I was stating my opinion on holdbacks, and I'm curious about how many people would approve of a rule limiting players to one year in any given grade level, regardless of how many years it takes them to reach the maturity level required to advance successfully.
Perhaps it would limit the sports-only holdbacks somewhat, and level the playing field for those schools and school systems who don't allow the practice at all.
So my question is: would you approve of a rule change that limited holdbacks to only one playing year per school grade?
eratia Wrote:I was stating my opinion on holdbacks, and I'm curious about how many people would approve of a rule limiting players to one year in any given grade level, regardless of how many years it takes them to reach the maturity level required to advance successfully.
Perhaps it would limit the sports-only holdbacks somewhat, and level the playing field for those schools and school systems who don't allow the practice at all.
So my question is: would you approve of a rule change that limited holdbacks to only one playing year per school grade?
Corbin has always had that rule. If you hold back, you do not play school sanctioned sports.
I'd hold mine back if they were allowed to play or not.
High School athletics already have that rule but I would be in favor if Middle School did also.There would have to be a governing body to inforce it. IMO that is why it would be good if KHSAA took over 6-8.
KHSAA should take over 6-8 and place every team in a region and district and class. That way you would at least have some consistency.
Let them play. Sports is extracurricular anyways. Have good attendance and make good grades - Reward - PLAYING SPORTS
Could that holdback continue to be on the academic team.......member of the band.....member of FCA? All of those things are extra-curricular.
new o Wrote:Could that holdback continue to be on the academic team.......member of the band.....member of FCA? All of those things are extra-curricular.
Good question but those things would not be controlled by KHSAA.
Should be, after all they are STUDENT-athletes. Holding kids back happens nationwide. Some do it and some don't. I support it because I am getting one more year with my kids in my life.
I dont think a child should be allowed to graduate until the are 19 or at the least 18. If they play sports so be it but 17 is just to young to be out in the real world. If you can't vote you shouldn't be in college.
but you have to think the kid on the academic team or fca is not running full speed down a football field and hitting a kid 1-2 and possibly 3 years younger
I'm against it. You have the same right as I did. I wish I was held back.
TOUCHDOWN Wrote:I dont think a child should be allowed to graduate until the are 19 or at the least 18. If they play sports so be it but 17 is just to young to be out in the real world. If you can't vote you shouldn't be in college.
This is a blanket statement. I started college at 17 and played college sports. I agree in some cases 17 is young to be in college, however if you are holding them back due to immaturity then they should concentrate on other issues and not be concerened with how they are doing in middle school sports.
We can discuss this all we want but it is never gonna change either get on board and fight fire with fire or get used to second place throphies.hell as against hold backs as i have been on this site i'm about ready to hold mine back just let me warn all those who do it if it ever becomes the norm in jefferson county it is over for the rest of the state.
The_Rock Wrote:Let them play. Sports is extracurricular anyways. Have good attendance and make good grades - Reward - PLAYING SPORTS
I think, like you, that sports are a privilidge, and should be restricted to those who do the things that allow them those privilidges. When they do those things and do them well, there will be no need for them to repeat a grade.
If they fail at academic tasks, or attendence issues, playing football wouldn't be a reward for them a second time through. I want every student to succeed, and I'm not against holdbacks as a whole, but rather holding back for sports sake. One year's enough for each grade level of athletic competition.
DOUGHDADDY Wrote:We can discuss this all we want but it is never gonna change either get on board and fight fire with fire or get used to second place throphies.hell as against hold backs as i have been on this site i'm about ready to hold mine back just let me warn all those who do it if it ever becomes the norm in jefferson county it is over for the rest of the state.
I hope it does happen for Jefferson County. You're more than welcome to bring your kids down here in south central Ky. The opportunities are endless. I've personally had Louisville parents ask me about the possibilities, positives, and negatives about holding back. I had a Farnsley parent approach me at a passing tournament in the summer acquiring information about the possibilities of their child living in our area. This tells me that there are parents across the state in areas that don't allow it that would definitely be interested in it if it were an available option.
I had a starting 5 of holdbacks and when we played summer ball and traveled we played up an age level. As 7th graders we played two high school teams. We wanted to play against kids 1-2 years older than us becuase that will make you better and make you work harder. We never played kids our age, always older than us. Sounds like some of the people on here are worried about little Johnnie getting a trophy,lol.
new o Wrote:I had a starting 5 of holdbacks and when we played summer ball and traveled we played up an age level. As 7th graders we played two high school teams. We wanted to play against kids 1-2 years older than us becuase that will make you better and make you work harder. We never played kids our age, always older than us. Sounds like some of the people on here are worried about little Johnnie getting a trophy,lol.
That is great and i am familiar with your situation however, if you are not playing against kids 1 or 2 years older your logic does not work. If you look at the holdbacks here the only kids playing against older kids in county sports are the non holdbacks.
wildcat18 Wrote:i hope it does happen for jefferson county. You're more than welcome to bring your kids down here in south central ky. The opportunities are endless. I've personally had louisville parents ask me about the possibilities, positives, and negatives about holding back. I had a farnsley parent approach me at a passing tournament in the summer acquiring information about the possibilities of their child living in our area. This tells me that there are parents across the state in areas that don't allow it that would definitely be interested in it if it were an available option.
how do you feel about adopting a 215 pound 8th grader from farnsley for a year
What is the reason for holding a kid back to play football for 1-2 years? I guess it would be because the kid doesn't have the skill set or ability to play kids his own age? If it is academics then the grades wouldn't be at the level to play sports so that wouldn't be the reason. I have seen a hold back team play a non hold back team and the difference between the 12 year old and 14 or 15 year old body is extreme. 8th grade teams that have 15 year olds? That means those players aren't good enough to play other 15 year olds so hold them back to play 13 year olds. I heard all the boosting about some programs how big and fast they were......until I found out they are 2 years older than everyone else. If you hold kids back 2 years of course they should be bigger and faster than younger kids. Not impressed. This can get kids hurt due to the size and speed difference. I wish there was a rule about hold backs and hold back "programs" to not compete against middle schools who don't hold back kids for safety reasons alone.
RichBrooks Wrote:KHSAA should take over 6-8 and place every team in a region and district and class. That way you would at least have some consistency.
That would definitely be interesting. The KHSAA could become involved, but I would think they'd have to govern all middle school sports to be effective at governing. I'm not sure that would even be something they'd want to do.
KYMSFA could establish some kind of rules structure that would prohibit repeat performers among the member organizations, and more definitively outline procedures for dealing with 'held back' students in addition to the 'can't be 14 before August 1st' rule. This would be a way to prevent schools from aggressively working to 'hold back' kids to build a football powerhouse in middle school, and allow similiarly aged students to use effort, determination, preparation, and will to determine games, conference championships, and state playoff participants.
The benefits of this plan would be that schools who are practicing education as primary and sports as secondary could still be competitive, or at least not be penalized by their lack of willingness to have a child or a whole group of children repeat a grade at the whim of a coach, or fan base.
Everyone who is on here in opposition of holding back kids has their own opinion, but speaking for myself and my son it was the best thing I've ever done for him in school and sports!! He also says it was the best decision he has made thusfar too!! He I a straight A student and has neverade a B, a Duke Tips scholar, and made a 21 on ACT as a 7th grader. So holding him back hasn't hurt his academics, if anything it has added to it!! So everyone who is on here saying it's not good for academics should speak with the kids who have held back and get their input before shaming everyone who does!!
new o Wrote:Could that holdback continue to be on the academic team.......member of the band.....member of FCA? All of those things are extra-curricular.
Seriously, if a kid is good enough to make the academic team, he or she probably has no reason or desire to hold back. In addition to that, I can't think of a single example of a kid holding back so he or she can really rack up points in quick recall.
Band is not a sport, and therefore, not relevent to this discussion. FCA is a club that every athlete should participate in, but not something to be governed. Again, there's never been an occasion of someone holding back to play a smoother trumpet solo, or to pray for athletics. There's no competitive edge to be gained there, so they'd only be held back if there was a specific academic or social need.
Everyone's justification for 'holding back' just for sports seems to be that everyone else is doing it, or I don't want my kid to go to college at 17, or I want my middle school team to be really good. Does that mean, someday, you'll encourage them to wait a year before they take that job, or get married, or have that first child? Maybe they should wait a year to go to church, or to drive a car. After all, we want them to be as prepared as possible for the world. Another year waited on everything would do that, right?
The truth is, having a kid 'hold back' just for sports is bad for the quality of the game. We should raise the quality of play for everyone, not just the schools who cooperate with the 'hold back' mentality. Nothing makes a kid shine more than to stand out among his peers, rather than standing out when playing against kids younger than him. That would be cosmetic standing out, not actual standing out.
Who would it hurt to limit each student to one year only per grade level?
snapcat91 Wrote:Everyone who is on here in opposition of holding back kids has their own opinion, but speaking for myself and my son it was the best thing I've ever done for him in school and sports!! He also says it was the best decision he has made thusfar too!! He I a straight A student and has neverade a B, a Duke Tips scholar, and made a 21 on ACT as a 7th grader. So holding him back hasn't hurt his academics, if anything it has added to it!! So everyone who is on here saying it's not good for academics should speak with the kids who have held back and get their input before shaming everyone who does!!
Subjecting any student to repeating materials they've already mastered, is harmful to the child's growth. High potential kids need to feed their intellect to keep it growing, and a year off slows that growth. The long term effects could be exponential, and the sports gains by playing against younger kids is extremely short term. It seems highly unlikely that what seems an ok concession to make in 7th grade is going to pay dividends 4-5 years down the road on either front: Academic success or Athletic.
I have held my boys back and will do so with my daughter. I LOVE MY KIDS and want to spend an extra year with them. Unlike some parents I do not want to push them out the door asap.
Why not just start the kid late instead of holding them back in 7th and 8th grade? Or repeating a critical grade for reading and math skills like 2nd and 3rd grade? I would find it hard to swallow as a parent that my 7th grade boy would have to compete with the kids that could be freshman or soph's in football. At some point kids pay the price for all this hold back stuff because older kids are taking the younger kids positions because its their second year on the 8th grade team type stuff. I am all for kids graduating older and being a 19 year old senior, but getting to play 8th grade football twice is not right.
bob green Wrote:Why not just start the kid late instead of holding them back in 7th and 8th grade? Or repeating a critical grade for reading and math skills like 2nd and 3rd grade? I would find it hard to swallow as a parent that my 7th grade boy would have to compete with the kids that could be freshman or soph's in football. At some point kids pay the price for all this hold back stuff because older kids are taking the younger kids positions because its their second year on the 8th grade team type stuff. I am all for kids graduating older and being a 19 year old senior, but getting to play 8th grade football twice is not right.
Money... Child care is very expensive. I can send my 4 year old to pre-school then at 5 kindergarden....I wish more people had money to start them late, but where I live people are just lucky enough to have a job.
DOUGHDADDY Wrote:how do you feel about adopting a 215 pound 8th grader from farnsley for a year
LOL...we may be able to work something out. You seem to have somewhat of a different outlook on the topic since about a year ago.
People can say what they want about holding back, but most of the negativity comes from those who live in an area where it has never been allowed by the school system. If those people were around it and around the families who have had success with it, it would be different, I guarantee it.
wildcat18 Wrote:lol...we may be able to work something out. You seem to have somewhat of a different outlook on the topic since about a year ago.
People can say what they want about holding back, but most of the negativity comes from those who live in an area where it has never been allowed by the school system. If those people were around it and around the families who have had success with it, it would be different, i guarantee it.
my opinion really hasn't changed just realizing it is a losing battle
Starting them late is the same as holding them back, they still would take your kids spot. Holding a kid back does not make them better, they have to work very hard that extra year for it to pay off. Back when I was in school all kids started school around the same age but now kids start as early as 3 years old which is crazy but because the parents work they have no choice financially.