Just a question I thought about recently everyone can recall schools that were once the teams you saw win every Friday such as Breathitt and Bell Prestonsburg could be counted in there I suppose the point is what's it gonna take for this schools to get back to their former glory Breathitt is one that stands out in mind.
I won't even pretend to know very much about the schools that you mentioned, but I think the feeder programs are valuable to any high school team.
Having a strong middle school program and league programs gets a lot more kids as well as the community involved.
The short answer is jobs. All of the schools you mentioned are mountain schools in coal country. Each of which have experienced significant losses to enrollment. Blue collar jobs bring blue collar dads, and blue collar dads bring blue collar athletes.
Single Wing 77 Wrote:The short answer is jobs. All of the schools you mentioned are mountain schools in coal country. Each of which have experienced significant losses to enrollment. Blue collar jobs bring blue collar dads, and blue collar dads bring blue collar athletes.
Not sure this argument holds up with the success of Paintsville, Johnson Central, Belfry, and Hazard. All in the same economic state as the others mentioned.
I do recall Breathitt and Pburg being powers once upon a time.
I recall PT being there as well.
Coupon21 Wrote:Not sure this argument holds up with the success of Paintsville, Johnson Central, Belfry, and Hazard. All in the same economic state as the others mentioned.
Not quite. Paul Patton greatly added to the infrastructure of those areas. While the coal industry is depressed there as well, there have been more opportunities for new businesses and population growth.
Before anybody jumps on me with both feet for being jealous; let me say that I am very thankful for ANY part of Kentucky to have those opportunities.
Loss of jobs and population base in Eastern Kentucky has been disastrous. These communities will have a hard time rebounding from overly burdensome administrative regulations. Hilary set out the mind set in her infamous speech.
Coupon21 Wrote:Not sure this argument holds up with the success of Paintsville, Johnson Central, Belfry, and Hazard. All in the same economic state as the others mentioned.
I think that the difference here is also the consolidation of talent. I don't think it's a coincidence that p-burg, Sheldon Clark, and a lot of other schools surrounding these schools have had the bottom fall out.
I'll speak about Prestonsburg and the Floyd County area in general and the problem that I see is transfers. Kids and their parents are leaving the schools they started at and chasing better teams and the ability to be more competitive in sports instead of working to build something at the school they are at.
I feel like perhaps the coal jobs were a big hit but i dont think they are whole reason I have to agree with coupon 21 pike county used to be the county with the most millionaire population and alot of them were coal owners and such when coal left they did because pike county no longer has that but belfry is still a powerhouse so I wonder if its something else i have to agree its more feeder programs and such maybe might even be the quality of coach there at a school just not sure
mysonis55 Wrote:I recall PT being there as well.
PT's long decline is due to the adminitiation. When I was there 30+ years ago Tilghman was a football school, period. It was all anyone cared about. The other sports and all other extracurricular activities were secondary. I imagine it is that way now at places that are experiencing success year in and year out like Trinity, Bowling Green, Belfry and Mayfield.
Honestly there are people running things now that could not care less about the football program or maybe they outright resent it and try to undermine it.
One responsible party was thankfully let go recently but at least one or two others remain.
Serious question, is Belfry a private school? If not, how do they have so many good players year in and year out?
No, belfry just draws alot of players from West Virginia. The border is just a mile or so Down the road. Not a bad area to draw from with 119 helping bring players in from WV
There was another thread on here 2-3 weeks ago about "recruiting". The phrase which was used was "talent flow". A lot of the schools that are successful year in and year out benefit from kids transferring in at some age. Around many of these successful programs there is a vacuum left in other schools. Administrative support with good facilities and coaching hires can get the ball rolling.
A lot small town drama and politics is what's hurt Prestonsburg more than anything. A lot parents want to see Jerry Butcher and the Derossetts gone. That divide amongst the community has really hurt the Prestonsburg football program. It all started with the success of baseball program under Shane Simpkins. Since then, the wheels have been slowly falling off. With the recent success with the two programs in Johnson County and the new Floyd Central opening next year, I'm afraid it's only going to get worse. Very sad times for the Blackcat football program.
Belfry has benefited from the bordering West Virginia schools being horrendous. They do a good job in the class room and on the field.
I really wonder if these schools will ever rise back to their former glory I mean Breathitt county as recent as 2008 was in a state championship will they ever regain that status of power house? Bell county won it in bell county right around that same time as well will they get back on top?
I will make a prediction, in two years or maybe three those down schools in the mountains will be back. Trump will bring back the coal industries by striking down some of these crazy EPA regs.
Bell County until they get a new coach
BlackcatAlum Wrote:A lot small town drama and politics is what's hurt Prestonsburg more than anything. A lot parents want to see Jerry Butcher and the Derossetts gone. That divide amongst the community has really hurt the Prestonsburg football program. It all started with the success of baseball program under Shane Simpkins. Since then, the wheels have been slowly falling off. With the recent success with the two programs in Johnson County and the new Floyd Central opening next year, I'm afraid it's only going to get worse. Very sad times for the Blackcat football program.
Sadly, that basic plot seems to play itself out repeatedly in a lot of these small-town petri dishes. Once a sufficient number coalesce against whomever the head coach might be (for whatever reason), the downward spiral begins.
I see several mountain schools at various stages of this same self-defeating, melodrama...and others just getting ready to begin their own. Those with no perspective on the true mission of high school sports tend to eat their own.
Bobcats 9108 Wrote:Bell County until they get a new coach
Do you really believe so? i thought what hurt bell most this year was the loss of humfleet
BlackcatAlum Wrote:A lot small town drama and politics is what's hurt Prestonsburg more than anything. A lot parents want to see Jerry Butcher and the Derossetts gone. That divide amongst the community has really hurt the Prestonsburg football program. It all started with the success of baseball program under Shane Simpkins. Since then, the wheels have been slowly falling off. With the recent success with the two programs in Johnson County and the new Floyd Central opening next year, I'm afraid it's only going to get worse. Very sad times for the Blackcat football program.
Prestonsburg is the prime example here..You took the words right out of my mouth. I wont even repeat the stories Ive heard but to say the least they are ridiculous...Just to talked to one dad a couple days ago whos boy transferred..Another who has a heck of a middle school talent who said his boy will not play at Prestonsburg until,,,,well you know
I can honestly say my boys didn't come to Belfry for football. It started with the great middle school academics. But had to make the decision of the academic team or football team. Glad to say his school would be paid for by an academic scholarship if he didn't have one for football. His mother made them smart but Belfrt made them football players. They wasn't known as football players when they first went to Belfry.
proud44pirate Wrote:I can honestly say my boys didn't come to Belfry for football. It started with the great middle school academics. But had to make the decision of the academic team or football team. Glad to say his school would be paid for by an academic scholarship if he didn't have one for football. His mother made them smart but Belfrt made them football players. They wasn't known as football players when they first went to Belfry.
Great to hear that big ole boy has more than talent and size, because one day hopefully not soon it will end. These kids need that education to make this country better for all of us..We need the best and brightest to be all they can be and not settle for something less. Good luck to Cole in all he does!:1:
I don't think that the state of the coal industry has anything to do with the fortunes of most mountain football programs. All of them are competing in the class with similar enrollment numbers and look at Belfry, Johnson Central, Paintsville, Pikeville, and Hazard's programs. They have never been in better shape than they are right now.
Look at Highlands' program. Highlands football program never benefited from coal industry jobs and yet the football program has fallen onto hard times the past couple of years.
It would be great if every school had a solid football program and fielded competitive teams every season, but coaches move on and the priorities of schools and students shift. I despise Obama and Hillary, but they are not to blame for the decline of a few football programs in eastern Kentucky.
waughdaddy59 Wrote:I feel like perhaps the coal jobs were a big hit but i dont think they are whole reason I have to agree with coupon 21 pike county used to be the county with the most millionaire population and alot of them were coal owners and such when coal left they did because pike county no longer has that but belfry is still a powerhouse so I wonder if its something else i have to agree its more feeder programs and such maybe might even be the quality of coach there at a school just not sure
The Belfry system works well. They hold 7th graders and 8th graders back each year. Time they get to a sophomore they are 16/17 and highly experienced.
checkmate9113 Wrote:The Belfry system works well. They hold 7th graders and 8th graders back each year. Time they get to a sophomore they are 16/17 and highly experienced.
Thought the latest you could hold a kid back now was 5th grade? Isn't that the new rules?
And if you stay back in those years you have to sit out that year... But hasn't Belfry been in the middle school state championship game or champion for many years in a row?