The strength of some classes were brought up in another thread, so I propose that we rank the classes by strength of teams. Take into consideration each class has basically 3 tiers of teams. Tier 1 consists of teams that can compete at a championship level, Tier 2 consists of teams that are consistently competitive, and Tier 3 consists of teams that are usually not competitive. Some classes may be heavy with Tier 1 teams however may be very weak with the rest of the teams compared to a class that may not have Top Tier teams but loaded with middle of the road teams. If there is anyone that has other criteria that should be included please share.
So in your opinion BGR rank the 6 classes from strongest to weakest.
For the upcoming season with the new alignment or last year under the old alignment?
For the upcoming season with the new alignment.
I know several teams have moved classes so if there are any questions about which class a team is in I'm sure myself or users can clarify.
Last year:
1. 6A- No debate here...about 10 very good teams and another 5 or 6 good teams.
2. 4A- The Top 5 was super strong... beyond the Top 10 it took a bit of a nosedive... but the upper tier was excellent
3. 1A- Strongest year in 1A I can recall. Very strong behind some Senior dominated teams and strong traditional powers like Mayfield and Beechwood
4. 2A- Top 5 was stellar. DeSales was the best small school in the State and CAL wasn't far behind them. Massive drop beyond about the first 6 teams.
5. 3A- Not a very good year in 3A. Belfry was very good but even they had a loss to a 1A team. It ended up being Belfry and about 10 "good" teams.
6. 5A- IMHO by far the weakest class. Bowling Green wasn't their normal self and two of the Classes Top Teams (Graves and Southwestern) each took it on the chin to 3A teams.
Upcoming Year Projection:
1. 6A- Just loaded with the big schools
2. 5A- Highlands, CovCath, Bowling Green.... no question
3. 3A- Becomes a bear. The best 3A teams remain, add in Boyle, LexCah, Bardstown, and Caldwell. Several younger teams last year will be strong.
4. 2A- DeSales and CAL remain and Mayfield moves up. Should be a solid year, but once again after about the first 6 teams or so the drop off is significant.
5. 4A- When 6 of the class' Top 7 teams move up or down it will have a major impact.
6. 1A- Mayfield is gone and those teams who ahd histroic years with heavy Senior classes have to reload.
EKUAlum05 Wrote:Last year:
1. 6A- No debate here...about 10 very good teams and another 5 or 6 good teams.
2. 4A- The Top 5 was super strong... beyond the Top 10 it took a bit of a nosedive... but the upper tier was excellent
3. 1A- Strongest year in 1A I can recall. Very strong behind some Senior dominated teams and strong traditional powers like Mayfield and Beechwood
4. 2A- Top 5 was stellar. DeSales was the best small school in the State and CAL wasn't far behind them. Massive drop beyond about the first 6 teams.
5. 3A- Not a very good year in 3A. Belfry was very good but even they had a loss to a 1A team. It ended up being Belfry and about 10 "good" teams.
6. 5A- IMHO by far the weakest class. Bowling Green wasn't their normal self and two of the Classes Top Teams (Graves and Southwestern) each took it on the chin to 3A teams.
Upcoming Year Projection:
1. 6A- Just loaded with the big schools
2. 5A- Highlands, CovCath, Bowling Green.... no question
3. 3A- Becomes a bear. The best 3A teams remain, add in Boyle, LexCah, Bardstown, and Caldwell. Several younger teams last year will be strong.
4. 2A- DeSales and CAL remain and Mayfield moves up. Should be a solid year, but once again after about the first 6 teams or so the drop off is significant.
5. 4A- When 6 of the class' Top 7 teams move up or down it will have a major impact.
6. 1A- Mayfield is gone and those teams who ahd histroic years with heavy Senior classes have to reload.
:dontthink
EKU....I'd switch 4A and 2A.
I'll take:
Johnson Central over Mayfield
South Warren over DeSales
John Hardin over CAL
...not to mention the likes of Franklin-Simpson, Warren Central (one more year, then a significant fall), Warren East (who returns maybe the best RB in the state next year as a Sophomore in Willie Reynolds), Wayne County, Collins, Hopkinsville etc. etc.
To be honest, and know this will sound ridiculous to many, but I'm not so sure I wouldn't take 4A over 3A. Or a lot closer to 3A than people think.
Let's just compare:
Johnson Central (4A) shut out Belfry (3A) 35-0 in week 10 last year.
Wayne County (4A) has split with Corbin (3A) the last two years. Like Wayne in 2013, Corbin graduates the house (not like they will be gone, but down from last year nonetheless).
With what Franklin-Simpson has returning, let's say they play Caldwell (who graduates their main guys, yet return maybe their best overall player in Dee Cain and several others)..I'll take F-S Next year.
I'm not so sure I wouldn't take Johnson Central over Boyle next year. Or let's call it what it would likely be....they play 10 times, they go 5-5. A push.
John Hardin and LexCath? Ballgame right there. Two Semi-Final teams in their respected classes last year who return most everybody.
Collins vs. Bardstown? See John and LexCath. Would be a great game.
Tilghman is the X-Factor in 3A. They might be the one more needed trump card for 3A. There are only a couple 4A teams out there who I think would match up with them & that's Warren Central/Hopkinsville. I'd like to say Madisonville, given they beat Tilghman last year; but, Madisonville graduated something like 18-20 starters. They'll be back. Always have talent, but I don't think next year is it.
If anything, 3A and 4A might be more of a push, but I don't think the gap there is actually as big as what many of us (me included) originally thought.
Fly Like a Duck Wrote:EKU....I'd switch 4A and 2A.
I'll take:
Johnson Central over Mayfield
South Warren over DeSales
John Hardin over CAL
...not to mention the likes of Franklin-Simpson, Warren Central (one more year, then a significant fall), Warren East (who returns maybe the best RB in the state next year as a Sophomore in Willie Reynolds), Wayne County, Collins, Hopkinsville etc. etc.
To be honest, and know this will sound ridiculous to many, but I'm not so sure I wouldn't take 4A over 3A. Or a lot closer to 3A than people think.
Let's just compare:
Johnson Central (4A) shut out Belfry (3A) 35-0 in week 10 last year.
Wayne County (4A) has split with Corbin (3A) the last two years. Like Wayne in 2013, Corbin graduates the house (not like they will be gone, but down from last year nonetheless).
With what Franklin-Simpson has returning, let's say they play Caldwell (who graduates their main guys, yet return maybe their best overall player in Dee Cain and several others)..I'll take F-S Next year.
I'm not so sure I wouldn't take Johnson Central over Boyle next year. Or let's call it what it would likely be....they play 10 times, they go 5-5. A push.
John Hardin and LexCath? Ballgame right there. Two Semi-Final teams in their respected classes last year who return most everybody.
Collins vs. Bardstown? See John and LexCath. Would be a great game.
Tilghman is the X-Factor in 3A. They might be the one more needed trump card for 3A. There are only a couple 4A teams out there who I think would match up with them & that's Warren Central/Hopkinsville. I'd like to say Madisonville, given they beat Tilghman last year; but, Madisonville graduated something like 18-20 starters. They'll be back. Always have talent, but I don't think next year is it.
If anything, 3A and 4A might be more of a push, but I don't think the gap there is actually as big as what many of us (me included) originally thought.
Below is a list of how many teams have won a championship over the last 10 seasons and how many championships are accounted for by the members of that class. As I said in the title you can't really just pick the top 3 or 4 teams from each class and compare how you think they would compete against the top of the other classes. It's about the strength of the entire class. And honestly 4A doesn't have a lot of proven teams.
1A- 2 teams accounting for 3 Championships
2A- 5 teams accounting for 12 Championships
3A- 8 teams accounting for 17 Championships
4A- 2 teams accounting for 2 Championships
5A- 4 teams accounting for 12 Championships
6A- 3 teams accounting for 10 Championships
Fly Like a Duck,
I see the points you make, but you aren't comparing teams in their rightful spots in the 3A vs. 4A
You pit a top 5 4A team in FS vs. Caldwell who may not even be a Top 10 3A team
You pit Boyle against probably the top 4A team, when they probably will be more along the lines of the 3rd team (Warren Central or South Warren)
You have Bardstown (Probably outside Top 10 vs. a Collins team that will be in the 8-9 range
You also left off these notable 3A teams:
Central- Return 9 defensive starters and 8 offensive after besting South Warren
Bell County- Expect them to take Corbin's place in their District
Russell- Return almost everyone from a Semi-Finals team
It's clear 4A gets the edge in a Belfry vs. JC matchup..but as you go down the line after it I think 3A either has the edge or at worst a push until you get to about the 9-12 range. Then I think 3A is once again stronger once you factor in the Caldwell County, Bardstown, Lawrence County, Garrard County, and other teams.
To the poster's point above..the issue with the new 4A is a bunch of teams who have not proven they can win the big one. For all the love for South Warren they didn't even reach the State Finals, JC is a great program but have only yet to play on the carpet, John Hardin is O-Fer, Collins won the title behind a class with numerous D-1 players...
EKUAlum05 Wrote:Fly Like a Duck,
I see the points you make, but you aren't comparing teams in their rightful spots in the 3A vs. 4A
You pit a top 5 4A team in FS vs. Caldwell who may not even be a Top 10 3A team
You pit Boyle against probably the top 4A team, when they probably will be more along the lines of the 3rd team (Warren Central or South Warren)
You have Bardstown (Probably outside Top 10 vs. a Collins team that will be in the 8-9 range
You also left off these notable 3A teams:
Central- Return 9 defensive starters and 8 offensive after besting South Warren
Bell County- Expect them to take Corbin's place in their District
Russell- Return almost everyone from a Semi-Finals team
It's clear 4A gets the edge in a Belfry vs. JC matchup..but as you go down the line after it I think 3A either has the edge or at worst a push until you get to about the 9-12 range. Then I think 3A is once again stronger once you factor in the Caldwell County, Bardstown, Lawrence County, Garrard County, and other teams.
To the poster's point above..the issue with the new 4A is a bunch of teams who have not proven they can win the big one. For all the love for South Warren they didn't even reach the State Finals, JC is a great program but have only yet to play on the carpet, John Hardin is O-Fer, Collins won the title behind a class with numerous D-1 players...
To follow up on this matchups may look like
3A vs 4A
Belfry vs Johnson Central
Lexington Catholic vs John Hardin
Central vs South Warren
Boyle vs North Oldham
Tilghman vs Franklin Simpson
Corbin vs Warren Central
Bell vs Collins
Russell vs Ashland
Garrard vs Knox Central
Lawrence vs Bourbon
Caldwell vs Wayne
Bardstown vs Scott
After the top 12 teams 3A still has some 2nd tier middle of the road teams that can be competitive.
In regaurds to a level playing field, this alignment, is probably the best alignment we have had since the 6 class system was set in motion. Many years, you could argue that the top 5 or so in each class could have competed and/or won the class above them, quite possibly the next 2 classes over them, on a consistent basis. I think though, with this alignment, I dont think that wont be the case.
With that said, for the new alignment, I think 5A with the addition of Highlands could be the strongest class within tier 1. I dont pay attention to, or care as much about the bigger classes, so i could be wrong in that regaurd.
I do think that 1A will be the weakest class, as in all honesty, it should be, being the smallest class. 2A should be strong amongst tier 1, but 3A should be as well. Id go wth this for tier 1 (which imo, is the whole point of this doscussion)
5A
6A
3A
4A
2A
1A
Unlike other years, i think by seasons end, we will see each higher class, show that each champ is quite a bit better than the one below it. Outside of 5A/6A and MAYBE 3A/4A. It just depends on how the move of Highlands and CC impacts things.
Are we counting trophies or evaluating the strength of the classes?
6a
5a
4a
3a
2a
1a
goBIGblue82 Wrote:To follow up on this matchups may look like
3A vs 4A
Belfry vs Johnson Central
Lexington Catholic vs John Hardin
Central vs South Warren
Boyle vs North Oldham
Tilghman vs Franklin Simpson
Corbin vs Warren Central
Bell vs Collins
Russell vs Ashland
Garrard vs Knox Central
Lawrence vs Bourbon
Caldwell vs Wayne
Bardstown vs Scott
After the top 12 teams 3A still has some 2nd tier middle of the road teams that can be competitive.
If these are pushes who is left in 3a to beat?
Rockcastle, Taylor Co. (Hilton led), Franklin County, Mason county, Warren East, and Mercer County.
Cardfan1 Wrote:Are we counting trophies or evaluating the strength of the classes?
6a
5a
4a
3a
2a
1a
:Thumbs: The overall strength of a football class is directly proportional to enrollment. Moving a few teams up or down in class because of enrollment changes has little effect on the relative strength of an individual class.
How I forgot about Central, I have no idea. Good call there.
Even still...I don't know there is that much of a gap, if any. On the surface and just counting trophies over the years, yes (I was guilty of pulling the trigger and thinking 3A), but when you look at things...4A is every bit as good IMO.
Hoot Gibson Wrote::Thumbs: The overall strength of a football class is directly proportional to enrollment. Moving a few teams up or down in class because of enrollment changes has little effect on the relative strength of an individual class.
So in other words the 5A class was stronger than the 4A class last year...
I think there has been a lot of valid responses, but the topic has varied from what I expected. I didn't word the question right in the description. Ranking the classes by strength of each individual class. So not necessarily can 4A beat 5A or 1A vs 6A, but the strength of the class from top to bottom. Example last year 1A was very strong due to the normal powerhouses along with numerous other teams that were capable of playing at a championship level.
goBIGblue82 Wrote:I think there has been a lot of valid responses, but the topic has varied from what I expected. I didn't word the question right in the description. Ranking the classes by strength of each individual class. So not necessarily can 4A beat 5A or 1A vs 6A, but the strength of the class from top to bottom. Example last year 1A was very strong due to the normal powerhouses along with numerous other teams that were capable of playing at a championship level.
I liked the question and times the argument could be made that a lower class but when you go top to bottom even those years would be a push.
Be a great 2 year contract in theory. I liked all those games you came up with big blue. I bet there could be some great 5a vs 6a and 1a vs. 2a.
6
5
4
3
2
1
Trinity > Highlands > Johnson Central > Belfry > Mayfield > Beechwood
Last year:
6A
5A
4A
3A
2A
1A
Next Year:
6A
5A
4A
3A
2A
1A
Last Year
6A
4A
1A
5A
3A
2A
Mayfield would have been a state champion in 5A,3A,and 2A
This year
6,5,4,3,2,1
I would probably go...
6A - Top to bottom, probably the strongest class. Many quality teams out of Louisville.
5A - Big improvement with realignment per class. Added Highlands, CovCath; kept Pulaski, Bowling Green, & vastly improved Southwestern.
3A - Agree with most others...about 5-6 teams who could take it. I will predict one of the Boyle, Belfry, Corbin trio to win it for the next 5-6 years.
4A - If Johnson Central can't win a title now, it's a failure and they should clean house. Everyone else is fighting for 2nd in my opinion.
2A - Mayfield should roll 2A similar to 1A.
1A - Wide open now that Mayfield is out.
Wildcat18 Wrote:I would probably go...
6A - Top to bottom, probably the strongest class. Many quality teams out of Louisville.
5A - Big improvement with realignment per class. Added Highlands, CovCath; kept Pulaski, Bowling Green, & vastly improved Southwestern.
3A - Agree with most others...about 5-6 teams who could take it. I will predict one of the Boyle, Belfry, Corbin trio to win it for the next 5-6 years.
4A - If Johnson Central can't win a title now, it's a failure and they should clean house. Everyone else is fighting for 2nd in my opinion.
2A - Mayfield should roll 2A similar to 1A.
1A - Wide open now that Mayfield is out.
I think Desales, CAL, and NCC will have some say in that.
#1 Blackcat Fan Wrote:I think Desales, CAL, and NCC will have some say in that.
Those guys will have a say, not denying that. Mayfield is just my personal pick to win. They absolutely drilled at top 3-4 2A team last year in Caldwell County with Kentucky's Mr. Football. They also beat a 5A finalist by 3 scores on the road. Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of Mayfield and I hope they lose to be quite honest based on arrogant fans (as they have the history to be that way), LOL. It won't be as easy for them as 1A, but I believe the Cardinals have what it takes to beat DeSales, CAL, & NCC.
goBIGblue82 Wrote:I think there has been a lot of valid responses, but the topic has varied from what I expected. I didn't word the question right in the description. Ranking the classes by strength of each individual class. So not necessarily can 4A beat 5A or 1A vs 6A, but the strength of the class from top to bottom. Example last year 1A was very strong due to the normal powerhouses along with numerous other teams that were capable of playing at a championship level.
To expand on this...I think Johnson Central would beat most 3A teams 7 out of a 10 game series format (just for kicks), but I'm not sure the 2nd best team in 4A could win half the games in a 10 game series against any of those 5-6 top tier teams in 3A. Who would technically be considered the 2nd best team in 4A?
Hoot Gibson Wrote::Thumbs: The overall strength of a football class is directly proportional to enrollment. Moving a few teams up or down in class because of enrollment changes has little effect on the relative strength of an individual class.
I find it funny that before the 6 class system most would argue that 1A was stronger than 2A. That was when there was an even bigger discrepancy in enrollment numbers. Mayfield, Beechwood, and Danville owned 1A and 1A was considered to be considerably stronger than whatever teams just happened to be good in 2A each year. However, now with 6 classes and the discrepancy in numbers between each class getting smaller everyone on here wants to act like it is insane to think that a lower class may have better competition than a higher class. SMH:please:
Wildcat18 Wrote:To expand on this...I think Johnson Central would beat most 3A teams 7 out of a 10 game series format (just for kicks), but I'm not sure the 2nd best team in 4A could win half the games in a 10 game series against any of those 5-6 top tier teams in 3A. Who would technically be considered the 2nd best team in 4A?
I agree Johnson without a doubt would be considered the top team in 3A (although I still don't trust a team that can never win a big game), but I also struggle finding teams that round out a top 5 in 4A that would be considered better on a regular basis than the top 5 in 3A.
If I was looking for a Head Coaching position I would be looking at 4A schools that have a decent talent base. I think 4A would be the easiest class to come in and have success right away.
[quote=EKUAlum05]Last year:
1. 6A- No debate here...about 10 very good teams and another 5 or 6 good teams.
2. 4A- The Top 5 was super strong... beyond the Top 10 it took a bit of a nosedive... but the upper tier was excellent
3. 1A- Strongest year in 1A I can recall. Very strong behind some Senior dominated teams and strong traditional powers like Mayfield and Beechwood
4. 2A- Top 5 was stellar. DeSales was the best small school in the State and CAL wasn't far behind them. Massive drop beyond about the first 6 teams.
5. 3A- Not a very good year in 3A. Belfry was very good but even they had a loss to a 1A team. It ended up being Belfry and about 10 "good" teams.
6. 5A- IMHO by far the weakest class. Bowling Green wasn't their normal self and two of the Classes Top Teams (Graves and Southwestern) each took it on the chin to 3A teams.
and Graves got taken to the woodshed by a 1A team as well
Class 1A has never not been the weakest class and it never will be. The range of enrollment numbers between the largest 1A schools and the schools with the smallest enrollments has a far greater impact than for any other class. That ensures that the weakest teams in 1A will always be far, far weaker than the weakest teams in 2A or above. There is a point where a school's enrollment numbers are just not capable of producing a competitive football team and all of the schools that suffer that problem play in 1A.
Take Paintsville, for example. Paintsville will be a legitimate Top 10, and maybe even a legitimate Top 5 team this fall. Match Paintsville against the top team in any other class, and it is likely that the Tigers would lose by 40+ and the top team in 1A will be very heavily favored if they play Paintsville.
Paintsville has a great football tradition and the school has produced some outstanding college football players. Obviously, during most of the program's history, the Tigers have been well coached and blessed with some great individual talent. What the program has lacked is the depth that the top team in 1A has, and lack of depth is the direct result of small enrollment numbers.
Consider Fairview. The team has benefited greatly from transfers in recent years, but it would be very hard for a very small school to recruit enough talent to seriously compete for a state title. It is much easier for very small schools to compete in other sports than in football.