The way Divisions are divided is still not fair. Schools who have around 250 boys have to compete with schools that have 500-600, just isn't fair. They need to take whichever member has the most boys and divide that into three separate divsions. If for example it is 600 then Divison 1 should 400-600+, Divsion 2 should be 200-399, and Division 3 should be 0-199.
Or if its 500, D 1 - 325-500+ D2 - 176- 324, D3 - 0-175.
Each division should have an equal range of numbers. not 100, 100, 400 as it stands now. (not exactly but close) I don't have the actual numbers with me now.
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Well there not going to be so you might as well get use to it.
The same thing was happening when high school football was only 4 classes and you had schools like Whitley, North Laurel and South Laurel with a little over a 1000 kids competing against schools like Trinity, St. X, all the Fayette schools, etc. Until you can evenly distribute teams, and you cant in middle school football, than it will always be this way.
Going to six classes in high school wass the best possible move for schools with enrollments at the bottom of the other 4 classes.
RichBrooks Wrote:The way Divisions are divided is still not fair. Schools who have around 250 boys have to compete with schools that have 500-600, just isn't fair. They need to take whichever member has the most boys and divide that into three separate divsions. If for example it is 600 then Divison 1 should 400-600+, Divsion 2 should be 200-399, and Division 3 should be 0-199.
Or if its 500, D 1 - 325-500+ D2 - 176- 324, D3 - 0-175.
Each division should have an equal range of numbers. not 100, 100, 400 as it stands now. (not exactly but close) I don't have the actual numbers with me now.
There is no exact way to do it. I understand exactly what you are saying but you are looking at big school. You say 250 can't compete with 500 but it's OK for small school with 65 boys to compete against a school with 174 boys.
But then everyone has to compete with schools twice their size instead of a few schools competing against schools 3-4 times their size. The fairest playing field is one thats evenly distributed.
The schools at the bottom of division 1 are severly punished. It is obviously a disadvantage either way for teams on the cusp of a division but if it is evenly distributed then it would be fair. That way no team is competing against a school more than two or three times its size. Instead of a few schools being punished for being on the line.
The KMSFA is is going down hill because there shouldn't being guys who run the association also competing in the association. I think the KHSAA taking over would be the best thing. That way the rules would be consistent across the state and not determined by a few coaches.
RichBrooks Wrote:But then everyone has to compete with schools twice their size instead of a few schools competing against schools 3-4 times their size. The fairest playing field is one thats evenly distributed.
The schools at the bottom of division 1 are severly punished. It is obviously a disadvantage either way for teams on the cusp of a division but if it is evenly distributed then it would be fair. That way no team is competing against a school more than two or three times its size. Instead of a few schools being punished for being on the line.
The KMSFA is is going down hill because there shouldn't being guys who run the association also competing in the association. I think the KHSAA taking over would be the best thing. That way the rules would be consistent across the state and not determined by a few coaches.
I think you are making what would be, on the surface at least, good points. Had to laugh at the part where you said the KMSFA is "going downhill" though. We had 157 member schools last year, just FYI. Do that math. There are 120 counties in the state - not all of which even have middle school football.
To answer your concerns though, I will say to you that Coach Mann spends hours and hours on this, trying to maintain consistency and fairness for ALL programs in ALL divisions. That being said, there are going to be schools on the edges numbers-wise that will have to "play up" versus schools that have a larger enrollment. I'm certain the same thing goes for high schools in all divisions. Its just the way it falls.
There were a couple of other options on the table for us this offseason. We looked at our membership from the past 2 years, the trends involved, etc. Part of our issue is schools who get in and out of the KMSFA depending on how good/bad the coach thinks their team is that year. That is not a sustainable model for us as an association. Programs need to be committed to membership EVERY year. If that was in fact the case, then perhaps we could add another class? Diversify further the ones that do exsist? Who knows?
I (once again) will assure you that EVERY board member on the KMSFA dedicates COUNTLESS hours to serving this association. We don't just show up in July and start doing things. We work every month of the year - and for no $$$$$.
I realize that this message board exsists for people to post their opinions. Me choosing to get on here and even reply to this thread itself is me putting myself out there. I get that. I will say that it is a bit disconcerting when namelss people want to criticize things. It is not acceptable for those kinds of folks to question our integrity. That, to me, is inexcusable. We work too hard for that to be the case. We go out of our way to be as impartial as we can be - many times recusing ourselves if there is in fact a conflict of interest. (case in point - there has never been a program of a board member make it to the state finals.)
We have no problem answering questions. And for the record, I don't think your comments are out of line. If you think the KHSAA is better suited to run middle school athletics, then you are certainly entitled to that opinion. I would obviously disagree and I say that 6 years ago, before the KMSFA exsisted, there were opportunites lost for student athletes because of no organization. I won't get into the criticisms that high school programs have of the KHSAA. I'm sure you will agree that those are documented fairly well, even on this site. Your assertion that that same organization would get it entirely right with middle school athletics might be a hard case to prove? But, I digress.....
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Some posters will never get it.
I understand that folks can have questions. I don't think any of us mind that. Its just baffling how the conspiracy type stuff starts. There's NO WAY any of us on the board would cheat a kid, coach, or program. We value what we do far to much.
I also am of the opinion that if you were going to sincerely talk about competing for a state championship, then you can't be afraid to play anybody. Again, that's just my mindset on that and I'd point to many successful programs that think that same way (Central HS is a easy one that comes to mind).
KMSFA2 Wrote:I understand that folks can have questions. I don't think any of us mind that. Its just baffling how the conspiracy type stuff starts. There's NO WAY any of us on the board would cheat a kid, coach, or program. We value what we do far to much.
I also am of the opinion that if you were going to sincerely talk about competing for a state championship, then you can't be afraid to play anybody. Again, that's just my mindset on that and I'd point to many successful programs that think that same way (Central HS is a easy one that comes to mind).
You guys are doing a great job and don't forget that there are people out here that support you in what you do for these kids. I don"t care if its a few more boys in school, who really gives a damn. Its about giving these boys a chance to play after their regular season is over and working towards a goal. Thank you for everything you guys are doing to make Ky a name on the map for football, god knows it can use it thanks to people like you in KYMSFA. And another thing, maybe these whiners should know KY FBU went to the national championship playoffs this past year. Smoke that on when you are looking for a way to win instead of making these kids men that will contribute to their respective high schools in the future,
Thank you for the kind words, tigerblues.
I think that the overwhelming majority of the members of our association are happy with the direction and events that we undertake.
I also would say that we share the same passion that folks who may not necessarily agree with every decision that we make. Again, civil discourse can sometimes be helpful. We aren't thin skinned by any means. That, and we are always open to suggestions, comments, questions, etc. that are directed appropriately.
Thank you again for your support of the KMSFA.
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Your always going to have haters.
Some people are always going to feel there little johnny is getting cheated.
IMO, the KMSFA is the best thing that has happened to middle school football.