[alleycat53]

The fact is, the administrators knew, just like everyone else involved. They got caught and are trying to cover everything up to take the heat off the school. They already had it planned to tell officials that they played against the JV squad, the Varsity , and some other made up games so Teddy could play with them.
This all happening in light of the stuff that went on in the lockerroom at halftime of the Pike County Championship game! Heard lawyers came to school and everything over that.

What happened in the locker room?

[Kentucky Sports Fan]

I guess they forgot to cross their T's and dot their I's.

[Alpha_Male]

My question is how does any of the parents, administrators, friends, family or players allow this to happen haven't they worked as a team all year for this? Then in walks one player the last day and “joins” the “team”.

It’s bad enough all the hold backs and recruiting all in the name of what...... 6th 7th or 8th grade tournament win. Really who cares… how do these kids feel when they are ineligible to play your senior year (because they are 19 or 20 years old) because you won a GRADE SCHOOL tournament when you where 15 or 16, instead of 11 to 14 like the rest of the USA, but I digress.

Just amazing that it gets this far, I was not there and I do not have a horse in the race but it seems to me that red flags had to be flying all over the place and not one parent, player friend or administrator steps up before some sore loser or potential sore loser cry's foul in the 12hr...

Its grade school basket for kids that should not have to worry about anything but having fun with friends and doing something to the best of their abilities win lose or draw… Just my $.02 which these days are worth far less than when I was a kid!

You are DUMB.

[foriegn flatlander]

My question is how does any of the parents, administrators, friends, family or players allow this to happen haven't they worked as a team all year for this? Then in walks one player the last day and “joins” the “team”.

It’s bad enough all the hold backs and recruiting all in the name of what...... 6th 7th or 8th grade tournament win. Really who cares… how do these kids feel when they are ineligible to play your senior year (because they are 19 or 20 years old) because you won a GRADE SCHOOL tournament when you where 15 or 16, instead of 11 to 14 like the rest of the USA, but I digress.

Just amazing that it gets this far, I was not there and I do not have a horse in the race but it seems to me that red flags had to be flying all over the place and not one parent, player friend or administrator steps up before some sore loser or potential sore loser cry's foul in the 12hr...

Its grade school basket for kids that should not have to worry about anything but having fun with friends and doing something to the best of their abilities win lose or draw… Just my $.02 which these days are worth far less than when I was a kid!

I agree with everything you say except for someone (ie parent,player,etc ) being able to stop this. My son is involved with Pikeville middle school basketball and other sports, there is no communication by the coaches to the parents of any type (unless you are on the A-list) I to this day have not been spoken to by the coaches about my son or his progress ( he is a starter) or involved in anything that involves basketball games or practice unless it is in a text. The adm is solely responsible for this along with the coaches. You can spin it any way you want but, it is what it is a black eye for Pikeville.

[Micro-Brew]

The rules for this tournament should not have been bent. Plain and simple. The kid is eligible to play with the high school and JV teams and that should have been where it ended for now. This Summer.....Play away!!. But the rules of the tourney were specific....5 games prior..... Things should have been addressed by the proper people prior to the tournament for all involved. Very unfair to lots of kids, for and against Pikeville.

[BigVMan23]

Wow...just...wow! How sad for the kids of the Pikeville team who have been with the team all year. And not just because they were dq'd, thats bad enough, but that they had to see a bunch of grownups make terrible decisions that greatly affected the end of their season in a hugely negative way. This could have been stopped I'm sure by several people before it ever got this far, so I think their is plenty of blame to go around, but as a coach myself, I would have to think the final and ultimate decision rested with the coach here in this situation. I mean, unless he was just forced to play the kid and told "or else", then he knew he wasn't eligible it seems to me and should have never played the kid. I'm sure I don't have all the facts, but on the surface it appears to me Pikeville was willing to try and win "at all costs"...and it ended up costing them dearly. I think a lot of people inside and outsde the program have plenty of reasons to be upset, and this taints the whole tournament.

[b1gblu3sports]

How is that dumb Alpha? It' true, you see it everywhere you go. Coaches want to hold kids back at all cost to make their program look better. EVERY STRONG team has holdbacks. Holdbacks don't bother me as much as recruiting. I think if a coach gets caught recruiting he should lose his job, no questions. I don't understand the big deal with winning a MIDDLE school tournament. Oh well it is what it is and the hardcore winning at all cost coaches will not change. Just makes your school look really bad.

[Hustle]

What happened in the locker room?

Heard the coach slammed C.C. into the locker at halftime. Some of the 6th graders told and from there the lawyers started investigating it. All the players had to write papers on what happened. Of course, they wanted to have a coach for KBA, so they didn't put everything down.

[foriegn flatlander]

I hink the kids can be more mature than the people on here... When I watched dorton play southern Pulaski I saw pikevilles players cheering dorton on... Whenever I saw pikeville in this championship game most of dortons players were watching and cheering them on as well.. And them knowing that they had a player that didn't play in the regular season...... Why can't us as adults cheer for a team that's in the same region? I would also like to point out that the reason pikeville was disqualified was not because of Teddy they almost got disqualified for that at the beginning of the game but at halftime they talked to coach Johnson and somehow came up with that we were an aau team because they did not ride a bus down. I also thought it was very immature of northern to cause these problems any team could have done it... After the game I saw the worst moment of my life these kids getting a state championship took away from them... Everyone of these kids have worked hard for that trophy.. And these kids love coach Johnson they look to him as family

If this is true Pikeville needs to work on academics (ie reading) it was an 8th grade middle school tournament not AAU. In fact the countless other teams knew this and played accordingly. It was done with the knowledge of the adm and the bus had noting to do with it.

[jetpilot]

http://www.bluegrassrivals.com/forum/sho...p?t=130681

[b1gblu3sports]

http://www.bluegrassrivals.com/forum/sho...p?t=130681

May want to delete this thread before you get ate alive. Just giving a fair warning. With all the FACTS floating around out there, this thread is a bad ideal.:thanks:

[Alpha_Male]

All I am saying BIGBLUE is that parents/coaches don't want/have kids holdback for middle school championships. If its for sports or academics. It usually is in the best interest for the kids. I am sorry for saying that you were dumb but I know more than a few holdbacks that hve gotten scholarships due to athletics that they may have not gotten after their JR year (year they were supposed to graduate). I would have rather been thrown into the real world at 19 rather than 17.

[b1gblu3sports]

All I am saying BIGBLUE is that parents/coaches don't want/have kids holdback for middle school championships. If its for sports or academics. It usually is in the best interest for the kids. I am sorry for saying that you were dumb but I know more than a few holdbacks that hve gotten scholarships due to athletics that they may have not gotten after their JR year (year they were supposed to graduate). I would have rather been thrown into the real world at 19 rather than 17.

You actually called unbiased dumb, but thats ok. I agree with some kids are not ready for the real world at age 17 or 18. My point is this: I hate to here parents/coaches talk about holding little Johnny back just for sports. Let's be real look at all the holdbacks and how many really gets scholarships to play somewhere. Very few. I hate seeing coaches encourage holding a kid back KNOWING that this is will never make it through college. You see this all over the state where coaches will talk with parents about holding their child back, telling them you this will really help (to some degree it will) but deep down knowing this kid will never get a scholarship. All he is doing is making his program (middle school woop woop) look good. :Cheerlead

[Micro-Brew]

You raise a good point b1gblu......I wonder how many of the kids that are posted on BGR right now with scholarships to here or there are either A. Olders kids or B. Have been held back. I kinda disagree with your point. I can think of 5 area kids who have received scholarships in the past 3 years and all 5 were hold backs. Also I had 2 friends in my class that were hold backs and they both received athletic scholarships. I guess the way I see it is if a kid was held back and didn't get an athletic scholly, he surely wouldn't have received one the year prior either. So really what did it hurt to give he or she that extra year to try for that free education ticket? I'm sure there are plenty of kids who have never been held back and receive scholarships, but I would like to see the actual results instead of just opinions. Maybe we should start a thread on here to track Hold-backs and see what their future results are. Not to BASH the kid or their parents, but just to see results.

[SWHS future]

The KHSAA has set an age limit for varsity sports. You must be 18 years of age on August 1st of your senior year to be eligible to play sports. In saying that, it is the parents choice if they want their child to be 18 on August 1st of their senior year or 17, or 16, ...etc. Don't knock those that play by the rules.

[SWHS future]

You raise a good point b1gblu......[B]I wonder how many of the kids that are posted on BGR right now with scholarships to here or there are either A. Olders kids or B. Have been held back.[/B] I kinda disagree with your point. I can think of 5 area kids who have received scholarships in the past 3 years and all 5 were hold backs. Also I had 2 friends in my class that were hold backs and they both received athletic scholarships. I guess the way I see it is if a kid was held back and didn't get an athletic scholly, he surely wouldn't have received one the year prior either. So really what did it hurt to give he or she that extra year to try for that free education ticket? I'm sure there are plenty of kids who have never been held back and receive scholarships, but I would like to see the actual results instead of just opinions. Maybe we should start a thread on here to track Hold-backs and see what their future results are. Not to BASH the kid or their parents, but just to see results.

I could shed a lot of insight on the top players in the state and their age. Start a thread and I bet many will be surprised!

[b1gblu3sports]

You raise a good point b1gblu......I wonder how many of the kids that are posted on BGR right now with scholarships to here or there are either A. Olders kids or B. Have been held back. I kinda disagree with your point. I can think of 5 area kids who have received scholarships in the past 3 years and all 5 were hold backs. Also I had 2 friends in my class that were hold backs and they both received athletic scholarships. I guess the way I see it is if a kid was held back and didn't get an athletic scholly, he surely wouldn't have received one the year prior either. So really what did it hurt to give he or she that extra year to try for that free education ticket? I'm sure there are plenty of kids who have never been held back and receive scholarships, but I would like to see the actual results instead of just opinions. Maybe we should start a thread on here to track Hold-backs and see what their future results are. Not to BASH the kid or their parents, but just to see results.

I'm not knocking holdbacks, I could really careless. My point is this: I DISAGREE with holding a kid back to better MY PROGRAM. I know several coaches knowing that the kid want make it still encourages them to hold back to help the middle school. If your child needs an extra year to grow up, needs extra help in education, or has a chance for a scholarship; yes hold them back.

You said you knew 5 in 3 years. Lets do a little math shall we: in 3 years you looking at at least 15 players on the 8th grade team. 15 players for 3 years that would be a total of 45 players going through the 8th grade class. Out of the 45 how many was holdbacks? At least half or close to that. Anyways 5 out of 45 would equal 11.1%. Thats not good numbers. Let's say half of the 45 was hold backs. So your still looking at 5 out of 23 or so; 21.7%. A little better but what about the other 78.3% of hold backs?

All that isn't really my point, again not speaking bad about hold backs, just saying if coaches do it knowing that the child will not benefit is WRONG....:Thumbs:

[RebelPride12]

I could shed a lot of insight on the top players in the state and their age. Start a thread and I bet many will be surprised!

Please do. I can make a list equally long with hold backs who didn't get athletic scholarships.

[Micro-Brew]

I'm not knocking holdbacks, I could really careless. My point is this: I DISAGREE with holding a kid back to better MY PROGRAM. I know several coaches knowing that the kid want make it still encourages them to hold back to help the middle school. If your child needs an extra year to grow up, needs extra help in education, or has a chance for a scholarship; yes hold them back.

You said you knew 5 in 3 years. Lets do a little math shall we: in 3 years you looking at at least 15 players on the 8th grade team. 15 players for 3 years that would be a total of 45 players going through the 8th grade class. Out of the 45 how many was holdbacks? At least half or close to that. Anyways 5 out of 45 would equal 11.1%. Thats not good numbers. Let's say half of the 45 was hold backs. So your still looking at 5 out of 23 or so; 21.7%. A little better but what about the other 78.3% of hold backs?

All that isn't really my point, again not speaking bad about hold backs, just saying if coaches do it knowing that the child will not benefit is WRONG....:Thumbs:

Just so we are on the same page here, I'm not arguing for or against hold backs, I just wanted to see some numbers. Also I guess I wasn't perfectly clear, I wasn't speaking from one school out of a certain number of holdbacks per say. I don't know all the kids that have been held back in one particular program. In the program that I am most closely aware of, we would have AT MOST 3 in one class. Not sure what program you know that has 23 total holdbacks in 3 years worth of classes. That seems like alot to me. So your numbers that you've created would make sense if what I was speaking of was 5 out of 23. I was not. I was speaking of 5 individuals all from different schools in our area who I KNOW had been held back, all received scholarships. I don't know all the kids who have been held back, I'll confess, so I can't make up some percentage and say its fact. All I was asking for was if you knew of a holdback, what was the result?? Off the top of my head I can only think of 1 for sure that I knew had been held back, that ended up quitting his sport by the time he was a senior. All the rest of the holdbacks that I KNOW, have resulted in positive results. But honestly I don't know over 20 holdbacks to be honest so the numbers are not overwhelming, so thats why I've asked these questions. I wasn't asking for a programs sake, I was asking for the kids sake (Athletically or academically).

[qryche11]

Back to the thread topic.

Pikeville administrators should reprimand the coach and parents should demand an explanation.

Who was winning the game at halftime? I am curious.

[PaintsvilleTigerfan]

The same Pikeville that pitched a hissy fit when jenkins used frehmen in a junior high game?

[SWHS future]

Please do. I can make a list equally long with hold backs who didn't get athletic scholarships.

I'm not sure where you are going with this? I'm sure 90% of the kids in school do not get athletic scholarships whether they are held back or not. And, going with your angle, I guess you could say I could make a list even longer of kids that didn't hold back and didn't get a scholarship. So your argument is almost self defeating in a round about way.

Like Micro-brew said, if the kid didn't get a scholarship after holding back then he or she surely wasn't getting one the year prior. But, it doesn't hurt to give them a chance to succeed as long as you are playing by the rules.

My point is I don't care if you hold back or not. Just quit the asking if a player is a holdback or not to insinuate a kid has a fair or unfair advantage depending on your perspective. If you are playing by the rules it should be a mute point. Give the kid a pat on the back and say good job instead of getting on here and saying the only reason he is so good is because he should be a year ahead in school. (RebelPride I just want to say I have never seen you post anything about holdbacks so the third paragraph does not apply to you. Your statement just got me on a soap box.LOL)

[b1gblu3sports]

Just so we are on the same page here, I'm not arguing for or against hold backs, I just wanted to see some numbers. Also I guess I wasn't perfectly clear, I wasn't speaking from one school out of a certain number of holdbacks per say. I don't know all the kids that have been held back in one particular program. In the program that I am most closely aware of, we would have AT MOST 3 in one class. Not sure what program you know that has 23 total holdbacks in 3 years worth of classes. That seems like alot to me. So your numbers that you've created would make sense if what I was speaking of was 5 out of 23. I was not. I was speaking of 5 individuals all from different schools in our area who I KNOW had been held back, all received scholarships. I don't know all the kids who have been held back, I'll confess, so I can't make up some percentage and say its fact. All I was asking for was if you knew of a holdback, what was the result?? Off the top of my head I can only think of 1 for sure that I knew had been held back, that ended up quitting his sport by the time he was a senior. All the rest of the holdbacks that I KNOW, have resulted in positive results. But honestly I don't know over 20 holdbacks to be honest so the numbers are not overwhelming, so thats why I've asked these questions. I wasn't asking for a programs sake, I was asking for the kids sake (Athletically or academically).

I thought you were saying they had "x" amount of holdbacks per year for an "x" amount of years. Thats how I got my numbers. But it is what it is and still we have coaches trying to hold kids back for their own help.:closeenough:

[trufan]

Holding kids back, as long as their 15th birthday isn't before August 1st, isn't cheating, it is legal. However, playing ineligible players on your team is illegal. As long as a kid doesn't turn 15 by August 1st their 8th grade year or 19 by August 1st their senior year, they can play anything they want.

[jetpilot]

Back to the thread topic.

Pikeville administrators should reprimand the coach and parents should demand an explanation.

Who was winning the game at halftime? I am curious.

http://www.bluegrassrivals.com/forum/sho...ostcount=7

[Throwback]

http://www.bluegrassrivals.com/forum/sho...ostcount=7

Fact they cheated

[imperfective]

Back to the thread topic.

Pikeville administrators should reprimand the coach and parents should demand an explanation.

Who was winning the game at halftime? I am curious.

The answer to this question gives a clue as to why disqualification was the right thing to do. The score at halftime was Pikeville 24 to Holmes 16, BUT the ineligible player had scored 16 of Pikeville's 24 points.