After watching the 15th Region Tourney this past week all I can say is WOW
The 15th has turned into the 16th.
Aside from the Belfry - Paintsville game every game was just flat out horrible to watch if you were not a fan of the teams playing.
Scoring in the 40's and 50's, and sometimes taking OT to do it, is just plain UGLY.
I appreciate Defense and good coaching as much as anyone but at least one fast break a quarter isn't too much to ask is it?
I would have loved to seen Bell, Harmon and Clevinger allowed to go full speed to the offensive end and scoring then watching Justice, Hatfield and the Bryants push it right back at them.
Instead of an entertaining final we had 2 coaches slow it down to a snails pace with the players having to pass the ball 7 times before they shoot.
U-G-L-Y
Well that was the coaches style, but I agree there was alot of slow and sloppy play. It was an awesome tournament though.
I dont think it is no scecret that the athletes in the 15th arent what they used to be. This goes for all sports not only basketball, but I will agree basketball in teh 15th is really watered down
I think the transition from a small high school gym, to a college like arena is what made a difference in scoring. And I'm sure defense had alot to do with it, since everyteam had everything to play for.
Tubby Hater Wrote:I dont think it is no scecret that the athletes in the 15th arent what they used to be. This goes for all sports not only basketball, but I will agree basketball in teh 15th is really watered down
I don't think is the athletes. I know JJ Hylton and Todd Conley are not playing in the 15th anymore but there are some good athletes in the 15th. Harmon, Clevinger, Justice, the Bryants, Case, Newsome and a few more are nice athletes and DAMN good players.
Even if the athletes are not up to par, your playing each other not a 10h region team so no way you score in the 40's all the time
Avg. score
Winners - 61
Losers - 51
Take away the Belfry/Paintsville and AC/Phelps game and it is -
Winners - 54
Losers - 46
Thats sad.
blackcat_student Wrote:I think the transition from a small high school gym, to a college like arena is what made a difference in scoring. And I'm sure defense had alot to do with it, since everyteam had everything to play for.
I would agree if it were not for Belfry, Paintsville and AC scoring like they did.
I have to agree Tubby Hater, I enjoyed all the games as a whole but really not much great talent at all in the region. Even the premier players in the region wouldn't start on most teams 3 or 4 years ago or whatever.
Case could have played at anytime for BHS
Elisha Justice would have started for any single team that has went through Valley since it opened. He has D-1 talent, but not D-1 size, hopefully that will come with his age. He played in this tournament last year as an eighth grader, he had the best poise I have ever seen for a freshmen in this side of the state. He took home the 15th MVP and is only a freshmen, that is one great accomplishment, his presence on the court was felt throughout the entire tournament as, if my memory serves me right, he never left the court. Talent hasn't dropped, it's just all this talent is YOUNG talent, you have to remember, Valley starts 3 freshmen, a Sophomore and a Junior, so the talent is there, it just hasn't got much experience yet, but these men will be a force to reckon with the next few years.
NEXT Wrote:I don't think is the athletes. I know JJ Hylton and Todd Conley are not playing in the 15th anymore but there are some good athletes in the 15th. Harmon, Clevinger, Justice, the Bryants, Case, Newsome and a few more are nice athletes and DAMN good players.
Even if the athletes are not up to par, your playing each other not a 10h region team so no way you score in the 40's all the time
Avg. score
Winners - 61
Losers - 51
Take away the Belfry/Paintsville and AC/Phelps game and it is -
Winners - 54
Losers - 46
Thats sad.
I guess we have all been watching UK play too much. LOL
ComeFlyWithMe Wrote:Elisha Justice would have started for any single team that has went through Valley since it opened. He has D-1 talent, but not D-1 size, hopefully that will come with his age. He played in this tournament last year as an eighth grader, he had the best poise I have ever seen for a freshmen in this side of the state. He took home the 15th MVP and is only a freshmen, that is one great accomplishment, his presence on the court was felt throughout the entire tournament as, if my memory serves me right, he never left the court. Talent hasn't dropped, it's just all this talent is YOUNG talent, you have to remember, Valley starts 3 freshmen, a Sophomore and a Junior, so the talent is there, it just hasn't got much experience yet, but these men will be a force to reckon with the next few years.
Well said.
ComeFlyWithMe Wrote:Elisha Justice would have started for any single team that has went through Valley since it opened. He has D-1 talent, but not D-1 size, hopefully that will come with his age. He played in this tournament last year as an eighth grader, he had the best poise I have ever seen for a freshmen in this side of the state. He took home the 15th MVP and is only a freshmen, that is one great accomplishment, his presence on the court was felt throughout the entire tournament as, if my memory serves me right, he never left the court. Talent hasn't dropped, it's just all this talent is YOUNG talent, you have to remember, Valley starts 3 freshmen, a Sophomore and a Junior, so the talent is there, it just hasn't got much experience yet, but these men will be a force to reckon with the next few years.
Me and my brother told people when Elisha was in 7th grade that he was going to be GREAT. No one believed us(outside of those from Valley).
He is one of my all-time favorite players already.
I watched every game and the Pikeville/Allen central game was a great game to watch as was the SV/Belfry game. Regardless of the scores there was alot of exciting games both girls and boys. It is good to watch good defensive effort too. Pikeville stayed close to SV because they did what they needed to do defensively early and had Valley not hit freethrows.... us Valley fans might still be talking to ourselves.
Elisha is a very good ball player but let's not give him "D-1 talent" just yet. He is only a freshman who is a long way from D-1. Hopefully he grows a little bit and continues working hard both physically and mentally...THEN let's decide if he is D-1 material. Remember when Landon Slone pumped in 51 against Shelby Valley as a freshman? I believe a lot of people starting calling him D-1 material. Is he? No, he couldn't play for EKU, Morehead State, ETSU or any other local D-1 school at the moment. Good luck Shelby Valley at Rupp.
Mr. Baseball Wrote:Elisha is a very good ball player but let's not give him "D-1 talent" just yet. He is only a freshman who is a long way from D-1. Hopefully he grows a little bit and continues working hard both physically and mentally...THEN let's decide if he is D-1 material. Remember when Landon Slone pumped in 51 against Shelby Valley as a freshman? I believe a lot of people starting calling him D-1 material. Is he? No, he couldn't play for EKU, Morehead State, ETSU or any other local D-1 school at the moment. Good luck Shelby Valley at Rupp.
Elisha will be the best PG to come out of the 15th since Shawn Hager of Belfry and could very well end up being better than him.
ComeFlyWithMe Wrote:Elisha Justice would have started for any single team that has went through Valley since it opened. He has D-1 talent, but not D-1 size, hopefully that will come with his age. He played in this tournament last year as an eighth grader, he had the best poise I have ever seen for a freshmen in this side of the state. He took home the 15th MVP and is only a freshmen, that is one great accomplishment, his presence on the court was felt throughout the entire tournament as, if my memory serves me right, he never left the court. Talent hasn't dropped, it's just all this talent is YOUNG talent, you have to remember, Valley starts 3 freshmen, a Sophomore and a Junior, so the talent is there, it just hasn't got much experience yet, but these men will be a force to reckon with the next few years.
I agree, he does have alot of poise to be so young and so do the rest of the players and Id say that the size will come along as he gets older.
-STATS- Wrote:I agree, he does have alot of poise to be so young and so do the rest of the players and Id say that the size will come along as he gets older.
Hope so
I guess if the average score of the winners was 81, and the losers was 71, I bet people would be complaining about the lack of defense.
<P>Let me ask you something Next. If you were coaching the regional championship game and you were up and the other coach sat in a zone would you not kill some time off the clock every possession. I think that is what Jason Booher was thinking , not "well this won't make everyone happy who is watching the game so I better not do it." I am sure he was thinking that this gives him the best opportunity to be playing at rupp. I just think it was two very good defensive teams going at it. Every basket was well earned and every possession was so crucial. I enjoyed the heck out of the game and no it wasn't ugly to me because I enjoy a good physical, defensive game. I don't enjoy no defense like AC against Phelps and Painstville/Belfry, and that is what those games were.</P>
Both teams played a zone btw which usually leads to passing the ball a little before shooting it. I am no basketball coach but aren't you suppose to work it around till you find your shot against a zone. Someone help me out?
NEXT Wrote:After watching the 15th Region Tourney this past week all I can say is WOW
Aside from the Belfry - Paintsville game every game was just flat out horrible to watch if you were not a fan of the teams playing.
Instead of an entertaining final we had 2 coaches slow it down to a snails pace with the players having to pass the ball 7 times before they shoot.
U-G-L-Y
And shockingly the teams that were able to play at a "snails pace" made it to the final, while Belfry and Paintsville were sent home... Maybe if those two teams were able to play defensively like Pikeville and Valley, or able to play against tough defense they wouldn't have made early exits from the tourney...
The King Wrote:And shockingly the teams that were able to play at a "snails pace" made it to the final, while Belfry and Paintsville were sent home... Maybe if those two teams were able to play defensively like Pikeville and Valley, or able to play against tough defense they wouldn't have made early exits from the tourney...
:Thumbs: Excellent point. As the old saying goes, defense wins championships (even if it's ugly). If Valley can get over the "Rupp Factor" and maintain this style of defense during the Sweet 16, they will represent the 15th Region well. It's a breath of fresh air to see a team concentrate on "team" defense instead of "me" offense.
jammin' jamey Wrote::Thumbs: Excellent point. As the old saying goes, defense wins championships (even if it's ugly). If Valley can get over the "Rupp Factor" and maintain this style of defense during the Sweet 16, they will represent the 15th Region well. It's a breath of fresh air to see a team concentrate on "team" defense instead of "me" offense.
They don't have the size to play half-court ball past the first round.
They can play this style against a 16th region school, but against anyone else they will have to get up-and-down the court and score some easy buckets to have a chance to win.
You ought to come check out the 9th region. Year in and year out little noise is ever made by the 9th region respresentative to the state tourney..CovCath and Holmes and nothing much after that..
BoondockSaint Wrote:They don't have the size to play half-court ball past the first round.
They can play this style against a 16th region school, but against anyone else they will have to get up-and-down the court and score some easy buckets to have a chance to win.
I think Shelby Valley will have it's hands full with whoever (Ashland or Elliott Co.) comes out of the 16th.... But that being said, SV did play well against Warren Central on a neutral court in a half-court game (63-60). Granted this wasn't the same setting as Rupp, but to say they would
have to get up-and-down the court to have a chance is incorrect...
BoondockSaint Wrote:They don't have the size to play half-court ball past the first round.
They can play this style against a 16th region school, but against anyone else they will have to get up-and-down the court and score some easy buckets to have a chance to win.
Didn't you ever watch
Hoosiers?
Seriously, I agree that they will have to get up-and-down the floor, but only when the opportunity presents itself, such as a steal or long rebound kick. I wouldn't push the tempo for the sake of it just because my opponent wants to get me into that kind of game.
I think there were times SV could've pushed the ball on Pikeville and elected not to. That may be different against a stronger opponent.
how old is Justice to be a freshman? HE is a very talented player but let's not get carried away with the D1 stuff. His size will hurt him in that area.
HazzBeen Wrote:<P>Let me ask you something Next. If you were coaching the regional championship game and you were up and the other coach sat in a zone would you not kill some time off the clock every possession. I think that is what Jason Booher was thinking , not "well this won't make everyone happy who is watching the game so I better not do it." I am sure he was thinking that this gives him the best opportunity to be playing at rupp. I just think it was two very good defensive teams going at it. Every basket was well earned and every possession was so crucial. I enjoyed the heck out of the game and no it wasn't ugly to me because I enjoy a good physical, defensive game. I don't enjoy no defense like AC against Phelps and Painstville/Belfry, and that is what those games were.</P>
No problem with playing zone.
My problem is with the talent at Valley playing that half court junk that they played against Pikeville, kept Pikeville in the game.
Hatfield and Newsome can grind it out in the 15th and 16th in the post. Against teams from down state they cannot plain an simple. Not strong enough.
The Belfry/Paintsville game had plenty of D. Case scored 10 of his points off of steals.
Shelby Valley reminds me of Belfry in the early 90's and they were an injury from Jim Dotson away from winning a title. Guess what they did against EVERY TEAM they played.
jammin' jamey Wrote:Didn't you ever watch Hoosiers?
Seriously, I agree that they will have to get up-and-down the floor, but only when the opportunity presents itself, such as a steal or long rebound kick. I wouldn't push the tempo for the sake of it just because my opponent wants to get me into that kind of game.
I think there were times SV could've pushed the ball on Pikeville and elected not to. That may be different against a stronger opponent.
EVERY team should look for fastbreak opportunities when they get defensive rebounds. That's all I'm saying. I'm not saying man press the entire game, because they play zone defense really well. But you can run out of a zone just as easily in my opinion.