[halfstep]

:Cheerlead
Just wanted to hear everyone's thoughts on this and wanted to know if it is fair or authorized. This is why.
:Cheerlead
Just for everyone's info. JCHS will be using their COMPETION SQUAD inplace of their regular season squads for the District and in the Regions if they make it there! The sponsor says they are doing this so they can up their chances of Victory!

To me this isn't fair to the girls that are on the regular squads and cheer the entire season and then they get shoved out of the picture and told that they can't cheer in these Tounaments. To me this is like using your basketball team all season long and then bringing in a much better team who hasn't played a game all season to replace them. Which would be against the rulles in KHSAA!

This is NOT a rumor either! I know this for a fact!

I don't uderstand. Why rob these other girls of memories that will last them for a life time!

:Cheerlead

[catsfan072]

Then when do they even have a regular season squad? It's pointless to practice with girls that are not going to be competeing with the rest of the squad in competitions.

[The Informer]

They have actually 3 squads. A Black Squad, A Gold Squad and Competion Squad. The Black and Gold Squads alternate between Boys and Girls Games. The Competion Squad is supposed to be for Competions and NOT games. She is sidwling her other two squads when the districts start. Doesn't sound fair does it?:wtf1:

[Fuzzy5118]

How did this whole three squad deal come about?
The black squad and the gold squad should cheer their ballgames. District & Region included(if they get to the region). They started this year and should darned well get to finish it.
Game situation and Competition situation are two totally different things. One has NOTHING to do with the other. One is involved with an entire game, where the crowd is very involved, the cheer surface is the actual hardwood, and you're being judged to boot. You can choose not to be judged and let 'er rip (hoopin it up and having fun) or you can let 'er rip and be judged (but know your chances of success may be diminished) or you can be judged and follow the guidelines to see where you stand compared to your peers. Competition will find you in a division (see thread KAPOS 2006) decided by your size. Since you're speaking of JCHS, they've opted to cheer small varsity 2-1/2 minute routine. They will perform a 2-1/2 minute routine that will contain cheers, stunts, gymnastics, and dance. This requires good music, good choreography, lots of practice beginning in the Summer, and dedication to a goal. Many things factor into a 2-1/2 minute routine and to understand what all that might be, would take some folks a long time to understand, so I won't go there, but direct you to www.kapos.org for further explanation. These routines are performed on a special cheer mat. (and not on hardwood like they do in West Virginia) I guess what I am trying to say is this, if you have a school large enough to support two 20 member squads and they are of equal talent(as prescribed by Title IX & the KHSAA) you should darned well compete them both. Giving 40 young ladies a chance to shine and giving your school a doubled opportunity to be victorious. This is something to be proud of instead of winnowing your talent pool down to nothing & killing your program in one fell swoop. Take a hint from schools who send (2) squads to competitions and are successful. Everyone loves a winner, Success breeds success.

[halfstep]

How did this whole three squad deal come about?
The black squad and the gold squad should cheer their ballgames. District & Region included(if they get to the region). They started this year and should darned well get to finish it.
Game situation and Competition situation are two totally different things. One has NOTHING to do with the other. One is involved with an entire game, where the crowd is very involved, the cheer surface is the actual hardwood, and you're being judged to boot. You can choose not to be judged and let 'er rip (hoopin it up and having fun) or you can let 'er rip and be judged (but know your chances of success may be diminished) or you can be judged and follow the guidelines to see where you stand compared to your peers. Competition will find you in a division (see thread KAPOS 2006) decided by your size. Since you're speaking of JCHS, they've opted to cheer small varsity 2-1/2 minute routine. They will perform a 2-1/2 minute routine that will contain cheers, stunts, gymnastics, and dance. This requires good music, good choreography, lots of practice beginning in the Summer, and dedication to a goal. Many things factor into a 2-1/2 minute routine and to understand what all that might be, would take some folks a long time to understand, so I won't go there, but direct you to www.kapos.org for further explanation. These routines are performed on a special cheer mat. (and not on hardwood like they do in West Virginia) I guess what I am trying to say is this, if you have a school large enough to support two 20 member squads and they are of equal talent(as prescribed by Title IX & the KHSAA) you should darned well compete them both. Giving 40 young ladies a chance to shine and giving your school a doubled opportunity to be victorious. This is something to be proud of instead of winnowing your talent pool down to nothing & killing your program in one fell swoop. Take a hint from schools who send (2) squads to competitions and are successful. Everyone loves a winner, Success breeds success.

Great Post! Maybe some one needs to tell Ms. Sturgill that! But JC cares nothing about Title IX. Ms. Sturgill is over the Black and Competion Squads and all she does is practice the Comp. Squad and won't even practice the Black until the day of a game. She isn't even fair in her squad rotations for games. The Gold squad has got to cheer the Apple Bowl, the 1st P-ville & JC game and now also the 2nd P-ville & JC game. These are the biggest games of the year and some of the girls don't even get to cheer them once and if they meet in the Districts or Regionals (if they make it), they won't even get to cheer those either, that will be her coveted Comp. Squad. It's just not fair for the girls who have cheer all season long. It's like, Now that you have done all the dirty work, we don't need you any more and you aren't good enough so get out of our way so we can cheer in the spotlight.
:Angry07: :bow: :redboxer:
God that makes my blood boil!:wtf1:

[Fuzzy5118]

Easy now, consider the hour and your blood pressure. From your post you sound very very frustrated. You can't really say JC doesn't adhere to Title IX when only yesterday their girls basketball team ruled the roost, while most sporting squads they field have equal attire, media coverage, support, square footage, and all of the other title ix essentials as expressed by the law. What JC has is a careless attitude about its cheer leaders. They seem to be going about all of this wrong. I bet really and truly Ms. Sturgill didn't want it done this way. This set up sounds like (pardon me) something a man would come up with... thinking it was the very best solution to the situation.
Considering that the Apple Bowl is a major cheer event for everyone, why couldn't every squad be out there supporting the team, leading the cheers, and making lifetime memories? Instead of leading by exclusion why not lead by inclusion and see where that takes ya!

[halfstep]

Easy now, consider the hour and your blood pressure. From your post you sound very very frustrated. You can't really say JC doesn't adhere to Title IX when only yesterday their girls basketball team ruled the roost, while most sporting squads they field have equal attire, media coverage, support, square footage, and all of the other title ix essentials as expressed by the law. What JC has is a careless attitude about its cheer leaders. They seem to be going about all of this wrong. I bet really and truly Ms. Sturgill didn't want it done this way. This set up sounds like (pardon me) something a man would come up with... thinking it was the very best solution to the situation.
Considering that the Apple Bowl is a major cheer event for everyone, why couldn't every squad be out there supporting the team, leading the cheers, and making lifetime memories? Instead of leading by exclusion why not lead by inclusion and see where that takes ya!

SPEAKING of the Apple Bowl! You just jarred my memory. The Gold squad cheered PLUS,the seniors from the other squad.
As for Title IX, Sorry just another seeing red vent. Spoke before thinking:HitWall: .

[Fuzzy5118]

I knew you were just on a BTVS(big time venting spree). I wish there was a hug to give or a back being patted!

[halfstep]

My back needs patted and Patched, cause it's full of HOLES! LOL!
Thanks!

[wildcat20]

I think whoever cheers for the boys throughout the year should be given enough respect to compete in dictrict or regional. They should save their competetion squad for BIG competetions not the ones that the actual cheerleaders should be given the opportuntunity to cheer at!!!

[catsfan072]

Well let me tell you, at Prestonsburg we have 12 cheerleaders. Those cheerleaders cheer for girls and boys, and do competitions. They are also competing in the district tournament for both squads, unless the girls and boys are to play the same night and then they are only getting judged for one or the other. These cheerleaders are also going to be the ones going to KAPOS. They have worked together all year long and worked very hard and their coach isn't going to sit anyone out, for any reason!

[Fuzzy5118]

This brings me to another good point worthy of discussion.... look for the new thread on "The more the merrier". I could begin it here, but I hate it when a thread gets threadjacked.

[KentuckyHillBilly5321]

I think it is weak.

If they are good enough to cheer during the games--they should be good enough to cheer during the competitions.

This is one of the reasons why people will always have a low opinion of cheerleading--there is way too much drama (which is a ashamed--but these girls/kids are definitely athletes).

[Fuzzy5118]

Look, as long as school administrators do not get a tight grip on their coaches/ programs and enforce the rules as approved by their councils, cheer is always gonna have drama. FOLLOW THE RULE BOOK OR TOSS IT IN THE GARBAGE FOR ALL THE GOOD IT'S WORTH. However, in many schools there's as much drama going on in the mainstream sports as in cheer. Weak Administrators will get you drama enough to walk away with all the Academy Awards cast in any and every sport!

[KentuckyHillBilly5321]

Look, as long as school administrators do not get a tight grip on their coaches/ programs and enforce the rules as approved by their councils, cheer is always gonna have drama. FOLLOW THE RULE BOOK OR TOSS IT IN THE GARBAGE FOR ALL THE GOOD IT'S WORTH. However, in many schools there's as much drama going on in the mainstream sports as in cheer. Weak Administrators will get you drama enough to walk away with all the Academy Awards cast in any and every sport!

Therein lies your problem. Most administrators don't want to touch cheerleading with a 10 foot pole. If anything--it HURTS a school because they do not get credit for these girls in their Title 9 numbers.

I don't believe that there is more drama in other sports. And I think that you would have a hard time proving it. And for that reason--that is why there is still not widespread acceptance.

I find it interesting that you point the finger in the direction of adminstration in regard to this issue. Sure, administrators are ultimately responsible for the sponsors, but, if the sponsors would be consistent in how they determine their squads--and be responsible for theirselves--it would never be a question of how the administration is managing the program.

As a coach--I DO MY JOB SO MY PRINCIPAL DOESN'T EVER HAVE TO GET INVOLVED. I am accountable for my program. I am the one who controls the drama--not the administration.

Don't you think that the administration should be a little more concerned with running the school as opposed to making sure that the cheerleading program is run in the proper manner?

[Fuzzy5118]

Couldn't agree more... that is why I began the thread on real coaches and mommy coaches. If the administration cared enough about hiring adequate coaches or getting the ones they have to follow the rules they're given, then most folks can live with things. i.e. most cheerleaders make great athletes in other programs because they love knowing where the boundaries are and being treated equally and fairly as stated by a given set of rules instead of a whim or a group vote on something. I applaude all schools who think enough of their cheer leaders (the first folks the public has to put a face with a school name) to hire the BEST coaches and I applaude all administrators who make it abundantly clear as to what is expected, what will be allowed, and what will get them replaced. Once the ground rules are set, everyone can live in perfect harmony.:Cheerlead

[KentuckyHillBilly5321]

Cool--I am going to reply in the Real/Mommy thread . . . .

[cheergirl]

1. Johnson Central gave their cheerleaders a choice. The competition squad came about for those girls that want to cheer games, but didn't want to do competitions. They were also given a choice between Black and Gold or either. There is one coach for black, one for gold and they both coach the competition squad since the team is comprised of girls from both teams. Games were divided equally between the 2 squad. Both cheered football, boys basketball and girls basketball. Both cheered a bowl game,,,,,,one the apple bowl and one the touchstone energy bowl. The set up this year has been entirely fair to both teams.

2. Would a basketball coach in district play, substitute his best players in a tight game for 5 weaker players,,to ensure that all players got to play? Those players have worked hard all year, after all........GIVE ME A BREAK! HE or She would not jeopardize a win in district or region play so that all can play. That is how it is in sports. Is cheerleading a sport or not? Why not let the best compete in district competition when a trophy is involved???? That is what I consider "competition"

3. The competition squad might be judged during district, but that does not mean that the rest of cheerleaders can't cheer for their team in the stands.
Why are they cheering after all? Maybe we need to ask ourselves that.

[SnakE]

I'd like to remind everyone, who is contemplating an answer to this, to go to abnother thread and think about something else, breathe, and consider that cheer always gets a bad name because folks get so emotional.... I am going to take my own advice and go somewhere else for a while before giving an answer to this one! Everyone have a nice evening!

[jchscheerleader]

You say 'we' as if it is a squad decision, however, it isn't. This has nothing to do with the cheerleaders on either squads.

[halfstep]

1. Johnson Central gave their cheerleaders a choice. The competition squad came about for those girls that want to cheer games, but didn't want to do competitions. They were also given a choice between Black and Gold or either. There is one coach for black, one for gold and they both coach the competition squad since the team is comprised of girls from both teams. Games were divided equally between the 2 squad. Both cheered football, boys basketball and girls basketball. Both cheered a bowl game,,,,,,one the apple bowl and one the touchstone energy bowl. The set up this year has been entirely fair to both teams.

2. Would a basketball coach in district play, substitute his best players in a tight game for 5 weaker players,,to ensure that all players got to play? Those players have worked hard all year, after all........GIVE ME A BREAK! HE or She would not jeopardize a win in district or region play so that all can play. That is how it is in sports. Is cheerleading a sport or not? Why not let the best compete in district competition when a trophy is involved???? That is what I consider "competition"

3. The competition squad might be judged during district, but that does not mean that the rest of cheerleaders can't cheer for their team in the stands.
Why are they cheering after all? Maybe we need to ask ourselves that.

I think your quote was supposed to read "The competion squad came around for those NOT wanting to cheer games but cheer in competions." So why are they cheering at the District Games?

SO your point is way off. Competions Squad was formed for competions such as qualifying and going to nationals. Not, cheer ballgames. Also as for the coach taking out his best players and replacing them for a district game, Your right! He would play the players that have been playing all season! Also as for using your "BEST" cheerleaders, you had 17 quit the competion squad and a few were replaced. NOT to offend anyone, but, how can you say that they are the "best", when that many original girls quit. Also how can you say that there is NOT a problem when that many quit.

Also BOTH don't get to cheer a Paintsville & JCHS Boys Varsity Game! I am sorry but there is a problem when that many champions come over from JCMS and they can't put together a squad that will stay together and dominate like they did over there! And the problem is at the top.:coach:

:Cheerlead

[halfstep]

You say 'we' as if it is a squad decision, however, it isn't. This has nothing to do with the cheerleaders on either squads.

You are exactly right. It is NOT the girls choice, it is the Sponsors choice.
Can you tell me this also? What does cheering at a basketball game have to do with a 2 1/2 min. routine? NOTHING! So how is that going to prep them for any competions? Also, if both coaches coach the Black and Gold squad, why is it that the Gold Squad coach can find time all week long to have practice for her Gold squad, yet the Black squad only practices once maybe twice a week just before ball games?

CHEERGIRL "since the team is comprised of both squads"

There is only one girl from Gold that is on the Competion Squad if I am not mistaken.:wtf1:

[cheergirl]

My comment was correct. I think that in the beginning the competition squad was created to give choices to the girls. Yes,,,many talented girls have quit. BUT,,,,,that was their choice.

At tryouts-----16 Black squad and 9 Gold squad members made up the competition team,,,,,,,,,,although not equal,,,,,close.

[Eagle Eye]

You are exactly right. It is NOT the girls choice, it is the Sponsors choice.
Can you tell me this also? What does cheering at a basketball game have to do with a 2 1/2 min. routine? NOTHING! So how is that going to prep them for any competions? Also, if both coaches coach the Black and Gold squad, why is it that the Gold Squad coach can find time all week long to have practice for her Gold squad, yet the Black squad only practices once maybe twice a week just before ball games?

CHEERGIRL "since the team is comprised of both squads"

There is only one girl from Gold that is on the Competion Squad if I am not mistaken.:wtf1:

Again Halfstep, I have to ask the question why do you care so much about the JCHS squads. It appears by your posts on this site that you are a Pville fan so why does it bother you so much about what is going on at another school. You seem so involved in our squads when the Pville squad needs ALOT more help. I never hear you speak of your own squad. Thanks for caring so much but......why?hh:

By the way, I haven't spoken with all of the cheerleaders, but the ones I have spoken to doesn't seem to mind if they cheer in their uniforms or in the pep section during district tournament. Maybe some do but some definately do not. They have told me that the district games aren't about them as much as it is just cheering for their team and hoping for them to win regardless if they are on the floor or in the stands.

[wildman_06]

Three squads is not a good idea at all. Have a black squad for boys and a gold squad for girls and rotate the football games. Then let the sponsors pick the competition that they want to send there squad to. Make both compete against each other in KAPOS and everything!!!

[Eagle Eye]

Three squads is not a good idea at all. Have a black squad for boys and a gold squad for girls and rotate the football games. Then let the sponsors pick the competition that they want to send there squad to. Make both compete against each other in KAPOS and everything!!!

I agree 100%.:Thumbs:

[SnakE]

Again Halfstep, I have to ask the question why do you care so much about the JCHS squads. It appears by your posts on this site that you are a Pville fan so why does it bother you so much about what is going on at another school. You seem so involved in our squads when the Pville squad needs ALOT more help. I never hear you speak of your own squad. Thanks for caring so much but......why?hh:

By the way, I haven't spoken with all of the cheerleaders, but the ones I have spoken to doesn't seem to mind if they cheer in their uniforms or in the pep section during district tournament. Maybe some do but some definately do not. They have told me that the district games aren't about them as much as it is just cheering for their team and hoping for them to win regardless if they are on the floor or in the stands.

And that folks, is why threads are closed. This person, Halfstep, posts in all forums and it's their right to do so. Do not try to denigrate this person or make them appear as though their point is not a valid one, by throwing other things into the discussion. The point is, the BEST INTERESTS OF THE GIRLS, WHO CHOOSE TO CHEER, ARE NOT BEING MET. THE POINT IS, THE SCHOOL'S ADMINISTRATORS OBVIOUSLY DO NOT CARE ENOUGH ABOUT IT TO MAKE IT RIGHT, BUT THEY'D FALL ALL OVER EACH OTHER TO START A NEW BASEBALL LEAGUE FOR THE GOOD OF THE BOYS, OR MAKE CERTAIN THE FOOTBALL TEAM GETS AN INDOOR PRACTICE FACILITY. I'm not gonna curse on here or use any of the signs, but what's being done in the situation you're talking about stinks to high heaven and it's all our tax dollars involved!

[OJ Simpson]

that is absolutley stupid

[cheergirl]

And that folks, is why threads are closed. This person, Halfstep, posts in all forums and it's their right to do so. Do not try to denigrate this person or make them appear as though their point is not a valid one, by throwing other things into the discussion. The point is, the BEST INTERESTS OF THE GIRLS, WHO CHOOSE TO CHEER, ARE NOT BEING MET. THE POINT IS, THE SCHOOL'S ADMINISTRATORS OBVIOUSLY DO NOT CARE ENOUGH ABOUT IT TO MAKE IT RIGHT, BUT THEY'D FALL ALL OVER EACH OTHER TO START A NEW BASEBALL LEAGUE FOR THE GOOD OF THE BOYS, OR MAKE CERTAIN THE FOOTBALL TEAM GETS AN INDOOR PRACTICE FACILITY. I'm not gonna curse on here or use any of the signs, but what's being done in the situation you're talking about stinks to high heaven and it's all our tax dollars involved!

Who says the best interests of the girls who cheer are not being met? One side of this situation has been represented in this thread. Most of what has been written is faulty information. The administrators at JCHS do care and have tried to give their students choices.

[cheergirl]

Three squads is not a good idea at all. Have a black squad for boys and a gold squad for girls and rotate the football games. Then let the sponsors pick the competition that they want to send there squad to. Make both compete against each other in KAPOS and everything!!!

Title 9 and KHSAA will not allow this.