Bluegrassrivals

Seems some things remain the same, after watching Sheldon Clark loose to a very week Tug Valley WVa team last night and seeing their struggles this year it makes you wonder what is more important politics or letting the kids play the game like they should. I am very amazed and disappointed that Roger Harless has bought into the old Martin Co. way of doing things as in his younger days he was so very against. I guess thats what it takes to coach basketball in Martin Co. and thats the reason SC has lost good coach's in the past such as Johnny Martin and Sam Sparks. Those gentlemen refused to play the political game. There is talent in Martin Co. and anyone who is familar with the area knows about the powerhouses that Inez and Warfield highschool's had before consolidation. Coach's like Russell Williamson, Johnny Williams, Billy Ray Cassady played the game different, they played to WIN. One example that the staff has done as of late that is mind blowing is to bring up a freshman to the varsity level, (won't mention any names the kid dosen't deserve to be hurt reguardless of what the staff or parents do) well anyway this freshman may someday be a excellent varsity player but he is far from ready, he struggles in most JV games, but it is a fact that his parents threw a fit and threatened to take him and their financial support to another school if he did not get to play varsity. What would one of the above mentioned coach's done in this situation? It would have been good luck but see ya. There are several other players on that JV team and players on the varsity bench who are about ready and work hard everyday that deserves a shot. What kind of message does this send them? A message that if my mother and father had more money I could play? That is a smack in the face to some of these young men just like the statement that Harless made to a group in which he said he would have a good team if he could get rid of his juniors and seniors, if that is how he feels he should cut them and not make those statements about kids who give them their heart everyday and he did make that statement it is no rumor. This team could be a decent team not a world beater but at one point they were 3-1 in district play and playing well but now with all the termoil they will prob end up 3-5 and fighting to get out of the bottom seed. I am very sorry if I offended anyone in this post and I have no dog in this fight other then I am a SCHS graduate and I played 4 years for that school and it hurts me to follow my Cards and try to support them knowing that things will never change. Cardinal juniors and seniors keep you head up and work hard, most of the true fans are behind you.

i heard one of the other JV players talking about this the other day
but the kids name needs to stay off this or its closed real fast.

That job is a good job. Politics didn't have as much to do with it as some think, because Harless was the most experienced coach that applied.


I will tell you that I have heard that one of the asst. coaches is getting the job year after next. His brother is asst. coach at the middle school, I do not know his name though.

NEXT Wrote:That job is a good job. Politics didn't have as much to do with it as some think, because Harless was the most experienced coach that applied.


I will tell you that I have heard that one of the asst. coaches is getting the job year after next. His brother is asst. coach at the middle school, I do not know his name though.

I know who you are talking about......I think he would be a great coach! He seems to know basketball really well!

Politics I believe should not even be a factor in any type of sporting event. Especially on the high school level. A last name or an amount of money should not depict how much playing time is rewarded. Hard work and guts should. Also, seniority should be a major issue, the older, the more experienced should see more court time IMO.

devilhead Wrote:Seems some things remain the same, after watching Sheldon Clark loose to a very week Tug Valley WVa team last night and seeing their struggles this year it makes you wonder what is more important politics or letting the kids play the game like they should. I am very amazed and disappointed that Roger Harless has bought into the old Martin Co. way of doing things as in his younger days he was so very against. I guess thats what it takes to coach basketball in Martin Co. and thats the reason SC has lost good coach's in the past such as Johnny Martin and Sam Sparks. Those gentlemen refused to play the political game. There is talent in Martin Co. and anyone who is familar with the area knows about the powerhouses that Inez and Warfield highschool's had before consolidation. Coach's like Russell Williamson, Johnny Williams, Billy Ray Cassady played the game different, they played to WIN. One example that the staff has done as of late that is mind blowing is to bring up a freshman to the varsity level, (won't mention any names the kid dosen't deserve to be hurt reguardless of what the staff or parents do) well anyway this freshman may someday be a excellent varsity player but he is far from ready, he struggles in most JV games, but it is a fact that his parents threw a fit and threatened to take him and their financial support to another school if he did not get to play varsity. What would one of the above mentioned coach's done in this situation? It would have been good luck but see ya. There are several other players on that JV team and players on the varsity bench who are about ready and work hard everyday that deserves a shot. What kind of message does this send them? A message that if my mother and father had more money I could play? That is a smack in the face to some of these young men just like the statement that Harless made to a group in which he said he would have a good team if he could get rid of his juniors and seniors, if that is how he feels he should cut them and not make those statements about kids who give them their heart everyday and he did make that statement it is no rumor. This team could be a decent team not a world beater but at one point they were 3-1 in district play and playing well but now with all the termoil they will prob end up 3-5 and fighting to get out of the bottom seed. I am very sorry if I offended anyone in this post and I have no dog in this fight other then I am a SCHS graduate and I played 4 years for that school and it hurts me to follow my Cards and try to support them knowing that things will never change. Cardinal juniors and seniors keep you head up and work hard, most of the true fans are behind you.

this post is very true, and i totally agree with devilhead. so much talent goes through Sheldon Clark undetected each year either on the bench or wont play because of the coaching staff. also there is talent that is run off it if you would say. now i've been to a couple of the cards games this season. players who i've seen in the past r really nice players didn't even get in the game. i think when Sheldon Clark get some people who wants to play and who deserves to play they could probably be a region contender but until then they will just be a below average team. next year Sheldon Clark has a great opp. to play for a region title, they have alot of good juniors returning and i believe bj Moore may be alot better and make smarter decisions but if coach harless doesn't pick it up he may be playing freshman next season. i just hope when i have children that it isnt all about politics.

318mag thats were your wrong bj moore isnt the most consistent player. dont get me wrong he will be an excellent ball player but he is far from being very consistant. ive seen him have a coulpe bad games where he has way too many turnovers and just silly middle school mistakes. and i ve differnt a bout the playing time situation.

Allenator 10, I have watched all but one game this year and see the official game stats every week. so i can give a very informed opinion. Moore is the most consisent player we have. check the game sheets and check for his assist and turnovers, you will be suprised

you obviously don't know a lot about this topic or you would know that Roger Harless was most definately not the most qualified. many highly qualified applicants were passed over-including coaches whom have coached in state tournaments

Kamakazi41 Wrote:you obviously don't know a lot about this topic or you would know that Roger Harless was most definately not the most qualified. many highly qualified applicants were passed over-including coaches whom have coached in state tournaments

I know who the final 3 were, and out of those 3 Harless was the most qualified.


Give me some names, or at least pm them to me.

Allenator 10, I have watched all but one game this year and see the official game stats every week. so i can give a very informed opinion. Moore is the most consisent player we have. check the game sheets and check for his assist and turnovers, you will be suprised.


well everyone has there own option. that may be true his turnover to assist ratio maybe decent. but i've seen him lose the ball in the closing seconds of the game against belfry and air ball a shot to tie against tug valley. but his assist is suppose to be higher than turnovers also if you know. he probably plays more than any one on the team and the balls always in his hand. I believe Ryan Mollett is the best and most consistent if the team would play as hard and with as much heart as he does they could go along way.

I agree Mollett and Goble play with a lot of heart, I just wish Mollett would shoot more.

devilhead Wrote:Seems some things remain the same, after watching Sheldon Clark loose to a very week Tug Valley WVa team last night and seeing their struggles this year it makes you wonder what is more important politics or letting the kids play the game like they should. I am very amazed and disappointed that Roger Harless has bought into the old Martin Co. way of doing things as in his younger days he was so very against. I guess thats what it takes to coach basketball in Martin Co. and thats the reason SC has lost good coach's in the past such as Johnny Martin and Sam Sparks. Those gentlemen refused to play the political game. There is talent in Martin Co. and anyone who is familar with the area knows about the powerhouses that Inez and Warfield highschool's had before consolidation. Coach's like Russell Williamson, Johnny Williams, Billy Ray Cassady played the game different, they played to WIN. One example that the staff has done as of late that is mind blowing is to bring up a freshman to the varsity level, (won't mention any names the kid dosen't deserve to be hurt reguardless of what the staff or parents do) well anyway this freshman may someday be a excellent varsity player but he is far from ready, he struggles in most JV games, but it is a fact that his parents threw a fit and threatened to take him and their financial support to another school if he did not get to play varsity. What would one of the above mentioned coach's done in this situation? It would have been good luck but see ya. There are several other players on that JV team and players on the varsity bench who are about ready and work hard everyday that deserves a shot. What kind of message does this send them? A message that if my mother and father had more money I could play? That is a smack in the face to some of these young men just like the statement that Harless made to a group in which he said he would have a good team if he could get rid of his juniors and seniors, if that is how he feels he should cut them and not make those statements about kids who give them their heart everyday and he did make that statement it is no rumor. This team could be a decent team not a world beater but at one point they were 3-1 in district play and playing well but now with all the termoil they will prob end up 3-5 and fighting to get out of the bottom seed. I am very sorry if I offended anyone in this post and I have no dog in this fight other then I am a SCHS graduate and I played 4 years for that school and it hurts me to follow my Cards and try to support them knowing that things will never change. Cardinal juniors and seniors keep you head up and work hard, most of the true fans are behind you.

NICE POST!!!!!!!!

Sounds like the words of a parent or someone else who is close to a player, most likely Junior or Senior, who is not getting as much playing time as they would like to see. Perhaps because someone much younger is seeing the court far more than they deem fit?

If politics played any part in Harless getting that job, he would not have gotten the job in the first place. Many influential people in the process of picking a coach were dead set agaisnt his getting the job.

If politics played any part in Harless getting that job, he would not have gotten the job in the first place. Many influential people in the process of picking a coach were dead set agaisnt his getting the job.


he doesnt mean with him getting the job. he means who he plays

:howdy:

Politics have played a part in Martin County for as long as I can remember. When was the last time Sheldon Clark actually had a good team that could compete in the 15th region? Mid 80's? Enough kids have left there over the last 20 plus years to field a few all star teams.

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devilhead Wrote:Seems some things remain the same, after watching Sheldon Clark loose to a very week Tug Valley WVa team last night and seeing their struggles this year it makes you wonder what is more important politics or letting the kids play the game like they should. I am very amazed and disappointed that Roger Harless has bought into the old Martin Co. way of doing things as in his younger days he was so very against. I guess thats what it takes to coach basketball in Martin Co. and thats the reason SC has lost good coach's in the past such as Johnny Martin and Sam Sparks. Those gentlemen refused to play the political game. There is talent in Martin Co. and anyone who is familar with the area knows about the powerhouses that Inez and Warfield highschool's had before consolidation. Coach's like Russell Williamson, Johnny Williams, Billy Ray Cassady played the game different, they played to WIN. One example that the staff has done as of late that is mind blowing is to bring up a freshman to the varsity level, (won't mention any names the kid dosen't deserve to be hurt reguardless of what the staff or parents do) well anyway this freshman may someday be a excellent varsity player but he is far from ready, he struggles in most JV games, but it is a fact that his parents threw a fit and threatened to take him and their financial support to another school if he did not get to play varsity. What would one of the above mentioned coach's done in this situation? It would have been good luck but see ya. There are several other players on that JV team and players on the varsity bench who are about ready and work hard everyday that deserves a shot. What kind of message does this send them? A message that if my mother and father had more money I could play? That is a smack in the face to some of these young men just like the statement that Harless made to a group in which he said he would have a good team if he could get rid of his juniors and seniors, if that is how he feels he should cut them and not make those statements about kids who give them their heart everyday and he did make that statement it is no rumor. This team could be a decent team not a world beater but at one point they were 3-1 in district play and playing well but now with all the termoil they will prob end up 3-5 and fighting to get out of the bottom seed. I am very sorry if I offended anyone in this post and I have no dog in this fight other then I am a SCHS graduate and I played 4 years for that school and it hurts me to follow my Cards and try to support them knowing that things will never change. Cardinal juniors and seniors keep you head up and work hard, most of the true fans are behind you.

Thats bull****...... thats all i got to say about that
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BCLions Wrote:Politics have played a part in Martin County for as long as I can remember. When was the last time Sheldon Clark actually had a good team that could compete in the 15th region? Mid 80's? Enough kids have left there over the last 20 plus years to field a few all star teams.

2004....and 2 kids from our class left. We should have been in Rupp that year. We lost in overtime in the region semi-final game where we couldn't shoot the ball into the ocean if we had tried. We really played awful that game and should have lost worse than that. East Ridge beat us at the buzzer from the ugliest shot I have ever seen. It looked like he pulled it outta his pocket! lol But anyway, East Ridge went to state that year. We could have been regional champs that year, so apparently it has been since the mid 80s.

Thats bull****...... thats all i got to say about that


no tree 8 thats the truth. thats why we can never have anything good in this county. except for the football and baseball teams. thats only because its not about who you are and if you have money. but its a different story with the basketball team. we've lost great coaches and great players simply over that reason.

its not right about how some kids are treated here in this county, and I'm sure its not only here. but i know about the situation here, and i don't think its right. its just like the situation with the freshman i wont mention his name, but his parents threw a fit and told the "so called Coaching Staff" that if he didn't get to play varsity they would take him some where else and thats not right, theres kids that go into practice everyday and work hard and bust there butts who have been there and know what a true varsity game is like and they don't get what they deserve, but a kids parents could dictate how much pt they get by threating the coaching staff, now I'm not cutting the kid hes a decent ball player, but i don't think hes ready to step in and play big time min.? but being apart of a basketball team sure is about learning the fundamentals but also the coaches r suppose to teach you about the real world and if you work hard and don't get rewarded for it what does that tell you to do in life. And if coach harless really made the statement that if he didn't have his juniors and seniors then thats not saying much about what kind of coach he is. but don't get me wrong i know roger personality, and i have the greatest respect for him as a person but i don't think he can handle that program how it needs to be handled. and i wish him and the cards the best of luck and hope they can bring some hardware home. but i thought roger harless was a better basketball coach than what hes shown this year. hes really let the kids down and the people in this community who put so much hope into him.

Cardsftw2010 Wrote:Sounds like the words of a parent or someone else who is close to a player, most likely Junior or Senior, who is not getting as much playing time as they would like to see. Perhaps because someone much younger is seeing the court far more than they deem fit?

No I'm not a parent at all, much less anyone on the team. Just a fan who played there myself and play some pickup games at the community center with a few of the kids on the team. You need to read the post again, I was just saying Harless should have never made the comment about his juniors and seniors in a public group (he did make the comment, I was standing there) If he had something to say to them it should have been a private team issue.

Cardsftw2010 Wrote:If politics played any part in Harless getting that job, he would not have gotten the job in the first place. Many influential people in the process of picking a coach were dead set agaisnt his getting the job.

I didn't say it had anything to do with him getting the job, but it must have something to do with him keeping it. Some is sure controling to some extent now. I know Roger Harless and he did not coach this irratic and inconsistand in the past.

Well, based on my observations and humble opinion I feel that SC's current coach is somewhat trying to make a statement. If you take a sec. to look at the lineup you see alot of talented kids from the previous coach's (Hammonds) squad. Actually you still have 4 players who had significant playing time last year. To be honest those boys should be the nucleus of this year's team. These four are the most experienced and proven cards on the squad, but out of them only one is actually starting regularly and getting the minutes that all 4 deserve. It looks as if Harless is willing to tank the next 2 seasons to bring up a youngster who may not even stick around (Tug Valley????) and sacrifice the min.'s and playing time that a lot of other players (A FEW JUNIORS SPECIFICALLY) need to improve and be better ready to lead the cards next season. If Harless is trying to make his team (The 8th grader and Freshmen and Sophmores) He is doing so by disrespecting all the hard work his Juniors and Seniors have put in over the years. In Summary, SC could be more competitive than it currently is. You cant be competitive with a 6'0 tall 170 lb center in this district, and by relying on an 8th grader to be mentally ready all season. Dont get me wrong the 8th grader is good, but I honestly dont see an improvement over last years starting PG who is still currently on the squad for this year and the next, and not getting all the work he needs. And with regards to our current center, the boy has been a loyal hardworking card and is a good player, but he really isnt a center (physically) and its just proof of how the talent at SC is being misused. Your 5 starters at SC should be Stroud (PG) Porter (G/F) Horn (G/F) Hensley (C/F) and Goble (F)........Mollette and Moore should see the most PT off the bench and the others should be role players used accordingly. The Cline and Marcum boys have the size SC needs at the center position but they need more experience (which they arent getting enough of) and with that will come more confidence to bang around with the big boys of other schools...Sheldon Clark could be very competitive this year but if our talent was nurtured as it should be we could be a real threat next year. I dont totally agree that politics are the only factor in how harless plays his players. Dont get me wrong, they have an influence on him, but what coach hasnt been influenced by politics and stuck around long enough to win? I just think that he is trying to create "his team" and not play "JR's Boys" because if he plays hammond's squad and wins with them he proves that hammonds was on the right track and should have been allowed to ride it out with the team. So he more or less is letting his ego and his concept of what SC basketball should look like get in the way of being competitive. With all the experience and depth that SC has this year and next they should be able to play a very aggressive defense and have at least a solid 8 or 9 man rotation. But harless is trying to fit a square peg in a round hole, so good luck Cards I'm sorry but if things dont improve I dont see a competitive SC team for at least 2 years. (Long enough for the current 8th 9th and 10th graders to come around"...............P.S. if Hammonds had to go Setser should have got the job.

returnofthebunny Wrote:Well, based on my observations and humble opinion I feel that SC's current coach is somewhat trying to make a statement. If you take a sec. to look at the lineup you see alot of talented kids from the previous coach's (Hammonds) squad. Actually you still have 4 players who had significant playing time last year. To be honest those boys should be the nucleus of this year's team. These four are the most experienced and proven cards on the squad, but out of them only one is actually starting regularly and getting the minutes that all 4 deserve. It looks as if Harless is willing to tank the next 2 seasons to bring up a youngster who may not even stick around (Tug Valley????) and sacrifice the min.'s and playing time that a lot of other players (A FEW JUNIORS SPECIFICALLY) need to improve and be better ready to lead the cards next season. If Harless is trying to make his team (The 8th grader and Freshmen and Sophmores) He is doing so by disrespecting all the hard work his Juniors and Seniors have put in over the years. In Summary, SC could be more competitive than it currently is. You cant be competitive with a 6'0 tall 170 lb center in this district, and by relying on an 8th grader to be mentally ready all season. Dont get me wrong the 8th grader is good, but I honestly dont see an improvement over last years starting PG who is still currently on the squad for this year and the next, and not getting all the work he needs. And with regards to our current center, the boy has been a loyal hardworking card and is a good player, but he really isnt a center (physically) and its just proof of how the talent at SC is being misused. Your 5 starters at SC should be Stroud (PG) Porter (G/F) Horn (G/F) Hensley (C/F) and Goble (F)........Mollette and Moore should see the most PT off the bench and the others should be role players used accordingly. The Cline and Marcum boys have the size SC needs at the center position but they need more experience (which they arent getting enough of) and with that will come more confidence to bang around with the big boys of other schools...Sheldon Clark could be very competitive this year but if our talent was nurtured as it should be we could be a real threat next year. I dont totally agree that politics are the only factor in how harless plays his players. Dont get me wrong, they have an influence on him, but what coach hasnt been influenced by politics and stuck around long enough to win? I just think that he is trying to create "his team" and not play "JR's Boys" because if he plays hammond's squad and wins with them he proves that hammonds was on the right track and should have been allowed to ride it out with the team. So he more or less is letting his ego and his concept of what SC basketball should look like get in the way of being competitive. With all the experience and depth that SC has this year and next they should be able to play a very aggressive defense and have at least a solid 8 or 9 man rotation. But harless is trying to fit a square peg in a round hole, so good luck Cards I'm sorry but if things dont improve I dont see a competitive SC team for at least 2 years. (Long enough for the current 8th 9th and 10th graders to come around"...............P.S. if Hammonds had to go Setser should have got the job.

Good Post, B. J. Moore is a great player and well developed for an 8th grader, but Harless lets him play completely out of control at some points, how many teams have an 8th grade point guard leading them in shots taken and some of those shots are horroble, last night a couple times when the Cards fought back and cut the lead to 7 he absolutely killed them by driving in the lane and forcing shots with 3 people on him while some of the shooters stood wide open. he has done this on several occassions this season and Harless does nothing, let Let Goble, Horn, Stroud or Porter do this and its benched for them. I also agree that Moore will not even be there, maybe not even after this season, him not living in Martin Co. makes it easy for transfer, his brother is currently at Tug Valley, WVa

Moore won't transfer to Tug Valley, you can only play four years of high school ball in Wva . so he would lose a year of playing. The cards wasn't hitting there shots tonight and played soft. that's why they lost!!!!!! Moore forced a couple shots tonight but still shot 8/16 for 20 points,

I've only seen a couple games this year but i'm very familiar with the program and Roger will get the program turned around if he's given time. The biggest problem at SC for years is the kids don't improve or work on their games when they get to high school. U have a bunch of hold backs who dominate in middle school and think their all stars and don't need improvement. When the kids from other schools catch up physically in high school and also work on their skills they surpass our boys. SC always has athletes but they don't have basketball players. Anyways, i could go on for pages but i won't put anyone through that torture. I just wish the best for the program and the kids and I personally think the Moore kid is the best player they have and if I was coaching he'd be starting as well. To steal a quote from Mike Hall a few years ago in baseball. "I'd rather win 3 games now with middle schoolers and be really good in a few years, as win 5 games every year with juniors and seniors." Seems to have worked out pretty good for the baseball program.

returnofthebunny Wrote:Well, based on my observations and humble opinion I feel that SC's current coach is somewhat trying to make a statement. If you take a sec. to look at the lineup you see alot of talented kids from the previous coach's (Hammonds) squad. Actually you still have 4 players who had significant playing time last year. To be honest those boys should be the nucleus of this year's team. These four are the most experienced and proven cards on the squad, but out of them only one is actually starting regularly and getting the minutes that all 4 deserve. It looks as if Harless is willing to tank the next 2 seasons to bring up a youngster who may not even stick around (Tug Valley????) and sacrifice the min.'s and playing time that a lot of other players (A FEW JUNIORS SPECIFICALLY) need to improve and be better ready to lead the cards next season. If Harless is trying to make his team (The 8th grader and Freshmen and Sophmores) He is doing so by disrespecting all the hard work his Juniors and Seniors have put in over the years. In Summary, SC could be more competitive than it currently is. You cant be competitive with a 6'0 tall 170 lb center in this district, and by relying on an 8th grader to be mentally ready all season. Dont get me wrong the 8th grader is good, but I honestly dont see an improvement over last years starting PG who is still currently on the squad for this year and the next, and not getting all the work he needs. And with regards to our current center, the boy has been a loyal hardworking card and is a good player, but he really isnt a center (physically) and its just proof of how the talent at SC is being misused. Your 5 starters at SC should be Stroud (PG) Porter (G/F) Horn (G/F) Hensley (C/F) and Goble (F)........Mollette and Moore should see the most PT off the bench and the others should be role players used accordingly. The Cline and Marcum boys have the size SC needs at the center position but they need more experience (which they arent getting enough of) and with that will come more confidence to bang around with the big boys of other schools...Sheldon Clark could be very competitive this year but if our talent was nurtured as it should be we could be a real threat next year. I dont totally agree that politics are the only factor in how harless plays his players. Dont get me wrong, they have an influence on him, but what coach hasnt been influenced by politics and stuck around long enough to win? I just think that he is trying to create "his team" and not play "JR's Boys" because if he plays hammond's squad and wins with them he proves that hammonds was on the right track and should have been allowed to ride it out with the team. So he more or less is letting his ego and his concept of what SC basketball should look like get in the way of being competitive. With all the experience and depth that SC has this year and next they should be able to play a very aggressive defense and have at least a solid 8 or 9 man rotation. But harless is trying to fit a square peg in a round hole, so good luck Cards I'm sorry but if things dont improve I dont see a competitive SC team for at least 2 years. (Long enough for the current 8th 9th and 10th graders to come around"...............P.S. if Hammonds had to go Setser should have got the job.

stroud is way to inconsistant and has about 20 more to than assists i look at the stats everygame he should becomeing off the bench like he is now as for moore he had a few costley to but played an all around good game i have to give criedit to lc D it was very good as for poter i think he should recive more min than he has the last few games but should be the sixth man he can keep u in the game with his shoot. horn should start and has been playing his best basket ball as of late hasnt been takeing ne bad shots. mollette should start he finishes well around the rim and has the best mid range game on the team aside from goble.

IntheZone Wrote:stroud is way to inconsistant and has about 20 more to than assists i look at the stats everygame he should becomeing off the bench like he is now as for moore he had a few costley to but played an all around good game i have to give criedit to lc D it was very good as for poter i think he should recive more min than he has the last few games but should be the sixth man he can keep u in the game with his shoot. horn should start and has been playing his best basket ball as of late hasnt been takeing ne bad shots. mollette should start he finishes well around the rim and has the best mid range game on the team aside from goble.

I agree with horn starting.