This is a freaking joke, no other way to put it.
This is old news...I've been fighting this for 4 months. A Marine Corps buddy of mine and I have been to New York three times over this.
I don't think it's right at all. They may build one but some of the American people will more than likely return the favor, if you smell what I am stepping in.
I personally think it will be a slap in the face to all the people who were victims of 9/11.
I just dont see the problem here.
Just because some Muslim extremists were behind 9/11, doesnt mean all Muslims supported them.
I dont see anything wrong with this either.
The mosque will just be "near" the site of 9/11.
Also, would there be a problem with putting a church "near" the sites of concentration camps in Germany and Poland? I think not.
ukyfootball Wrote:I dont see anything wrong with this either.
The mosque will just be "near" the site of 9/11.
Also, would there be a problem with putting a church "near" the sites of concentration camps in Germany and Poland? I think not.
Why wouldn't they? Poland is a majority Roman Catholic and Germany is largely a Christianity faith.
ukyfootball Wrote:I dont see anything wrong with this either.
The mosque will just be "near" the site of 9/11.
Also, would there be a problem with putting a church "near" the sites of concentration camps in Germany and Poland? I think not.
The "near" its referring to is two blocks over, from which you can see the crash site. It doesn't mean "near" as in "still in New York City but 10 miles away". I believe the families of the victims should vote on this, not some board of people who weren't affected by the disaster.
Yea, I don't agree with this..
Benchwarmer Wrote:Why wouldn't they? Poland is a majority Roman Catholic and Germany is largely a Christianity faith.
Because thats where Jewish followers were brutally massacred by Christians who thought they were superior to everybody.
PC_You_Know Wrote:The "near" its referring to is two blocks over, from which you can see the crash site. It doesn't mean "near" as in "still in New York City but 10 miles away". I believe the families of the victims should vote on this, not some board of people who weren't affected by the disaster.
So we should discriminate against them even though they are US citizens? Right.
American Muslims arent harmful and are actually very nice people. You being scared of their placement of mosques brings flashbacks of the Red Scare.
I've met the guy that wants to put the community center in...I got the vibe that he's doing it in spite but that's just me.
They've used it as a mosque for a long time now...the big deal about it is that they want to make it into an "official" mosque I guess you can say and a community center. There have been hundreds of these mosques in the U.S. that have supported terrorism. I'm not saying that this could be one of those but I'd rather not take the chance of that...I mean look how easy that could happen. They're right next to Ground Zero. That would be a great recruiting tool.
This guy has plenty of money to put this in anywhere else...but he insists on putting it in view of Ground Zero. If he were a religious man, in my opinion, he would respect the majority of families of the people that were killed that day and put the center in a different building. And there are alot of vacant buildings through there.
So Muslims are going to recruit and train their followers now in the middle of New York City? Gotcha.
They've done it before and and they'll do it again? What's so hard to believe about that?
Of course they keep it on the down-lo...good lord, you people are oblivious.
Oblivious? You think we're oblivious? The government now monitors these sort of things. Also, whatever happened to freedom of religion?
That's another thing I'm so sick of. WE ARE IN A WAR. This country will do what it has to to protect itself...it's as simple as that. Don't you see? The people that are in this country and are Islamic extremists use the same argument you do and they get by with this **** for longer. Then, when the FBI starts catching on, they get on the first plane to Egypt, then Yemen.
I'm all for all of these freedoms that this country offers...but when the people who want to kill us use that as a defense for their activities, it's gone a little to far. They can put that mosque anywhere, but they INSIST on putting it there.
So, abide by the constitution unless we're in war? Once again, gotcha. Lets run the country by some unwritten law, just like England in the eighteenth century. We saw where that got them.
I didn't expect you to understand. We agree to disagree. :Thumbs:
ukyfootball Wrote:So, abide by the constitution unless we're in war? Once again, gotcha. Lets run the country by some unwritten law, just like England in the eighteenth century. We saw where that got them.
And I would appreciate if you wouldn't take my posts out of context...Thanks.
Its not like theyre going to be out in the field going terrorist drills. Even if
they are radical (which they probably arent), then theyll be under watchful eyes in New York. Dont worry about it.
vundy33 Wrote:That's another thing I'm so sick of. WE ARE IN A WAR. This country will do what it has to to protect itself...it's as simple as that. Don't you see? The people that are in this country and are Islamic extremists use the same argument you do and they get by with this **** for longer. Then, when the FBI starts catching on, they get on the first plane to Egypt, then Yemen.
I'm all for all of these freedoms that this country offers...but when the people who want to kill us use that as a defense for their activities, it's gone a little to far. They can put that mosque anywhere, but they INSIST on putting it there.
Good post
There are very few radical Muslims in America. To tell a whole church where to go just because a handful are radical is you just being scared.
Yes, the Quran does encourage violence, but so does the Bible.
ukyfootball Wrote:There are very few radical Muslims in America. To tell a whole church where to go just because a handful are radical is you just being scared.
Yes, the Quran does encourage violence, but so does the Bible.
Whoa, whoa, whoa - NOTHING in the bible, and I repeat nothing - in the bible "ENCOURAGES" violence. You show me anyplace, and I say again anyplace, where the bible
encourages the voluntary murder and genocide of another race or creed. You show where it
encourages it! The bible has acts of defense and protection, but to make a comment like encourages is completely an uneducated comment. That's why people fail in their understanding of religion!
Encourages is completely wrong!
Uneducated? Thats you. There are tons of verses in the Bible that talk about rape and slavery.
And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion.--Rev.9:5
In Genesis (20:3-7), God even threatens to kill Abimelech and his people for believing Abe's lies.
You were just served a piece of humble pie, Stardust.
I've read the Quran, it's not radical. I don't know how they twist it up like they do either...
I'm not scared of Muslims my friend. Like you said, not all of them are extremist. We just have to many here in our own country. It seems like everyday on the news there is another guy arrested for terrorist plots or there's another homegrown hajji that has ran off to Yemen.
Everyday? Now youre just exaggerating. There are radical Christians out there too, but Im sure if they were going to build a church "near" Ground Zero you wouldnt have a problem with it.
"It seems like"...
You not see that part of my post? I would have a problem with radical anybody putting anything near Ground Zero...Have you ever heard of Westboro Baptist Church? They're no better than Muslim extremists..
ukyfootball Wrote:Yes, the Quran does encourage violence, but so does the Bible.
I think the old testament of the bible
sometimes encourages violence (but I don't really know the old testament very much because I don't read it very much), but the new testament encourages peace, kindness, etc. Here are a few bible verses I found:
Galatians 5:16-23
16)
I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh.
17) For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish.
18) But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
19) Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness,
20) idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies,
21) envy, murders,[d] drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
22)
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,
23)
gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.
Matthew 5:44
44) But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
All of these bible verses were taken from the King James Version.
I don't mean to offend you with this post or anything, ukyfootball. I just wanted to help a little with this.
I'll go ahead and say it, because I couldn't give a **** less what you people think of me, the people who are against this don't want it there because it's a mosque. Because it's muslims. The people behind 9/11 were muslims. They relate that to this, and they think it's a slap in the face, which it is. This guy should realize that. Don't go into the whole "not all of muslims are radical" speech, I know that. I've known plenty of muslims in my day.
These people want to know why it HAS to be there, instead of a building another block over. It's out of respect for the people who died there. I don't hate the guy, nor do I hate any of the muslims that go there. It's just a matter of respect.
Just like it's a matter of respect to ask the people of Westboro Baptist not to hold signs up that say "Thank God for dead Soldiers" at my bestfriends funeral.
These people are not the same, but you kind of get my point.