Bluegrassrivals

FBALL Wrote:We survived W and Super Dick. I think the country will be all right.

Obama has added more to the national debt already in less than 4 years that Bush did in 8 years. According to his own spending projections, the size of our national debt will increase more in 8 years of Obama "rule" than it did during the all of the previous presidents combined. I am glad that you are confident that the country can continue to spend 40 percent more money than it collects forever, but if we do, we will be the first country in the history of the world to accomplish that feat.

Add to the Obama debt explosion the fact that fewer people are working today than were working when he took office, and I think that there are some pretty good reasons to fear a second Obama term. At least the slowing Obama economy is temporarily easing gasoline prices.

Don't lecture on politics. Even fewer people would be working had GM not been bailed out. Yes that added to the debt but it was necessary.

I'm not a democrat before you go there not that that would be a bad thing. I'm independent. Each side can quote statistics to make their case . The spin is nauseating. Honestly I'll take Obama over Romney. Each side is more interested in defeating the other than in doing the best for the country.

I hate politics but unfortunately it is a necessary evil. Luckily our forefathers saw the need for checks and balances. God help us all if one political party ever controls the house, the senate, the supreme court and the presidency.

FBALL Wrote:Don't lecture on politics even fewer people would be working had GM not been bailed out. Yes that added to the debt but

Don't lecture me on how the country is doing just fine under Obama's leadership. I know better. The GM bailout is a drop in the bucket of the total money that Obama is wasting. Vote for him if you want, but if you help reelect Obama and the economy crashes in a few years, at least place the blame where it will belong - on Obama and the misguided people who voted for him.

Your lecturing again. Like anybody gives a crap. That's why we have elections. You vote for your choice I'll vote for mine.

Accidentally hit the wrong button on the phone while typing that last post. If you want to preach about the whole thing now feel free.

I love how the hardcore republicans refuse to believe the part W played in the recession. Just line Bush 1 played a big part in the economic success if the Clinton administration. A president's effectiveness or failure is usually not seen until after his term in office is completed.

FBALL Wrote:Your lecturing again. Like anybody gives a crap. That's why we have elections. You vote for your choice I'll vote for mine.

Accidentally hit the wrong button on the phone while typing that last post. If you want to preach about the whole thing now feel free.

I love how the hardcore republicans refuse to believe the part W played in the recession. Just line Bush 1 played a big part in the economic success if the Clinton administration. A president's effectiveness or failure is usually not seen until after his term in office is completed.

I am not preaching, just laying out the facts. History will not erase the unprecedented contributions to the national debt that Obama has made. Our first socialist president has been a monumental flop. Americans were smart enough to dump Jimmy Carter after four years of weak leadership and fiscal mismanagement. Hopefully, this generation will rise to the challenge and follow suit.

This is the wrong forum to debate how bad the Obama era has been, so I will make this my last post here. Obama did a nice job congratulating the UK players on their title, but I hope somebody else will be doing the honor next year.

Actually Vundy invited this debate.

Facts differ in each side of the aisle. Your facts and their facts are not the same. That is why political arguments are only superseded in stupidity by arguments over religion. Nobody wins in either case.

REMARKS BY THE PRESIDENT HONORING THE 2012 NCAA MEN’S BASKETBALL CHAMPION KENTUCKY WILDCATS East Room 5:03 P.M. EDT THE PRESIDENT: Thank you! (Applause.) Thank you very much. Everybody, have a seat. Have a seat. Welcome to the White House, and congratulations to the Kentucky Wildcats on your 8th national championship. (Applause.) Eighth national champ -- that’s not bad. (Laughter.) That’s not bad. Although, this is the first in 14 years. Now, this was the fourth year that I filled out my bracket on ESPN. And what I’ve learned is that if I make the right picks, I look like a genius. But if things go the other way, then a team like Kentucky gets to come to my house and remind me, in person, that I was wrong. (Laughter.) So it is a double-edged sword. Of course, I knew Kentucky was good. I had them in the championship game. But in the end, I thought, they got all these freshmen. These guys are too young. (Laughter.) And keep in mind, at this time last year, three of the Wildcats’ five starters were still in high school. Michael Kidd-Gilchrist couldn’t even vote yet. (Laughter.) But let’s face it, sometimes talent trumps experience. And sometimes, a bunch of young players, even if they’re used to being big fishes in their ponds, even if they’ve never played together before, they can buy into a system, they understand the concept of team, and they do something special right away. And that’s exactly what happened in Kentucky. Of course, a lot of credit for that goes to their outstanding coach, Coach Calipari. (Applause.) My understanding is, when he recruited these players, Coach started off by asking them some simple questions: Do you want to win a national title? The answer was yes, apparently. (Laughter.) Can you do it by yourself? The answer was no. He took a roster with six former All-Americans and got them to do something even more impressive, and that was share the ball. So you had six players average double figures in points this year; nobody averaged more than nine shots a game. If you didn’t play defense, you didn’t play. And as a result, the Wildcats started winning. At one point, they won 24 straight. They spent the final eight weeks of the season ranked number one. They cruised through the tournament, trailed for less than 10 minutes total, before beating Kansas in front of 70,000 fans at the Super Dome. (Applause.) So that’s a pretty good run. Most importantly, though, they did it as a team. And nobody, I think, was a better example of that than Anthony Davis, who -- everybody kept on remarking on it. Nobody has ever seen somebody who didn’t have a lot of field goals and yet still controlled the game. Still ended up being the most valuable player -- racked up sixteen rebounds, six blocks, three steals. That doesn’t count all the intimidation factor -- (laughter) -- that the other team had to go through. Of course, that’s what happens when you grow eight inches between your sophomore and senior years of high school. In fact, he has grown an inch since he got to the White House. (Laughter.) His pants are already like this. (Laughter.) Just got a new suit. (Laughter.) When Anthony needed help, Doron Lamb stepped up, dropping 22 points in the biggest game of his career. (Applause.) First off the bench, Darius Miller, who became -- (applause) -- the first player in Kentucky history to be named Mr. Basketball, win a state championship in high school and win a national title with the Wildcats. (Applause.) I’m pretty sure Coach Cal is right that if Darius decides to run for governor he’ll do all right in Kentucky. (Laughter.) I also want to congratulate Darius and Eloy Vargas for getting their diplomas on Sunday. That’s worth a big round of applause. (Applause.) And I want to congratulate them for doing their share of community service in the Lexington community -- from packing backpacks full of food for kids who don’t have enough, to raising money for tornado victims. So these guys do it all. Everybody’s got to take a good look now, because a whole bunch of these guys are going on to the NBA. Who knows, one of them might end up here in Washington. We’ll take him. (Applause.) Coach Cal is back on the recruiting trail, and if the next group of Wildcats is anything like this one, then I might see them again sometime soon. So congratulations again to all the fans, to all the faculty, to all the -- everybody who helps to make Kentucky such an outstanding university. Most of all, congratulations to the team and to coach Calipari. (Applause.) COACH CALIPARI: Thank you very much. Mr. President, on behalf of the Big Blue Nation, the Commonwealth of Kentucky, we are honored and humbled to be here. This team, when they won that championship on that court in New Orleans, they were jumping up and down not saying, “We did it! We won!” They were saying, “We’re going to the White House! We’re going to the White House!” (Laughter.) Because they wanted to meet you. As a member of our team, I’d like our seniors, Darius Miller, to give you his #1 jersey that he wore for four years. Eloy Vargas has a ball that the team has signed, and the young -- (laughter and applause.) There’s the #1 jersey. THE PRESIDENT: That's a good-looking jersey right there. (Applause.) COACH CALIPARI: And the young guy from your home city of Chicago -- THE PRESIDENT: Chicago! (Laughter.) COACH CALIPARI: -- would like to present you with the 2012 National Championship ring, and it might say, it is the first. (Applause.) THE PRESIDENT: Thank you. Look at that. Well, this is some nice gear. (Laughter.) I have to say, by the way, after the game, I called the coach and the team, and I mentioned to Anthony that I had actually been to his school, a small charter school in Chicago, when I was still a senator. And I had spoken to the kids there, and he told me, yes, I was there. (Laughter.) But I didn't recognize him. He looked a little different apparently four years ago, so what a wonderful set of gifts. I appreciate that. END 5:10 P.M. EDT



Read more here: http://www.kentucky.com/2012/05/04/21760...rylink=cpy

FBALL Wrote:Actually Vundy invited this debate.

Facts differ in each side of the aisle. Your facts and their facts are not the same. That is why political arguments are only superseded in stupidity by arguments over religion. Nobody wine in either case.

Facts don't differ depending on your party affiliation. Opinions differ. Most of the stats about the Obama administration that i post come from departments and agencies that report to him, others come from the Congressional Budget Office, which is supposed to be non-partisan. The facts are there, but it is easy to listen to party spin and ignore elephants (and donkeys) that are destroying the house from within.

You're spinning.

Hoot Gibson Wrote:Facts don't differ depending on your party affiliation. Opinions differ. Most of the stats about the Obama administration that i post come from departments and agencies that report to him, others come from the Congressional Budget Office, which is supposed to be non-partisan. The facts are there, but it is easy to listen to party spin and ignore elephants (and donkeys) that are destroying the house from within.

Trust me Hoot, its worthless going down this route of arguing with a door knob.

Sources told him that.

FBALL Wrote:You're spinning.

No, I am just stating an informed opinion. You can check the stats yourself from IRS, Bureau of Labor Statistics, and the Congressional Budget Office, and draw your own conclusions. Some people honestly believe that there is nothing wrong with borrowing more than a trillion dollars a year and passing the bill for current entitlement spending to future generations. I disagree.

In a few years, the interest alone on our national debt will exceed our entire defense budget. In the not so distant future, some president will be unable to continue funding current entitlements, even if he or she wants to do so - and it will not matter whether he is a Democrat or a Republican. If you see nothing wrong with that picture, then by all means cast another vote for Obama.

I think that it is morally wrong to spend the money of our grandchildren for government benefits and security that they will not have.

RunItUpTheGut Wrote:Trust me Hoot, its worthless going down this route of arguing with a door knob.

Yeah, I know. Most moderates/independents prefer condemning those of us who take an active interest in what our government is up to (mostly conservatives and liberals) over spending the time and effort needed to become informed. "Moderate" is just one of those words that sounds so warm and fuzzy. nicker:

I'm not condemning anyone. I have some conservative views as well. Moderate was your term. Political fighting back forth is just something nobody wins. That doesn't mean I don't take an active interest either. To me it means I'm not going to be too critical of anybody for doing what they believe is right.

FBALL Wrote:I'm not condemning anyone. I have some conservative views as well. Moderate was your term. Political fighting back forth is just something nobody wins. That doesn't mean I don't take an active interest either. To me it means I'm not going to be too critical of anybody for doing what they believe is right.

Stalin and Mao probably did what they thought was right for their respective countries. I would not have voted for them either. As long as I am allowed to be critical of politicians who I believe are doing irreparable harm to this country, I don't plan to stop. The rate at which the federal government is accumulating debt is unsustainable. That is a historical fact.

I don't see how anybody could be pleased with obama's first term in office. People can think what they want about George W. Bush, but the fact is he is nearly years gone. I wouldn't expect to see obama turn all this around in four years, but at the same time there should be some positive signs about the future. Unfortunately things are looking worse and I honestly don't know if we can survive a second obama term. It doesn't matter who is running - Romney, Paul, Gingrich, whoever - obama needs to go.

Hoot Gibson Wrote:Stalin and Mao probably did what they thought was right for their respective countries. I would not have voted for them either. As long as I am allowed to be critical of politicians who I believe are doing irreparable harm to this country, I don't plan to stop. The rate at which the federal government is accumulating debt is unsustainable. That is a historical fact.

Now who is condemning? Just a bit hypocritical.

^ Moved the thread to the right place.

FBALL Wrote:Now who is condemning? Just a bit hypocritical.

Not hypocritical at all. Elected officials should be judged on results not on good intentions. You said that you don't believe in being critical of anybody for doing what they believe is right. I never doubted that Jimmy Carter did what he thought was right when he was president but good intentions does not make up for poor performance. I am less inclined to believe that Obama believes that what he has done during his first term is right - but that is really irrelevant - what counts are the consequences of his actions. His war on fossil fuels has already hit our economy hard but it is doing a tremendous amount of long term damage.

IMO, Obama has shown a blatant disregard for the U.S. Constitution in signing laws like Obamacare into law. As you rightly pointed out, the Constitution does provide checks and balances on the power of each of the three branches - but an arrogant, politically ambitious president can wreak havoc on the system when his party also controls Congress.

You also stated that you would hate to see one party gain control of all three branches of government. If Obama is elected to a second term, there is a very good chance that will happen at some point during his presidency. He is one Supreme Court appointment away from tilting the Supreme Court sharply to the left.

Do you actually believe that a president who has presided over the largest single term increase in the national debt deserves a second term? What would a failed first term have looked like, in your opinion?

FBALL Wrote:Your lecturing again. Like anybody gives a crap. That's why we have elections. You vote for your choice I'll vote for mine.

Accidentally hit the wrong button on the phone while typing that last post. If you want to preach about the whole thing now feel free.

I love how the hardcore republicans refuse to believe the part W played in the recession. Just line Bush 1 played a big part in the economic success if the Clinton administration. A president's effectiveness or failure is usually not seen until after his term in office is completed.

So, we may take it then, that the 26 months of above mentioned job growth, is the aggregate of forward thinking George W policies?

Failure to bailout the auto industry would have been complete failure.

Bush played a part in that job growth. Yes. Who do you think started the bailouts to save a recessing?

Continuing to raise the debt is not sustainable. We all know that. even the evil O has said so.

FBALL Wrote:Facts differ in each side of the aisle. Your facts and their facts are not the same. That is why political arguments are only superseded in stupidity by arguments over religion. Nobody wins in either case.

:popcorn:

Hoot Gibson Wrote:No, I am just stating an informed opinion. You can check the stats yourself from IRS, Bureau of Labor Statistics, and the Congressional Budget Office, and draw your own conclusions. Some people honestly believe that there is nothing wrong with borrowing more than a trillion dollars a year and passing the bill for current entitlement spending to future generations. I disagree.

In a few years, the interest alone on our national debt will exceed our entire defense budget. In the not so distant future, some president will be unable to continue funding current entitlements, even if he or she wants to do so - and it will not matter whether he is a Democrat or a Republican. If you see nothing wrong with that picture, then by all means cast another vote for Obama.

I think that it is morally wrong to spend the money of our grandchildren for government benefits and security that they will not have.

As George W was leaving office the projected date for Social Security running out of funds was the year 2060. After nearly one full Obama term, that date has been adjusted backward to 2036, is now the last year full benefits will be paid to retirees. He slashed the projected timeline nearly in half in less than one full term. There isn't one guy on this board that won't affect. Folks, for most of you, it will mean eating regularly or not eating regularly. And believe me, retirement time will come around much sooner than you think. Four more years of the destructive practices of present day will assure the 'death knell' for SS between the years 2037-2040, is set in stone.

The time for the naive politics of the past, when the dems generally represented the blue collar population has past. They are not your grandfather's party anymore, the voting base has mutated from basically labor to special interests. Cutting our own throat by pushing ahead with the absurdly non-existant green energy programs, is nationally destructive, especially in light of the fact that we have hundreds of years of fossile fuels left. Dividing the country into the haves and the havenots is equally suicidal because up until the Obama administration redefined the American middle class, over 90% of America considered themselves to be in the middle class. Now, thinkers of the progressive/liberal agenda propaganda machine are saying that it's 99% poor and 1% rich. Sadly the ruse has begun to take solid root, and the resulting divide has produced waves of contempt between the free peoples of the United States.

I don't care if Obama thinks he's the savior of American civilization or not, he's wrong and misguided IMO. His policies have all been tried in the past, largely during the Roosevelt era and have proven to be inappropriate for a free society. The debt and rising prices of food and generally the cost of living have exploded in the past 4 years and all are threatening to go much higher. America is the place where a man can get a job and succeed in having his own place in the American Dream, complete with house, car and the whole deal. We're not about giving people a life ala "Extreme Makeover: Home Edition", and we sure can't give away a dream home to 115 million households. When you think about it, government can only give the treasury away once, and it will be gone. With 40 cents of every dollar spent now being borrowed in this country, it is truly time for a reality check. All it will take is your vote being cast for a the candidate who wants to slow things down a bit, cut spending a bit, and do what is best for the country. Obama has already said he's not about to stop the national headlong plunge and the choice is clear. Romney deserves a chance to pull the riens back.

FBALL Wrote:Actually Vundy invited this debate.

Facts differ in each side of the aisle. Your facts and their facts are not the same. That is why political arguments are only superseded in stupidity by arguments over religion. Nobody wins in either case.

If you're trolling, I'll bite. The Facts don't differ. Only the loose interpretation of the facts differ. Out of the striving that has the Congress of the US in gridlock, one thing is clear, the side doing the bashing is the dems. "United We Stand, Divided We Fall", I use to be proud of our State Motto. The ones who keep coming with all the negative stuff, the party of No and on and on, is the dems. The two parties use to work together just fine, they better get a handle on this crap soon or it's over. Like I have said before, it's about putting love of country over everything else, including hatred for those across the aisle.

I would rather give Duke this title than to have obama another 4 years

FBALL Wrote:Continuing to raise the debt is not sustainable. We all know that. even the evil O has said so.

Obama has said this, that is true, in fact he said that Bush's deficit spending was unpatriotic. Yet, Obama has more than doubled the size of the annual deficits that Bush compiled, it is going on three years since the Democratic-controlled Senate passed an annual federal budget, which they are required to do by law, and Obama's own spending plans include tax increases and huge deficits 10 years from now. There are fewer people working today than when Obama took office and we have the highest corporate tax rate of any developed country. Socialism drives jobs out of this country and that is the path that Obama has placed this nation.

Obama's policies are condemning all of us to a miserable future, including the moochers who have no desire to work. Somebody has to pay the bills.