[Beetle01]

First it was the guy was suspected of being involved in a drug ring, but there were no drugs or evidence of that, then they said he was suspected of being involved in a break-in ring, but there was also no evidence in that. So now they say he had a gun, which the safety was never off.

They do come in sirens blaring, and I cant tell from the video exactly what is said, but Police is said. But all of this happens in a span of 10 seconds or so, the door is kicked in and the Swat members open fire. (of course at first they said he shot first, but that has since been changed to the police opened fire, 71 shots, he never fired once.)

I mean why not take some time, jump on the bullhorn and ask the guy to come out. It seems the SWAT team was a little jittery from the get go, so why not ask the guy to come out, spend some time negotiating and try to resolve it peacefully rather than drive up to someones house and within 30 seconds bust the door down and open fire.

Police are out of control, more and more videos like this pop up all the time. Also, recently you have the murder on Memorial Day in Miami.

[nky]

http://www.captainsjournal.com/2011/06/0...swat-raid/
Here's a story on the incident.


If the police knock your door down Don't point an assult weapon at them. They'll shoot first and ask questions later.

[Beetle01]

http://www.captainsjournal.com/2011/06/0...swat-raid/
Here's a story on the incident.


If the police knock your door down Don't point an assult weapon at them. They'll shoot first and ask questions later.

Why are they going up and kicking in the door to begin with is my question?

[Hoot Gibson]

I am not going to label this as a murder without knowing more information but at the very least it sounds like a very badly botched operation. There are some very valid reasons that people sometimes do not or cannot answer the door within a few seconds of hearing a knock - and when anybody hears somebody forcibly entering their home, it is natural to either flee to safety or arm themselves.

I would like to know if the only video taken was from the camera that was too far away to capture anything useful and if so, then I would like to know why?

I agree with you, Beetle, that incidents like this are far too common. SWAT teams should not be serving search warrants unless there is concrete evidence that a person in the home will use firearms to avoid a legal search. If this was a murder suspect, I find it implausible that he was a threat to flush evidence down the toilet. A suspect of murder who has not already disposed of flushable evidence is not likely to think of doing so when somebody knocks at the door to serve a warrant.

For other crimes, such as drug possession, I would rather let a suspect live free than be gunned down without getting a chance to defend himself in court. If flushing is a concern, then have the water company cut off the water an hour or two before serving the warrant.

This country's enforcement methods for many laws are far worse than the crimes of which targets are suspected. Anybody who is unfamiliar with what the feds did in the Ruby Ridge case a few years ago should take time to research it and understand exactly what lengths some law enforcement agencies will go to "get their man."

[nky]

Pima County Arizona is near the US Mexican border where a massive drug war is being faught by various drug cartels. This violence over the last few years has spread to Tucson. These law enforcement officers have to make a life or death decision quickly.

[Beetle01]

Pima County Arizona is near the US Mexican border where a massive drug war is being faught by various drug cartels. This violence over the last few years has spread to Tucson. These law enforcement officers have to make a life or death decision quickly.

No doubt, but this was an American citizen who had served two tours for our country.

Now if they had spent 15 minutes on a bullhorn asking for those to come out with their hands up and get on the ground and they did not do so, and then after that they kicked in the door, saw a man with a rifle and opened fire, I would 100% back these guys up for what they did. But to pull up to someones house blare some sirens for a second, knock on the door, yell police and 5 seconds later kick in the door and open fire, I cant back them for that.

[Hoot Gibson]

It turns out that Guerena’s brother was the object of an investigation in a drug case - not Jose Guerena. No drugs were found in Guerena's home.

So, Jose Guerena, fell asleep after working all night in a mine and was awakened by his wife who saw a guy with a gun walk by their window. He grabbed his gun to protect his home from a potential intruder and was gunned down in front of his five-year old son.

This is the same Pima County Sheriff's office that conducted this raid whose sheriff, Clarence Dupnik, immediately blamed the Gabrielle Giffords shooting on “the vitriol that comes out of certain mouths about tearing down the government.” Now, his department is blaming an innocent victim for his own death at the hands of his own SWAT team.

There is absolutely no excuse to send a SWAT team to serve a narcotics warrant when the home's owner is not even a target of an investigation. At least Sheriff Dupnik did not plant drugs in the house to cover up this senseless killing.

Police State Brutality: On The Rise

[Bolt]

If this guy wasnt a veteran, would this have even made the news?
Wouldnt have people probably taken the side of the cops and agreed he was a bad guy no matter the evidence?
It seems to me people are way to out to get cops nowadays and jump to judgement, but i also understand some cops shouldnt be cops and are only there for the power.
But, ill never take a guess unless i know the whole fact.

[Hoot Gibson]

If this guy wasnt a veteran, would this have even made the news?
Wouldnt have people probably taken the side of the cops and agreed he was a bad guy no matter the evidence?
It seems to me people are way to out to get cops nowadays and jump to judgement, but i also understand some cops shouldnt be cops and are only there for the power.
But, ill never take a guess unless i know the whole fact.

If this guy had been anybody else and Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio's SWAT team had killed him in the same manner, the demands by the liberal media and politicians for Sheriff Joe's head would have drowned out all other news, including Weinergate.

Instead, the Pima County Sheriff, an avid Obama supporter and vocal critic of Sarah Palin, Rush Limbaugh, and other high profile conservatives gets a free pass - at least so far.

[vundy33]

If the guy had a weapon and he even made anything resembling a move toward me with that weapon, I would shoot him. Just how it is. Need more details though.

[vundy33]

Actually, I just watched this again. There is no way in hell that this SWAT team is nationally recognized because of their proficiency...that was horrible. Like the article said, looks like a bunch of Afghan Army guys. Just poking their head in the door and spray and pray.

[geauxtigers75]

First it was the guy was suspected of being involved in a drug ring, but there were no drugs or evidence of that, then they said he was suspected of being involved in a break-in ring, but there was also no evidence in that. So now they say he had a gun, which the safety was never off.

They do come in sirens blaring, and I cant tell from the video exactly what is said, but Police is said. But all of this happens in a span of 10 seconds or so, the door is kicked in and the Swat members open fire. (of course at first they said he shot first, but that has since been changed to the police opened fire, 71 shots, he never fired once.)

I mean why not take some time, jump on the bullhorn and ask the guy to come out. It seems the SWAT team was a little jittery from the get go, so why not ask the guy to come out, spend some time negotiating and try to resolve it peacefully rather than drive up to someones house and within 30 seconds bust the door down and open fire.

Police are out of control, more and more videos like this pop up all the time. Also, recently you have the murder on Memorial Day in Miami.

Agreed 100% with the bolded. Guy serves 2 tours in Iraq and gets gunned down in what should be the 'safety' of his home. Pitiful display by this so-called 'SWAT' team. :please: