[64SUR]

Riutg just keep running the ball up the middle.the opposing team will just play the run on defense.I just think some passing play would spead the defense an this is all I'm going to say on this subject. :igiveup::igiveup::igiveup: I just wonder what would have happen if Dalton Sizemore had play at Whitley. :football::football::football:

[panther nation]

I just wonder what would have happen if Dalton Sizemore had play at Whitley. :football::football::football:

If he was there Whitley could very well be the 1 team in the district, and have a real shot a region championship, and a run at the state. I think that he is that good with the right line and defense..

[RunItUpTheGut]

If he was there Whitley could very well be the 1 team in the district, and have a real shot a region championship, and a run at the state. I think that he is that good with the right line and defense..

It isnt the first time a good athlete has left the county.
We tend not to baby the kids so much nicker:

[RunItUpTheGut]

Riutg just keep running the ball up the middle.the opposing team will just play the run on defense.I just think some passing play would spead the defense an this is all I'm going to say on this subject. :igiveup::igiveup::igiveup: I just wonder what would have happen if Dalton Sizemore had play at Whitley. :football::football::football:

I dont know. To be honest im surprised hes still at Wburg.
The kids been to more schools in the last 6 or 7 years then Perry has recruiting vouchers.

[RunItUpTheGut]

First I think the offense ran at Williamsburg during coach Blacks reign was ran and developed by Coach Woods. The reason it did not work at Whitley was because they did not take the time to develop the skill position kids to run the system. I mean you can not take a receiver that has just blocked all his life and and a quarterback that has just handed the ball off all of his life and expect them to win the game for you the next year. It takes time to develop that system and that is what Coach Herron has done at Williamsburg. If you go to a flag football game at Williamsburg you see them throwing the ball. It is the same system from flag football all the way up to highschool, that is what I think separates a great football program from a mediocre program.

1. I believe you mean it was developed by Tony Franklin. While Black and Woods came up with there own tweaks to it, Wburg, along with schools like South Laurel lived off that system in the early 00's.

2. You are correct. It takes time to develop a system. HOWEVER, you know as well as i do, there are six different elementary schools in this county system with different 3rd/4th and 5th/6th grade coaches for each school, and there is no way you'll ever get those coaches to all agree to start implementing the system at an early age. It just wont happen. It would be difficult for them to all run the same plays when they play each other. Its the BIGGEST problem with Whitley feeder program. To much emphasis is put on beating each other than progressing the entire system as a whole.

3. There have been several schools, and still are, that run the ball consistently, with a heavy run offense that still dominate today. You dont have to pass the ball to win, IMO, you have to defend the pass to win. Its all about speed and sadly, you cant teach speed. Its the one thing this area lacks. While there are fast players, like Mills or Patrick for example, there is usually very little team speed.

[topnotch]

Ive seen it time and time again.
Some schools you just cant win at no matter how well youve done or who you are. Black brought in the same passing attack (that Herron learned from black) and tried to use it at Whitley. After posting a couple of 2-8 years, he switched to the option and won district, region, and went 12-2.

Its about what kind of kids youve got and what offense you can use with them. Good coaches figure that out. Most coaches around here have come to accept the fact that they can pass or they cant. Others dont know how to teach the passing game so they dont bother. Black had a passing machine while at Wburg, and Greers numbers there prove that. Herron still uses most of Blacks plays today with his own little tweaks to them.
With that said, my point is, even though he is a passing mastermind, he knows he cant do it at Whitley. Id love to see it, and we have kids who can throw and catch the ball, but its the other teams thats mor difficult to pull it off against and all you do is end up throwing picks.

Coach Black can't do it because he doesn't try, I like coach Black but, he has a losing record at Whitley because HE IS 1 dimensional period. I love your spirit and how you support WC but until he makes that change you will always be blaming it on the talent. Example they had as good of talent as any school in Kentucky( 2008 I think) they had Jamey LaBanion, Cody Jones the Powers ked, Elmer Patrick's boy Alex and one of the best lines anywhere. Alex Patrick left Williamsburg to be a receiver for coach black Alex gave up 1 year of elgibility just to play for his old coach. I heard it said Alex caught every ball thrown to him at whitley during the 2 years he was there. (All 6) Right now he has talent that is as good as any team in the area, 2 quarterbacks that would start for 95% of the teams in the Mountains Both can throw darts Luke Allen and Isadro he has a hell of a passing attack right now. I pull for them but it aint going to happen. RIUTG talent just don't show up you as a coach develop it. Get ready for the same old year.

[HDE]

If he was there Whitley could very well be the 1 team in the district, and have a real shot a region championship, and a run at the state. I think that he is that good with the right line and defense..

I don't know if quarterback was Whitley's problem last year, plus Sizemore has extremely good receivers at Williamsburg and a defense that gave up only seven points in the regional finals and still lost.

[HAROLD]

In Jewell and Corbin's defense, they couldn't help that the KHSAA put them in the districts that they were in. Regardless, going undefeated for 10 plus years in district is an accomplishment. Sure it was generally weak but at times they had some pretty tough squads. Corbin played with the hand they were dealt and did exactly what they were supposed to do to those teams. They beat the everloving hell out of them.

That being said, I think Corbin could have had a title or three during that stretch had they played a tougher district slate which helped prepared them. The talent was there, the competition which builds a team to be successful in the post season just wasn't.

[Crazycarrot]

Top Mountian Coaches.

[topnotch]

I dont know. To be honest im surprised hes still at Wburg.
The kids been to more schools in the last 6 or 7 years then Perry has recruiting vouchers.

I want to ask you a simple question riutg if you had a son who could throw the football as well as Dalton Sizemore, would you leave him in a situation where you know he would never realize his god given ability to throw the football or would you, if you were financially able move him where he would be able to enjoy what he loves to do, throw the football and win games?
Why would you put one of the best athletes in the state (Isedro) at quarterback where the use of this super athletic abilities are limited? You can take a slow fat sub par player and in a few days coach him on exactly how to hand off the football. Why would any youngster aspire to be a quarterback where they don't throw the ball it makes no sense anyone can hand off the ball? I admire a parent who is willing to sacrifice anything for his child. GO WHITLEY GO WILLIAMSBURG GO Corbin GO EASTERN KENTUCKY :Thumbs::Thumbs:

[johnnyd]

I want to ask you a simple question riutg if you had a son who could throw the football as well as Dalton Sizemore, would you leave him in a situation where you know he would never realize his god given ability to throw the football or would you, if you were financially able move him where he would be able to enjoy what he loves to do, throw the football and win games?
Why would you put one of the best athletes in the state (Isedro) at quarterback where the use of this super athletic abilities are limited? You can take a slow fat sub par player and in a few days coach him on exactly how to hand off the football. Why would any youngster aspire to be a quarterback where they don't throw the ball it makes no sense anyone can hand off the ball? I admire a parent who is willing to sacrifice anything for his child. GO WHITLEY GO WILLIAMSBURG GO Corbin GO EASTERN KENTUCKY :Thumbs::Thumbs:

I beg to differ. Used properly an athlete at QB can be deadly. Think about it he touches the ball on every play. If he is a good athlete then use his running ability like another running back. The QB position has evolved into something more than just a fat kid handing it off.

[footballfever]

I beg to differ. Used properly an athlete at QB can be deadly. Think about it he touches the ball on every play. If he is a good athlete then use his running ability like another running back. The QB position has evolved into something more than just a fat kid handing it off.

I agree. Whitley's offense is a true mid-line, triple option. The QB has to make split second reads and be a threat running the ball. Ysidro was the 2nd in rushing attempts, 3rd rushing yards and 2nd in TD's on the team last year.
I believe Whitley will have 2 QB's this year who are capable of running the offense.

[topnotch]

I beg to differ. Used properly an athlete at QB can be deadly. Think about it he touches the ball on every play. If he is a good athlete then use his running ability like another running back. The QB position has evolved into something more than just a fat kid handing it off.

I never said a quarterback was a fat kid, I said you could train or coach him to hand it off as well as anybody. I stick to my assesment if you don't agree, when did you know of the last time a good running QB that couldn't pass very well play college football. When any college recruits a qb what do they look at first. NO BRAINER when a coach is below 500 about every year,:biglmao: you can usually spot his weakness . Remember the old attage STUPID is doing the same thing the same way over and over again and somehow expecting a different result. Same thing in coaching Football:Sad04:

[RunItUpTheGut]

Coach Black can't do it because he doesn't try, I like coach Black but, he has a losing record at Whitley because HE IS 1 dimensional period. I love your spirit and how you support WC but until he makes that change you will always be blaming it on the talent. Example they had as good of talent as any school in Kentucky( 2008 I think) they had Jamey LaBanion, Cody Jones the Powers ked, Elmer Patrick's boy Alex and one of the best lines anywhere. Alex Patrick left Williamsburg to be a receiver for coach black Alex gave up 1 year of elgibility just to play for his old coach. I heard it said Alex caught every ball thrown to him at whitley during the 2 years he was there. (All 6) Right now he has talent that is as good as any team in the area, 2 quarterbacks that would start for 95% of the teams in the Mountains Both can throw darts Luke Allen and Isadro he has a hell of a passing attack right now. I pull for them but it aint going to happen. RIUTG talent just don't show up you as a coach develop it. Get ready for the same old year.

The 2008 team was one of the best to ever put on a uniform at the school, and was probably top 3 or 4 in talent to ever step on the field at Whitley, and to be honest the 09 team was just as good or better but had internal problems with misconduct leading to losses against Letcher, and then a bad play call against Pulaski in the playoffs. That team should have repeated as both district and region teams but didnt for reasons i wont discuss on here.
They still would have lost to Highlands, but they would have been there again.

Im not disagreeing with the fact that the passing game needs to be developed better at Whitley. But as i said before, you cant wait until a kid is in 8th or 9th grade before you start implementing the passing game, and you cant tell the 6 different elementary coaches what kind of plays to run.
Im happy with the option. It is my favorite type of offense by far. I wish we would have ran it instead of a power offense when i was in school. Ran correctly, and effieciently, it is the hardest offense for a high school defense to read and stop. You just dont see it that often. I thin you'll be surprised when you see Whitley using two QB's this year, and Woods will get the majority of the playing time IMO, while Ysidro will be used in the backfield and at linebacker more. You'll see passes gradually increase more over the next three years then you have ever seen at Whitley. AND, the reason Black didnt stick with the offense after the first two years is because he didnt have a QB. Bowman and Mccumbers were not throwing QB's. Not even close to it.

[RunItUpTheGut]

I want to ask you a simple question riutg if you had a son who could throw the football as well as Dalton Sizemore, would you leave him in a situation where you know he would never realize his god given ability to throw the football or would you, if you were financially able move him where he would be able to enjoy what he loves to do, throw the football and win games?
Why would you put one of the best athletes in the state (Isedro) at quarterback where the use of this super athletic abilities are limited? You can take a slow fat sub par player and in a few days coach him on exactly how to hand off the football. Why would any youngster aspire to be a quarterback where they don't throw the ball it makes no sense anyone can hand off the ball? I admire a parent who is willing to sacrifice anything for his child. GO WHITLEY GO WILLIAMSBURG GO Corbin GO EASTERN KENTUCKY :Thumbs::Thumbs:

1. I wouldnt move a kid to 4 different schools in a 5 or 6 year span. Maybe once at the most, but it would have to be a dire situation. Sizemore could have really helped this team. Yes, the kid has a cannon, but hes a stud runnung back to. He would have excelled in a triple option offense like Whitleys with his size and speed. It just wouldnt have got him the same college offers that the passing attack of Wburg will give him.

2. As i stated above, your going to see a change in Whitleys offense. You'll see Woods, who is fast, trying to decide a triple option play where he keeps it himself, give it to Mills, whos the fastest player in this area, or give it to Ysidro who can make plays happen out of nothing.
This offense will work. BEST part is, almost this entire team will return in 2014. I think by next year, they will be the favorites in this region. HC still has an edge on them this year.

[RunItUpTheGut]

I agree. Whitley's offense is a true mid-line, triple option. The QB has to make split second reads and be a threat running the ball. Ysidro was the 2nd in rushing attempts, 3rd rushing yards and 2nd in TD's on the team last year.
I believe Whitley will have 2 QB's this year who are capable of running the offense.

Spot on.
I think you'll see a lot of motion with toss sweeps being faked on way to Ysidro or Mills, while its brought back up the middle to the other one.

This team will have a lot of offensive weapons. Its the defense that needs work. I would love to see these offensive players play one way, but this defense would really have to step up. Maybe next year it can.

[64SUR]

I never said a quarterback was a fat kid, I said you could train or coach him to hand it off as well as anybody. I stick to my assesment if you don't agree, when did you know of the last time a good running QB that couldn't pass very well play college football. When any college recruits a qb what do they look at first. NO BRAINER when a coach is below 500 about every year,:biglmao: you can usually spot his weakness . Remember the old attage STUPID is doing the same thing the same way over and over again and somehow expecting a different result. Same thing in coaching Football:Sad04:

harlan county can run the ball they have a good record :runtouchd

[cherokee]

1. I wouldnt move a kid to 4 different schools in a 5 or 6 year span. Maybe once at the most, but it would have to be a dire situation. Sizemore could have really helped this team. Yes, the kid has a cannon, but hes a stud runnung back to. He would have excelled in a triple option offense like Whitleys with his size and speed. It just wouldnt have got him the same college offers that the passing attack of Wburg will give him.

2. As i stated above, your going to see a change in Whitleys offense. You'll see Woods, who is fast, trying to decide a triple option play where he keeps it himself, give it to Mills, whos the fastest player in this area, or give it to Ysidro who can make plays happen out of nothing.
This offense will work. BEST part is, almost this entire team will return in 2014. I think by next year, they will be the favorites in this region. HC still has an edge on them this year.

sizemore played his entire grade school and middle school career from the 3rd grade up in the Whitley County school system, Freshman year they moved to Letcher ( he never did enroll at Whitley County High School) so he could play for his uncle, then returned back at the end of the year and has played his entire high school career at williamsburg. I think if you add that up his family made 1 move,KHSAA has only had to clear him 1 time, they still live in Corbin in the same house they lived in since they came to the area. Regardless he is playing the game he loves, in a system that fits his talent, and more important they are winning. By the way gut I love how you talk about your skill positions in that offense, having 2 qb's and all those good running backs, it's plan and simple if you don't dominate the Offensive line that running game will never work

[RunItUpTheGut]

sizemore played his entire grade school and middle school career from the 3rd grade up in the Whitley County school system, Freshman year they moved to Letcher ( he never did enroll at Whitley County High School) so he could play for his uncle, then returned back at the end of the year and has played his entire high school career at williamsburg. I think if you add that up his family made 1 move,KHSAA has only had to clear him 1 time, they still live in Corbin in the same house they lived in since they came to the area. Regardless he is playing the game he loves, in a system that fits his talent, and more important they are winning. By the way gut I love how you talk about your skill positions in that offense, having 2 qb's and all those good running backs, it's plan and simple if you don't dominate the Offensive line that running game will never work

He also went to Corbin, did he not?
So four different schools of changing around?
If were going strictly by football, its foolish to act like he never was thought of as a high school player at Whitley. He played his eighth grade year at Whitley, then went to Letcher, and then Wburg. So yes, thats quite a few schools, and only transferring for athletics. That is the only reason. Had anybody cared enough to fought it, more than likely he would have set a year. IMHO, when he left Whitley, there was a good chance had he enrolled at Wburg, he would have set his frosh year because he didnt transfer until the new school year, so the change of address all the way to letcher made him eligible and then when the move back happened it was alright that he was at Wburg.
Either way, I, or no one else really cares. We wish nothing but the best for the young man and hope he continues to be recruited and has a successful college career.

As for the offensive line remark, i think that more or less common sense. Whitley returns quite a few lineman, and they will only get better.

[topnotch]

This thread was about mountain coaches. Jerry Herron should be in the top 4 Why?
News Journal Coach of the year 2006 and 2011. Kentucky football Coaches Acc Coach of the year 2000, 2010, 2011, 2012. District 5 Region 3 Coach of The Year 2007,2008, 2010, 2011,2012. S E K C Coach of the year2012. W Y M T Coach of the year 2011. 2012. Times Tribune Coach of the year 2002,2010, 2011, 2012. He has had 6 District Champions iin his 7 years. He has had 2 Region finals in his 7 years. He has a record of 56 wins which is 8 a year,. AT this stage in his career can any coach out there match this acomplishments. HIS RECORD SPEAKS FOR ITSELF

[cherokee]

He also went to Corbin, did he not?
So four different schools of changing around?
If were going strictly by football, its foolish to act like he never was thought of as a high school player at Whitley. He played his eighth grade year at Whitley, then went to Letcher, and then Wburg. So yes, thats quite a few schools, and only transferring for athletics. That is the only reason. Had anybody cared enough to fought it, more than likely he would have set a year. IMHO, when he left Whitley, there was a good chance had he enrolled at Wburg, he would have set his frosh year because he didnt transfer until the new school year, so the change of address all the way to letcher made him eligible and then when the move back happened it was alright that he was at Wburg.
Either way, I, or no one else really cares. We wish nothing but the best for the young man and hope he continues to be recruited and has a successful college career.
As for the offensive line remark, i think that more or less common sense. Whitley returns quite a few lineman, and they will only get better.

Boy you are ignorant, yeah Whitley recruited dalton right after his 2nd grade year at corbin:biglmao:
it's evident you are more ignorant about khsaa rules until you are enrolled into the 9th grade you can attend any high school you wish in Whitley county that includes Corbin and Williamsburg they have a receptacle agreement (many kids at oak grove attend corbin middle after the 6th grade)The right choice for dalton was made, the middle school class he played with at Whitley dominated everybody except bell and they played 2 nail bitting games the only difference that whitley group graduated last year with a losing record in their high school career and well you see what has happened with dalton. The reason nobody challenged was because they had nothing to challenge, and that administration had to many bonds with the sizemore's to start anything.

[School Admin.]

A good Coach doesn't necessarily mean the number of wins. Some schools do not and will not have the level of support or commitment as other schools that are successful year after year. When you talk about good coaches, Donnie Daniels from South Floyd comes to mind. Although he doesn't have the record of other Sucessful programs, he has consistently been pretty competitive at a school that has a lot of disadvantages. I know some people might think I'm nuts for saying this, but this the way I see it. Most anyone would be Sucessful at Highlands, Belfry, Beechwood, etc. The real coaching challenge is at a program that doesn't have a lot of support.

[Pirate1991#8]

A good Coach doesn't necessarily mean the number of wins. Some schools do not and will not have the level of support or commitment as other schools that are successful year after year. When you talk about good coaches, Donnie Daniels from South Floyd comes to mind. Although he doesn't have the record of other Sucessful programs, he has consistently been pretty competitive at a school that has a lot of disadvantages. I know some people might think I'm nuts for saying this, but this the way I see it. Most anyone would be Sucessful at Highlands, Belfry, Beechwood, etc. The real coaching challenge is at a program that doesn't have a lot of support.

I'm not saying Coach Daniels is a bad Coach at all, But in my opinion GREAT coaches can get that support.....

[RunItUpTheGut]

Boy you are ignorant, yeah Whitley recruited dalton right after his 2nd grade year at corbin:biglmao:
it's evident you are more ignorant about khsaa rules until you are enrolled into the 9th grade you can attend any high school you wish in Whitley county that includes Corbin and Williamsburg they have a receptacle agreement (many kids at oak grove attend corbin middle after the 6th grade)The right choice for dalton was made, the middle school class he played with at Whitley dominated everybody except bell and they played 2 nail bitting games the only difference that whitley group graduated last year with a losing record in their high school career and well you see what has happened with dalton. The reason nobody challenged was because they had nothing to challenge, and that administration had to many bonds with the sizemore's to start anything.

Whatever you say.
Im not going to debate with someone who has to resort to name calling because they dont have a clue.


Sad part is, you know im right. Other wise, you wouldnt get mad :Sad04:

[RunItUpTheGut]

This thread was about mountain coaches. Jerry Herron should be in the top 4 Why?
News Journal Coach of the year 2006 and 2011. Kentucky football Coaches Acc Coach of the year 2000, 2010, 2011, 2012. District 5 Region 3 Coach of The Year 2007,2008, 2010, 2011,2012. S E K C Coach of the year2012. W Y M T Coach of the year 2011. 2012. Times Tribune Coach of the year 2002,2010, 2011, 2012. He has had 6 District Champions iin his 7 years. He has had 2 Region finals in his 7 years. He has a record of 56 wins which is 8 a year,. AT this stage in his career can any coach out there match this acomplishments. HIS RECORD SPEAKS FOR ITSELF

Hes 0-2 in those games.
Thats why hes not mentioned.
The news journal and times tribune coach of the year awards mean nothing, its only between 6 or 7 coaches from the same area.


Flounder is a good coach, but it will be a while before hes a top ten type.
I wonder if Cherokee knows Herron went to Whitley before transferring to Wburg in high school too:biglmao:

[Newjacket]

Whatever you say.
Im not going to debate with someone who has to resort to name calling because they dont have a clue.


Sad part is, you know im right. Other wise, you wouldnt get mad :Sad04:

I don't know much about Sizemore's situation, but I know enough to know that no one knows more about it than Cherokee.

[johnnyd]

I never said a quarterback was a fat kid, I said you could train or coach him to hand it off as well as anybody. I stick to my assesment if you don't agree, when did you know of the last time a good running QB that couldn't pass very well play college football. When any college recruits a qb what do they look at first. NO BRAINER when a coach is below 500 about every year,:biglmao: you can usually spot his weakness . Remember the old attage STUPID is doing the same thing the same way over and over again and somehow expecting a different result. Same thing in coaching Football:Sad04:

Evidently we are finding out that Tebow can't throw, Colin Kline evidently couldn't throw. By your assessment David Klingler and Andre Ware should be pro football hall of famers. There's more to being a QB than just throwing the ball. I didn't say that a QB shouldn't be able to throw some. There are many different ways to skin a cat. There are kids every year that put up huge numbers as qb's that DON'T go to college. If you want to know the truth the first thing s college coach looks at when he recruits a QB is his grades and measurables.

[johnnyd]

I'm not saying Coach Daniels is a bad Coach at all, But in my opinion GREAT coaches can get that support.....

Easy to say if your school has tradition. Phillip Hayword would have never been thought of the way he is at Phelps or Jenkins.

[Pirate1991#8]

Easy to say if your school has tradition. Phillip Hayword would have never been thought of the way he is at Phelps or Jenkins.

Well sir you must have never sat down and had a conversation with Coach Haywood, the man can get the best out of any young man out there...He teaches you much more than the game of football....he teaches you how to be a winner in life....So yes i may be biased, but Coach Haywood could take over the worst team in the state and have them winning in just a short period...

[johnnyd]

Well sir you must have never sat down and had a conversation with Coach Haywood, the man can get the best out of any young man out there...He teaches you much more than the game of football....he teaches you how to be a winner in life....So yes i may be biased, but Coach Haywood could take over the worst team in the state and have them winning in just a short period...

I've sat down with many coaches that are on the same level as Haywood. They will all tell you that they were much better coaches when they had great players. You said winning. Donny Daniels as stated earlier has his team winning. How many titles would Belfry if their teams would have just consisted of players only from Pike County. Red Jacket, Matewan, Huntington have all been very good to Belfry if I recall. Belfry has distinct advantages to many of the other schools in Pike County.