Following the Billy Donovan fiasco, some fans mentioned the name of John Pelphrey coming home to Kentucky as head coach. That idea was quickly put down due to Pelphrey's "lack of major coaching experience".
It's been the best thing that's happened to Arkansas. A team with arguably less talent that UK's roster last year and this season, yet Pelphrey is getting visable results.
Hindsight's 20/20, but who would you choose now? Was John Pelphrey qualified after all or is his success at Arkansas a flash in the pan?
I think we should've picked John Pelphry. He is doing a great job with Arkansas...which hasn't really been a big name basketball school.
Stay with Gillespie. The guy is a good coach and can recruit like crazy. Is Arkansas gonna win a title this year? no! are they next? no! THe year after? no! Kentucky going to win this year? probally not. Next year? they have a shot? Year after? its theres to lose!!!! What Im saying is just cause he is winning right know doesnt mean he is going to continue to win and turn Arkansas into a national power.
herd_fan_1 Wrote:Stay with Gillespie. The guy is a good coach and can recruit like crazy. Is Arkansas gonna win a title this year? no! are they next? no! THe year after? no! Kentucky going to win this year? probally not. Next year? they have a shot? Year after? its theres to lose!!!! What Im saying is just cause he is winning right know doesnt mean he is going to continue to win and turn Arkansas into a national power.
Don't you think that "winning now" is a whole lot more appealing to an incoming recruit?
I agree neither team is anywhere near national title contender status, but "winning now" leads to better recruiting and increasing your chances of being a national contender.
Arkansas is winning with less talent than Kentucky right now and it's a direct result of coaching, chemistry and desire to win.
herd_fan_1 Wrote:Stay with Gillespie. The guy is a good coach and can recruit like crazy. Is Arkansas gonna win a title this year? no! are they next? no! THe year after? no! Kentucky going to win this year? probally not. Next year? they have a shot? Year after? its theres to lose!!!! What Im saying is just cause he is winning right know doesnt mean he is going to continue to win and turn Arkansas into a national power.
You must have missed the game last night, Arkansas is probably the favorite in the west and maybe in the whole SEC. I love their style of play, it is fun to watch. At the end of the game they said that Pelphrey had beaten the last 4 top 25 ranked teams that had visited Arkansas, 2 top 10 teams in the last week. His first 2 years he has a better record than Eddie Sutton and Nolan Richardson. JMO but I think we should have hired Pelphrey. Might be hard to get him now, if you read the msg boards, they love him in Arkansas. Trust me, if you haven't seen them play you are missing out.
jammin' jamey Wrote:Don't you think that "winning now" is a whole lot more appealing to an incoming recruit?
I agree neither team is anywhere near national title contender status, but "winning now" leads to better recruiting and increasing your chances of being a national contender.
Arkansas is winning with less talent than Kentucky right now and it's a direct result of coaching, chemistry and desire to win.
True True but it isnt Gillespies faught if some players dont have the desire to win, you cant recruit 2 star prospects just because there going to play hard Gillespie is getting the talent in at UK now its up to the players to start knowing what basketball in Kentucky is all about.
Billie Gillespie had the credentials that proved he was a big school coach at the time of the decision. Though UK has yet to win the the fashion that UK fans are accustomed to, he is the right choice to put UK back at the top of the NCAA. I won't say anything negative in tone to Pelph. I wish him continued success and hope that he takes Arkansas to the peak that they once were (as long as it is right behind UK):dontthink
Is this even a question that needs to be asked?? Look at the recruits that Gillispie has coming in and look at Arkansas's and tell me whose is better.
Pelphrey is doing pretty well at Arkansas but I still choose Billy G because he is still rebuilding and needs time to get his system in, but I do expect great things out of both of them and I do hope Pelphrey eventually comes to UK to coach the Cats someday.
Money Maker Wrote:Is this even a question that needs to be asked?? Look at the recruits that Gillispie has coming in and look at Arkansas's and tell me whose is better.
You're looking at potential on paper. I'm looking at results now. Arkansas is winning with less talent than UK has on their current roster right now thanks to John Pelphrey. That's just my opinion.
Everyone keeps saying that you can't judge Gillispie's performance as coach yet because he doesn't have the kind of players he needs to get the job done. So I guess Pelphrey started with a full roster of players that "he needed" in ordered to win now? There's no Pattersons or Meeks on Arkansas' roster. Imagine if one or both were there?
jammin' jamey Wrote:You're looking at potential on paper. I'm looking at results now. Arkansas is winning with less talent than UK has on their current roster right now thanks to John Pelphrey. That's just my opinion.
Everyone keeps saying that you can't judge Gillispie's performance as coach yet because he doesn't have the kind of players he needs to get the job done. So I guess Pelphrey started with a full roster of players that "he needed" in ordered to win now? There's no Pattersons or Meeks on Arkansas' roster. Imagine if one or both were there?
Very good post.
I have not watched enough of Arkansas to know how they play every game, but in the last two that I have seen, they play with intense effort. That is a missing ingredient with UK. That IMO, is all coach.
I'm not knocking BG, he is the right guy for the job. But what I am asking for is to increase the effort. Too much inconsistency on the defensive end for my liking. When PP gets frustrated, he can take plays off. Many people have posted that Miller plays "lazy". Meeks can be very inconsistent with his effort on both sides of the ball.
A team will have off nights shooting the basketball. They will have nights where they do not execute. And there are nights when the other team is flat out better than you. But there should never be an instance when your effort comes into question. Ther have been times, when UK has not shown the consistent effort.
If Arkansas is showing that effort, then it is the most likely reason why they are overachieving. Does that make Pelphrey a better coach? I don't think so, but what I do like right now is that he is getting more consistent effort from his players than it appears BG is getting out of his.
jammin' jamey Wrote:Following the Billy Donovan fiasco, some fans mentioned the name of John Pelphrey coming home to Kentucky as head coach. That idea was quickly put down due to Pelphrey's "lack of major coaching experience".
It's been the best thing that's happened to Arkansas. A team with arguably less talent that UK's roster last year and this season, yet Pelphrey is getting visable results.
Hindsight's 20/20, but who would you choose now? Was John Pelphrey qualified after all or is his success at Arkansas a flash in the pan?
You really think that Arkansas has less talent then UK?
I love Pelphrey as a coach. He and Gillispie were the two candidates at the time that I really like. But Pelphrey inherited a very talented team with everybody comming back from Stan Heath's team.
Gillispie inherited a much depleted roster after the turmoil that surrounded Tubby Smith's last season. The only real talent he had comming in was Patterson who he had to rerecruit and some very pshycologically fragile gaurds.
I think both coaches have done tremendous jobs at each school. Right now I'll take Gillispie and be happy with it. I would have been happy with either one but I think Gillispie was and is the best choice for the rebuilding job that UK is still going through.
jammin' jamey Wrote:You're looking at potential on paper. I'm looking at results now. Arkansas is winning with less talent than UK has on their current roster right now thanks to John Pelphrey. That's just my opinion.
Everyone keeps saying that you can't judge Gillispie's performance as coach yet because he doesn't have the kind of players he needs to get the job done. So I guess Pelphrey started with a full roster of players that "he needed" in ordered to win now? There's no Pattersons or Meeks on Arkansas' roster. Imagine if one or both were there?
Well Gillispie got patterson himself. So if there is none that good, then Pelphrey isn't recruiting good enough to coach UK. It takes more than a good coach to win games, it takes players that fit right with the system they run and right now Uk is in the process of getting those players. So you would say Arkansas wins the game if they played today???
Less talent huh?? There big man averages a double-double and 4 of there starters average double digits. Both good coaches though and I'd been happy with either.
herd_fan_1 Wrote:Stay with Gillespie. The guy is a good coach and can recruit like crazy. Is Arkansas gonna win a title this year? no! are they next? no! THe year after? no! Kentucky going to win this year? probally not. Next year? they have a shot? Year after? its theres to lose!!!! What Im saying is just cause he is winning right know doesnt mean he is going to continue to win and turn Arkansas into a national power.
I agree. Give Gillispie a chance people.
Money Maker Wrote:Less talent huh?? There big man averages a double-double and 4 of there starters average double digits.
FBALL Wrote:You really think that Arkansas has less talent then UK?
So how high was Michael Washington recruited back in 2005? He was ranked 35th overall by rivals.com in 2006 and received offers from Kansas State, Oklahoma State, Georgia, Arkansas State, UCONN, Oklahoma and Arizone. Played 1 1/2 minutes per game freshman year then 13 minutes last season. Now he's averaging a double/double. He was a regional recruit and received only one offer for a true power: UCONN.
Arkansas lost its top five scorers from last season's team that made the second round of the NCAA tournament, their improving this season and in my opinion, their overachieving. Nobody thought Arkansas would be in this position so soon.
Ark was (18-12) the season prior to Pelphrey's arrival and missed the NCAA tournament. Arkansas hasn't be a national factor in basketball since the late 90's. And you guys think that Tubby left Kentucky in a tougher spot than Arkansas' situation? I'm just not buying it.
Maybe Feb. 14th will answer a few questions for this thread.
From UK's site.
Arkansas (CBS)Day: Saturday
Date: Feb. 14, 2009
Location: Fayetteville, Ark.
Time: 1:00 p.m. ET
From Arkansas's site.
Sat, Feb 14 Kentucky * - Fayetteville, Ark. 12:05 p.m.
CBS
I see now, John is going to try to get in about 55 minutes of the game before Billy gets there, LOL.
FTR, I would just as soon have John as the coach, but maybe I'm biased.
jammin' jamey Wrote:So how high was Michael Washington recruited back in 2005? He was ranked 35th overall by rivals.com in 2006 and received offers from Kansas State, Oklahoma State, Georgia, Arkansas State, UCONN, Oklahoma and Arizone. Played 1 1/2 minutes per game freshman year then 13 minutes last season. Now he's averaging a double/double. He was a regional recruit and received only one offer for a true power: UCONN.
Arkansas lost its top five scorers from last season's team that made the second round of the NCAA tournament, their improving this season and in my opinion, their overachieving. Nobody thought Arkansas would be in this position so soon.
Ark was (18-12) the season prior to Pelphrey's arrival and missed the NCAA tournament. Arkansas hasn't be a national factor in basketball since the late 90's. And you guys think that Tubby left Kentucky in a tougher spot than Arkansas' situation? I'm just not buying it.
Back your word up with some ways Pelphrey coaches that makes Arkansas so good.
jammin' jamey Wrote:So how high was Michael Washington recruited back in 2005? He was ranked 35th overall by rivals.com in 2006 and received offers from Kansas State, Oklahoma State, Georgia, Arkansas State, UCONN, Oklahoma and Arizone. Played 1 1/2 minutes per game freshman year then 13 minutes last season. Now he's averaging a double/double. He was a regional recruit and received only one offer for a true power: UCONN.
Arkansas lost its top five scorers from last season's team that made the second round of the NCAA tournament, their improving this season and in my opinion, their overachieving. Nobody thought Arkansas would be in this position so soon.
Ark was (18-12) the season prior to Pelphrey's arrival and missed the NCAA tournament. Arkansas hasn't be a national factor in basketball since the late 90's. And you guys think that Tubby left Kentucky in a tougher spot than Arkansas' situation? I'm just not buying it.
When Pelphrey came in Arkansas was 18-12 the year before and returned everybody. Weems, Beverly, the 7 footer whose name I can't remember right now. Last year there was alot of experience and talented players on that team. Even if Heath would have been kept on there were alot of people that expected good things from them last year.
Without a doubt the hogs and Pelphrey have exceeded expectations this year. They did get a boost when Monk returned for a year of basketball. Nobody is saying that Pelphrey is not doing a great job or that they wouldn't have wanted him as the UK coach. I would have taken him in a heartbeat. But Gillispie was my first choice before Donovan, Ford, Pitino, Pelphrey,, anybody. But that was just my opinion on it.
Kentucky is still not that talented. After Patterson and Meeks anybody else on the roster is average at best. I like Porter and love his attitude but basketball talent wise he is very average. Stevenson was not highly recruited at all. Harrellson and Galloway are JC transfers that should be roll players. Harris is average at best. Liggins and Miller have potential but have yet to show that they are ready to step into a big roll. Out side of Patterson and Meeks Arkansas probably has an advantage at every position.
Protect_This_House26 Wrote:I think we should've picked John Pelphry. He is doing a great job with Arkansas...which hasn't really been a big name basketball school.
There goes all your credibility.
Id rather have BCG any day!
FBALL Wrote:When Pelphrey came in Arkansas was 18-12 the year before and returned everybody. Weems, Beverly, the 7 footer whose name I can't remember right now. Last year there was alot of experience and talented players on that team. Even if Heath would have been kept on there were alot of people that expected good things from them last year.
Without a doubt the hogs and Pelphrey have exceeded expectations this year. They did get a boost when Monk returned for a year of basketball. Nobody is saying that Pelphrey is not doing a great job or that they wouldn't have wanted him as the UK coach. I would have taken him in a heartbeat. But Gillispie was my first choice before Donovan, Ford, Pitino, Pelphrey,, anybody. But that was just my opinion on it.
Kentucky is still not that talented. After Patterson and Meeks anybody else on the roster is average at best. I like Porter and love his attitude but basketball talent wise he is very average. Stevenson was not highly recruited at all. Harrellson and Galloway are JC transfers that should be roll players. Harris is average at best. Liggins and Miller have potential but have yet to show that they are ready to step into a big roll. Out side of Patterson and Meeks Arkansas probably has an advantage at every position.
Yayyyy, Me and You finally agree on something!!
Money Maker Wrote:Back your word up with some ways Pelphrey coaches that makes Arkansas so good.
Watch. Defense for offense substitutions late in the game, He sat Michael Washington and Courtney Fortson for most of the first half with only two fouls each, keeping the game close for the most part leads for TX ranging about 4-8. He gets the most out of his players from what I've seen. Recruiting to him isn't about let's get this guy because he's a five-star. He gets what he needs and doesn't take attitude, Montrell McDonald who most likely would have started was kicked off the team mid-season after being suspended even from practice. He has asembled a team with shooters- Clarke and Welsh, big-guys that are solid- Washington and Sanchez (Brandon Moore is raw, but will be a future stud, and Andre Clark has shown flahses of potential) A TRUE PG in Courtney Fortson. And he can't recruit? He has won 3 away from UK already in Sanchez, Forston, and Clarke. His intensity as a Coach is very high. He is I believe 6-0 against the top 25 at Arkansas. He took USA who had been very down and tourned them into two of their best teams in school history with wins and close games with SEC schools. His offenses are created with defense (Much like Pitino's), full court press a lot. He won with a team that had very much underacheived and developed Micheal Washington, Stefan Welsh, Darian Townes, and Gary Ervin into good players in just one or two years. He won the first NCAA tournamnet game for Arkansas since the ninties. Players will respect him or they will not be there. He starts the players who need to start and will bench players if they aren't on (Welsh was taken out of the starting lineup earlier this year). Arkansas may get the top recruits right now but they soon will when the winning returns and it is. Remember this team starts 3 freshman and two juniors. Anything else you want to know?
TheRealVille Wrote:Maybe Feb. 14th will answer a few questions for this thread.
From UK's site.
Arkansas (CBS)Day: Saturday
Date: Feb. 14, 2009
Location: Fayetteville, Ark.
Time: 1:00 p.m. ET
From Arkansas's site.
Sat, Feb 14 Kentucky * - Fayetteville, Ark. 12:05 p.m.
CBS
I see now, John is going to try to get in about 55 minutes of the game before Billy gets there, LOL.
FTR, I would just as soon have John as the coach, but maybe I'm biased.
Arkansas is on CT time.
As for the original question. John has a lot to lose if he coaches at UK. The unrealistic fan expectations, could tarnish his career at UK. Arkansas fans are happy with him and want to sign him to a long term contract and apparently UK fans are too good for him, so the current situation may be best for all parties involved. I do, however, believe he will be the head coach of UK in the near future.
Panther Thunder Wrote:Watch. Defense for offense substitutions late in the game, He sat Michael Washington and Courtney Fortson for most of the first half with only two fouls each, keeping the game close for the most part leads for TX ranging about 4-8. He gets the most out of his players from what I've seen. Recruiting to him isn't about let's get this guy because he's a five-star. He gets what he needs and doesn't take attitude, Montrell McDonald who most likely would have started was kicked off the team mid-season after being suspended even from practice. He has asembled a team with shooters- Clarke and Welsh, big-guys that are solid- Washington and Sanchez (Brandon Moore is raw, but will be a future stud, and Andre Clark has shown flahses of potential) A TRUE PG in Courtney Fortson. And he can't recruit? He has won 3 away from UK already in Sanchez, Forston, and Clarke. His intensity as a Coach is very high. He is I believe 6-0 against the top 25 at Arkansas. He took USA who had been very down and tourned them into two of their best teams in school history with wins and close games with SEC schools. His offenses are created with defense (Much like Pitino's), full court press a lot. He won with a team that had very much underacheived and developed Micheal Washington, Stefan Welsh, Darian Townes, and Gary Ervin into good players in just one or two years. He won the first NCAA tournamnet game for Arkansas since the ninties. Players will respect him or they will not be there. He starts the players who need to start and will bench players if they aren't on (Welsh was taken out of the starting lineup earlier this year). Arkansas may get the top recruits right now but they soon will when the winning returns and it is. Remember this team starts 3 freshman and two juniors. Anything else you want to know?
Nope thats about everything I was wanting to know!! Thanks!!!
Panther Thunder Wrote:Arkansas is on CT time.
It was a joke.
Panther Thunder Wrote:As for the original question. John has a lot to lose if he coaches at UK. The unrealistic fan expectations, could tarnish his career at UK. Arkansas fans are happy with him and want to sign him to a long term contract and apparently UK fans are too good for him, so the current situation may be best for all parties involved. I do, however, believe he will be the head coach of UK in the near future.
Good post! The one prior was equally as good. :Thumbs:
Arkansas' play & attitude speaks for how Pelphrey coaches. Enough said.
I want BCG to succeed and UK to win. I started this thread just to look at hindsight in the fact that Pelphrey was qualified after all to be at UK in the first place.
I think that either one is a good choice. That being said if you have a chance to take a kid from kentucky and have him coach Kentucky it may mean more than someone from outside the organization. Pelphry is a good coach who is getting better. Travis Ford also would have been a good fit in my opinion. But it would have been great to se Pelphry is a blue jacket instead of that ugly red one.
You gotta give him 2 more years. To get Tubbys crappy players out of there.