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08-25-2011, 10:06 PM
SOOO many schools of thought on this issue.
Was it Lee Harvey Oswald? Was the United States Government involved? Was the Soviet government involved? Was L.H.O. simply crazy or was he coerced? Was there an elaborate cover-up? Did it happen exactly as it was told to the citizens of the US?
Was it Lee Harvey Oswald? Was the United States Government involved? Was the Soviet government involved? Was L.H.O. simply crazy or was he coerced? Was there an elaborate cover-up? Did it happen exactly as it was told to the citizens of the US?
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08-25-2011, 10:08 PM
Obama Administration. HAD TO BE!
08-25-2011, 10:58 PM
No Conspiracy, LHO acted alone.
08-30-2011, 09:54 AM
I've read a lot about the conspiracy theories presented about President Kennedy. I find it extremely interesting and very captivating.
From what I gather, there are three main theories.
1) Mob Hit
Sam Giancana aided the Kennedy family during election times in the Chicago area. He had a lot of connections outside America, too. He was just a really popular guy. Joseph Kennedy allegedly paid him for his influence in these elections. I have read that some folks said that President Kennedy met Marilyn Monroe at Giancana's house. Talk about combining work and play!! She was allegedly at this guy's house earlier on the night that she died. First Sam, then Bobby! But that's a whole 'nother conspiracy. Sam Giancana was scheduled to testify before the U.S. Senate Committee regarding the CIA and Cosa Nostra Collusions in their plots to assassinate President Kennedy in late June of 1975. Someone shot his brains out while he was cooking dinner on June 19, 1975. Not sure I believe in coincidences.
2) Bay of Pigs
There's wayyyy to much to go into here but suffice it to say that when you attempt to assassinate Fidel Castro, you could make a few enemies along the way. Not that Kennedy needed any more enemies. That project was as leaky as a sieve!! On April 13, 1961 radios behind the Iron Curtain broadcasted that there would be an invasion of Cuba by Kennedy within one week. Bay of Pigs initiated 4 days later. Even the Washington Post reported, finally, in April 2000 that the Soviets knew the very date of the invasion.
3) Lyndon B Johnson
This was always a "theory", but frankly it was my least favorite. It has; however, became a little more interesting as of late. Caroline Kennedy made a deal with the History Channel to not broadcast The Kennedys Miniseries. (really made Katie Holmes mad!!) Anyway, part of this deal was to release recordings that her mother had made with Arthur Schlesinger, Jr. shortly after Kennedy was assassinated. They were supposed to remain sealed for fifty years after Jackie O's death. Well Caroline gave them up to stop the History Channel from carrying that miniseries. Interesting..check it out.
http://video.foxnews.com/v/1099496833001...jfks-death
One thing about this idea that has always intrigued me is that Lady Bird Johnson’s family was closely tied to Bell helicopters. When Kennedy decided to down scale the activity that the United States had in Vietnam, those helicopter orders plummeted. I distinctly remember a question asked of Lyndon B Johnson from a reporter about the negative impact the de-escalation had on the cash flow from the sale of the helicopters. It was purportedly in the billions of dollars. He never answered that question directly.
As the JFK movie said, “Follow the money trail”…….
From what I gather, there are three main theories.
1) Mob Hit
Sam Giancana aided the Kennedy family during election times in the Chicago area. He had a lot of connections outside America, too. He was just a really popular guy. Joseph Kennedy allegedly paid him for his influence in these elections. I have read that some folks said that President Kennedy met Marilyn Monroe at Giancana's house. Talk about combining work and play!! She was allegedly at this guy's house earlier on the night that she died. First Sam, then Bobby! But that's a whole 'nother conspiracy. Sam Giancana was scheduled to testify before the U.S. Senate Committee regarding the CIA and Cosa Nostra Collusions in their plots to assassinate President Kennedy in late June of 1975. Someone shot his brains out while he was cooking dinner on June 19, 1975. Not sure I believe in coincidences.
2) Bay of Pigs
There's wayyyy to much to go into here but suffice it to say that when you attempt to assassinate Fidel Castro, you could make a few enemies along the way. Not that Kennedy needed any more enemies. That project was as leaky as a sieve!! On April 13, 1961 radios behind the Iron Curtain broadcasted that there would be an invasion of Cuba by Kennedy within one week. Bay of Pigs initiated 4 days later. Even the Washington Post reported, finally, in April 2000 that the Soviets knew the very date of the invasion.
3) Lyndon B Johnson
This was always a "theory", but frankly it was my least favorite. It has; however, became a little more interesting as of late. Caroline Kennedy made a deal with the History Channel to not broadcast The Kennedys Miniseries. (really made Katie Holmes mad!!) Anyway, part of this deal was to release recordings that her mother had made with Arthur Schlesinger, Jr. shortly after Kennedy was assassinated. They were supposed to remain sealed for fifty years after Jackie O's death. Well Caroline gave them up to stop the History Channel from carrying that miniseries. Interesting..check it out.
http://video.foxnews.com/v/1099496833001...jfks-death
One thing about this idea that has always intrigued me is that Lady Bird Johnson’s family was closely tied to Bell helicopters. When Kennedy decided to down scale the activity that the United States had in Vietnam, those helicopter orders plummeted. I distinctly remember a question asked of Lyndon B Johnson from a reporter about the negative impact the de-escalation had on the cash flow from the sale of the helicopters. It was purportedly in the billions of dollars. He never answered that question directly.
As the JFK movie said, “Follow the money trail”…….
09-01-2011, 07:32 PM
Read the book by Vincent Bugliosi, "Reclaiming History: The Assassination Of President John F. Kennedy (2007)". It is well researched and is over 1600 pages, so it's a long read but well worth the effort.
His book examines the JFK assassination in detail and his findings matched those of the Warren Commission's final report, which concluded that Lee Harvey Oswald had acted alone in the assassination of the 35th President.
The title, "Reclaiming History", derived from his belief that history of the Kennedy assassination has been hijcked by conspiracy theories. He stated, "Unless the fraud is finally exposed, the word 'believed' will be forgotten by future generations and John F. Kennedy will unquestionably become the victim of a conspiracy. Belief will have become unchallenged fact, and the faith of the American people in their institutions further eroded. If that is allowed to happen, Lee Harvey Oswald, a man who hated his country and everything for which it stands, will have triumphed even beyond his intent on that fateful day in November."
Author Gerald Posner, who wrote "Case Closed" (1993) about the JFK assassination states:
"Time and technology have caught up with the conspiracy theorist. Some of their most important contentions have collasped. For example: Photographic test reveal that the backyard photos of Oswald holding his weapons, contested as fakes, are authentic; ballistics and computer studies confirm the so-called magic bullet theory, long derided by consiracy theorist as impossible; and neuron activation test provide the final link that Oswald tried to assassinate General Edwin Walker, a crime for which many considered Oswald innocent. After years of studying the case the critics have failed to produce a single, cogent, alternate scenario of how the alleged conspiracy happened or who was involved.
There is more than enough evidence available on the record to draw conclusions about what happened in the JFK assassination. But apparently most Americans, despite the strength of the evidence, do not want to except the notion that random acts of violence can change the course of history and that Lee harvey Oswald could affect our lives in a way over which we have no control. It is unsettling to think that a sociopathic twenty-four year old loser in life, armed with a $12 rifle and consumed by his own warped motivation, ended Camelot. But with readers willing to approach the subject with an open mind, it is the only rational judgement."
His book examines the JFK assassination in detail and his findings matched those of the Warren Commission's final report, which concluded that Lee Harvey Oswald had acted alone in the assassination of the 35th President.
The title, "Reclaiming History", derived from his belief that history of the Kennedy assassination has been hijcked by conspiracy theories. He stated, "Unless the fraud is finally exposed, the word 'believed' will be forgotten by future generations and John F. Kennedy will unquestionably become the victim of a conspiracy. Belief will have become unchallenged fact, and the faith of the American people in their institutions further eroded. If that is allowed to happen, Lee Harvey Oswald, a man who hated his country and everything for which it stands, will have triumphed even beyond his intent on that fateful day in November."
Author Gerald Posner, who wrote "Case Closed" (1993) about the JFK assassination states:
"Time and technology have caught up with the conspiracy theorist. Some of their most important contentions have collasped. For example: Photographic test reveal that the backyard photos of Oswald holding his weapons, contested as fakes, are authentic; ballistics and computer studies confirm the so-called magic bullet theory, long derided by consiracy theorist as impossible; and neuron activation test provide the final link that Oswald tried to assassinate General Edwin Walker, a crime for which many considered Oswald innocent. After years of studying the case the critics have failed to produce a single, cogent, alternate scenario of how the alleged conspiracy happened or who was involved.
There is more than enough evidence available on the record to draw conclusions about what happened in the JFK assassination. But apparently most Americans, despite the strength of the evidence, do not want to except the notion that random acts of violence can change the course of history and that Lee harvey Oswald could affect our lives in a way over which we have no control. It is unsettling to think that a sociopathic twenty-four year old loser in life, armed with a $12 rifle and consumed by his own warped motivation, ended Camelot. But with readers willing to approach the subject with an open mind, it is the only rational judgement."
09-01-2011, 11:20 PM
I've read both books. Reclaiming History: The Assassination of President John F Kennedy was the better of the two. I found Case Closed a somewhat dubious in the research that was done/not done. I also read a version of the Warren Commission Report; albeit an abbreviated one. I've read a few other sources on the subject.
One thing that no none addresses to my satisfaction are the "coincidences" involved in the case; and there are many. I don't want to write pages here and get into great detail, but who loses a President's brain? Or alters the exit/entrance wound of the fatal shot during autopsy?
I do believe that Lee Harvey Oswald was the killer, but I also think he was part of a larger conspiracy that perhaps even he didn't know the degree to which it spread. Certainly I cannot prove anything, but I really enjoy reading about it and thinking about it.
One thing that no none addresses to my satisfaction are the "coincidences" involved in the case; and there are many. I don't want to write pages here and get into great detail, but who loses a President's brain? Or alters the exit/entrance wound of the fatal shot during autopsy?
I do believe that Lee Harvey Oswald was the killer, but I also think he was part of a larger conspiracy that perhaps even he didn't know the degree to which it spread. Certainly I cannot prove anything, but I really enjoy reading about it and thinking about it.
09-02-2011, 12:54 PM
Granny Bear Wrote:I've read both books. Reclaiming History: The Assassination of President John F Kennedy was the better of the two. I found Case Closed a somewhat dubious in the research that was done/not done. I also read a version of the Warren Commission Report; albeit an abbreviated one. I've read a few other sources on the subject.
One thing that no none addresses to my satisfaction are the "coincidences" involved in the case; and there are many. I don't want to write pages here and get into great detail, but who loses a President's brain? Or alters the exit/entrance wound of the fatal shot during autopsy?
I do believe that Lee Harvey Oswald was the killer, but I also think he was part of a larger conspiracy that perhaps even he didn't know the degree to which it spread. Certainly I cannot prove anything, but I really enjoy reading about it and thinking about it.
It's been 3 years since I read "Reclaiming History", but I believe he addresses the questions you have here.
Bugliosi won a mock re-trial of the JFK assassination case in 1986. It was held in London with famed attorney Gerry Spence representing the conspiracy side and Bugliosi taking the side of Oswald as the lone gunman. The British jury ruled in favor of Bugliosi, who by the way, was the attorney who prosecuted Charles Manson.
The book written by Posner, also an attorney, started out as a book about a conspiracy. But Posner said as he got further and further into his research he saw that it was obvious that there wasn't a conspiracy, so he switched gears and wrote "Case Closed" about Oswald as a lone gunman.
The JFK conspiracy angle will always be out there. There's no stopping it. Why??? Because it sales books and makes money for those who keep it in the news. I've read some of Mark Lane's books. I don't even believe he believed himself what he was writing was true. But it made him a good living in book sales and the lecture circuit.
09-02-2011, 01:34 PM
LOOKAYANNER Wrote:It's been 3 years since I read "Reclaiming History", but I believe he addresses the questions you have here.
Bugliosi won a mock re-trial of the JFK assassination case in 1986. It was held in London with famed attorney Gerry Spence representing the conspiracy side and Bugliosi taking the side of Oswald as the lone gunman. The British jury ruled in favor of Bugliosi, who by the way, was the attorney who prosecuted Charles Manson.
The book written by Posner, also an attorney, started out as a book about a conspiracy. But Posner said as he got further and further into his research he saw that it was obvious that there wasn't a conspiracy, so he switched gears and wrote "Case Closed" about Oswald as a lone gunman.
The JFK conspiracy angle will always be out there. There's no stopping it. Why??? Because it sales books and makes money for those who keep it in the news. I've read some of Mark Lane's books. I don't even believe he believed himself what he was writing was true. But it made him a good living in book sales and the lecture circuit.
It's been about three years for me as well.
As far as Posner is concerned, I believe you have proven my point. Instead of researching and presenting his facts, he became convinced of something he believed as "fact", and presented his "opinion" of his research rather than the results of his research. In the later, one can read that and come to their own conclusion. It became apparent that he was trying to prove his case toward the later part of that book.
I do remember the trial with Spence and Bugliosi. Spence was busy promoting his, then brand new, cedar log home and threatening to stop Bugliosi's watch during proceedings. It was a little contrived for me.
As far as the conspiracy theorists are concerned I also agree with you. Money and fame will lend themselves to the conspiracy theme. But, as I stated above, I like to research myself and come to my own conclusion. I think it's dangerous to be spoon fed by the media and politicians of any party. Money and fame has leaked into those positions far more than any conspiracy theorists.
09-03-2011, 02:49 PM
Granny Bear Wrote:It's been about three years for me as well.The last paragraph is very true.
As far as Posner is concerned, I believe you have proven my point. Instead of researching and presenting his facts, he became convinced of something he believed as "fact", and presented his "opinion" of his research rather than the results of his research. In the later, one can read that and come to their own conclusion. It became apparent that he was trying to prove his case toward the later part of that book.
I do remember the trial with Spence and Bugliosi. Spence was busy promoting his, then brand new, cedar log home and threatening to stop Bugliosi's watch during proceedings. It was a little contrived for me.
As far as the conspiracy theorists are concerned I also agree with you. Money and fame will lend themselves to the conspiracy theme. But, as I stated above, I like to research myself and come to my own conclusion. I think it's dangerous to be spoon fed by the media and politicians of any party. Money and fame has leaked into those positions far more than any conspiracy theorists.
Have you ever been to Dealey Plaza. I was there back in the 1980's. It is very interesting and facinating place for a history buff. When I was there they were just starting the museum.
I believe most historians now conclude that Oswald shot JFK from the sixth floor of the Depository building. All the new technology and investigative science points to the shots coming only from the direction of the sixth floor. Bugliosi and Posner both covered this in detail. Kennedy and Connelly were both struck by the same bullet. Connelly was sitting below and to the left of Kennedy in a jump seat, and the trajectory line can be traced backwards from Connlley, through Kennedy, and straight back up to the sixth floor where Oswald was.
09-03-2011, 05:52 PM
LOOKAYANNER Wrote:The last paragraph is very true.
Have you ever been to Dealey Plaza. I was there back in the 1980's. It is very interesting and facinating place for a history buff. When I was there they were just starting the museum.
I believe most historians now conclude that Oswald shot JFK from the sixth floor of the Depository building. All the new technology and investigative science points to the shots coming only from the direction of the sixth floor. Bugliosi and Posner both covered this in detail. Kennedy and Connelly were both struck by the same bullet. Connelly was sitting below and to the left of Kennedy in a jump seat, and the trajectory line can be traced backwards from Connlley, through Kennedy, and straight back up to the sixth floor where Oswald was.
My husband and I visited Dealey Plaza in the late 80s. I will tell you that that visit dramatically and surprisingly effected me. We weren't attempting to "recreate" the crime, but my husband stood where McGruder did his filming, I climbed behind the fence to see the angle of a possible second gunman and we both stood directly over the "X" in the middle of the road. Like I said, I was very surprised that it effected me like it did.
We spent so much time there that darkness fell before we were actually aware of the time. Our hotel was across the tracks from Dealey and we had to walk back. It was actually a little spooky; we opted to walk much further around to the hotel rather than go under the underpass where Kennedy's car had fled.
I was also surprised at the massive amount of room and trains that were just below the fence...you know where the "policeman" was purported to have been. This isn't evidencary, but I'm telling you I could've hid an elephant for a few minutes down there AND slipped him in a box car!!!
09-20-2011, 08:15 AM
Hey LOOKAYANNER!!
Just received my book that I had pre-ordered from amazon that was released 09/15. You know, Jackie O's interview with Schlesinger...
Anyway, it came with 8 CDs, copies of the original interview!! I can't wait to this weekend. I may post more...
inglepar
Just received my book that I had pre-ordered from amazon that was released 09/15. You know, Jackie O's interview with Schlesinger...
Anyway, it came with 8 CDs, copies of the original interview!! I can't wait to this weekend. I may post more...
inglepar
09-20-2011, 11:02 PM
Granny Bear Wrote:Hey LOOKAYANNER!!
Just received my book that I had pre-ordered from amazon that was released 09/15. You know, Jackie O's interview with Schlesinger...
Anyway, it came with 8 CDs, copies of the original interview!! I can't wait to this weekend. I may post more...
Great!!! :Thumbs:
I've seen some reports about it on the news channels. She said a few things about the French that weren't very flattering.
09-22-2011, 07:56 AM
Not to mention King, LBJ and Marilyn!!
10-04-2011, 08:23 PM
I have 3 guesses.
1. John Lennon
2. Mick Jagger
3. Forrest Gump
1. John Lennon
2. Mick Jagger
3. Forrest Gump
10-05-2011, 11:15 AM
RunItUpTheGut Wrote:I have 3 guesses.
1. John Lennon
2. Mick Jagger
3. Forrest Gump
The nic "Granny Bear" is literal, Gut...I'm getting old. You'll have to explain your relevance, so's I can better respond.
10-09-2011, 06:07 AM
Granny Bear Wrote:The nic "Granny Bear" is literal, Gut...I'm getting old. You'll have to explain your relevance, so's I can better respond.
lol
Well John Lennon because the Beatles were bad news and everyone knows if it wasnt for there music, we'd still live like we did in the 50's which was a better place.
Mick Jagger has done so many wierd things that its possible, plus hes 227 years old meaning he probably killed lincoln as well.
And Forrest Gump because, well, lets face it, that boy just aint right.
10-10-2011, 09:40 AM
RunItUpTheGut Wrote:lol
Well John Lennon because the Beatles were bad news and everyone knows if it wasnt for there music, we'd still live like we did in the 50's which was a better place.
Mick Jagger has done so many wierd things that its possible, plus hes 227 years old meaning he probably killed lincoln as well.
And Forrest Gump because, well, lets face it, that boy just aint right.
1 - The 50s WERE a better place, but the 60s were better!!
2 - Mick Jagger has had so much "work" done that his butt has now stretched to the back of his head.
3 - Forest Gump - Agreed!!
And that's all I have to say about that......
10-28-2011, 02:41 PM
Weren't the Watchmen behind it. I thought 'The Comedian' acted alone.:blabbermo
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