well, didnt witness the game, but sounds like everybody is to blame, coaches made bad decisions, players made bad decisions, but above all else, no matter what, how do you not get fired up for this game? it doesnt matter whats goin on, as a player, you never give up! it doesnt matter whats going on. you never give up! as for the blame, really does sound like everybody is to blame
SmackDaddy2 Wrote:THIS RUSSELL TEAM IS JUST FINE!! The players were not ready to play, and the coaches made no adjustment to what the Ashland coaches laid on the table for them! Anybody that knows anything about Football could see that!!! The coaches are the ultimate leaders of any team, and have to take responsibility no matter what happens! I am sure that the ship will be righted for the future and all is not lost! I hope most of us Russell fans can rebound also! It almost makes me sick to read some of the post on here! These young men have not given up the ship! Lets give them a break and let them do there jobs! The ashland game was not as bad as the score indicated, nor was it very pretty! But all will work its self out I am sure! I sure would not want some young players to give up as easily as some fans do! If we have to judge them, lets a least give them the benefit of a full season! REMEMBER 2005!
What most are concerned about was the standing around. I have never seen that before with a Russell team. One play in particular was the kickoff in the second half to Abrams. Not one Ashland player was blocked and the Russell players were standing around watching there leader get the snot knocked out of him. Not one came over to even help him up off the ground.
We have a great bunch of kids who will respond. I have seen no post on here that would indicate that they would give up the season. Most say they got smacked in the mouth and will respond. I also have not seen anyone point to any one player in a negative manner. You have to take the good with the bad. We always say just how good they are. Bottom line from the head Coach on down it was a bad half of football for Russell. I would not want to be Carter county on Friday.
FBALL Wrote:For all of you who think the players don't need to hear or read the criticism you need to grow up. They have been told how great they are enough. Sure they are high school kids. But they are not babies. Maybe hearing they are not as great they think they are is exactly what some of them need. Sure the coaching staff takes some of the blame. But the attitude of the players is something that can't be coached.
If this makes any of the players mad. Well good. Do something about. Prove me wrong. I would love nothing more than to see this team regroup and run the table.
Also you are right about some of the fans. Some of them are not true fans. Some know nothing about the game of football. All they want is to tell the players and coaches how great they are win they are winning and whine when they are losing.
I for one don't have a problem with losing a game. Its going to happen. I do have a problem with what I saw friday night and for that matter even in the Boyd County game. I saw lazy and I saw some players just give up. That I do have a problem with.
On another note. I had a talk today with someone whose relative played for Russell in the past. This person told me how his relative "made Russell football". "Russell was nothing before this person and they will be nothing after him." is what I was told. Never mind all the other great players that have gone through this school. This is the kind of attitude we are talking about. ITS NOT ABOUT ONE PERSON.
For the players, the person that told me that works at Raceland and told me the Rams were going to embarress you when the time comes. Do us all a favor and show the teamwork and character that it takes to win championships.
The talent is there. There is no way I would question the talent in this group. Lets see if they can come up with a championship attitude.
I agree with what you have stated. Some people just don't understand that if it walks like a duck and it quacks like a duck 99.99% of the time it's a duck. If we don't tell our own that they played poorly who in the heak is going to do it. Some think it is overkill. I challenge anyone to ask any Russell player how they felt about thier performance. I would bet they will tell you the same stuff you are hearing on here. Russell will respond.
EKY Sportster Wrote:Well, from a neutral party, if the players see the game get out of hand and if the players see the coaching staff doing the same thing over and over and it isn't working, then wouldn't you expect the players to give up. You can only try to topple a brick wall for so long before the fire is gone. I don't know the Russell players and I didn't watch the game, but from what I am hearing the coaching staff wasn't as prepared as they needed to be, didn't apparently make the necessary adjustments and brought down the morale of the team. That is surprising considering the coaching staff Russell has, but that is what you guys seem to be saying. If that is the case, then I would blame this performance (not necessarily this loss because Ashland is a good team) squarely on the coaching staff and give the players a break. There comes a point when effort becomes futile!
I'm sure Ivan would have called some different plays based on the results. We love him when he wins and we still love him when he looses. We at Russell just like a winner better.
I truely beleive if we were to play Ashland again in week 10 the result just might be different.
Bottom line, Cats out played Devils.
Russell may have been beaten up and outplayed by Ashland I bet it won't happen again this year.If you guys don't ease up on them their going to hurt East real bad.I'm sure every player and coach knows what happen and they will get it fixed.
Tough loss for Russell. Get it out of your system guys and prepare for next week. Go Red-Devils!
Congrats Ashland and I know Russell will rebound with this lose.
Dang, Didnt see this coming. Congrats Ashland.
I still think its was the play calling that did it in for the Devils.
Some_Kid Wrote:I still think its was the play calling that did it in for the Devils.
May have had a little to do with it. What plays would you have called so that Russell would have won?
Well not really any players maybe some different plays you cant move the ball running 8 36, 10 34 and 1036 about 500 times.
Some_Kid Wrote:Well not really any players maybe some different plays you cant move the ball running 8 36, 10 34 and 1036 about 500 times.
Once again what plays would you have Run? Screen pass, draw play, Ect.
At times it is a good idea to run a play over and over until you get it right. Why move on to other plays when you are having a difficult time executing your bread and butter plays. I think a couple of screen passes would have slowed the defense down and kept them honest.
I don't think a screen would have worked they couldn't even run bootleg pass with the lineman stationary. So taking away the tackle and gaurd off the line would have been bad.
As far as the standing around goes...all the returning starters of last years team stood around last year also except for abrams and rice...
anybody that knows ivan knows its all about exacution, he has been there for 30 years and every year he does pretty much the same thing. if he calls a play and it doesn't work he is going to call it again, that is pounded into players head "run it til you get it right" his record speaks for itself. so its up to the players to respond. if talent or strengh is the issue then they just take their lumps and move on, i can only recall one year that he went away from the wing t, do to being so low on talent and that was the 98 season with wyatt and day going to the shotgun just to be able to get outside. so with that said you can count on a rough week of practice so the players can relearn their assignments and the fans will see the same plays week after week, because thats ivan ball
Some_Kid Wrote:I don't think a screen would have worked they couldn't even run bootleg pass with the lineman stationary. So taking away the tackle and gaurd off the line would have been bad.
So once again You failed to tell me what plays you would have run. I suggested a screen pass and you indicated that that would not work. WHAT PLAYS WOULD YOU HAVE RUN?
FBALL Wrote:For all of you who think the players don't need to hear or read the criticism you need to grow up. They have been told how great they are enough. Sure they are high school kids. But they are not babies. Maybe hearing they are not as great they think they are is exactly what some of them need. Sure the coaching staff takes some of the blame. But the attitude of the players is something that can't be coached.
If this makes any of the players mad. Well good. Do something about. Prove me wrong. I would love nothing more than to see this team regroup and run the table.
Also you are right about some of the fans. Some of them are not true fans. Some know nothing about the game of football. All they want is to tell the players and coaches how great they are win they are winning and whine when they are losing.
I for one don't have a problem with losing a game. Its going to happen. I do have a problem with what I saw friday night and for that matter even in the Boyd County game. I saw lazy and I saw some players just give up. That I do have a problem with.
On another note. I had a talk today with someone whose relative played for Russell in the past. This person told me how his relative "made Russell football". "Russell was nothing before this person and they will be nothing after him." is what I was told. Never mind all the other great players that have gone through this school. This is the kind of attitude we are talking about. ITS NOT ABOUT ONE PERSON.
For the players, the person that told me that works at Raceland and told me the Rams were going to embarress you when the time comes. Do us all a favor and show the teamwork and character that it takes to win championships.
The talent is there. There is no way I would question the talent in this group. Lets see if they can come up with a championship attitude.
I know who you're talking about. For that guy to criticize anyone playing a sport I think makes him possibly the biggest hypocrite in the world. His brother is very talented player. While he struggles to walk and chew gum.
PBurg1313 Wrote:Wow, all I have read is fans sitting here bashing the players. Real fans stand behind their team whether they are mad at first they look past it and just say its okay guys you win some you lose some so regroup and take what you can from this game and get better. And Devilologist why dont you go and watch film my god, every lineman was on someone and there was still more guys coming. If all you Russell fans are going to sit here and do is criticize your team for their game then you all aren't the fans i really thought you all were. And i know if i was one of those Russell players i would hate everyone of you that is sitting here bashing them. And im sure they do, you all are wrong for doing that. What would have happened if Russell would have beaten Ashland?.........NOTHING AT ALL!!! Life goes on... you all would be saying oh well just another win. We are all grown men so why dont you all act like ones.
From a stands view and a neutral side on this it looked like Ashland played their best tonight they studied Russell inside and out. It didn't matter who the lineman blocked there was still 3 guys coming.
Russell never capitalized on any of Ashlands mistakes. Russell got beat in every aspect of the game including coaching.
And coming from a past player
And Russell should have passed, but on 1st down rather than 3rd down.
EKY Sportster Wrote:Well, from a neutral party, if the players see the game get out of hand and if the players see the coaching staff doing the same thing over and over and it isn't working, then wouldn't you expect the players to give up. You can only try to topple a brick wall for so long before the fire is gone. I don't know the Russell players and I didn't watch the game, but from what I am hearing the coaching staff wasn't as prepared as they needed to be, didn't apparently make the necessary adjustments and brought down the morale of the team. That is surprising considering the coaching staff Russell has, but that is what you guys seem to be saying. If that is the case, then I would blame this performance (not necessarily this loss because Ashland is a good team) squarely on the coaching staff and give the players a break. There comes a point when effort becomes futile!
sore_looser Wrote:I can't believe that some of these kids for Ruseell have even been to a practice this year. This is the most unconditioned team I have seen Russell have. Also, congrats to Ashland and the freshman QB, they made adjustments to win, and that they did.
The determination may not have been what everyone liked, but EKYsportster hit the nail on the head. These kids aren't stupid, they know what they need to do to win. When you spend the last two weeks putting in new plays and only use one of them one time and it went for 60+ yds.
Pburg is right also, even if our line was outmatched, it didn't matter, they could all pancake their assignment and there would still be 3 or 4 guys untouched. Ashland had 2 DB's in the game. TWO!!! They brought the house and all we did was run play action passes or Abrams off tackle. Which is what the bootleg is, playaction doesn't work if the other team is bringing 9 guys.
sore_looser,, you obviously know nothing about the Russell conditioning program. It's a play yourself into shape program. So when you spend 2 of the first 3 games on the sidelines the entire second half, you get the kind of effort we saw in the 4th quarter.
Our line is not as bad as it looked, are they great? no but they have some very talented linemen. They also have some young inexperienced ones. Ashland coaches knew that and brought everything they had, they know Ivan like the rest of us do. He's gonna run the off tackle play, if we win we win, if we lose we lose. It's how its always been, its how it will be until he is gone.
I still can't get over the no defensive adjustments, why do you stay with the same thing if it is not working? Why have 4 DB's in the game when their QB has a noodle for an arm, I promise I can pass better left handed than that kid can. Noone can answer these questions. Russell should have been running the same D Ashland was using. I guess we will see if things change, however, they never did in the past and I don't expect they will now. They have a game now to work on some new things. Also, sorry for EC but I don't care if its 90-0 the first team needs to stay in, they have to get in shape. I know you don't want to risk injury but its halway through the season and these kids have about 1 half in them right now.
Jeepman Wrote:Once again what plays would you have Run? Screen pass, draw play, Ect.
At times it is a good idea to run a play over and over until you get it right. Why move on to other plays when you are having a difficult time executing your bread and butter plays. I think a couple of screen passes would have slowed the defense down and kept them honest.
I agree with the passing idea! But to keep running off tackle when Ashland is plainly ready for that play seems futile! It might be bread and butter against some of the smaller teams, but give Asland credit they are not small, and was clearly prepared to stop Abrams!
But if you want some examples of some plays- screens, counters, passes over the middle to tight end (especially when they are blitzing), but one that really blows me away was the halfback pass that got big yardage and they never came back with it! If it works keep using it! The coaches clearly needed to take some of the pressure off the interior line to be sucessful last Friday!!
But as I stated earlier, I think the adjustments will be made! This is another really good Russell Football team and the full season will prove it for them!
WOW!!! Well i didn't see this one comin...........Great game Ashland layed the smack on ol Russell.
SmackDaddy2 Wrote:I agree with the passing idea! But to keep running off tackle when Ashland is plainly ready for that play seems futile! It might be bread and butter against some of the smaller teams, but give Asland credit they are not small, and was clearly prepared to stop Abrams!
But if you want some examples of some plays- screens, counters, passes over the middle to tight end (especially when they are blitzing), but one that really blows me away was the halfback pass that got big yardage and they never came back with it! If it works keep using it! The coaches clearly needed to take some of the pressure off the interior line to be sucessful last Friday!!
But as I stated earlier, I think the adjustments will be made! This is another really good Russell Football team and the full season will prove it for them!
They will be better football players after Friday.
This Ashland team must be for real at stopping the run. They held a pretty good Pikeville running game to 0 points and now man handles Russell's.
HazzBeen Wrote:This Ashland team must be for real at stopping the run. They held a pretty good Pikeville running game to 0 points and now man handles Russell's.
Well they completely sell out to it. None of thse running teams they have played have tried throwing the ball.
Ashland run's a 6-3 and brings the house on every play.
Beetle01 Wrote:The determination may not have been what everyone liked, but EKYsportster hit the nail on the head. These kids aren't stupid, they know what they need to do to win. When you spend the last two weeks putting in new plays and only use one of them one time and it went for 60+ yds.
Pburg is right also, even if our line was outmatched, it didn't matter, they could all pancake their assignment and there would still be 3 or 4 guys untouched. Ashland had 2 DB's in the game. TWO!!! They brought the house and all we did was run play action passes or Abrams off tackle. Which is what the bootleg is, playaction doesn't work if the other team is bringing 9 guys.
sore_looser,, you obviously know nothing about the Russell conditioning program. It's a play yourself into shape program. So when you spend 2 of the first 3 games on the sidelines the entire second half, you get the kind of effort we saw in the 4th quarter.
Our line is not as bad as it looked, are they great? no but they have some very talented linemen. They also have some young inexperienced ones. Ashland coaches knew that and brought everything they had, they know Ivan like the rest of us do. He's gonna run the off tackle play, if we win we win, if we lose we lose. It's how its always been, its how it will be until he is gone.
I still can't get over the no defensive adjustments, why do you stay with the same thing if it is not working? Why have 4 DB's in the game when their QB has a noodle for an arm, I promise I can pass better left handed than that kid can. Noone can answer these questions. Russell should have been running the same D Ashland was using. I guess we will see if things change, however, they never did in the past and I don't expect they will now. They have a game now to work on some new things. Also, sorry for EC but I don't care if its 90-0 the first team needs to stay in, they have to get in shape. I know you don't want to risk injury but its halway through the season and these kids have about 1 half in them right now.
You mean Russell has a conditioning program?
Beetle01 Wrote:The determination may not have been what everyone liked, but EKYsportster hit the nail on the head. These kids aren't stupid, they know what they need to do to win. When you spend the last two weeks putting in new plays and only use one of them one time and it went for 60+ yds.
Pburg is right also, even if our line was outmatched, it didn't matter, they could all pancake their assignment and there would still be 3 or 4 guys untouched. Ashland had 2 DB's in the game. TWO!!! They brought the house and all we did was run play action passes or Abrams off tackle. Which is what the bootleg is, playaction doesn't work if the other team is bringing 9 guys.
sore_looser,, you obviously know nothing about the Russell conditioning program. It's a play yourself into shape program. So when you spend 2 of the first 3 games on the sidelines the entire second half, you get the kind of effort we saw in the 4th quarter.
Our line is not as bad as it looked, are they great? no but they have some very talented linemen. They also have some young inexperienced ones. Ashland coaches knew that and brought everything they had, they know Ivan like the rest of us do. He's gonna run the off tackle play, if we win we win, if we lose we lose. It's how its always been, its how it will be until he is gone.
I still can't get over the no defensive adjustments, why do you stay with the same thing if it is not working? Why have 4 DB's in the game when their QB has a noodle for an arm, I promise I can pass better left handed than that kid can. Noone can answer these questions. Russell should have been running the same D Ashland was using. I guess we will see if things change, however, they never did in the past and I don't expect they will now. They have a game now to work on some new things. Also, sorry for EC but I don't care if its 90-0 the first team needs to stay in, they have to get in shape. I know you don't want to risk injury but its halway through the season and these kids have about 1 half in them right now.
I think it happened way before the 4th quater. Hands on hips, helmets off, not a good sign.
I believe this thread has reached DEAD HORSE status...
Put it behind us and move on...I'm sure the players have gotten the message by now...
Beetle01 Wrote:Well they completely sell out to it. None of thse running teams they have played have tried throwing the ball.
Ashland run's a 6-3 and brings the house on every play.
Well then they better change that as they get into their district schedule or they will be put away pretty quick!
sports_report Wrote:anybody that knows ivan knows its all about exacution, he has been there for 30 years and every year he does pretty much the same thing. if he calls a play and it doesn't work he is going to call it again, that is pounded into players head "run it til you get it right" his record speaks for itself. so its up to the players to respond. if talent or strengh is the issue then they just take their lumps and move on, i can only recall one year that he went away from the wing t, do to being so low on talent and that was the 98 season with wyatt and day going to the shotgun just to be able to get outside. so with that said you can count on a rough week of practice so the players can relearn their assignments and the fans will see the same plays week after week, because thats ivan ball
Your right. As far as his record goes, I think just about any coach could match the same record. Russell especially over the last 5 years had a weak weak weak weak schedule, maybe the weakest in the state. Yeah they on a state championship, and not to take anything away from that team. They didn't play a team that I would rate more than average. OC was bad, and the Belfry team they played was down.
Talent and strength isn't the issue. Its just that this teams talents and strengths aren't to run up the middle against 11 men in the box. I'm sorry there is no excuse for that, execution isn't the problem, as Ive stated the line could have all flat backed their assignments and there's still 3-4 unblocked players. Could they have done better? Absoloutely, but its not all their fault.
Jeepman you keep asking what plays they should have run. Well its simple, any 3 step drop passes, quick rollout passes that don't require play action, or even a toss play to the outside would have maybe worked.
Beetle01 Wrote:Your right. As far as his record goes, I think just about any coach could match the same record. Russell especially over the last 5 years had a weak weak weak weak schedule, maybe the weakest in the state. Yeah they on a state championship, and not to take anything away from that team. They didn't play a team that I would rate more than average. OC was bad, and the Belfry team they played was down.
Talent and strength isn't the issue. Its just that this teams talents and strengths aren't to run up the middle against 11 men in the box. I'm sorry there is no excuse for that, execution isn't the problem, as Ive stated the line could have all flat backed their assignments and there's still 3-4 unblocked players. Could they have done better? Absoloutely, but its not all their fault.
Jeepman you keep asking what plays they should have run. Well its simple, any 3 step drop passes, quick rollout passes that don't require play action, or even a toss play to the outside would have maybe worked.
I haven't seen Russell do a slant pass in years. Even a Fullback in the flat on the scramble would have worked.