[Scotty_Bronson]

Lets call a spade a spade. This is a rediculous "judgement call", of a rule. I understand its a safety issues but lord. Another one I cant grasp, im not sure if it applies to high school or not, but in college and the nefl it is illegal to hit a quarterback below the waiste or above the shoulders, yet in the pocket there is no such thing as a "hoarse collar" tackle. These rules are getting rediculous. Back to the hurdling rule...im lost. Here's an example:

http://www.hudl.com/athlete/2623959/high.../175747229

[Granny Bear]

Are you saying that the kid that jumped over the defense would be penalized?

[RoShamBo]

Are you saying that the kid that jumped over the defense would be penalized?

Yes, in high school you can not hurdle a defender if the defender is on his feet.

[skully03]

I've seen players hurdle numerous times and no penalties have ever been called.

[oneijoe]

I think the rule is really intended to keep the ball-carrier from doing the "high jump" over defenders when the defender is upright (keeping cleats out of faces/necks).

Most officials know that, but not all. This one called it by the "letter" vs. the "spirit".

[RoShamBo]

I've seen players hurdle numerous times and no penalties have ever been called.

Well I guess that would be the first time a ref missed a call then. It is an NFHS rule that is supposed to come with a 15 yard penalty. It is actually intended to protect the ball carrier and the tackler. I think the rule stems from a high schooler breaking his neck trying to hurdle a few years back.

[Scotty_Bronson]

I dislike the judgement call penalties. They simply rarely go without issue. Imo, the link I provided was a play that shouldnt have resulted in a penalty. The DB was shooting at the kids feet, nothing wrong with that. But the RB, Kane Snyder, would have likely been stopped hadhe not jumped him. My issue is that diving over a goal line pile is not penalized but these types of plays are. Where will they draw the line? In 10 years no one will be allowed to hitneone and it will be a game of touch. Its rediculous imo. Im all for safety but some of it, is ubsurd

[RoShamBo]

I dislike the judgement call penalties. They simply rarely go without issue. Imo, the link I provided was a play that shouldnt have resulted in a penalty. The DB was shooting at the kids feet, nothing wrong with that. But the RB, Kane Snyder, would have likely been stopped hadhe not jumped him. My issue is that diving over a goal line pile is not penalized but these types of plays are. Where will they draw the line? In 10 years no one will be allowed to hitneone and it will be a game of touch. Its rediculous imo. Im all for safety but some of it, is ubsurd

I agree completely. The likelihood of a hurdle even happening at the high school level is very slim and the chances it ends with an injury are even lower. It is no different than a receiver having to jump to catch a ball over the middle or an RB diving for the goal line IMO. The chance is always there that someone could get hurt but it is a part of the game.

[skully03]

I specifically remembdr a game last year when Carr from belfry hurdled over a player and I believe continued for about 20 yards for the score. I Can't remember what team it was against but it was a heck of a run. No penalty was called. Maybe Bucslover or 1998 may remember it also.

[Dawg Family]

Raceland had this called on them just this past Friday. Raceland has a kid jump right over top of a defender in stride and went about another 5 yards before getting pushed out of bounds. by another defensive back. It was an awsome run by the kid.

[papagrit]

I saw a call in a college game a couple of weeks ago that I'd not ever seen called. The ball is on the 40 yard line going in. 4th down and 8 and the team goes for it because they are down and it is late in the 4th quarter. Quarterback goes back for a pass, is hit from behind and the ball is knocked loose while he is still standing straight up, does NOT have his arm cocked for a pass but has the ball out carrying it like a loaf of bread. The ball goes flying forward and without hitting the ground is caught by an offensive tackle who rambles about 35 yards down to the 10 yard line or so. Ball is called back and put where the quarterback lost the ball and the ball changes hands on downs.

The ruling: A ball is not allowed to be advanced on 4th down due to a fumble by a quarterback. It must be recovered by the quarterback and ONLY the quarterback can advance it. I was told that Don Meredith, back in the day, would fumble a ball on purpose before getting tackled near the endzone on fourth down and hope one of his team mates would recover for a touchdown.

[panther nation]

^^

That is a rule that's been in affect for a long time but it's not just QB's. Here is the NFL rule:

On a play from scrimmage, if an offensive player fumbles anywhere on the field during fourth down, only the fumbling player is permitted to recover and/or advance the ball. If any player fumbles after the two-minute warning in a half, only the fumbling player is permitted to recover and/or advance the ball. If recovered by any other offensive player, the ball is dead at the spot of the fumble unless it is recovered behind the spot of the fumble. In that case, the ball is dead at the spot of recovery. Any defensive player may recover and/or advance any fumble at any time.

If I remember correctly this rule was pit onto place after Ken Stabler of the Oakland Raiders fumbled the ball forward around the 5yd line and it was recovered in the end zone by Dave Casper for the winning score.

[oneijoe]

^^

That is a rule that's been in affect for a long time but it's not just QB's. Here is the NFL rule:

On a play from scrimmage, if an offensive player fumbles anywhere on the field during fourth down, only the fumbling player is permitted to recover and/or advance the ball. If any player fumbles after the two-minute warning in a half, only the fumbling player is permitted to recover and/or advance the ball. If recovered by any other offensive player, the ball is dead at the spot of the fumble unless it is recovered behind the spot of the fumble. In that case, the ball is dead at the spot of recovery. Any defensive player may recover and/or advance any fumble at any time.

If I remember correctly this rule was pit onto place after Ken Stabler of the Oakland Raiders fumbled the ball forward around the 5yd line and it was recovered in the end zone by Dave Casper for the winning score.

I remember seeing that play. Someone had to tell John Madden his team won the game. lolol....


nicker:

[papagrit]

^^

That is a rule that's been in affect for a long time but it's not just QB's. Here is the NFL rule:

On a play from scrimmage, if an offensive player fumbles anywhere on the field during fourth down, only the fumbling player is permitted to recover and/or advance the ball. If any player fumbles after the two-minute warning in a half, only the fumbling player is permitted to recover and/or advance the ball. If recovered by any other offensive player, the ball is dead at the spot of the fumble unless it is recovered behind the spot of the fumble. In that case, the ball is dead at the spot of recovery. Any defensive player may recover and/or advance any fumble at any time.

If I remember correctly this rule was pit onto place after Ken Stabler of the Oakland Raiders fumbled the ball forward around the 5yd line and it was recovered in the end zone by Dave Casper for the winning score.

I see, so maybe I misunderstood what the coach I asked told me about it just being the QB that can recover and advance the ball. It was a QB that fumbled, so maybe he said only the QB could have recovered the ball on THAT play to advance the ball. He was the one that told me about Don Meredith may have been the one that triggered that play. I DO remember something about Kenny Stabler and the play you are talking about happening though.
Remembering Stabler playing will define my age a little.:biggrin:

[Quickkickonthird]

I saw a call in a college game a couple of weeks ago that I'd not ever seen called. The ball is on the 40 yard line going in. 4th down and 8 and the team goes for it because they are down and it is late in the 4th quarter. Quarterback goes back for a pass, is hit from behind and the ball is knocked loose while he is still standing straight up, does NOT have his arm cocked for a pass but has the ball out carrying it like a loaf of bread. The ball goes flying forward and without hitting the ground is caught by an offensive tackle who rambles about 35 yards down to the 10 yard line or so. Ball is called back and put where the quarterback lost the ball and the ball changes hands on downs.

The ruling: A ball is not allowed to be advanced on 4th down due to a fumble by a quarterback. It must be recovered by the quarterback and ONLY the quarterback can advance it. I was told that Don Meredith, back in the day, would fumble a ball on purpose before getting tackled near the endzone on fourth down and hope one of his team mates would recover for a touchdown.

They changed that rule in the NFL after the "Holy Roller" play. Oakland QB Kenny Stabler fumbled the ball forward and TE Dave Casper kept rolling the ball along until he finally fell on it in the end zone. They have been debating for years whether Casper did it on purpose or not. Regardless, it won the game for Oakland and this was in the playoffs!

[Quickkickonthird]

^^

That is a rule that's been in affect for a long time but it's not just QB's. Here is the NFL rule:

On a play from scrimmage, if an offensive player fumbles anywhere on the field during fourth down, only the fumbling player is permitted to recover and/or advance the ball. If any player fumbles after the two-minute warning in a half, only the fumbling player is permitted to recover and/or advance the ball. If recovered by any other offensive player, the ball is dead at the spot of the fumble unless it is recovered behind the spot of the fumble. In that case, the ball is dead at the spot of recovery. Any defensive player may recover and/or advance any fumble at any time.

If I remember correctly this rule was pit onto place after Ken Stabler of the Oakland Raiders fumbled the ball forward around the 5yd line and it was recovered in the end zone by Dave Casper for the winning score.

Sorry! I didnt see that u had already explained the "Holy Roller" play.

[panther nation]

Sorry! I didnt see that u had already explained the "Holy Roller" play.

That is ok. I had actually forgotten that they had nicknamed the play the Holy Roller until you reminded me!!

[irishcard16]

I specifically remembdr a game last year when Carr from belfry hurdled over a player and I believe continued for about 20 yards for the score. I Can't remember what team it was against but it was a heck of a run. No penalty was called. Maybe Bucslover or 1998 may remember it also.

Dustin May was penalized for it a few years back in a playoff game (I'm thinking against Breathitt Co)

[papagrit]

Thank you both for explaining that to me about the advancing a fumble rule. I actually went to youtube and found a video about it. I had never seen this rule enforced before a couple of weeks ago. Here is the video.

[topnotch]

I saw A Williamsburg player go down field and jump a offensive player it was plain and the reff saw it, It was ruled OK because the player had his feet off the ground.

[Scotty_Bronson]

^^^there lies the problem. It is called so inconsistantly.

[Spud6]

Seen a lot of hurdling this year in numerous games, and not once have I seen it called. Heck, Pikeville won the game on a 2-point conversion by their QB hurdling the CB on a read-option against Prestonsburg.