According to this USA Today article, one evil man is close to dying. How does everyone feel about this? A lot of people say we shouldn't celebrate his death, because he too is a person, etc. A lot of people say we should have a collective beer as American's when he goes. Where do you stand?
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/natio...s/6491073/
Boycott his funeral?
Physically protest his funeral?
Plaster pictures of all the military folks that he caused a disruption to in their funerals?
Pray for him?
I'm oscillating.
Be the bigger person and just let him die...
The death of any human being is sad. God would want to pray for his family, and church that they might change. Protesting and stooping to his level doesn't make us any better.
^
Couldn't agree more!!!
Just answered honestly as to what I felt....I
eventually got there!!
Romans 12:17-19 (KJV)
17 Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.
18 If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.
Ours is not to judge, rather we are to live peaceably with all men. (Hence, the doctrine of DADT.) And yet, if Phelps is every bit the psycho he looks to be, then he'll suffer to whatever degree God deems appropriate. And, I believe his suffering would start the second he closes his eyes in death. Paul warned everybody to take care to recognize the ("terror of the Lord." 2Cor 5:11) Just saying that though I may agree that Phelps is likely toast, every man has a very difficult date with the Almighty coming, and that date is one that will not be broken.
Having read the article, one thing jumped out at me. But, before I reveal what it is, I want to point out the obvious about Westboro Baptist. Their anti-gay, anti-war protests are totally unacceptable behavior for any Church. These and other actions make me think they are likely a cult rather than a Church, but that is God's purview. That being said, the article writer, seemed to take a political tack on the validity of the homosexual lifestyle when he referred to Phelps' church as "anti-gay", suggesting that current US law has settled the matter, making churches that don't capitulate that view as being outliers. And it would follow therefore, that America has moved past her condemnation of this particular sin, in much the same way she has moved past acceptance for racial bigotry. And, that is the argument being proffered by the left. But here's the rub, ALL true Churches are anti-gay. Obviously, any Church that dares to stand against homosexual behavior risks being relegated by the left to a Westboro-esque profile, (right wing extremists if you prefer) but, such are the slings and arrows of the day in which we live.
America may think she has moved past judging outward sin, but I can assure you that God has not. It's a shame that a group of misfits like those at Westboro, would gain such dubious national standing for opposing the sin of homosexuality, while the true Church lacks the will or the "terror of the Lord" to take her rightful place to condemn the sin. Notice I did not say condemn the people who are enslaved by the sin. Gods people make up the true Church, and only the Church has the authority to speak out against the act, while calling for repentance by those who are caught in the trap. Those who do repent and turn from their sin, including that of homosexuality, will be received gladly into any congregation of believers. And, since only the Church has authority in the matter, government officials who write law in opposition to the Church, by such actions usurp the authority given by God, and are not doing themselves or the "people" any service whatever.
Good riddance, he might be a person, but he's not very human. I hope his eternal damnation consists of being locked in a very crowded gay bar at 11:30 PM on a Saturday night.
^^
In buttless chaps!!
Sorry cougarpride and TRT, I couldn't resist.
On a more serious note, I often times will wonder if Heaven and hell will be personalized. After all, that wouldn't be too much for God, now would it??
Granny Bear Wrote:^^
In buttless chaps!!
Sorry cougarpride and TRT, I couldn't resist.
On a more serious note, I often times will wonder if Heaven and hell will be personalized. After all, that wouldn't be too much for God, now would it??
Nope. Matter of fact, I believe that is the very reason God will go to the trouble to lay it all down, chapter and verse, during the Judgment. And thus, we are all to be Judged at an individual level. Not withstanding there are two Judgments. 'The Great White Throne', for the lost without Christ. And, 'The Bema Seat Judgment', to determine the level of loss and reward for those who by faith will choose Christ, in this life here on earth.
So you believe in "levels" or "degrees" of Heaven and hell, or reward and judgment?
I'm not trying to start a debate, just want your opinion. I've been reading a lot about judgment lately, and it's starting to clear for me a little. That was what I meant when I asked if God could "personalize" judgment. And I believe He will do that. I don't think I will have a hotter hell or a more glorious Heaven. I just think that the personalized factor will make it different, but on the same degree as everyone else.
I know that sounds weird, LOL. Just been doing a lot of thinking here lately.
Granny Bear Wrote:So you believe in "levels" or "degrees" of Heaven and hell, or reward and judgment?
I'm not trying to start a debate, just want your opinion. I've been reading a lot about judgment lately, and it's starting to clear for me a little. That was what I meant when I asked if God could "personalize" judgment. And I believe He will do that. I don't think I will have a hotter hell or a more glorious Heaven. I just think that the personalized factor will make it different, but on the same degree as everyone else.
I know that sounds weird, LOL. Just been doing a lot of thinking here lately.
You may feel free to start a debate anytime Granny. :biggrin: But yeah, I believe there are 'levels' of reward and I believe there will be loss of reward.
1 Corinthians 3:12-15 (KJV)
12 Now if any man build upon
this foundation (the foundation of Jesus Christ) gold, silver, precious stones,
wood, hay, stubble;
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. [italics mine]
This passage is written to the Christian only. Our life's work for Christ will be tried, in what is to be a Judgment of fire. If we have built things that can be consumed by that fire, we will suffer loss, but we ourselves will be saved. In other words, some Christians just want to get saved and sort of coast on in, not making any waves. However, if we build things that cannot be consumed by that fire, as in the various services to Him like leading folks to Christ, we will receive an eternal reward that is meant to enhance our 'personal' eternal life. Sort of like your basic cable package versus the platinum package. I believe the possibilities for our eternal sted will therefore be very much like life on planet earth has been. Some live very graciously, some work with their hands. All noble pursuits, but some are grand by comparison.
Likewise, there will be levels of damnation for the lost.
I would never start a debate with you because I like to win!!
granny bear Wrote:i would never start a debate with you because i like to win!!
lol
In my opinion, I feel bad for his family for multiple reasons. One being, I believe Fred has them all brainwashed but I don't know.
However, I think his death makes the world a better place and I'll leave it at that... I hope he is greeted at the pearly gates by angry soldiers and rainbows before being promptly Stone Cold Stunner'd to the depths of hell.
Hopefully, God has mercy on his soul because he'll need it.
Most of his children have left him and Westboro Church.
It's official.
Fred is dead.
I am freaking broken hearted.
Granny Bear Wrote:It's official.
Fred is dead.
Reminds me of the joke about the singing telegram. Remember that one Granny?
That's what popped into my head when I read about Fred.
Wow, this rhyming is getting too freaky....
Maybe the gay community could protest his funeral
^
I honestly wonder if anyone will protest his funeral.
I could see it happening.
They may attempt to do that, but can you imagine the security they'll more than likely have!
Granny Bear Wrote:That's what popped into my head when I read about Fred.
Wow, this rhyming is getting too freaky....
First thing that popped in my mind was the old Curtis Mayfield song,
"Freddies Dead"...lol
TRT, plenty of churches are anti-gay and don't get vilified, I would say the majority are anti-gay. This church has been vilified because they want death for everyone who doesn't think like they do.
As for me, I wouldn't protest the guy's funeral because I'm not that low, even though they showed up twice to the funeral's of personal friends of mine, and many other times to a friend of a friend's. I sure as heck won't lose sleep over it, and I hope this guy enjoyed the surprise of entering hell in his last few seconds of life.
I was speaking in the broader sense Vundy. I have heard rumblings coming out of Frankfurt, of a move by leading legislators to revoke the tax exempt status of Churches found guilty of discriminating against gays. I know you have strong feelings about the matter and so do I. IMHO however, acceptance will not be nearly as innocuous as suggested, with the repeal of DADT having effectively legalized homosexuality. Such action forced Commanders in the various branches of the US Armed Services to openly support sexual preference by military statute. As you are no doubt aware, all 50 states had sodomy laws on the books in the very recent past. The US Military UCMJ merely mirrored those laws, which have become harder to enforce as time has gone by. The repeal of DADT was a stunning coup d'etat of a legal strategy, if I ever saw one. To the victors went the spoils as they reveled in their victory while, the majority was left claiming foul. Since then, the courts have been increasingly of a humor to come down on the side of those who yell discrimination. And that certainly includes the SCOTUS.
The author of the article sourced by Belfry0304, referred to Westboro as "Anti-gay Westboro Baptist Church" Even though this group has been guilty of a broad spectrum of affronts, the author none the less focused only on the anti-gay issue, so the question begs to be asked. Why single out the fact they were "Anti-gay" and leave the rest of the laundry on the floor? I think that was an obvious soap box issue for Polly Davis Doig and she seized upon the opportunity to reaffirm the matter to be closed, except perhaps in the minds of religious zealots?
My position on the matter is that most media types, and that certainly would include FOX News, is that the homosexual lifestyle is now legal and, that only Bible thumping right wingers cling to the recently antiquated opinion that said lifestyle is wrong.
But, you are right. All Churches which condemn homosexuality as being wrong, and have therefore refused to support same sex marriage, have not been legislated against as yet. However, I have reason to suspect the rumored loss of tax exempt status could well be correct. Additionally, we know the DOJ is prosecuting an action against the Roman Catholic Church in forcing them to comply with birth control regulations within the ACA, on pain of the same penalty. And, as you point out, Westboro brought all the bad they have received upon themselves by their actions. Unfortunately, that doesn't allay my concerns that too many in the media, equate fervent service to the Almighty with the wild eyed zealotry of Westboro Baptist.
In any case, Phelps has already met his Maker and experienced "the terror of the Lord."
Here's a thought at 2:12am...
I read that the church held their first protest since ol' Fred Phelps did his Pele impression ze bucket. Counter protesters held signs that said "Sorry for your loss" intending to send a positive message. A lot of people say we should pray for them, etc. So here's my question, maybe just maybe is WBC a good thing? A good example of how NOT to act, how not to hate? Since people react to them by doing the opposite, and spreading care and kindness, maybe that's their point all along?