why there is all this love for locals. Two of your last three coaches have been from Clay County. You fired one who had an asst who had THIRTY years invested in the program and the other used you to get what he thought would be a head coaching job in another state. Sounds like a great decision to hire local. Actually why don't you hire everybody local. Where is the superintendent from? WAY to many agents on here who have agendas. Anyone who opens themselves up to this mess is either 1. Just wanting to be a head coach. 2. A masochist who loves pain. Or 3. Just stupid.

Good luck to whatever poor soul whether it be a local or "outsider" who is "blessed" to get this job. Bottom line: Clay County eats it's own and runs out any outsider who wants to make a difference.

Well, THAT'S a little harsh!!

And then there's the Coaching Thread troll that swings through with his input.

nicker:

[The Eagle has landed]

We will just have to agree to disagree on the issue of the importance of the elementary program SP. I think it is highly important that 8-10 year olds learn the game and hoprfully find a love for the game. If we have 25 eight graders, I say why dont we have 30 then? One reason we dont keep these fine athletes once they get into high school is we have never placed a great value on our underclassmen. (or so it seems). Why are we not competing in a conference or league every year? Why do we feel the need to to use our underclassmen as practice targets? We need a staff to make certain that our underclassmen are playing every week and practicing daily as a group. We need to promote these kids and we need to ask those who are not playing why arent you playing. Once again if its a transportation issue lets get that resolved. A big issue in the past has been that we seldom have our coaches at the high school level. I think it would be a high priority to have a couple coaches at both the middle school and high school level so we can keep in constant contact with these kids and we leave no stone unturned and have these good kids fall thru the cracks.

excellent points about coaches being at the schools but I don't understand about underclassman being practice dummies. When I played and my sons played those guys where the scout team and if you didn't have them you could not run the other teams plays.

[The Eagle has landed]

And then there's the Coaching Thread troll that swings through with his input.

:biglmao:

[Bird]

We will just have to agree to disagree on the issue of the importance of the elementary program SP. I think it is highly important that 8-10 year olds learn the game and hoprfully find a love for the game. If we have 25 eight graders, I say why dont we have 30 then? One reason we dont keep these fine athletes once they get into high school is we have never placed a great value on our underclassmen. (or so it seems). Why are we not competing in a conference or league every year? Why do we feel the need to to use our underclassmen as practice targets? We need a staff to make certain that our underclassmen are playing every week and practicing daily as a group. We need to promote these kids and we need to ask those who are not playing why arent you playing. Once again if its a transportation issue lets get that resolved. A big issue in the past has been that we seldom have our coaches at the high school level. I think it would be a high priority to have a couple coaches at both the middle school and high school level so we can keep in constant contact with these kids and we leave no stone unturned and have these good kids fall thru the cracks.

I agree with most of this post except the practice target question. Football is a contact sport, and like with any sport a player will only get better playing older, better players. Hitting/getting hit is just part of it. I would like to see some sort of transportation system developed. Looking back at the past 5 years, Burning Springs has won 4 championships I think and has very few high school players on the roster. I would say 80%, or close to that, of the roster comes from Manchester, Hacker, and Paces Creek students.

[walterwhite]

Not really disagreeing in regards to elementary football. More players is always a good thing. And yes, having one or two coaches at the high school full time is paramount.

If we have 35 players on the 8th grade team and we play our top 15 players (as most teams do) to get the W, is that really making things better? 20 of em will warm the bench and skip out before they're sophomores. At least that's what's been happening.

Anytime we've had the numbers in the younger grades we've played a decent JV schedule, not sure on the conference stuff.

More freshman = more sophomores, more sophomores = more juniors and so on and so on. So I guess more 6th graders = more 7th graders, right?

I actually thought the creation of the middle school would help football. I thought it would allow the players to fully become involved in the "system" and allow for them to have access to better facilities and coaching. I also thought, incorrectly, that it would allow for more kids to play, as I figured the coaches would be told to platoon and use different players on special teams. I thought with the numbers available players would stay with their grade and not play up. More coaches also would equal more individual instruction on fundamentals.
I agree that there should be coaches in the building at both the high school and middle school. No better way to keep players involved than being involved.
As for elementary football, the high school coach should be directly in charge of the entire program, from playbooks to coaches.
Transportation will always be an issue in rural county school systems. some provide it, some don't. Just my opinion, but somewhere along the line parents and players have to take a personal interest in the program. Getting to practice is an individual responsibility. Football is an extracurricular activity.
When it comes right down to it, whover gets this job has to change the culture of the program, which is going to be a monumental job. It can be done but not by one man alone. As many have stated, it will take an entire community to get this going.

[SKINNYPIG]

I actually thought the creation of the middle school would help football. I thought it would allow the players to fully become involved in the "system" and allow for them to have access to better facilities and coaching. I also thought, incorrectly, that it would allow for more kids to play, as I figured the coaches would be told to platoon and use different players on special teams. I thought with the numbers available players would stay with their grade and not play up. More coaches also would equal more individual instruction on fundamentals.
I agree that there should be coaches in the building at both the high school and middle school. No better way to keep players involved than being involved.
As for elementary football, the high school coach should be directly in charge of the entire program, from playbooks to coaches.
Transportation will always be an issue in rural county school systems. some provide it, some don't. Just my opinion, but somewhere along the line parents and players have to take a personal interest in the program. Getting to practice is an individual responsibility. Football is an extracurricular activity.
When it comes right down to it, whover gets this job has to change the culture of the program, which is going to be a monumental job. It can be done but not by one man alone. As many have stated, it will take an entire community to get this going.

I've always looked at it like this WW...prior to the middle school we had 8 grade schools playing football and basketball. That meant coach Kieth could have 8 point guards coming to freshman practice to compete for the starting spot. Coach Hensley could have 8 QB's, 40 lineman and 16 linebackers fighting for a spot on the freshman team. Of course ALL the players didn't come out for the freshman team but, there certainly was more competition without the middle school. Now we're lucky if key players on the MS team even play at HS. When they do play freshman ball it seams like there's no competition to EARN your spot, it's in stone from the 6th grade on who the freshman point guard and QB will be.

We used to weed our athletes out when they were freshman, now we weed them out at the 6th grade. Just think how many good players we might not have had in the 70's & 80's if the middle school had been in service.

[walterwhite]

I've always looked at it like this WW...prior to the middle school we had 8 grade schools playing football and basketball. That meant coach Kieth could have 8 point guards coming to freshman practice to compete for the starting spot. Coach Hensley could have 8 QB's, 40 lineman and 16 linebackers fighting for a spot on the freshman team. Of course ALL the players didn't come out for the freshman team but, there certainly was more competition without the middle school. Now we're lucky if key players on the MS team even play at HS. When they do play freshman ball it seams like there's no competition to EARN your spot, it's in stone from the 6th grade on who the freshman point guard and QB will be.

We used to weed our athletes out when they were freshman, now we weed them out at the 6th grade. Just think how many good players we might not have had in the 70's & 80's if the middle school had been in service.

I agree 100% on the basketball aspect. I can't recall every school having football in the same year. You would never see a school decide not to play basketball, even if it was a "BTeam". It seemed like some would suddenly decide to field a team when, oddly enough, they had a good group of upper graders. Then, just as suddenly, there wouldn't be enough to field a team, coincidently right after the good group moved on. There was no interest in fielding a "B Team" until they had enough to play varsity. That's why I thought middle school "could" have helped. I see your point clearly, more kids playing the better off you are. I think the middle school could still accomplish that. Play LOTS of people, and don't move players up. Hey, even have 2 teams per grade level. As always it's good to discuss things with you, my friend.