[TheHotSnakes]

Dudley ! Dudley !

He needs to go somewhere, and then go back to Bell again. And then go another place. And then back to Bell again.

[Don Draper]

You hate to see any guy get fired like this, after two years, but the program was obviously in decline since Paul Rains left.

With that said, I don't think he was their first option when he was hired. I heard Brian Landis, who coaches at Frederick Douglass, was offered the job, but took a job with UK. I heard Oliver Lucas and Dennis Johnson interviewed for the job, too. Looking back, not hiring Johnson was a good move, but why not Oliver Lucas? The guy has been successful everywhere he has been. They should have canceled all other interviews once he applied, in my opinion.

[Don Draper]

Rains was.a great coach at LCA who won a lot of football games. Lawson held several assistant positions and knew his stuff. Held several records at Whitley as a player and is the principal their now.
It's not the character of coach they're hiring. They've had good people in that position willing to do good things.

This is what I think -

No one knows how difficult it is to coach there. They look at it as a school in Lexington that has athletes. Every coach thinks that if they get the right athletes, they can win with their system. That is such a misguided way of thinking. So, when they take the job, they realize it is not close to what they thought, and they bail. It's going to take someone who knows what they're getting into to make this job work.

From what I've heard at work, and it could be completely false, they are looking for a veteran coach who can turn things around. I'm not sure that guy is out there, though.

[Scotty_Bronson]

From the outside looking in, Dunbar is another Greenup CO. Ironic that Mullins has coached a both schools. Greenup always has a solid youth program and a solid feeder system, yet somehow it doesn't pan out at the HS level. Grizzle has made strides in two seasons at Greenup. Dunbar needs to go one or two ways. Find a veteran coach that has a pedigree and reputation that he sticks around, someone not afraid to buck the establishment and shake things up a bit. OR find a young guy that is chomping at the bit for a his shot. Either of the two needs to be given time. Imo, the HC turnover in HS football is ludicrous. Schools don't give a coach enough time. It takes a full season to establish your way of running things. The next season is spent putting those things into a system of practicing your way of doing things. Imo, you don't know what a coach is truly capable of until you see what his first Freshman class, looks like as Seniors, bc those are HIS kids. Not a team he inherited from the previous coach. Good or bad, coaches aren't given enough time in this day and age.

[Don Draper]

From the outside looking in, Dunbar is another Greenup CO. Ironic that Mullins has coached a both schools. Greenup always has a solid youth program and a solid feeder system, yet somehow it doesn't pan out at the HS level. Grizzle has made strides in two seasons at Greenup. Dunbar needs to go one or two ways. Find a veteran coach that has a pedigree and reputation that he sticks around, someone not afraid to buck the establishment and shake things up a bit. OR find a young guy that is chomping at the bit for a his shot. Either of the two needs to be given time. Imo, the HC turnover in HS football is ludicrous. Schools don't give a coach enough time. It takes a full season to establish your way of running things. The next season is spent putting those things into a system of practicing your way of doing things. Imo, you don't know what a coach is truly capable of until you see what his first Freshman class, looks like as Seniors, bc those are HIS kids. Not a team he inherited from the previous coach. Good or bad, coaches aren't given enough time in this day and age.

I agree completely. I think a young guy who isn't afraid to spend long hours at the office and do things the right way is the way to go. Most veteran coaches are in good situations and wouldn't leave for it.

I think the turnover is crazy, especially at public schools. The expectations are getting out of control and we are going to start seeing a decline in quality coaches. I think we already have, actually.

[TheRock]

Rains was.a great coach at LCA who won a lot of football games. Lawson held several assistant positions and knew his stuff. Held several records at Whitley as a player and is the principal their now.
It's not the character of coach they're hiring. They've had good people in that position willing to do good things.

I am going to print and frame this post. Gut has said something nice about a Whitley administration. There are pigs flying overhead. LOL

Was it a moment of weakness or your alter ego?

[Friday Night]

From the outside looking in, Dunbar is another Greenup CO. Ironic that Mullins has coached a both schools. Greenup always has a solid youth program and a solid feeder system, yet somehow it doesn't pan out at the HS level. Grizzle has made strides in two seasons at Greenup. Dunbar needs to go one or two ways. Find a veteran coach that has a pedigree and reputation that he sticks around, someone not afraid to buck the establishment and shake things up a bit. OR find a young guy that is chomping at the bit for a his shot. Either of the two needs to be given time. Imo, the HC turnover in HS football is ludicrous. Schools don't give a coach enough time. It takes a full season to establish your way of running things. The next season is spent putting those things into a system of practicing your way of doing things. Imo, you don't know what a coach is truly capable of until you see what his first Freshman class, looks like as Seniors, bc those are HIS kids. Not a team he inherited from the previous coach. Good or bad, coaches aren't given enough time in this day and age.

Agree PLD or Mullins (whoever made the decision) didn’t give him/himself enough time to get the program established. Mullins made steady gains at Greenup each year however Greenup has really benefited from Grizzle’s long hours and dedication to the off season weight program.
Good luck to PLD on their search for a new HC. Good luck to Mullins, hopefully he will go back into coaching one day.

[Scotty_Bronson]

I think a young guy who is hungry to establish himself is the way to go as well. Sometimes it's not about bucking the administration, or being bull headed towards them, that brings about changes. Alot of times it's simply putting in the extra hours to "work with", when in actuality you are working around, the admins. Not just anyone can come in and instantly be successful. No matter what the program has done as recent as the previous season. Look at Highlands. I was born and raised in the Raceland Worthington school district, graduated from there, played ball there, and now have two sons in the youth program. Bill Tom was the coach from long before I was born, until I was in 2nd grade. Then Hoof took over. He was there until 3 years after I graduated. Then Maynard and now Salmons. Raceland isn't the winningest program in the state by any stretch, no state title banners are hung up around Ram Stadium. We have only won 2 regional titles and then got are asses handed to us on a platter in the semis two years in a row. But we are in the thick of it every year and we are, if nothing else, consistent. I think alot of it has to do with the fact, that in 30 years, there have only been 4 head coaches and each time one stepped out, a staff member stepped in. Now, some would argue that is the very reason we can't get over the hump and I agree with that to an extent. But, we have become a program that a 6-4/7-3 season, is a travesty of a season and I credit our community and culture of the football program for that. Chris is a great dude and a good football coach. He will land on his feet somewhere soon and given the chance by a program AND HIMSELF, he will be successful.

[TheRock]

Gut?

[oldschool77]

Coaching is always the problem when there is a lack of success in parent's eyes. It is easier to blame coaches than all their "little Johnnies" on the field. The mentality of the NBA is rearing it's head in HS sports these days. Coaches are expendable. Easier to change coach than the players or culture. People talk about kid's "moving" to good programs. Easier to move to a program with established success than the years it takes to improve a program from the inside. Harder to get other kids to come out and play for a dismal program. All of these factors promote the status quo and increase the gap between the have's and have not's. Hire someone who the kids will believe in, give him all the resources possible and support him for the next 7 years. Don't pay attention to varsity record for a few years but watch development of feeder program and JV. That's just my opinion. Good luck to Coach Mullins. I have absolutely no association with Coach Mullins or Dunbar, so I have no agenda here. Just see this happen in a lot of programs.

[Iam4thecats]

There have been at least 2 mentions of feeder program in this thread. There is no direct feeder program in Fayette county schools.

[FBfan4life]

Atchley from LCA? What do you all think? His wife is a teacher at Dunbar and if he does well and go really deep in the playoffs with LCA, why shouldn't the hiring committee go after Atchley.

[Malcolm Ex]

It was time for Mullins to go very dispirited tenure

[Malcolm Ex]

Atchley from LCA? What do you all think? His wife is a teacher at Dunbar and if he does well and go really deep in the playoffs with LCA, why shouldn't the hiring committee go after Atchley.

A private school with evangelical white Christian students has not prepared him for a big public school with a lot of diversity and issues.

[oldschool77]

There have been at least 2 mentions of feeder program in this thread. There is no direct feeder program in Fayette county schools.

Have to rely on freshman and JV for insight then. This may be part of the problem. Middle schools that then feed into the HS allow familiarity with the system and the coaching heirarchy.

[Scotty_Bronson]

Coaching is always the problem when there is a lack of success in parent's eyes. It is easier to blame coaches than all their "little Johnnies" on the field. The mentality of the NBA is rearing it's head in HS sports these days. Coaches are expendable. Easier to change coach than the players or culture. People talk about kid's "moving" to good programs. Easier to move to a program with established success than the years it takes to improve a program from the inside. Harder to get other kids to come out and play for a dismal program. All of these factors promote the status quo and increase the gap between the have's and have not's. Hire someone who the kids will believe in, give him all the resources possible and support him for the next 7 years. Don't pay attention to varsity record for a few years but watch development of feeder program and JV. That's just my opinion. Good luck to Coach Mullins. I have absolutely no association with Coach Mullins or Dunbar, so I have no agenda here. Just see this happen in a lot of programs.

Very similar to what I have been saying. Nowhere near enough time is given to HC in this state any more. 7 years is probably the best time frame, but u and I both know that will never happen. At the very least though, they need to give a coach 4. To atleast look at the development of his first Freshman class, when they are seniors. Sadly, the vast majority knows that if a guy can't post a few back to back winning seasons, in this day and age, they will get canned or they will make it impossible for them to stick around. It's really a sad and pitiful situation. It's not like these guys are making a living off of coaching HS football. My question is this though, to PLD. If the hiring of Mullins was based off of his ability to be a Math Teacher, what do they do when he leaves for another coaching job?

[Scotty_Bronson]

Look at the most successful programs in the state over the last 50 years. The big 3, Highlands, Bowling Green, Mayfield, Beechwood, Danville, New Cath, Johnson Central, Belfry, etc. They all have one thing in common. They all have one or two coaches that were there for a long freaking time and nearly groomed their replacements when they left. There's something to be said for that imo.

[Malcolm Ex]

Very similar to what I have been saying. Nowhere near enough time is given to HC in this state any more. 7 years is probably the best time frame, but u and I both know that will never happen. At the very least though, they need to give a coach 4. To atleast look at the development of his first Freshman class, when they are seniors. Sadly, the vast majority knows that if a guy can't post a few back to back winning seasons, in this day and age, they will get canned or they will make it impossible for them to stick around. It's really a sad and pitiful situation. It's not like these guys are making a living off of coaching HS football. My question is this though, to PLD. If the hiring of Mullins was based off of his ability to be a Math Teacher, what do they do when he leaves for another coaching job?

It wasn’t a lack of enough time from what I understand it was his lack of interest he was not good for Dunbar

[TheHotSnakes]

Look at the most successful programs in the state over the last 50 years. The big 3, Highlands, Bowling Green, Mayfield, Beechwood, Danville, New Cath, Johnson Central, Belfry, etc. They all have one thing in common. They all have one or two coaches that were there for a long freaking time and nearly groomed their replacements when they left. There's something to be said for that imo.

There's also the issue of talent, but there is something to be said for the fact that the best teams have minimal coaching turnover.

[Hound05]

Look at the most successful programs in the state over the last 50 years. The big 3, Highlands, Bowling Green, Mayfield, Beechwood, Danville, New Cath, Johnson Central, Belfry, etc. They all have one thing in common. They all have one or two coaches that were there for a long freaking time and nearly groomed their replacements when they left. There's something to be said for that imo.

I agree with ya, having a stable coach there for a long time helps breed success. But that alone won’t help them. You have to look on both sides fence. How many coaches have been around their program forever and they are just mediocre or even worse? A lot. Plus most of the schools you mentioned have Good feeder programs. Which I think is key. PLD can’t do that so they’ll have to adopt a different model or approach to it. It almost sounds like a commitment issue. Like the admin and school almost just don’t care about football. I think they need to go for someone young, who is a players coach that they’ll wanna play for, someone who will energize the program.

[oldschool77]

Sometimes the branches on the coaching tree lose strength. New coach bringing excitement is necessary too. Corbin seems to be a good example of that. I am not from there but thought Haddix was an outsider and he has got them back in contention again. I am sure the administration and people there have given him all he needs to succeed and he has a great MS program with Coach Jackson. I imagine Fayette public school teams lose some talent to LCA, Lex Cath, and whichever the current "it" program is. So certain MS kids do not definitively go to certain high schools due to district boundaries?

[oldschool77]

A private school with evangelical white Christian students has not prepared him for a big public school with a lot of diversity and issues.

Hmm. Wow. Many good coaches can deal with problems of all faiths and color I would believe.

[Iam4thecats]

A private school with evangelical white Christian students has not prepared him for a big public school with a lot of diversity and issues.

The first few years of Atchleys career at LCA he was a teacher at Lafayette. The more you know:biggrin:

[Don Draper]

It wasn’t a lack of enough time from what I understand it was his lack of interest he was not good for Dunbar

This is all second-hand information, but from what I've heard, it was both time and interest. Apparently he was never hardly in the weight room, he missed several practices during the season and he made terrible decisions when it came to the program. Also heard that he let his defensive coordinator and offensive coordinator pretty much run the program throughout the summer and then came in and started changing everything when the season started. I think both of those coaches resigned at the end of the year too. I would like to hear what they have to say about the situation.

[Malcolm Ex]

There's also the issue of talent, but there is something to be said for the fact that the best teams have minimal coaching turnover.

seen em play several times they had no talent anywhere ...

[Malcolm Ex]

This is all second-hand information, but from what I've heard, it was both time and interest. Apparently he was never hardly in the weight room, he missed several practices during the season and he made terrible decisions when it came to the program. Also heard that he let his defensive coordinator and offensive coordinator pretty much run the program throughout the summer and then came in and started changing everything when the season started. I think both of those coaches resigned at the end of the year too. I would like to hear what they have to say about the situation.

for real ...dang that is bad if true ....did not know things was that bad ...

[Don Draper]

for real ...dang that is bad if true ....did not know things was that bad ...

Again second hand information but this guy has a kid who played so take it for what it is worth.

[LivingTheDream]

There have been a lot of talk about Dunbar on here this year, but none of those guys are talking. Where is Fly By Night? hahahahah

[Scotty_Bronson]

This is all second-hand information, but from what I've heard, it was both time and interest. Apparently he was never hardly in the weight room, he missed several practices during the season and he made terrible decisions when it came to the program. Also heard that he let his defensive coordinator and offensive coordinator pretty much run the program throughout the summer and then came in and started changing everything when the season started. I think both of those coaches resigned at the end of the year too. I would like to hear what they have to say about the situation.

I have to say, though I have spoke highly in Chris's regard, I have been friends with Grizzle (now the greenup HC) all my life and from what I can gsther, GCs weight program was pretty well non-exhistent. And this is not the first time I have heard of Mullins lack of interest in an off season program building system. But in regards to having no feeder system, what's the deal with that at PLD?

[Iam4thecats]

I have to say, though I have spoke highly in Chris's regard, I have been friends with Grizzle (now the greenup HC) all my life and from what I can gsther, GCs weight program was pretty well non-exhistent. And this is not the first time I have heard of Mullins lack of interest in an off season program building system. But in regards to having no feeder system, what's the deal with that at PLD?

It has nothing to do with PLD. Fayette county sets up the middle school lines differently than the HS lines. So you can have a school where 11 middle school starters go to 3 different high schools based on the street they live on and the hs lines being different.