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10-29-2008, 08:56 AM
I don't see why people are so blinded by their bias, and their hate for Bush to support some of Obama's ideas.
Ideas such that Obama is going to require Highschool's and Middle Schools to ensure their students do 50 hours of community service each in order to recieve Federal Aid. HE IS going to require 2 years of service in the military, or one of his corps after HS.
In the same questioning of Obama, it was asked if he favored mandatory service in order to have enough military. Obama said, and I paraphrase, that he would favor mandatory service, for both a civilian side and military side, which would make all young Americans responsible to participate in our country's conflicts. This is the institution of a draft for both males and females. So that means "All" of America's children, and future grandchildren would be in the service to America's protection, and in time of war, because the civilian side will also serve in the war zone without exception. Obama's approach to volunteers was a bigger control by government to organize people of all ages to a mandatory service. He said a democracy should have an active participation of all ages. I think his mantra was Active Democracy. To read Obama's actual words please see the "Transcript for 9/11 President Service Forum at Columbia University". It becomes clear right after his comments on his grandfather's service in World War II. (clipsandcomment.com)
Ideas such that Obama is going to require Highschool's and Middle Schools to ensure their students do 50 hours of community service each in order to recieve Federal Aid. HE IS going to require 2 years of service in the military, or one of his corps after HS.
In the same questioning of Obama, it was asked if he favored mandatory service in order to have enough military. Obama said, and I paraphrase, that he would favor mandatory service, for both a civilian side and military side, which would make all young Americans responsible to participate in our country's conflicts. This is the institution of a draft for both males and females. So that means "All" of America's children, and future grandchildren would be in the service to America's protection, and in time of war, because the civilian side will also serve in the war zone without exception. Obama's approach to volunteers was a bigger control by government to organize people of all ages to a mandatory service. He said a democracy should have an active participation of all ages. I think his mantra was Active Democracy. To read Obama's actual words please see the "Transcript for 9/11 President Service Forum at Columbia University". It becomes clear right after his comments on his grandfather's service in World War II. (clipsandcomment.com)
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10-29-2008, 09:22 AM
Obama was quoted in a 1995 Chicago Reader article saying, "individual actions, individual dreams, are not sufficient. We must unite in collective action, build collective institutions and organizations."
Obama's plan is "voluntary" in a technical sense - nobody gets arrested for opting out. But non-participants also won't be allowed to graduate from high school, and without those diplomas, life could get a bit rough.
The plan says: "Schools that require service as part of the educational experience create improved learning environments and serve as resources for their communities. The Obama-Biden plan sets a goal for all students to engage in service, with middle and high school students performing 50 hours of service each year ..."
You see, most public schools depend on federal dollars. And, as Obama elaborated in a speech last December, "At the middle and high school level, we'll make federal assistance conditional on school districts developing service programs, and give schools resources to offer new service opportunities."
Obama's plan is "voluntary" in a technical sense - nobody gets arrested for opting out. But non-participants also won't be allowed to graduate from high school, and without those diplomas, life could get a bit rough.
The plan says: "Schools that require service as part of the educational experience create improved learning environments and serve as resources for their communities. The Obama-Biden plan sets a goal for all students to engage in service, with middle and high school students performing 50 hours of service each year ..."
You see, most public schools depend on federal dollars. And, as Obama elaborated in a speech last December, "At the middle and high school level, we'll make federal assistance conditional on school districts developing service programs, and give schools resources to offer new service opportunities."
10-29-2008, 11:08 AM
Amun-Ra Wrote:I have been reading here and I was wondering.... Why is it bad that Obama wants kids to get off their butts and voulnteer to help their communities? Would you rather them set all day in front of a tv and play games or what?
Because its not volunteering. What about kids who spend every hour off involved in sports, then they have to throw in community service? When do they get time to be kids?
10-29-2008, 01:50 PM
Beetle01 Wrote:Because its not volunteering. What about kids who spend every hour off involved in sports, then they have to throw in community service? When do they get time to be kids?
In a debate in the primary, democratic candidates were asked, "Do you favor conscription?". Obama said he did not favor it. You lecture about blindness. The best I can say about that is this: "When the blind lead the blind, both fall into a ditch." And that's the best I can say about it.
10-29-2008, 01:59 PM
thecavemaster Wrote:In a debate in the primary, democratic candidates were asked, "Do you favor conscription?". Obama said he did not favor it. You lecture about blindness. The best I can say about that is this: "When the blind lead the blind, both fall into a ditch." And that's the best I can say about it.
Of course how many other stances has he changed in the time since the primaries began and now. Just about everything. Biden said last night that its no longer the 250k bracket, its down to the 150k bracket. Soon we'll be right down to McCain's 42k.
10-29-2008, 02:04 PM
Expand Service-Learning in Our Nation's Schools: Obama and Biden will set a goal that all middle and high school students do 50 hours of community service a year. They will develop national guidelines for service- learning and will give schools better tools both to develop programs and to document student experience. Green Job Corps: Obama and Biden will create an energy-focused youth jobs program to provide disadvantaged youth with service opportunities weatherizing buildings and getting practical experience in fast-growing career fields.
Require 100 Hours of Service in College: Obama and Biden will establish a new American Opportunity Tax Credit that is worth $4,000 a year in exchange for 100 hours of public service a year.
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/service/
Now I don't know about you, but I know plenty of people who struggle to get by, goto school full time, work a full time job, and also have kids. Yet he's going to require college students to do an additional 100 hours of service?
Require 100 Hours of Service in College: Obama and Biden will establish a new American Opportunity Tax Credit that is worth $4,000 a year in exchange for 100 hours of public service a year.
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/service/
Now I don't know about you, but I know plenty of people who struggle to get by, goto school full time, work a full time job, and also have kids. Yet he's going to require college students to do an additional 100 hours of service?
10-29-2008, 02:10 PM
Beetle01 Wrote:Of course how many other stances has he changed in the time since the primaries began and now. Just about everything. Biden said last night that its no longer the 250k bracket, its down to the 150k bracket. Soon we'll be right down to McCain's 42k.
I believe in progressive taxation. A tank of gas. A bag of groceries. A parcel of medicine. A modicum of insurance (car, home, health). These expenses take a greater % of total income depending on where one falls on the scale. I believe in progressive taxation. John McCain does not. I am not for John McCain.
10-29-2008, 02:11 PM
The more I look into it, this type of forced service is exactly what Hitler did with the youth of Germany. Under the cover of trying to improve the economy, he required young peoplem, starting at the age of 10. Middle School. To join up for service. He is following Hitler's path to Socialism and or Marxism.
Not surprising, some of his best friends are commies and anti-semites.
Not surprising, some of his best friends are commies and anti-semites.
10-29-2008, 02:15 PM
Beetle01 Wrote:The more I look into it, this type of forced service is exactly what Hitler did with the youth of Germany. Under the cover of trying to improve the economy, he required young peoplem, starting at the age of 10. Middle School. To join up for service. He is following Hitler's path to Socialism and or Marxism.
Not surprising, some of his best friends are commies and anti-semites.
Are you suggesting, just for clarity here, that Obama's thought processes are leading him toward Hiterlesque policies? Are you hinting that Obama is out to destroy Jewish and Anglo-Saxon society?
10-29-2008, 02:29 PM
thecavemaster Wrote:Are you suggesting, just for clarity here, that Obama's thought processes are leading him toward Hiterlesque policies? Are you hinting that Obama is out to destroy Jewish and Anglo-Saxon society?
You're solely focusing on the war and killing, which is not my point. He is trying to install a marxist govt here in America, and you can see this by the direct comparisons of quite a few of his policies and Hitler's. Hitler used these policies to instill his Marxist govt in Germany, and then after that, bad things happened. I'm not saying Obama is going to try and star ww3, or kill Jews. I am saying though he wishes the change this country's way of governing itself
How does the govt having more tax money from those who make more money, help those who don't make as much? You're just wanting a handout from the govt is all. That is a joke, if money is tight for you, get a second job, go back to school, EARN more money. Don't be lazy and expect other people to pay your way.
Alot of my family is in the top 10% and some in the top 1-2%. You know what's going to happen if Obama instills these ideas? They are going to lay workers off, or just close up shop, horde their money, and probably move out of the country. Sell off their stock, crash the markets, and then come back once Obama is thrown in the ocean. So when all these people are gone and their money, who is gonna pay for your social programs?
10-29-2008, 02:31 PM
vundy33 Wrote:I'm not assuming I'm a real man, I know I am. I have a *****. I'm just so sick of most of the people on here *****ing about the Patriot Act like it was made just to spy on us. That's not the case....it was created to protect us, not spy on us.
I am not, of course, speaking about anatomical manhood. If I recall right, I was suggesting that "Nazi Storm Troopers" and "Hitler youth" were being analogized to Obama. If in protecting "America," we lose sight of America's ideals, what have we done? "Those who would forsake essential liberty for temporary security deserve neither." Ben Franklin
10-29-2008, 02:44 PM
vundy33 Wrote:I wouldn't mind if I were spyed on if were for National security. I believe in Country first. I would die for my country if needed. I guess were just going to have to agree to disagree...
Protecting American citizens within Constitutional boundaries, I believe, provides plenty of latitude for intelligence officials to work within. I don't believe the goals of national security and essential liberty are mutually exclusive. It just takes dialogue and understanding from both "sides."
10-29-2008, 02:47 PM
thecavemaster Wrote:Protecting American citizens within Constitutional boundaries, I believe, provides plenty of latitude for intelligence officials to work within. I don't believe the goals of national security and essential liberty are mutually exclusive. It just takes dialogue and understanding from both "sides."
From what sides? Are you talking about dialogue between us and terrorists and rogue states?
10-29-2008, 03:31 PM
Beetle01 Wrote:From what sides? Are you talking about dialogue between us and terrorists and rogue states?
There are those who believe that conservatives would shred the Constitution to keep an outhouse from being used by a "terrorist." There are those who believe that liberals would allow a Super Bowl stadium to be blown to bits with a 100,000 people in it to protect a library card record. These are "sides" who believe nothing good about each other. I agree with Eleanor Roosevelt, who said, basically, that we have to talk with our enemies or else destruction comes to all. We don't have to agree with them, bow down to them, or any such. But we do need to understand them. The Palestinians, for instance, have some legitimate grievances. And, sometimes, when a people find they can't take anymore, they pick up a gun or a brick or a stone. Still, to suggest that a nation should be erased from existence only leads to total blindness.
10-29-2008, 04:09 PM
Beetle01 Wrote:You're solely focusing on the war and killing, which is not my point. He is trying to install a marxist govt here in America, and you can see this by the direct comparisons of quite a few of his policies and Hitler's. Hitler used these policies to instill his Marxist govt in Germany, and then after that, bad things happened. I'm not saying Obama is going to try and star ww3, or kill Jews. I am saying though he wishes the change this country's way of governing itselfI wish they'd just go now! We don't want em here if thats how they feel!
How does the govt having more tax money from those who make more money, help those who don't make as much? You're just wanting a handout from the govt is all. That is a joke, if money is tight for you, get a second job, go back to school, EARN more money. Don't be lazy and expect other people to pay your way.
Alot of my family is in the top 10% and some in the top 1-2%. You know what's going to happen if Obama instills these ideas? They are going to lay workers off, or just close up shop, horde their money, and probably move out of the country. Sell off their stock, crash the markets, and then come back once Obama is thrown in the ocean. So when all these people are gone and their money, who is gonna pay for your social programs?
10-29-2008, 04:12 PM
vundy33 Wrote:I wouldn't mind if I were spyed on if were for National security. I believe in Country first. I would die for my country if needed. I guess were just going to have to agree to disagree...
In Germany they first came for the Communists and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew. Then they came for the trade unionists and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me--and by that time no one was left to speak up."
--Pastor Martin Niemoller.
10-29-2008, 04:13 PM
All tax money does not go for handouts to lazy people. Geez. By the way, if the privatization of social security had of been adopted, guess where the safety net would be? ...in the crapper...
10-29-2008, 05:22 PM
DevilsWin Wrote:In Germany they first came for the Communists and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew. Then they came for the trade unionists and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me--and by that time no one was left to speak up."
--Pastor Martin Niemoller.
Are you sure you served in the military? The more posts you make makes me think you really don't like this country...
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10-29-2008, 05:24 PM
thecavemaster Wrote:All tax money does not go for handouts to lazy people. Geez. By the way, if the privatization of social security had of been adopted, guess where the safety net would be? ...in the crapper...
IMO social security should only be for disabled people and whoever recieves it should be drug tested...Sorry I know that really isn't related to the subject but I had to throw it in.
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10-29-2008, 07:17 PM
vundy33 Wrote:IMO social security should only be for disabled people and whoever recieves it should be drug tested...Sorry I know that really isn't related to the subject but I had to throw it in.
The elderly? All retirement? I'm not talking about disability aspect...the one people call "my social security pension."
10-30-2008, 08:38 AM
In 1926 the Hitler Youth (Hitler-Jugend) group was founded. It was part of Hitler's beliefs that the youth must play an important part in the success of the future of Germany. He felt that children must be trained to not be weak and to be able to perform specific tasks by certain ages. The way to achieve his goals was to ensure children were brought required to actively participate in the Hitler Youth movement
In 1939 it was mandated that all children who are over the age of 17 be active members of the HJ and by 1941 it was mandated that all children over the age of 10 become members of the HJ. As a result, over 90% of Germany's youth were members of the HJ. The indoctrination took place at school and at youth group events.
Hitler's Youths were very active on the German home front. Their participation in the spreading of nationalistic Nazism was essential to the perpetuation of the idea that Germany was working for a future that was very promising.
Compare one Marxist to another. Very similar ideas, and ways of approaching the transformation into Marxism.
In 1939 it was mandated that all children who are over the age of 17 be active members of the HJ and by 1941 it was mandated that all children over the age of 10 become members of the HJ. As a result, over 90% of Germany's youth were members of the HJ. The indoctrination took place at school and at youth group events.
Hitler's Youths were very active on the German home front. Their participation in the spreading of nationalistic Nazism was essential to the perpetuation of the idea that Germany was working for a future that was very promising.
Compare one Marxist to another. Very similar ideas, and ways of approaching the transformation into Marxism.
10-30-2008, 01:45 PM
Beetle01 Wrote:In 1926 the Hitler Youth (Hitler-Jugend) group was founded. It was part of Hitler's beliefs that the youth must play an important part in the success of the future of Germany. He felt that children must be trained to not be weak and to be able to perform specific tasks by certain ages. The way to achieve his goals was to ensure children were brought required to actively participate in the Hitler Youth movement
In 1939 it was mandated that all children who are over the age of 17 be active members of the HJ and by 1941 it was mandated that all children over the age of 10 become members of the HJ. As a result, over 90% of Germany's youth were members of the HJ. The indoctrination took place at school and at youth group events.
Hitler's Youths were very active on the German home front. Their participation in the spreading of nationalistic Nazism was essential to the perpetuation of the idea that Germany was working for a future that was very promising.
Compare one Marxist to another. Very similar ideas, and ways of approaching the transformation into Marxism.
Argument of the extremes: "if your kid don't go to college, he'll end up on the street." Lots of medical students find relief for tution and fees by agreeing to practice for five years in "tough" places. Common practice. Service for college guarantee and the like...compared to a drift toward Marx. If I thought you were serious, it would be hard for me to take you seriously.
10-30-2008, 09:34 PM
Only thing I have to say is anyone that says they would die for their country, particularly this one, is nuts. Why would anyone wanna die for a place that is a terrorist country. The first person that says we arent is in denial. This country bombs other countries for many reasons, number one being for oil, to control everything that goes on in the world. How many of you on here are really that blind and ignorant not to see it. So what if Obama is a socialist, I looked it up and it sounds fine to me. The only reason most people in this country dont want him to win is because he would change the way the rich man lives, and that kills you. Everybody is so afraid of change. Well I welcome it and hope that Obama will do everything he says he will do.
10-30-2008, 10:21 PM
thecavemaster Wrote:The elderly? All retirement? I'm not talking about disability aspect...the one people call "my social security pension."
When I think of disabled I think of the elderly...I know thats not the case everytime but you know what I mean. I didn't know retirement was classified as social security.
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10-30-2008, 10:27 PM
Braves_Fan_26 Wrote:Only thing I have to say is anyone that says they would die for their country, particularly this one, is nuts. Why would anyone wanna die for a place that is a terrorist country. The first person that says we arent is in denial. This country bombs other countries for many reasons, number one being for oil, to control everything that goes on in the world. How many of you on here are really that blind and ignorant not to see it. So what if Obama is a socialist, I looked it up and it sounds fine to me. The only reason most people in this country dont want him to win is because he would change the way the rich man lives, and that kills you. Everybody is so afraid of change. Well I welcome it and hope that Obama will do everything he says he will do.
You are pathetic. I would love to see you say that crap to my face. You don't deserve the privilege of living in this country...why don't you move to Iraq or somewhere like that and get the **** out of our country that you hate so much. It would be nice to see how good you would fit in over there...Coward.
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