[snipes8]

Only signal spygate Im aware of is when a teams staff came to watch a Lex Cath game the week before to scout. As everyones conversations indicate...coming to a game and taking notes is a standard practice and legit. But this team had a parent behind the lex team calling signals made up to the scouting coaches. Is that legit?????? Thats up for discussion?????

Just have to defend the knights.....having been on the outside looking in before its easy to put a bulls eye on them because they are a private school and have had success.

[barrel]

We have a very good relationship with Lex Cath. Trade film on common opponents and scouting reports. They picked up our signals through scouting. I never bad mouthed them or said they were wrong. Never called it a spygate or anything. Never said they went to some crazy extreme. I just stated they have done it and how we handled it.

Old Henry Man: With no film exhange policy to force teams to exchange and the fact not all teams film their games. There is not much of an issue filimg games. HS and above is a completely different thing.

[Blues]

Henry Co is not crying over the filming of the Western game.
But it is a ethic question.

What's so unethical about it? Just run your play and Lex Cath still has to stop it. Scouting is part of the game brother. Through filming or writing things down on paper.

[barrel]

I think Old Henry Man is appling High School POV to MS and they are two different animals. In HS they would greatly frown upon it and it might even be against the rules. MS is a different animal.

Now videoing the sidelines for signals and a few things like that are different no matter what level it is on.

And for the record Lex Cath did not do that in my stated case. They just picked up on the signals.

[KnightTime]

If a coach is scouting a team they are going to play, what is wrong with picking up on signals? I don't see that as unethical at all. IMHO, filming an opponent without consent is a much bigger problem.

[barrel]

Maybe I feel this way because I feel like I am just repeating myself over an dover and no one is listening. So let me put this in a step by step breakdown.

1) Lex Cath Scouted us
2) Lex Cath figure out our hand signals while scouting. As far as I know they were not using video equipment to capture the signals. I am not sure if they even video taped us.
3) Our first drive they called out the location of the play and the back carring the ball.
4) We fixed it

No where have I said that it was unethical. I believe videoing the sideline for the purpose of stealing signals is a completely different thing or making sure the game footage is wide enough so you can do it is a different issue.

Now video without permission on the MS level is a different thing I think. We have no film exchange past coaches just helping each other out. Of course you ask around enough there is going to be a school that is more than willing to give you film or a scouting report. Not going to lie but Henry Co got their scouting report for Lex Cath from me. I know Lex Cath would give a scouting report out on us and it is nothing personal. Because of th enature of MS football you have to make due. Some of it would be bushleague in HS and of course there is some bushleague stuff that goes on in MS.

[knighted]

Maybe I feel this way because I feel like I am just repeating myself over an dover and no one is listening. So let me put this in a step by step breakdown.

1) Lex Cath Scouted us
2) Lex Cath figure out our hand signals while scouting. As far as I know they were not using video equipment to capture the signals. I am not sure if they even video taped us.
3) Our first drive they called out the location of the play and the back carring the ball.
4) We fixed it

No where have I said that it was unethical. I believe videoing the sideline for the purpose of stealing signals is a completely different thing or making sure the game footage is wide enough so you can do it is a different issue.

Now video without permission on the MS level is a different thing I think. We have no film exchange past coaches just helping each other out. Of course you ask around enough there is going to be a school that is more than willing to give you film or a scouting report. Not going to lie but Henry Co got their scouting report for Lex Cath from me. I know Lex Cath would give a scouting report out on us and it is nothing personal. Because of th enature of MS football you have to make due. Some of it would be bushleague in HS and of course there is some bushleague stuff that goes on in MS.

I also agrre with you barrel on the filming of signs. Not good. I also applaud tht you said you gave Henry the scouting repor on Lex Cath. Nothing wrong with that either. I think MS teams should all exchange films./ Actuall I personally think its fine to film your opponents game cause in MS you might not have a chance any other time or who's to say that when you exchange films that the opposing team might not give you a real game film and maybe give you a film taken from sideline level where you cant see anything useful. This happened to a team very recently but i'm not going to name any names.

The biggest question I have is what year did Lex Cath steal your signs? 2007?, 2008? 2009? I ask this because beside the western game no coach to my knowledge has been to another MS game unless it was the Grid-a-rama we had this year. If we stole them during the actual game then that's a great coaching effort by somebody.

[barrel]

2009. I know Mitchel along with maybe another coach came and scouted us. They have provided us with good information and tape. We will trade or talk with anyone

[Old Henry Man]

We have a very good relationship with Lex Cath. Trade film on common opponents and scouting reports. They picked up our signals through scouting. I never bad mouthed them or said they were wrong. Never called it a spygate or anything. Never said they went to some crazy extreme. I just stated they have done it and how we handled it.

Old Henry Man: With no film exhange policy to force teams to exchange and the fact not all teams film their games. There is not much of an issue filimg games. HS and above is a completely different thing.

Henry would have traded films, all sorry we had a game.
So the High School ethics are different, I will remember that.

[Old Henry Man]

Henry Co coaches watched Farnsley play before they played them, and a parnet offered to film them, but we explained that it is against unwritten rules to film.

[barrel]

Henry would have traded films, all sorry we had a game.
So the High School ethics are different, I will remember that.

HS have a completely different set of rules period. It would be unethical for HS to do some of the stuff we do in MS because it is against the rules. There are no rules governing film exchange or filming opponents. We have never done it but if a team did it to us whatever. We will talk to or give film to just about anyone. Also I would not of been surprised if Farnsley had film on line. A few of the Louisville schools have some of their games online.

[Blues]

Maybe I feel this way because I feel like I am just repeating myself over an dover and no one is listening. So let me put this in a step by step breakdown.

1) Lex Cath Scouted us
2) Lex Cath figure out our hand signals while scouting. As far as I know they were not using video equipment to capture the signals. I am not sure if they even video taped us.
3) Our first drive they called out the location of the play and the back carring the ball.
4) We fixed it

No where have I said that it was unethical. I believe videoing the sideline for the purpose of stealing signals is a completely different thing or making sure the game footage is wide enough so you can do it is a different issue.

Now video without permission on the MS level is a different thing I think. We have no film exchange past coaches just helping each other out. Of course you ask around enough there is going to be a school that is more than willing to give you film or a scouting report. Not going to lie but Henry Co got their scouting report for Lex Cath from me. I know Lex Cath would give a scouting report out on us and it is nothing personal. Because of th enature of MS football you have to make due. Some of it would be bushleague in HS and of course there is some bushleague stuff that goes on in MS.

In reference to your qoute( # 3 point )...That's why teams and coaches scout other teams. Lex Cath saw your alignment, the offensive formation, the down and distant and they called out " Watch the tight end "....and the players did. And sure enough, you all attempted a pass to your TE that was broken up by Lex Cath safety. How do I know this? I was there, my neighbors grandson plays for HC. And to be honest HC formation and alignment were so predictable and so one dimensional:coach:, I told my neighbor where the ball was going. He kind of laugh.....:coach:

[barrel]

In reference to your qoute( # 3 point )...That's why teams and coaches scout other teams. Lex Cath saw your alignment, the offensive formation, the down and distant and they called out " Watch the tight end "....and the players did. And sure enough, you all attempted a pass to your TE that was broken up by Lex Cath safety. How do I know this? I was there, my neighbors grandson plays for HC. And to be honest HC formation and alignment were so predictable and so one dimensional:coach:, I told my neighbor where the ball was going. He kind of laugh.....:coach:

When you say "your" I have to assume you are not referencing me because I do not coach at Henry Co. In fact the year I am refering to there were no formational tendencies for us. None. In fact there wasn't much in the down and distance.

[Blues]

When you say "your" I have to assume you are not referencing me because I do not coach at Henry Co. In fact the year I am refering to there were no formational tendencies for us. None. In fact there wasn't much in the down and distance.

Well who do you think I would assume? Your the one that stated.....
# 1 Lex Cath scouted US
# 2 Lex Cath figured out OUR hand sgnal
# 3 OUR first drive, they called out the location of the play
# 4 WE fixed it
To me brother, sounds like your speaking in first person as if your where there as a coach. Only qouting what you said bro.

[barrel]

Well who do you think I would assume? Your the one that stated.....
# 1 Lex Cath scouted US
# 2 Lex Cath figured out OUR hand sgnal
# 3 OUR first drive, they called out the location of the play
# 4 WE fixed it
To me brother, sounds like your speaking in first person as if your where there as a coach. Only qouting what you said bro.

And if you read the other posts in this thread by me you'll see that

1: I gave Henry Co the scouting report on Lex Cath
2: It happen in 2009 when our signals were stolen
3: We are a no huddle all the time team

So yes on my previous list all of those things did happen to us but at no time did I mention anything that links my experience with Henry Co. or the HC vs LC game. In fact it is fairly clear that I coach at a completely different school that plays Lex Cath.

So saying that they knew we were going to throw to the TE has nothing to do with me because when we played them it was a different story. Of our 4 attempts to our TEs this year against Lex Cath only once was the TE covered. Unlike some schools we are very aware of formational use by us and tendencies. Its a very big part of our self scout and scouting our opponents.

[Old Henry Man]

If a coach is scouting a team they are going to play, what is wrong with picking up on signals? I don't see that as unethical at all. IMHO, filming an opponent without consent is a much bigger problem.

I am happy, a team putting up ove 40 points a game stole my signals and were only able to put up 14 points without my best LB.
I must have done something good.
Filming without consent is wrong, but some people do not uderstand that, and they hide behind the Middle School factor.
All sorry all of the places are not Middle Schools

[KnightTime]

Lexington Catholic 100% did not steal any of Henry County's signals. The Henry county offense is predictable based upon formation/down and distance, which is why many people who were at the game could hear the LexCath coaches shouting plays they thought were about to come. Sometimes they were right and others they weren't.

[barrel]

Some what off topic: Is Henry Co a System School still?

[Old Henry Man]

Lexington Catholic 100% did not steal any of Henry County's signals. The Henry county offense is predictable based upon formation/down and distance, which is why many people who were at the game could hear the LexCath coaches shouting plays they thought were about to come. Sometimes they were right and others they weren't.

I agree, we were predictable. I do not think that Lex Cath or any coach would film a game without permission.
All coaches shout out plays to the Defense, which is a educated guess on the coaches part.

[Bluegrasscard]

I agree, we were predictable. I do not think that Lex Cath or any coach would film a game without permission.
All coaches shout out plays to the Defense, which is a educated guess on the coaches part.

Being on sidelines a lot I am amazed that coaches can read a play by the looking at the formation and having a feel for the personnel in the formation. They are right over 75% of the time it seems. No film, no stealing of signals, just know who the key players are and what the formation is and they will have a good shot of making call.

I sometimes ask - how did you know? And the coaches will say well he was lined up there and that guy was there... and that means sweep...or that means pitch...hint - sweeps and pitches seem to be the easiest reads.

For LexCath - with the 3-4, 3-5 stunting defense there will always be a play called ahead of time but it is often is 'audibled' from the side lines or sometimes the MLB once the offensive formation starts to set up. Since it is not a passive defense there is always an attempt to adjust the defensive play to the formation right up until the snap. There is no time to steal or use other teams signals, it is just an adjustment to the formation right up to the snap.

[barrel]

It is often easy to predict plays against teams. MS teams often have very bad formational tendencies. You also can tell by the depth of the backs or sometimes the teams splits either OL or Recs. Add in knowing the down and distance tendencies and it can be pretty easy to pick up on things.

As far as the 34/35 defense goes and adjustments right up to the snap there was not much of that going on last year in the game I was referencing. We lined up the exact same way ever snap and since our offense that year was very much outside the norm we faced strange fronts. The DC would call out where the play was going before we got lined up. Easy fix for us once we heard him a few times.

[knighted]

It is often easy to predict plays against teams. MS teams often have very bad formational tendencies. You also can tell by the depth of the backs or sometimes the teams splits either OL or Recs. Add in knowing the down and distance tendencies and it can be pretty easy to pick up on things.

As far as the 34/35 defense goes and adjustments right up to the snap there was not much of that going on last year in the game I was referencing. We lined up the exact same way ever snap and since our offense that year was very much outside the norm we faced strange fronts. The DC would call out where the play was going before we got lined up. Easy fix for us once we heard him a few times.

LOL sounds like they stole your pants off. If that's what happened then all I can say is our 2009 DC must of been better than I first assumed.

[barrel]

LOL sounds like they stole your pants off. If that's what happened then all I can say is our 2009 DC must of been better than I first assumed.

It honestly didn't have much effect on the game. We were part of the way through the first drive when we realized it and it was a quick fix. I believe we loss by about a score or less. We moved the ball pretty well for the most part. Our offense was very out of the norm so the typical keys and such do not work.

[TOOMEY#4]

To whoever said that Anderson was tapeing farnsley practice is out right lie. We had game film from them playing Bondurant and Henry County didnt have too film there practice. Why would they say this only after we played the game if they knew this why not post it before the game. The reason why is because its not true. There is game swapping going on in middle school as well as high school and it is not illlegal to do so. I think it is unethical to tape someone practicing and it was not done by Anderson County. They beat us but i believe if we were healthy they would not have had a chance. My boy didnt even play in the 2nd half and most of the 2nd quarter. Our WR #25 was hurt from playing Conway just 3 days before we played Farnsley. Our All-State lineman #78 was hurt before the tournament even started. He is scheduled to have mcl and pcl surgery on the 9th of November. With all that said they did beat us and are in the championship game so congrats to them.

[deebo7198]

First of all to the last commenter, someone from Anderson County did film our practice. If you want to get technical we can post their license plate number. They were in the parking lot at the church across from our practice field. A parent went over to see who the person was with the camera stalking our kids and their license plate said Anderson County. What a coincidence the day before the game. As far as unhealthy players etc... we have kids that are hurt and have been through out the entire tournament like the kid that plays for us that has a cast on his arm, which one of the Anderson County players were nice enough to pull it after the whistle was blow and aggravate it more. We look past injury and play football quit whining and we don't need your luck or congratulations our kids earned everything that they have accomplished. How about giving our team their individual credit, oh never mind just give us the state championship :redboxer::redboxer::redboxer::redboxer::redboxer::redboxer:

[TOOMEY#4]

whatever is right post the liscense plate and i will find out who the ghost vehicle was. first you said a student went over and asked the person what they were doing now you say a parent. Get your facts straight before you post lies. Another thing you were right you just wanted the state championship just givin to you seems like you didnt get it givin to you got it taken from you.

:lmao:

:dontthink

[b40272]

Toomey,
I am the person who started this post.
I work with a gentleman from Anderson Co, and i told him about the taping of our practice.
The day after i talked to him about it he confirmed that another Anderson co resident who works here in Louisville stopped by our practice after work, and was in fact taping our practice.
It did happen, we arn't lieing, and apparently taping the practice didnt help.
On a little different note, i enjoyed our game with Anderson county more than any other game we played this year.
Not because we won,,,although that part was really nice,,,,,but because of the battle on the field between two teams with very different styles of play.
And because of the fact that neither team gave up when the momentom changed, which it did a number of times during the game.
I felt that both teams handled themselves like gentlemen and true sportsmen.
You have a great group of young men there.
Your comment about us wanting the final game given to us couldnt be farther from the truth. Our kids worked very hard this year. our coaching staff worked very hard, and your comment was way off base, and if you really knew our team you would know how wrong you are.

Thanks

Bill

[papawron]

To rectify....only one lex cath coach had cath clothing ....I think the others were in camoflauge doing military crawls and parachuting from helicopters .... the others were taking notes.....totally a standard practice. As to filming practice....thats off limits!!! I do know of a staff that was planted behind the cath bench taking notes on hand signals...too funny....didnt help them !!!

that obviously wasn't anyone from Corbin. Didn't need a lot of help

[TOOMEY#4]

Bill,
Well i agree was a very good game between 2 very good teams. if it didnt matter us tapeing your practice why would you even start a post like you did. call out the Anderson county resident who was tapeing and not the coaching staff, The coaches had no iclination that this was done, and would have appologized from the get go. I was trying to be a good sport about the situation but who ever Deebooo is said he did not want my congadulations or anything of that matter, yes i responded wrongly and do appologize. Your kids did a great job and had a wonderful innaugural season and hope you all keep it going in the future.

:1: