Is Johnny Cash Overrated?

KentuckyHillBilly5321 · 02-03-2006, 09:48 PM

I say yes. . . . .

He has gotten entirely too much attention because of the silly walk the line movie.

I would say that Merle Haggard has been way more influential in regard to country music.

What do you think?

bevinsville_bomber · 02-03-2006, 11:10 PM

You're joking right?

ZMG · 02-03-2006, 11:26 PM

I don't think he is. He has had an influence on several generations. He wasn't just a country singer, but a "pop" singer as well. He had numerous top songs on the country charts, and several cross-over hits. Not to mention his cover of NIN's "Hurt".

I think he's done a lot for music. I didn't learn to appreciate his music until a couple of years ago. I wish I had gotten into it more while he was alive.

Why do you think Walk the Line is silly, btw?

KentuckyHillBilly5321 · 02-03-2006, 11:35 PM

bevinsville_bomber Wrote:You're joking right?

Why would I be joking?

KentuckyHillBilly5321 · 02-03-2006, 11:37 PM

ZMG Wrote:I don't think he is. He has had an influence on several generations. He wasn't just a country singer, but a "pop" singer as well. He had numerous top songs on the country charts, and several cross-over hits. Not to mention his cover of NIN's "Hurt".

I think he's done a lot for music. I didn't learn to appreciate his music until a couple of years ago. I wish I had gotten into it more while he was alive.

Why do you think Walk the Line is silly, btw?

I think that it was silly because I don't believe that a lot of it happened.

I think that it was a glorified Hollywood story.

Johnny Cash was nothing more than a myth created after his career fizzled out. And the worst part is--the current generation is buying into it. I don't see how his music was influential. If anything--he was a rip off of Merle Haggard (who was/still is the genuine article).

ZMG · 02-04-2006, 12:40 AM

I'm sure some stuff was made up. I would like to see one true to life, every single fact is straight out of the real world, biographical movie. For example, the movie shows June Carter coming up with "Ring of Fire" after a fight which appears to come a couple years after it was really written. The fact is, June Carter wrote the song, no matter when or what the exact reason.

I'm not quite sure how he could rip off Merle Haggard. It looks like Cash predates Haggard by about 8 years. Heck, some of Cash's most popular and most notable songs came out while Haggard was stuck in prison, before he got his real start in music.

**BC75** · 02-04-2006, 01:59 AM

bevinsville_bomber Wrote:You're joking right?

my thoughts exactly

acoustic_andrew · 02-04-2006, 02:38 AM

oh my gosh. i could go on for days on why Johnny is the most influential person to music ever.

He was a legend before the movie, you know.

**15thRegionCrazy** · 02-04-2006, 03:50 AM

I don't think he is

KentuckyHillBilly5321 · 02-04-2006, 12:01 PM

acoustic_andrew Wrote:oh my gosh. i could go on for days on why Johnny is the most influential person to music ever.

He was a legend before the movie, you know.

Please, go on for days. I am listening.

acoustic_andrew · 02-04-2006, 12:09 PM

i'm not going to explain things to a Cash Basher. Us true fans know who he really was and what he did for music. apparently you aren't a musician like i am.

KentuckyHillBilly5321 · 02-04-2006, 12:14 PM

acoustic_andrew Wrote:i'm not going to explain things to a Cash Basher. Us true fans know who he really was and what he did for music. apparently you aren't a musician like i am.

I am not a "cash-basher" (nice!).

I asked because I am open to your opinion (because your arguements usually make sense to me).

Just because I think he is over-rated doesn't mean I am bashing him.

evillive · 02-04-2006, 04:46 PM

First of all -- i will start by saying that i do like johnny cash ...

but i don't think he is the end all/be all...

He has some great songs... a great attitude and was a better than average entertainer...

but why does everyone love him so much ... think about it he was able to connect with the younger generation through his american recordings series of cd's .... think about it would the younger generation have even started to listen to him if he hadn't started covering tunes by Danzig, NIN, Depeche Mode, etc. ....

my son loves johnny cash and took a look at the cd.s ---5.5 of the songs on the "Walk the Line " album were written by him... and there are 16 total ... on his giant hits cd.... 4 of the 12 songs were written by him.... and all of the newer american recordings cd's were not written by him...

does this not make him as good as a writer as everyone thinks he is...?

i will say that he was influential in making country music to more of the pop side of things ... but does it make him overrated ? possibly ....

Doc Holliday · 02-04-2006, 10:46 PM

Hill billy did you want to be named sue and is that the true reason you are pissed at the man in black
there must be some deep issue between you and popular things

you dont like Cash or seinfeild this would lead one to beleive that you have a problem with what is viewed as being in the norm.
as a Doc i presribe several hours of roy Orbison in the dark, then perhaps you can touch your inner feelings
LOL

OU_Bruiser · 02-04-2006, 11:37 PM

Never new he was rated.....

ZMG · 02-05-2006, 01:17 AM

BTW, looking over WIkipiedia today, I see an interesting statement:

"Merle attended three of Johnny Cash's concerts at San Quentin in three different years. Cash inspired him to straighten up and pursue his singing."

Seems that Cash had an influnce on Haggard.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merle_Haggard

**thetribe** · 02-05-2006, 03:23 AM

I don't listen to the man, never have and never will. I just know this, he did stuff for music but after the movie was made alot more people got into him. I don't know if this is a good or bad thing and it doesn't matter to me either way.

KentuckyHillBilly5321 · 02-05-2006, 11:09 AM

Doc Holliday Wrote:Hill billy did you want to be named sue and is that the true reason you are pissed at the man in black
there must be some deep issue between you and popular things

you dont like Cash or seinfeild this would lead one to beleive that you have a problem with what is viewed as being in the norm.
as a Doc i presribe several hours of roy Orbison in the dark, then perhaps you can touch your inner feelings
LOL

Doc--why don't you take a step off with your personal attacks at me.

You are out of line.

As an administrator--I would expect you to be a little more calculating with some of the things that you say.

Just because I started a thread that points towards someone being over-rated--doesn't give you the right to give me a hard time about how I feel.

The last time I checked--I haven't done that to you.

A little more class/maturity would be nice here.

KentuckyHillBilly5321 · 02-05-2006, 11:11 AM

ZMG Wrote:BTW, looking over WIkipiedia today, I see an interesting statement:

"Merle attended three of Johnny Cash's concerts at San Quentin in three different years. Cash inspired him to straighten up and pursue his singing."

Seems that Cash had an influnce on Haggard.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merle_Haggard

"Inspired him to straighten up .. . . ."

That says it all.

Anyone who knows anything knows that Merle was already singing--he just did not take it as serious as he could have at the time.

Again, you may want to read a little closer--and then learn a little more about Merle.

Also--if you asked every musician (today) who they were influenced by--99 times out of a 100--they are going to say Merle--not Johnny "I can't write my own songs" Cash.

Doc Holliday · 02-05-2006, 02:56 PM

KentuckyHillBilly5321 Wrote:Doc--why don't you take a step off with your personal attacks at me.

You are out of line.

As an administrator--I would expect you to be a little more calculating with some of the things that you say.

Just because I started a thread that points towards someone being over-rated--doesn't give you the right to give me a hard time about how I feel.

The last time I checked--I haven't done that to you.

A little more class/maturity would be nice here.

I am truly sorry that you were offended by my post, I would hope that you belive me when I say that I was only joking.
I would have hoped that you knew me and my sense of humor by my post however it is apparent that you do not.
So I can only say that it will not happen again

KentuckyHillBilly5321 · 02-05-2006, 03:35 PM

Doc Holliday Wrote:I am truly sorry that you were offended by my post, I would hope that you belive me when I say that I was only joking.
I would have hoped that you knew me and my sense of humor by my post however it is apparent that you do not.
So I can only say that it will not happen again

Doc--

You are fine--and matter of fact--SORRY for being so touchy (it was early for me). Whatever you do--don't change the way you post.

You don't need to change your direction. No need to apologize (but I appreciate it either way).

But I will tell you this--I am not a boy named Sue . . . . . . !

acoustic_andrew · 02-05-2006, 03:38 PM

as a musician and being surround by musicians all day every day, I can tell you first hand that 99 out of 100 would say johnny way over merle.

and sure, a few may have jumped on the bandwagon from the movie, but the people that i spend my time around every day have ALWAYS been fans and followers.

Haven't any of you actually studied his life and influence on music and not just based all your opinions from the movie?

KentuckyHillBilly5321 · 02-05-2006, 03:42 PM

acoustic_andrew Wrote:as a musician and being surround by musicians all day every day, I can tell you first hand that 99 out of 100 would say johnny way over merle.

and sure, a few may have jumped on the bandwagon from the movie, but the people that i spend my time around every day have ALWAYS been fans and followers.

Haven't any of you actually studied his life and influence on music and not just based all your opinions from the movie?

Here is one for you--I haven't even seen the movie (with no plans to). But it wasn't hard to pick up the fact that there were a lot of things that were not the truth (it isn't hard to find information in other places that critique the movie)

And what kind of muscians are you talking about--not any of the guys who have made it big today.

Haggard is listed as the inspriation long before anyone else.

Like I said before--explain to me, as a muscian, why Cash isn't overrated . . . I don't want heresay--I want to know why you think (with as many facts as possible) why he isn't overrated. I am not trying to bash--but I am trying to keep an open mind.

acoustic_andrew · 02-05-2006, 04:20 PM

I understand your opinion and where you are coming from KYhillbilly. I can't stand madonna but i'm sure some people in the world would fight me to the death to convince me otherwise. : )

but anyways, loads and loads of professional musicians have said that johnny was their inspiration.
i'll try and make this quick........i guess people respect him because they can relate to him somewhat. he grew up in a poor home with a dream of being a star. he watched his brother die in a lumber saw accident. He was the pioneer singer for the sun record studio which later became a legendary studio. Johnny was among the 3 or 4 that put rock and roll into the mainstream in the 50s and 60s. i guess you could say he was like nsync in the 90s. he sang "rock and roll" for two or three decades before he actually got into outlaw and country music. his music became the soundtrack to people's lives because he sang about good and bad times. his young fans of the 50s eventually got older and as he continued singing, he drew in fans of all ages. "Folsom Prison Blues" is what really blew him off the charts because it was a huge hit. Then in the 80s he joined up with Willie and Kris and Waylon for the Highwaymen and did some records with them. Then when everyone thought his career was over, lost highway picked him up with the CASH albums and brought him to even more young people because they mixed his old country with current rock musicality.

ok maybe that wasn't as short as i would have liked, : ), but i just think saying walk the line is what made him famous like like saying the movie RAY is the only reason Ray Charles is a legend. these people were huge before their movies were even written.

of course you are entitled to your opinion and i'm glad to hear what other people think. what would the world be like if we all agreed on everything? boring!

ZMG · 02-05-2006, 09:25 PM

KentuckyHillBilly5321 Wrote:"Inspired him to straighten up .. . . ."

That says it all.

Anyone who knows anything knows that Merle was already singing--he just did not take it as serious as he could have at the time.

Again, you may want to read a little closer--and then learn a little more about Merle.

Also--if you asked every musician (today) who they were influenced by--99 times out of a 100--they are going to say Merle--not Johnny "I can't write my own songs" Cash.

Tell you what, I've been doing research and can only find informaton pointing to Cash coming up with his sound before Haggard. Maybe you can do some research and point me in the direction that says otherwise.

Doc Holliday · 02-06-2006, 01:47 AM

KentuckyHillBilly5321 Wrote:Doc--

You are fine--and matter of fact--SORRY for being so touchy (it was early for me). Whatever you do--don't change the way you post.

You don't need to change your direction. No need to apologize (but I appreciate it either way).

But I will tell you this--I am not a boy named Sue . . . . . . !

Sue was the toughest son of a gun since ringo
its an honor to be called Sue well maybe not
LOL