Having had the pleasure of watching high school football in Georgia, Florida, Texas, Alabama and California, I am shocked and dismayed at the lack of talent and lack of coaching in KY. There are a few exceptions, but very few. I guess my question is, what do they put in the water, in KY, to stunt the mental and physical growth of football players and coaches. I am from KY and it is painful to watch Trinity and Highlands and Bell County and have to say they are good. Good compared to what? I think it might be time for a relocation, again. As a long time fan of the game, I feel like I deserve more. Now I get to watch UK and Vandy? Man that sucks!
Probably should go on with your bad self. We're obviously not worthy...
OffensiveGuru Wrote:Having had the pleasure of watching high school football in Georgia, Florida, Texas, Alabama and California, I am shocked and dismayed at the lack of talent and lack of coaching in KY. There are a few exceptions, but very few. I guess my question is, what do they put in the water, in KY, to stunt the mental and physical growth of football players and coaches. I am from KY and it is painful to watch Trinity and Highlands and Bell County and have to say they are good. Good compared to what? I think it might be time for a relocation, again. As a long time fan of the game, I feel like I deserve more. Now I get to watch UK and Vandy? Man that sucks!
Could one reason be population (and hence the numbers of kids in the quality pool)?
The states you mentioned are ranked (9) Georgia, (4) Florida, (2) Texas, (23) Alabama and (1) California - in terms of population.
By comparison, KY ranks #26 in state population.
Obviously the anomaly is Alabama but I'm sure tradition and the major metropolitan areas that are in the state dwarf the number of similar size cities in KY.
I agree that population must be a factor, but kids are kids right? And coaches are coaches, right? So why is it a single A team in TX would roll over Trinity? Last time I checked, Trinity was an all boys school with a decent sized population. They are the best we have around here but couldn't compete with schools from some of the areas I mentioned. I just don't get it.
OffensiveGuru Wrote:I agree that population must be a factor, but kids are kids right? And coaches are coaches, right? So why is it a single A team in TX would roll over Trinity? Last time I checked, Trinity was an all boys school with a decent sized population. They are the best we have around here but couldn't compete with schools from some of the areas I mentioned. I just don't get it.
I'm not sure you can make valid comparisons without specifics. For example, you say a Class A team in Texas would roll Trinity.
Unless we know which team you are speaking of there is no way to validate your claim. All we have is your assessment of Trinity.
One key factor would be the time frame you are dealing with (are we talking last 10 years at Trinity or just last 5?) and what is the measuring stick used. For example: Is the bench mark the number of Division 1 or 1-AA players that come out of the program?
If so, then give us a team to compare them too. Trinity has produced a few Div 1 players in the last few years. As has Highlands, St X, Boyle and others would make that list.
I am speaking generally based on what I have observed elsewhere. Tough teams playing tough competition. I cannot give you a specific example based on this season, as I have been here in KY all year. While all of the teams you mentioned have produced some good D-1 talent, one player does not a team make. Individuals can certainly be difference makers but coaching and talent across the board make great teams.
I apologize for starting this thread, it is just frustration setting in. I guess I need to dumb down my expectations and just enjoy what i have at my disposal.
OffensiveGuru Wrote:I am speaking generally based on what I have observed elsewhere. Tough teams playing tough competition. I cannot give you a specific example based on this season, as I have been here in KY all year. While all of the teams you mentioned have produced some good D-1 talent, one player does not a team make. Individuals can certainly be difference makers but coaching and talent across the board make great teams.
I apologize for starting this thread, it is just frustration setting in. I guess I need to dumb down my expectations and just enjoy what i have at my disposal.
Not a problem. I think most states have a level of great talent and a level of not so great talent. The larger the state, the more teams with great talent appear and that makes the discrepency look larger. Here in VA there is a lot of talent and good teams. Some are dominated with talent in the metropolitan areas (Tidewater, NVA, Richmond) and others are just good solid teams in rural areas (Salem, Amherst come to mind). It's not unlike KY IMO but there are more people and therefore more talent/teams. :Thumbs:
Hatz Wrote:Could one reason be population (and hence the numbers of kids in the quality pool)?
The states you mentioned are ranked (9) Georgia, (4) Florida, (2) Texas, (23) Alabama and (1) California - in terms of population.
By comparison, KY ranks #26 in state population.
Obviously the anomaly is Alabama but I'm sure tradition and the major metropolitan areas that are in the state dwarf the number of similar size cities in KY.
Good Post
Hatz Wrote:Could one reason be population (and hence the numbers of kids in the quality pool)?
The states you mentioned are ranked (9) Georgia, (4) Florida, (2) Texas, (23) Alabama and (1) California - in terms of population.
By comparison, KY ranks #26 in state population.
Obviously the anomaly is Alabama but I'm sure tradition and the major metropolitan areas that are in the state dwarf the number of similar size cities in KY.
Actually Louisville is bigger than Birmingham and Montgomery combined and Lexington is slightly larger than either individually.
I wonder how an all-star team from KY would do against some of the better teams around the country...
I've always said that Kentucky's top 3 or 4 teams could compete most years with the best teams of the "Football States". The level of teams after those top 3 or 4 though falls off the chart.
Kentucky compounds the problem by having six classes for a couple hundred teams. Each year only 1 or 2 teams per class have a legitimate shot of winning a state title. Some years, a couple of our state champs would have a tough time winning more than a game or two in other states.
OffensiveGuru Wrote:I wonder how an all-star team from KY would do against some of the better teams around the country...
Against Ohio, Pennsylvania, Texas, California, Florida, Georgia, etc...? They would get crushed nine years out of ten.
I'm not talking all-stars vs. all-stars. I'm saying KY all-stars vs. St. Thomas Aquinas, for example.
OffensiveGuru Wrote:Having had the pleasure of watching high school football in Georgia, Florida, Texas, Alabama and California, I am shocked and dismayed at the lack of talent and lack of coaching in KY. There are a few exceptions, but very few. I guess my question is, what do they put in the water, in KY, to stunt the mental and physical growth of football players and coaches. I am from KY and it is painful to watch Trinity and Highlands and Bell County and have to say they are good. Good compared to what? I think it might be time for a relocation, again. As a long time fan of the game, I feel like I deserve more. Now I get to watch UK and Vandy? Man that sucks!
:worthy: One thing about these states u mentioned , is , they're traditionally football states .. I was stationed in the military in Abilene Tx. for 5 years and football in Texas is king , basketball and most of the other sports are just something u go through to get to football season lol ... I'm sure the other states are similar ... I'm a football guy I've coached high school and grade school in this state , but , this is a B-ball state at most schools , good or bad most coaches and schools are forced to deal with it .... Not making excuses , lack of coaching , with hard work and dedication can be corrected, but , lack of time with players is hard to correct , most kids in our state are b-bll first so you get them when u can .... I'm sure there are some exceptions , but , I think we have some pretty good teams in this state , I , saw alot of football in Texas in my 5 years there and never saw a single A school that could beat the best we have .. JMO ... Starting our kids younger , learning the fundamentals state wide would surely help , and the more football they play the better they'll be .. Things like this years middle school state tourn .. are a step in the right direction , the better the comp. the better players will produce .... :Thumbs: JMO thanks for the time ..... oh yeah and go big blue ... UK ......
irateSho
BluegrassBuckeye Wrote:Actually Louisville is bigger than Birmingham and Montgomery combined and Lexington is slightly larger than either individually.
That was my point. You cited 2 cities in KY who are larger / slightly larger.
Alabama has: Birmingham, Montgomery, Mobile, Huntsville, and 2 Major Universities with decent cities around them. (I didn't even mention Gadsden, Hoover, Dothan, Decataur)
OffensiveGuru Wrote:Having had the pleasure of watching high school football in Georgia, Florida, Texas, Alabama and California, I am shocked and dismayed at the lack of talent and lack of coaching in KY. There are a few exceptions, but very few. I guess my question is, what do they put in the water, in KY, to stunt the mental and physical growth of football players and coaches. I am from KY and it is painful to watch Trinity and Highlands and Bell County and have to say they are good. Good compared to what? I think it might be time for a relocation, again. As a long time fan of the game, I feel like I deserve more. Now I get to watch UK and Vandy? Man that sucks!
Don't let door hit you on the bottom on your way out. :moon:
OffensiveGuru Wrote:I'm not talking all-stars vs. all-stars. I'm saying KY all-stars vs. St. Thomas Aquinas, for example.
Given a full season to practice and play together as a team; the Kentucky kids would do well and win a few games. Thrown together after the season to take on a powerhouse team; they'd get crushed.
OffensiveGuru Wrote:I'm not talking all-stars vs. all-stars. I'm saying KY all-stars vs. St. Thomas Aquinas, for example.
All Star teams lack the team cohesiveness that comes from having a team of talented individuals play a season or more under the direction of a talented coach. I think that it is why some of our Olympic basketball teams often struggle against much less talented teams. It takes time to build great teams.
Great coaching is at least as important as natural talent in building great teams. Kentucky is blessed with some outstanding coaches and some of the teams that you dismiss as inferior can and often do beat more talented teams from bigger football states that are not as well coached. The top teams have both talent and great teams but there are many teams in Texas, Florida, Alabama, etc. that are not top teams.
Hatz Wrote:That was my point. You cited 2 cities in KY who are larger / slightly larger.
Alabama has: Birmingham, Montgomery, Mobile, Huntsville, and 2 Major Universities with decent cities around them. (I didn't even mention Gadsden, Hoover, Dothan, Decataur)
You said
"major metropolitan areas". I sure wouldn't count some of the cities that you named in Alabama as "major metropolitan areas". LOL Anyway, let's move on , huh?
No one in Alabama could beat Trinity. No one!! And have you seen some of the coaching that goes on in Florida and Alabama. A couple of programs have good coaching in those states but overall its terrible. I've seen football in just about every state and in Most years Trinity is good in any state including this year.
Have you seen the defense's in Texas? Well if you haven't, neither have I. They forget about that down there. Two teams in Texas play outstandig defense on a yearly bases and that is Katy, TX and Eulis Trinity, TX. Everyone else hopes for a stop or two and will try and outscore. Did you happen to see that Albeline vs Plant game on ESPN? Those were supposedly two of the best teams in the country with supposedly one of the best players in the country. I saw two teams that were not physical at all with a couple of fast guys and terrible coaching.
nptb17 Wrote:No one in Alabama could beat Trinity. No one!! And have you seen some of the coaching that goes on in Florida and Alabama. A couple of programs have good coaching in those states but overall its terrible. I've seen football in just about every state and in Most years Trinity is good in any state including this year.
Trinity might beat Hoover but they would go into the game as an underdog.
They would be underdogs to the people who don't know football and think that, that is Hoover Alabama and they were on tv some years back. They are too good for anyone in Kentucky.
nptb17 Wrote:They would be underdogs to the people who don't know football and think that, that is Hoover Alabama and they were on tv some years back. They are too good for anyone in Kentucky.
Sure, everybody outside of the state of Kentucky overrate teams like Hoover just because they dominate the teams in football rich states like Alabama. :eyeroll:
I watched a state champion Pratville Alabama team come and play Cincinnati St. X and struggle to get first downs. I watched that same St. X team go to Louisvlle and get smacked in Papa Johns stadium. Trinity won state that year but they also got thumped by Louisville St. X.
OffensiveGuru Wrote:Having had the pleasure of watching high school football in Georgia, Florida, Texas, Alabama and California, I am shocked and dismayed at the lack of talent and lack of coaching in KY. There are a few exceptions, but very few. I guess my question is, what do they put in the water, in KY, to stunt the mental and physical growth of football players and coaches. I am from KY and it is painful to watch Trinity and Highlands and Bell County and have to say they are good. Good compared to what? I think it might be time for a relocation, again. As a long time fan of the game, I feel like I deserve more. Now I get to watch UK and Vandy? Man that sucks!
what kind of game did u have back in the day, hero. was u head and shoulders above all the "lack of talent" players in the state or did u just sit in the stands knowing u could do better then too?
Get over yourself
nptb17 Wrote:I watched a state champion Pratville Alabama team come and play Cincinnati St. X and struggle to get first downs. I watched that same St. X team go to Louisvlle and get smacked in Papa Johns stadium. Trinity won state that year but they also got thumped by Louisville St. X.
In Trinity's best seasons, they have been among the top teams in the nation. This is not one of Trinity's top teams. They dominate the competition in Kentucky because there are far fewer outstanding teams in the state than in larger states. You can't make the case that Trinity would thump Hoover this season because they lost to Cincy St. X in previous seasons and Trinity has beaten St. X before. That is a ridiculous argument, IMO.