[nky]

The left and Media in this country are pathetic. Few years ago Git mo, water boarding, Abu Ghraib, and a whole litany of other alleged rights violations were condemned as unamerican and inhumane.
Yet yesterday we hear this on US policy
[YOUTUBE="yea this is right"]4kFL1rnRiEM[/YOUTUBE]

So we can fire drones at US citizens suspected as terrorist with out due process or any other Constitutional guaranteed rights and the left and media is not outraged at this administration?

[nky]

http://openchannel.nbcnews.com/_news/201...icans?lite

A confidential Justice Department memo concludes that the U.S. government can order the killing of American citizens if they are believed to be “senior operational leaders” of al-Qaida or “an associated force” -- even if there is no intelligence indicating they are engaged in an active plot to attack the U.S.
The 16-page memo, a copy of which was obtained by NBC News, provides new details about the legal reasoning behind one of the Obama administration’s most secretive and controversial polices: its dramatically increased use of drone strikes against al-Qaida suspects abroad, including those aimed at American citizens, such as the September 2011 strike in Yemen that killed alleged al-Qaida operatives Anwar al-Awlaki and Samir Khan. Both were U.S. citizens who had never been indicted by the U.S. government nor charged with any crimes.

[RunItUpTheGut]

Ive come to accept the fact that i will live life, grow old, and die, all while watching the socialist democrats of this country and there media continue to it apart.
There will come a day when most people in this country would rather be dead than living.

[WideRight05]

^ Agreed.

[crazytaxidriver]

Ive come to accept the fact that i will live life, grow old, and die, all while watching the socialist democrats of this country and there media continue to it apart.
There will come a day when most people in this country would rather be dead than living.

Even if you don't believe it, pick up a bible and read some prophecy. Not revelation exactly but prophecy from the Old Testament. I've been hearing about this stuff since I was a kid. But I truly never thought I'd see it happen in my lifetime.

[TheRealThing]

Even if you don't believe it, pick up a bible and read some prophecy. Not revelation exactly but prophecy from the Old Testament. I've been hearing about this stuff since I was a kid. But I truly never thought I'd see it happen in my lifetime.

It is incredible, is it not? I mentioned in another thread that even though no man knows the hour or the day, that feeling I once had of having a certain amount of slack until He comes, has now departed. It's all unfolding right before our eyes. In this time when the end is drawing near, I am more impressed than ever, that every word, every vote, and every action defines us individually before our Savior. People now call for compromise on every hand. The opportunities avialable for His people to choose to stand with Him seem to be coming more and more often these days. And, folks that insist on holding the line are pooh-poohed as out of touch extremists. A badge I would gladly bear for the One who gave His life on the cross for us. :biggrin:

[TheRealThing]

The left and Media in this country are pathetic. Few years ago Git mo, water boarding, Abu Ghraib, and a whole litany of other alleged rights violations were condemned as unamerican and inhumane.
Yet yesterday we hear this on US policy
[YOUTUBE="yea this is right"]4kFL1rnRiEM[/YOUTUBE]

So we can fire drones at US citizens suspected as terrorist with out due process or any other Constitutional guaranteed rights and the left and media is not outraged at this administration?

LOL, the only thing this administration does better than running over the law, is the way they can justify, running over the law. :biglmao:

[RunItUpTheGut]

Even if you don't believe it, pick up a bible and read some prophecy. Not revelation exactly but prophecy from the Old Testament. I've been hearing about this stuff since I was a kid. But I truly never thought I'd see it happen in my lifetime.

Its a lot closer than most people think i believe....

[tvtimeout]

It is incredible, is it not? I mentioned in another thread that even though no man knows the hour or the day, that feeling I once had of having a certain amount of slack until He comes, has now departed. It's all unfolding right before our eyes. In this time when the end is drawing near, I am more impressed than ever, that every word, every vote, and every action defines us individually before our Savior. People now call for compromise on every hand. The opportunities avialable for His people to choose to stand with Him seem to be coming more and more often these days. And, folks that insist on holding the line are pooh-poohed as out of touch extremists. A badge I would gladly bear for the One who gave His life on the cross for us. :biggrin:

Excellent, so you are with me on taking care of the poor, the elderly, giving everything you own because you and I both believe in the book of Acts as the people sold everything that they owned ( expect for the two that tried to lie to the holy spirit!) and no one went with out. I am glad to see you stand brother!!!!

[tvtimeout]

Its a lot closer than most people think i believe....

I think it was closer than it was by the simple fact of time has passed since the Lord has walked with us, nearly 2000 years ago, (most people forget Jesus started his ministery at the age of 30 or close to that age anyway).

However, I would contend that human nature is the exact way it has always been, we can choose to do either good or evil at any moment. The difference that we have today is that the area of communication has so vastly improved.

Think about it in our own country or even in our own state. People from pike county hardly ever communiticated to anyone else outside the region when the state was founded and now look we have all kinds of Belfry fans reporting daily!!!

[TheRealThing]

Excellent, so you are with me on taking care of the poor, the elderly, giving everything you own because you and I both believe in the book of Acts as the people sold everything that they owned ( expect for the two that tried to lie to the holy spirit!) and no one went with out. I am glad to see you stand brother!!!!

Nope. You and I are light years apart brother. Here's what God has said about how we are to feed ourselves.

Genesis 3:19 (KJV)
19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

We are supposed to work unless we are physically incapable of doing so. This idea of giving the poor everything in life is a secular-humanistic concept and is not of God.

1 Timothy 5:8 (KJV)
8 But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.

------------------------------------------------------------

But as far as giving help to the poor, this is an example of God's provision. Notice the poor were still expected to get out and work for their food by gleaning out in the fields. It wasn't to be just handed to them.

Leviticus 19:10 (KJV)
10 And thou shalt not glean thy vineyard, neither shalt thou gather every grape of thy vineyard; thou shalt leave them for the poor and stranger: I am the LORD your God.


Leviticus 23:22 (KJV)
22 And when ye reap the harvest of your land, thou shalt not make clean riddance of the corners of thy field when thou reapest, neither shalt thou gather any gleaning of thy harvest: thou shalt leave them unto the poor, and to the stranger: I am the LORD your God.

[tvtimeout]

Nope. You and I are light years apart brother. Here's what God has said about how we are to feed ourselves.

Genesis 3:19 (KJV)
19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

We are supposed to work unless we are physically incapable of doing so. This idea of giving the poor everything in life is a secular-humanistic concept and is not of God.

1 Timothy 5:8 (KJV)
8 But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.

------------------------------------------------------------

But as far as giving help to the poor, this is an example of God's provision. Notice the poor were still expected to get out and work for their food by gleaning out in the fields. It wasn't to be just handed to them.

Leviticus 19:10 (KJV)
10 And thou shalt not glean thy vineyard, neither shalt thou gather every grape of thy vineyard; thou shalt leave them for the poor and stranger: I am the LORD your God.


Leviticus 23:22 (KJV)
22 And when ye reap the harvest of your land, thou shalt not make clean riddance of the corners of thy field when thou reapest, neither shalt thou gather any gleaning of thy harvest: thou shalt leave them unto the poor, and to the stranger: I am the LORD your God.

Wonderful verses!

Acts 4:32

All the believers were one in heart and mind. No one claimed that any of their possessions was their own, but they shared everything they had. 33 With great power the apostles continued to testify to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus. And God’s grace was so powerfully at work in them all 34 that there were no needy persons among them. For from time to time those who owned land or houses sold them, brought the money from the sales 35 and put it at the apostles’ feet, and it was distributed to anyone who had need.

36 Joseph, a Levite from Cyprus, whom the apostles called Barnabas (which means “son of encouragement”), 37 sold a field he owned and brought the money and put it at the apostles’ feet.

Mathew 6: 19
19 “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

A great warning!

Mathew 14:
15 As evening approached, the disciples came to him and said, “This is a remote place, and it’s already getting late. Send the crowds away, so they can go to the villages and buy themselves some food.”

16 Jesus replied, “They do not need to go away. You give them something to eat.”

17 “We have here only five loaves of bread and two fish,” they answered.

18 “Bring them here to me,” he said. 19 And he directed the people to sit down on the grass. Taking the five loaves and the two fish and looking up to heaven, he gave thanks and broke the loaves. Then he gave them to the disciples, and the disciples gave them to the people. 20 They all ate and were satisfied, and the disciples picked up twelve basketfuls of broken pieces that were left over. 21 The number of those who ate was about five thousand men, besides women and children.

I will follow the example of the Lord to give freely, to love kindly, to have mercy on others: for I myself am not worthy of such things, but the Lord sees fit to save my soul!

I am sorry that we are light years apart. I still wish you nothing but the best!

[TheRealThing]

Wonderful verses!

Acts 4:32

All the believers were one in heart and mind. No one claimed that any of their possessions was their own, but they shared everything they had. 33 With great power the apostles continued to testify to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus. And God’s grace was so powerfully at work in them all 34 that there were no needy persons among them. For from time to time those who owned land or houses sold them, brought the money from the sales 35 and put it at the apostles’ feet, and it was distributed to anyone who had need.

36 Joseph, a Levite from Cyprus, whom the apostles called Barnabas (which means “son of encouragement”), 37 sold a field he owned and brought the money and put it at the apostles’ feet.

Mathew 6: 19
19 “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

A great warning!

Mathew 14:
15 As evening approached, the disciples came to him and said, “This is a remote place, and it’s already getting late. Send the crowds away, so they can go to the villages and buy themselves some food.”

16 Jesus replied, “They do not need to go away. You give them something to eat.”

17 “We have here only five loaves of bread and two fish,” they answered.

18 “Bring them here to me,” he said. 19 And he directed the people to sit down on the grass. Taking the five loaves and the two fish and looking up to heaven, he gave thanks and broke the loaves. Then he gave them to the disciples, and the disciples gave them to the people. 20 They all ate and were satisfied, and the disciples picked up twelve basketfuls of broken pieces that were left over. 21 The number of those who ate was about five thousand men, besides women and children.

I will follow the example of the Lord to give freely, to love kindly, to have mercy on others: for I myself am not worthy of such things, but the Lord sees fit to save my soul!

I am sorry that we are light years apart. I still wish you nothing but the best!

Make that light-aeons apart, LOL.

[PaintsvilleTigerfan]

The Dormer Manhunt is a better example. If he was a white supremicist instead of a liberal democrat they would be all over it, instead they never mention his political affiliation

[SKINNYPIG]

Make that light-aeons apart, LOL.

The "poor and needy" do not include those that are lazy and have zero intentions to better themselves or family by the sweat of their brow. They suck the life from their communities and expect others to support them under any circumstance. It's a point some dodge every time this discussion comes up, dodged on purpose or by ignorance.

Any mature human that does not have a clue what personal responsibility is or has no drive to add that attribute deserves no gifts...from anyone.

I fully understand where you're coming from TRT and I'm certain you have no problem helping those in need.

Does this make me a hater?

[TheRealThing]

The "poor and needy" do not include those that are lazy and have zero intentions to better themselves or family by the sweat of their brow. They suck the life from their communities and expect others to support them under any circumstance. It's a point some dodge every time this discussion comes up, dodged on purpose or by ignorance.

Any mature human that does not have a clue what personal responsibility is or has no drive to add that attribute deserves no gifts...from anyone.

I fully understand where you're coming from TRT and I'm certain you have no problem helping those in need.

Does this make me a hater?

I would answer you with the following. You're not a hater, just a realist. One day every man will give an account of his life to The Almighty. Consider what God said to "righteous" Job, in the midst of his afflictions;

Job 38:1-3 (KJV)
1 Then the LORD answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said,
2 Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge?
3 Gird up now thy loins like a man; for I will demand of thee, and answer thou me.

God expects us to be responsible before Him and before the world in which we live. He knows every last thought we have ever had, or will ever have. Though the exact count is always in flux, He knows the exact number of hairs on our head at any second of the day. As is in evidence in the verse above, He expects men to act like men. Those that are faking disablilities or, are too lazy to work for their substance for what ever reason, aren't kidding God. He knows full well who can work and who cannot. All the bleeding hearts of the handout crowd think they are doing God's bidding by giving the masses unmerited gifts which, averages about $45,000 dollars a year for an average family. Nowhere in the scripture, have I ever seen a suggestion by our Lord to take care of the able bodied.

This link will take you to one of the greatest articles I have ever seen about the real state of affairs in the US when it comes to runaway welfare. And the author goes down the list of entitlements detailing how much money each family of four can expect to recieve via the handout process. He also takes the time to detail the misguided thinking that got us into this nightmare of runaway giveaways, in the first place. Trust me, it's well worth the read.
LINK--- http://www.thenewamerican.com/reviews/op...in-poverty

I am happy to help the poor. Even when I suspect the bum on the street will just go buy a pint of muscatel, I help anyway. He has to hear a sermon in a few seconds for it, but I help. The way I see it, he has enough trouble headed his way, without my judging him, or witholding help. The Lord was speaking of folks that have no recourse. Those who lack the physical ability to get out and go to work. And you made some excellent points that I happen to agree with. The vast majority of those on welfare are there by choice. Just as their defenders dodge calling out what should be their shame, by choice.

[Granny Bear]

Thank you for that link TRT. It was definately worth the read!!

Uncanny, isn't it? The total heath "benefit" for medicaid, etc. actually totals more than the poverty income line.

If you're considered a "hater" SKINNYPIG, I'm right there with you.

[tvtimeout]

Thank you for that link TRT. It was definately worth the read!!

Uncanny, isn't it? The total heath "benefit" for medicaid, etc. actually totals more than the poverty income line.

If you're considered a "hater" SKINNYPIG, I'm right there with you.

Who bills medicaid? ( This is a rhetorical question) We all know that government does not create wealth...just don't look at the Dr.'s!!!

[tvtimeout]

Thank you for that link TRT. It was definately worth the read!!

Uncanny, isn't it? The total heath "benefit" for medicaid, etc. actually totals more than the poverty income line.

If you're considered a "hater" SKINNYPIG, I'm right there with you.

No one thinks anyone is a "hater", how could that be I mean people will quote old testiment books!

I think it is interesting if people would like at history and the reasons for such programs, many people believe that it is the church's responsibility to take care of the poor.

How did the church lose this responsibility? What would happen if we did not have the safety nets that we have today? What would happen to the people, how about the people in your local economy that makes money off of these people?

The truth is your communities are so entangled that you do not even know it. The dr's, lawyers, dentists, any merchant that takes any money from these people, the teachers, nurses...what would happen to these people?

It is my view that if you take away something like the safety nets, it would have such reprecutions, some have never really considered.

[Granny Bear]

No one thinks anyone is a "hater", how could that be I mean people will quote old testiment books!

To be honest, that wasn't directed entirely at you from my perspective; however, some of the best haters I've ever seen could quote the Bible very well.


I think it is interesting if people would like at history and the reasons for such programs, many people believe that it is the church's responsibility to take care of the poor.
How did the church lose this responsibility?

IMO the church didn't lose this responsibility.


What would happen if we did not have the safety nets that we have today? What would happen to the people, how about the people in your local economy that makes money off of these people?

The truth is your communities are so entangled that you do not even know it. The dr's, lawyers, dentists, any merchant that takes any money from these people, the teachers, nurses...what would happen to these people?

It is my view that if you take away something like the safety nets, it would have such reprecutions, some have never really considered.

I believe you have a valid point....TO a point. Greed and down right laziness has muddled the picture and any true definition of pubic assistance.

[TheRealThing]

No one thinks anyone is a "hater", how could that be I mean people will quote old testiment books!

I think it is interesting if people would like at history and the reasons for such programs, many people believe that it is the church's responsibility to take care of the poor.

How did the church lose this responsibility? What would happen if we did not have the safety nets that we have today? What would happen to the people, how about the people in your local economy that makes money off of these people?

The truth is your communities are so entangled that you do not even know it. The dr's, lawyers, dentists, any merchant that takes any money from these people, the teachers, nurses...what would happen to these people?

It is my view that if you take away something like the safety nets, it would have such reprecutions, some have never really considered.

I don't remember ever having, not even one time, read on here that anybody was opposed to the safety net. If you don't want to read the article, or can't grasp it's message just say so. The author has really done his homework, published the cold hard facts and broken down how much each entitlement is worth for the average family. Which, works out to whopping forty five thousand dollars a year. That amount of help for perpituity ain't no safety net. It's a taxpayer funded, party for life.

Now, if you want to look at history as it actually unfolded when the state, (Lyndon Johnson) usurped the ministry of the church and began the "great society" initiatives, it is all in the article. And, BTW, if your church wants to help people, I guarantee, there is way more need out there than you all could ever come close to filling. Welfare laws or no welfare laws, the sky's the limit and nobody is stopping you.

[TheRealThing]

Thank you for that link TRT. It was definately worth the read!!

Uncanny, isn't it? The total heath "benefit" for medicaid, etc. actually totals more than the poverty income line.

If you're considered a "hater" SKINNYPIG, I'm right there with you.

Yes it absolutely is. SKINNYPIG completely nailed it when he mentioned that liberals, and those in favor of the unlimited ride on the gravy train, choose to miss the moral misapplication of the idea of helping folks the way we do it in America. Helping people get back on their feet or catching them before they fall as the result of something like the sudden loss of employment is consistent with the idea of American behavior. But, this idea of perpetuating a voting base on the premise that democrats will ensure their loyal voters vast entitlements is decidedly un-American.

Like it or not, they can base it on liberalism, or secular humanism, or social justice but, it certainly is not consistent with the scriptures.

[tvtimeout]

I don't remember ever having, not even one time, read on here that anybody was opposed to the safety net. If you don't want to read the article, or can't grasp it's message just say so. The author has really done his homework, published the cold hard facts and broken down how much each entitlement is worth for the average family. Which, works out to whopping forty five thousand dollars a year. That amount of help for perpituity ain't no safety net. It's a taxpayer funded, party for life.

Now, if you want to look at history as it actually unfolded when the state, (Lyndon Johnson) usurped the ministry of the church and began the "great society" initiatives, it is all in the article. And, BTW, if your church wants to help people, I guarantee, there is way more need out there than you all could ever come close to filling. Welfare laws or no welfare laws, the sky's the limit and nobody is stopping you.

I have not had the time to read it yet. So let me get this straight, anyone on entitlments makes $45,000 dollars a year, because of all the benefits, is the guys arguement. Wow, SEKY is one of the richest places on earth, I mean the lowest amount anyone is going to make is $45,000 a year. Goodness, I guess we really are blessed! I can not wait to read the article, because as you say it is nothing but facts and no opinions in it what so ever. I believe you and thankyou for putting this article out there. By this logic alone I should be able to appeal to a real resturant chain since the base income is $45,000. Alot more eatting places! Yes!!!!

Lyndon Johnson response was adequete. Have you read Night Comes to the Cumberlands?

I agree there is a lot more work to be done. right now we feed 85 families a month, clothe, and provide a safe place for their children to go to on Wednesday night.

[tvtimeout]

Yes it absolutely is. SKINNYPIG completely nailed it when he mentioned that liberals, and those in favor of the unlimited ride on the gravy train, choose to miss the moral misapplication of the idea of helping folks the way we do it in America. Helping people get back on their feet or catching them before they fall as the result of something like the sudden loss of employment is consistent with the idea of American behavior. But, this idea of perpetuating a voting base on the premise that democrats will ensure their loyal voters vast entitlements is decidedly un-American.

Like it or not, they can base it on liberalism, or secular humanism, or social justice but, it certainly is not consistent with the scriptures.

Of course the money coming in to run the campaigns on the right dont want anything in return, like the RENNS credits or anything like that would they? They just want to return it to the fabled good old american image that you have constructed in your mind.

[TheRealThing]

I have not had the time to read it yet. So let me get this straight, anyone on entitlments makes $45,000 dollars a year, because of all the benefits, is the guys arguement. Wow, SEKY is one of the richest places on earth, I mean the lowest amount anyone is going to make is $45,000 a year. Goodness, I guess we really are blessed! I can not wait to read the article, because as you say it is nothing but facts and no opinions in it what so ever. I believe you and thankyou for putting this article out there. By this logic alone I should be able to appeal to a real resturant chain since the base income is $45,000. Alot more eatting places! Yes!!!!

Lyndon Johnson response was adequete. Have you read Night Comes to the Cumberlands?

I agree there is a lot more work to be done. right now we feed 85 families a month, clothe, and provide a safe place for their children to go to on Wednesday night.

LOL. You didn't bother to read the link and yet you have felt compelled to comment on it three times so far? If and after you read the article, maybe then some of your comments and questions may make some sense to me. I realize Appalachia is a depressed area and always has been. Obama hasn't helped their situation any with his policy to eliminate the usage of fossil fuels and coal in particular. Or are your a solid supporter of his energy policies too?

[TheRealThing]

Of course the money coming in to run the campaigns on the right dont want anything in return, like the RENNS credits or anything like that would they? They just want to return it to the fabled good old american image that you have constructed in your mind.

Thanks, but if it's all the same to you, I would prefer to seek psychoanalysis from somebody who has it together just a little better. :biggrin:

[vundy33]

Terrorists, American or not, should be targeted and killed if they are actively working to kill us all. Simple as that.

I see what you mean though for sure.

[vundy33]

All trying to bring them in and give them due process does is put good Americans, ya know the non-terrorists, lives at risk. If its possible, do it. If not, don't. Anwar Al-Awlaki comes to mind. We would've loved to bring him in alive but it just wasn't possible without a very high risk operation.

[nky]

But with out Due Process or other safe guards who to say a person is to be labeled a "terrorist"

[nky]

By the way this Executive order comes from our President who won a Nobel Peace prize for his potential anticipated activities. Makes you wonder if this is what Alfred Nobel had in mind